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Fireball prototype?

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July 7, 2005 1:05:47 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

We just came across fireball with the serial# 1014. It has a black
spinning disk instead of red. Does anyone know if this was a prototype
disk or some aftermarket deal.

thanks

More about : fireball prototype

Anonymous
July 7, 2005 1:12:27 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

That would be the 14th game made. I have the 30th game made with a red
disk.
Anonymous
July 7, 2005 2:54:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

stevepinfla@aol.com wrote:
> That would be the 14th game made. I have the 30th game made with a red
> disk.

KME: The IPDB Bally Serial Number Project research shows that some
other Fireball games have been submitted with black discs. We are not
aware of any other differences in early games from later ones, and it
may well be that a disc could have been replaced later on in that
machine's life for wear or damage reasons. The Twin Win machines which
have the same type of assembly in them have all had black discs, so a
later replacement part from them is always a fair possibility.
We'll log in Fireball #1014 now. Thanks!
Brian Saunders IPDB Bally Research
Related resources
July 7, 2005 4:03:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Thanks Brian, Where is the ser# database? We also have ser#4972 . It
must be at the end of the run.
July 7, 2005 10:12:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Awful big coincidence... how often do those things break?


Fireball # 1005 has a black disk.
But, since I haven't owned it since new, it could have been replaced as
Brian said.
July 7, 2005 10:48:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

In summary,

#1005 has a black spinning disk.
#1014 has a black spinning disk.
#1030 has a red spinning disk.

If they did start out using black, perhaps by the 30th game they
switched to red? Or, maybe they used black ones beyond 1030, but some
owner assumed their black one on 1030 was incorrect, and replaced it
with a red one? Or, maybe these early games had red discs but
coincidentally were replaced with black ones? Or maybe...?

The 1976 Bally parts catalog indicates the rubber mats for Fireball and
Twin Win have different part numbers:

Fireball
Spinner Assembly - AS-2699
Mat & Disc Assembly - AS-2698
Rubber Mat - R-226-16

Twin Win
Spinner Assembly - AS-2699-1 (same as AS-2699, excepting Mat & Disc
Assembly)
Mat & Disc Assembly - AS-2698-1 (same as AS-2698, excepting rubber mat
and washers)
Rubber Mat - R-226-14

(Does "R" stand for "Red"? Well, wait, you said all Twin Wins had
black...)

Brian, we need to stare and compare the discs from a black Fireball, a
red Fireball, and a black Twin Win. Are the diameters identical? Is the
ridge spacing identical?

I like to feature examples of "Early Production" games in the ipdb
listings, where such little-known differences can be presented to all.
For the people who posted: Is it possible that pictures can be taken of
either the #1005 game or the #1014 game for this purpose? It would be
great to show a closer pic of the disc area of either of your
particular games. Also the entire playfield, so users can see for
themselves if any other playfield differences exist. Are there any
cabinet art differences? Even if not, I'll show your cabinet, too, if
you are so inclined to take those pictures!

Thanks,

Jay

for the IPDB Bally Serial Number Project
July 7, 2005 11:28:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

>Feel free to post the pictures of #1005 I sent to you a few months back.

Ooops! (Red face) Where did I put those... :) 

Jay
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 12:41:27 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Fireball # 1005 has a black disk.
But, since I haven't owned it since new, it could have been replaced as
Brian said.

- Steve B.

"Brian Saunders" <bsaunders@consolidated.net> wrote in message
news:1120758877.576454.258320@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> stevepinfla@aol.com wrote:
>> That would be the 14th game made. I have the 30th game made with a red
>> disk.
>
> KME: The IPDB Bally Serial Number Project research shows that some
> other Fireball games have been submitted with black discs. We are not
> aware of any other differences in early games from later ones, and it
> may well be that a disc could have been replaced later on in that
> machine's life for wear or damage reasons. The Twin Win machines which
> have the same type of assembly in them have all had black discs, so a
> later replacement part from them is always a fair possibility.
> We'll log in Fireball #1014 now. Thanks!
> Brian Saunders IPDB Bally Research
>
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 2:22:37 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Hi Jay,

Feel free to post the pictures of #1005 I sent to you a few months back. If
you need me to resend them, other specific photos, or take measurements of
the disk let me know.

- Steve B.


"Jay" <jay@ipdb.org> wrote in message
news:1120787331.532401.147800@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> In summary,
>
> #1005 has a black spinning disk.
> #1014 has a black spinning disk.
> #1030 has a red spinning disk.
>
> If they did start out using black, perhaps by the 30th game they
> switched to red? Or, maybe they used black ones beyond 1030, but some
> owner assumed their black one on 1030 was incorrect, and replaced it
> with a red one? Or, maybe these early games had red discs but
> coincidentally were replaced with black ones? Or maybe...?
>
> The 1976 Bally parts catalog indicates the rubber mats for Fireball and
> Twin Win have different part numbers:
>
> Fireball
> Spinner Assembly - AS-2699
> Mat & Disc Assembly - AS-2698
> Rubber Mat - R-226-16
>
> Twin Win
> Spinner Assembly - AS-2699-1 (same as AS-2699, excepting Mat & Disc
> Assembly)
> Mat & Disc Assembly - AS-2698-1 (same as AS-2698, excepting rubber mat
> and washers)
> Rubber Mat - R-226-14
>
> (Does "R" stand for "Red"? Well, wait, you said all Twin Wins had
> black...)
>
> Brian, we need to stare and compare the discs from a black Fireball, a
> red Fireball, and a black Twin Win. Are the diameters identical? Is the
> ridge spacing identical?
>
> I like to feature examples of "Early Production" games in the ipdb
> listings, where such little-known differences can be presented to all.
> For the people who posted: Is it possible that pictures can be taken of
> either the #1005 game or the #1014 game for this purpose? It would be
> great to show a closer pic of the disc area of either of your
> particular games. Also the entire playfield, so users can see for
> themselves if any other playfield differences exist. Are there any
> cabinet art differences? Even if not, I'll show your cabinet, too, if
> you are so inclined to take those pictures!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jay
>
> for the IPDB Bally Serial Number Project
>
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 2:40:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

KME wrote:
> Awful big coincidence... how often do those things break?
>


The spinning disk on the flyer pictured on the IPDB looks black to me
too, compared to photos of machines with the red disk. Maybe someone
with a flyer can tell for sure if the disk pictured is black. If so, I
think it's more likely that the earliest Fireballs had black disks than
to think the red disks were replaced with black ones on the two know
earliest surviving Fireballs. (my 2 cents)

- Steve B.
October 13, 2011 3:58:21 AM

Hello,

I'm not sure if this thread is still active, but I just bought a 1972 Fireball, serial number 1001, and based on the comments above, it seems as though it might be the first one off the production line. Is that correct, or have people uncovered lower serial numbers?

Thanks.
Terry
!