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UPDATE: HSII Problem Returned, I am out of ideas????

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Anonymous
July 8, 2005 2:57:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Hi,

My Shooter Lane Kicker problem has returned, I am totally out of options
with this, it stopped for a little while when I changed the ROM to L2 but it
has started doing it again.

This thing is so random its giving me no idea where it is, if it was
kicking when another switch was being activated I would have no trouble
finding it but its still kicking when the ball is rolling around the
Playfield and no where near switches and not even bouncing to cause
vibrations, tomorrow I am going to replace the diodes on the switches that
make of the troubled solenoids switch number, the shooter lane kicker switch
is #78 so I am going to replace the diodes on #77, #87 & #88 to eliminate
the phantom switch theory.

If this doesn't work I an going to start looking at the Chips that
control the Switch Matrix on the WPC and change them, I know the problem
isnt on the PDB because I changed it with my TZ one and the problem was
still there.

Just one more think the Shooter Lane Kicker runs through a High Current
Driver under the Playfield, its a very simple circuit to it and does anyone
think this could have something to do with the problem?

Thanks again,

Kevin
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 2:57:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

have you removed the coil itself to make sure its not
shorting/grounding out on the metal bracket during gameplay and
energizing? thanks! jr
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 2:57:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I would personally concentrate on switch #78 then. Once the ball is
put into play any time that switch is closed the coil is triggered.

-wolffy


Sojourner353 wrote:
> Hi,
>
> My Shooter Lane Kicker problem has returned, I am totally out of options
> with this, it stopped for a little while when I changed the ROM to L2 but it
> has started doing it again.
>
> This thing is so random its giving me no idea where it is, if it was
> kicking when another switch was being activated I would have no trouble
> finding it but its still kicking when the ball is rolling around the
> Playfield and no where near switches and not even bouncing to cause
> vibrations, tomorrow I am going to replace the diodes on the switches that
> make of the troubled solenoids switch number, the shooter lane kicker switch
> is #78 so I am going to replace the diodes on #77, #87 & #88 to eliminate
> the phantom switch theory.
>
> If this doesn't work I an going to start looking at the Chips that
> control the Switch Matrix on the WPC and change them, I know the problem
> isnt on the PDB because I changed it with my TZ one and the problem was
> still there.
>
> Just one more think the Shooter Lane Kicker runs through a High Current
> Driver under the Playfield, its a very simple circuit to it and does anyone
> think this could have something to do with the problem?
>
> Thanks again,
>
> Kevin
>
>
Related resources
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 2:57:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

>My Shooter Lane Kicker problem has returned, I am >totally out of options

OK, let's do this again-

When in switch edge test mode- do you:
1- see strange switch operations?
2- get the coil to fire?
When in coil mode-
3- Do you get strange coil firing?
4- Does it fire when it's supposed to?

Kirb
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 4:58:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

On Fri, 08 Jul 2005 10:57:58 GMT, "Sojourner353"
<sojourner@dodo.com.au> wrote:

> My Shooter Lane Kicker problem has returned, I am totally out of options
>with this, it stopped for a little while when I changed the ROM to L2 but it
>has started doing it again.
>

Here is one more to check -

If you have not checked it, make sure your playfield is at 6-7 degree
angle.



Freeman
I would rather be happy then right.
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 6:26:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

"Sojourner353" wrote:
> is #78 so I am going to replace the diodes on #77, #87 & #88 to eliminate
> the phantom switch theory.

Replacing diodes won't do anything- the diode (whether good or bad) is in an
OPEN circuit whenever the switch it's attached to is open, so it's a waste
of time and money- don't do it.

If there are any switches closed, or closing, when the auto-kicker fires,
then you may want to look at those, but my best guess it that it really is
"random" and not related to any specific switch, or action on the playfield-
correct?

My best guess is that you've got a switch matrix problem related to
something else in the machine that's causing a "phantom" closure of the
plunger lane switch, which makes the auto-launch coil fire. I'd put the
game in switch test and just let it sit there for 5, 10, 30 minutes, and see
if anything "goes off" while it's just sitting. That may point you in the
direction of other clues...

> If this doesn't work I an going to start looking at the Chips that
> control the Switch Matrix on the WPC and change them, I know the problem
> isnt on the PDB because I changed it with my TZ one and the problem was
> still there.

Save yourself some more time and money- swap the MPU board in from your TZ
and try that. If no problem, then yes- you've got a problem on the Getaway
MPU board. But if problem persists with TZ MPU board, then your problem is
with something on the playfield...

Some simple troubleshooting like this will not only help you narrow down
where the problem is coming from, but will save you a lot of time and money
replacing things that probably don't need to be replaced- not to mention the
wear and tear of handling/working on circuit boards, and risk of making a
problem worse or damaging it beyond repair. Don't reach for the soldering
iron unless you're sure you have to...

> Just one more think the Shooter Lane Kicker runs through a High
Current
> Driver under the Playfield, its a very simple circuit to it and does
anyone
> think this could have something to do with the problem?

Worth looking at. I believe this game uses a standard coil switch
transistor circuit on the driver board to activate the high-power (TIP36C?)
transistor on the board that runs the auto-launcher, so you can examine both
circuits and see if you're getting a false triggering of either. Monitor
the low-current circuit to see if it is firing (connect a LED or lamp to it
that will light up whenever the circuit activates), and if so, then it's
either truly a bona-fide or phantom closure of the plunger lane switch
causing it to fire, or if it doesn't fire but the auto-launch coil still
does, then it's on the high-current side of that board- maybe a leaky
TIP36C... Worth checking!

Ray J.
--
Action Pinball & Amusement, LLC
Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Web: www.actionpinball.com

We're serious about pinball. Anything else is just for fun!
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 6:26:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

<pinball77@comcast.net> wrote:
> have you removed the coil itself to make sure its not
> shorting/grounding out on the metal bracket during gameplay and
> energizing? thanks! jr

Good suggestion- ran into this on an IJ once...

Ray J.
--
Action Pinball & Amusement, LLC
Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Web: www.actionpinball.com

We're serious about pinball. Anything else is just for fun!
Anonymous
July 8, 2005 6:27:55 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

"freeman" wrote:
> Here is one more to check -
>
> If you have not checked it, make sure your playfield is at 6-7 degree
> angle.

Why?

Ray J.
--
Action Pinball & Amusement, LLC
Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Web: www.actionpinball.com

We're serious about pinball. Anything else is just for fun!
Anonymous
July 9, 2005 9:48:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Ok to all the replies:

jr, I checked to see if the coil was grounding and its all fine, I have
installed heat shrink on the lugs of the coil so there is no exposed parts
at all, done that months ago.

Kirb, In all test modes there is no strange behaviour at all.

Freeman, I seriously don't think the angle of my playfield has anything
to do with this.

Ray, I have done the switch test for about 30min and nothing, tonight I
will leave it on overnight and see if any have triggered in the morning, I
wont be replacing diodes now or components on the MPU and I will try my TZ
MPU in the machine also, if its still there I will start looking at the HCD
for the problem.

Thanks to all that have helped with this and I will keep you posted on
the results I find.

Kevin
"Ray Johnson - Action Pinball" <staff@actionpinball.com> wrote in message
news:9sydnXXQL4zqfFPfRVn-ow@aros.net...
> "Sojourner353" wrote:
>> is #78 so I am going to replace the diodes on #77, #87 & #88 to eliminate
>> the phantom switch theory.
>
> Replacing diodes won't do anything- the diode (whether good or bad) is in
> an
> OPEN circuit whenever the switch it's attached to is open, so it's a waste
> of time and money- don't do it.
>
> If there are any switches closed, or closing, when the auto-kicker fires,
> then you may want to look at those, but my best guess it that it really is
> "random" and not related to any specific switch, or action on the
> playfield-
> correct?
>
> My best guess is that you've got a switch matrix problem related to
> something else in the machine that's causing a "phantom" closure of the
> plunger lane switch, which makes the auto-launch coil fire. I'd put the
> game in switch test and just let it sit there for 5, 10, 30 minutes, and
> see
> if anything "goes off" while it's just sitting. That may point you in the
> direction of other clues...
>
>> If this doesn't work I an going to start looking at the Chips that
>> control the Switch Matrix on the WPC and change them, I know the problem
>> isnt on the PDB because I changed it with my TZ one and the problem was
>> still there.
>
> Save yourself some more time and money- swap the MPU board in from your TZ
> and try that. If no problem, then yes- you've got a problem on the
> Getaway
> MPU board. But if problem persists with TZ MPU board, then your problem
> is
> with something on the playfield...
>
> Some simple troubleshooting like this will not only help you narrow down
> where the problem is coming from, but will save you a lot of time and
> money
> replacing things that probably don't need to be replaced- not to mention
> the
> wear and tear of handling/working on circuit boards, and risk of making a
> problem worse or damaging it beyond repair. Don't reach for the soldering
> iron unless you're sure you have to...
>
>> Just one more think the Shooter Lane Kicker runs through a High
> Current
>> Driver under the Playfield, its a very simple circuit to it and does
> anyone
>> think this could have something to do with the problem?
>
> Worth looking at. I believe this game uses a standard coil switch
> transistor circuit on the driver board to activate the high-power
> (TIP36C?)
> transistor on the board that runs the auto-launcher, so you can examine
> both
> circuits and see if you're getting a false triggering of either. Monitor
> the low-current circuit to see if it is firing (connect a LED or lamp to
> it
> that will light up whenever the circuit activates), and if so, then it's
> either truly a bona-fide or phantom closure of the plunger lane switch
> causing it to fire, or if it doesn't fire but the auto-launch coil still
> does, then it's on the high-current side of that board- maybe a leaky
> TIP36C... Worth checking!
>
> Ray J.
> --
> Action Pinball & Amusement, LLC
> Salt Lake City, Utah USA
> Web: www.actionpinball.com
>
> We're serious about pinball. Anything else is just for fun!
>
>
>
>
>
!