Finding a GI Short

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I have a short on F-14 that is driving me nuts - it's the upper right
playfield GI. The fuse doesn't blow during attract mode, it usually
goes within a couple games.

If a socket does NOT have the bulb in it, can it still short? My plan
is to remove the bulbs and add them one by one untill I find the short.
Is this the way to go?

Also, could it be any other ussue? Any ideas? All the board wiring
looks clean.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Ha ha ha, that's a fun one! It could be so many things... Once we had
to trace the wire back to the source and back just to find it was
pinched between a metal and a plastic. That was fun, and took several
hours, but sometimes there's nothing else to do... It can still short
without the bulb, because power still runs through the wire to another
bulb, so you get all or nothing, just because of the way wiring works.
Have fun!
Jenna

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Lloyd Olson wrote:
> Sure a socket can short without a bulb. Could be a splash of solder in
> there, the fiberboard spacer might not be insulating good, etc. LTG

Ok, so any hints? Should I start clipping wires and taking sections out
to narrow it down?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I'd start by making sure your the GI connectors are good - especially
at the first connector coming from the playfield. High resistance
'surges' caused by oxidation can blow a fuse in the way you've
described.

Another thing that comes to mind is that F14's playfield backboard is
populated with flashers and it's easy for wire snags to occur in that
area.

-Gregg

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Sure a socket can short without a bulb. Could be a splash of solder in
there, the fiberboard spacer might not be insulating good, etc. LTG

"ldnayman" <ldnayman@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1121015799.309351.49120@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> I have a short on F-14 that is driving me nuts - it's the upper right
> playfield GI. The fuse doesn't blow during attract mode, it usually
> goes within a couple games.
>
> If a socket does NOT have the bulb in it, can it still short? My plan
> is to remove the bulbs and add them one by one untill I find the short.
> Is this the way to go?
>
> Also, could it be any other ussue? Any ideas? All the board wiring
> looks clean.
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I'd narrow it down to one line, then disconnect wires and hook them back up
one at a time until you pop the fuse, then you will know where it is. LTG

"ldnayman" <ldnayman@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1121017321.940895.324330@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> Lloyd Olson wrote:
> > Sure a socket can short without a bulb. Could be a splash of solder in
> > there, the fiberboard spacer might not be insulating good, etc. LTG
>
> Ok, so any hints? Should I start clipping wires and taking sections out
> to narrow it down?
>

 

[otto]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

They can short with bulbs out. Example: an empty socket with a blob of
solder or a loose hexnut or any other metal debris in it. Any other metal
to metal like chafed wire or shorted socket tabs.

Determine the whereabouts of the entire string. Things like coin doors, Pf
backboards, and insert panels are often overlooked. Important to be 100%
sure you know the entire sting.

Start inspecting it inch by inch. Check inside each socket with a
flashlight. Look for any metal to metal, chafed wires, pinched wires, etc.

If nothing found, you may have to disconnect segments of the string and play
it until you find which disconnect eliminates the short.

You can also disconnect the entire string and see if the fuse blows. Then
you will know the string is good and the problem is elsewhere.

Keep a log of your process to eliminate backtracking.

Be methodical.

Be sure you are 100% positive you know where the entire string is before you
start this or you may chase your tail for days.

Sounds to me like your short is triggered by gameplay vibration. A chafed
wire moving slightly or a blob of solder jiggling around or other metal
debris moving around.

Hth.


Otto

CARGPB11

My web page: http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-Ottoslanding

"ldnayman" <ldnayman@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1121015799.309351.49120@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>I have a short on F-14 that is driving me nuts - it's the upper right
> playfield GI. The fuse doesn't blow during attract mode, it usually
> goes within a couple games.
>
> If a socket does NOT have the bulb in it, can it still short? My plan
> is to remove the bulbs and add them one by one untill I find the short.
> Is this the way to go?
>
> Also, could it be any other ussue? Any ideas? All the board wiring
> looks clean.
>

 

[otto]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I would determine the line, check the wires and the sockets(inside and out)
for obvious problem, then proceed with the disconnection if no luck with
initial inspection.

Also make sure you are using the right size and type of fuse.

Otto

CARGPB11

My web page: http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-Ottoslanding

"Lloyd Olson" <ltg@ssbilliards.com> wrote in message
news:noudnb5O1pRd_0zfRVnygQ@skypoint.com...
> I'd narrow it down to one line, then disconnect wires and hook them back
> up
> one at a time until you pop the fuse, then you will know where it is. LTG
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Well doing the easiest thing possible (always the first thing i do) I
just started desoldering chunks of the offending GI string. 3 or 4
fuses later I have it narrowed down to 4 or 5 sockets, so the lights
are back on (mostly) untill I get the time to check each of those bulbs
individually. I just kept detatching and reattatching areas of the
string until I figured it out.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I have the most luck connecting a 6v lantern battery to the string,
then checking each socket (wiggling the bulb, moving the tabs on the
socket, etc.)

When the bulbs lite, I know I found the problem. The battery approach
eliminates the fuse problem. Sometimes I disconnect the string
connector from the power board for safety reasons.

Good luck and post back results,
Mike

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

>
> Good luck and post back results,
> Mike

I have isolated the problem to 4 or 5 sockets, so I think I'll just go
through them one by one till I find which one is blowing the fuse- the
system worked well so far so I'll stick with it even if it costs me
another few fuses. I just disconnected big chunks of the GI string at a
time to narrow it down. Actually it worked very well and bailed me out
of the frustration I was feeling- I had looked at every socket, and
even jostled each one with the game on with no results, but this helped
me out.

Even if I don't fix it anytime soon only 4 lights are out now so I can
see and play the game.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Don't forget to check the bulbs themselves. I never had a bad one out
of the box until recently. It drove me freakin' nuts trying to find
the bad GI culprit. Now, I always test the bulbs with a 9v battery
before installation.

Jim
---
flipper [at] pa [dot] net



ldnayman wrote:
> >
> > Good luck and post back results,
> > Mike
>
> I have isolated the problem to 4 or 5 sockets, so I think I'll just go
> through them one by one till I find which one is blowing the fuse- the
> system worked well so far so I'll stick with it even if it costs me
> another few fuses. I just disconnected big chunks of the GI string at a
> time to narrow it down. Actually it worked very well and bailed me out
> of the frustration I was feeling- I had looked at every socket, and
> even jostled each one with the game on with no results, but this helped
> me out.
>
> Even if I don't fix it anytime soon only 4 lights are out now so I can
> see and play the game.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

A bad bulb can short a GI string?

Gott Lieb? wrote:
> Don't forget to check the bulbs themselves. I never had a bad one out
> of the box until recently. It drove me freakin' nuts trying to find
> the bad GI culprit. Now, I always test the bulbs with a 9v battery
> before installation.
>
> Jim
> ---
> flipper [at] pa [dot] net
>
>
>
> ldnayman wrote:
> > >
> > > Good luck and post back results,
> > > Mike
> >
> > I have isolated the problem to 4 or 5 sockets, so I think I'll just go
> > through them one by one till I find which one is blowing the fuse- the
> > system worked well so far so I'll stick with it even if it costs me
> > another few fuses. I just disconnected big chunks of the GI string at a
> > time to narrow it down. Actually it worked very well and bailed me out
> > of the frustration I was feeling- I had looked at every socket, and
> > even jostled each one with the game on with no results, but this helped
> > me out.
> >
> > Even if I don't fix it anytime soon only 4 lights are out now so I can
> > see and play the game.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

>A bad bulb can short a GI string?

Yep- one with the leads shorted. Most often bad out of the box. Some
that have had the glass seperated from the base and twisted.

Kirb

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Check your sockets inside of your pop bumpers. If the socket rubs up
against the mounting screw for the pop bumper body....it'll blow.

Ahh.....GI shorting problems.....what fun. Been there.


Craig



On 10 Jul 2005 19:51:53 -0700, "ldnayman" <ldnayman@aol.com> wrote:

>Well doing the easiest thing possible (always the first thing i do) I
>just started desoldering chunks of the offending GI string. 3 or 4
>fuses later I have it narrowed down to 4 or 5 sockets, so the lights
>are back on (mostly) untill I get the time to check each of those bulbs
>individually. I just kept detatching and reattatching areas of the
>string until I figured it out.

2005 Texas Pinball Festival
October 28th-30th, 2005
Irving, Texas
www.texaspinball.com


Hassell Castle Homepage
Includes information on my games and
the Cirqus Voltaire Owners List:
http://www.hassellcastle.com

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[otto]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Ray at Action and Lloyd got me to go with a thermal breaker. Available at
good electronics stores.

I have a 5A and 3A.

The 5A gets used all the time for GI shorts. Use whatever amperage the fuse
would normally be.

Take blown fuse and solder it, using a pair of wires, to the thermal
breaker.

Now when troubleshooting, simply insert the Thermal breaker fuse into the
fuseholder and if the short is still present the breaker will pop but can be
reset after about 90 seconds and it has cooled.

One short and the related troubleshooting will pay for the breaker--after
that it is free.


Otto

CARGPB11

My web page: http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-Ottoslanding

"ldnayman" <ldnayman@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1121102733.522465.250720@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>the
> system worked well so far so I'll stick with it even if it costs me
> another few fuses.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I don't know if this will help at all. You've probably already tried it.
However.......

.........I had a System-11 game once that kept blowing one of the GI fuses
every game or so. It wasn't right away, almost just "out of the blue." It
turns out that the wiring for one of the GI connectors (on the interconnect
board) was incorrect. One wire was on the wrong connector, probably one
plugged into the backbox verses playfield. So there was too much current
going into the line which held the fuse, hence......overloading it and
blowing it after a short time.

This might not be it. Just a thought in case you get stuck and maybe
want to double check the wiring on the GI is correct.

Chris


--
-------------------------------------------

Bucci's Pinball Arcade
"My collection & obsession online"
http://www.buccisarcade.com


"Lloyd Olson" <ltg@ssbilliards.com> wrote in message
news:M9-dnWHW8fE_xkzfRVnyrg@skypoint.com...
> Sure a socket can short without a bulb. Could be a splash of solder in
> there, the fiberboard spacer might not be insulating good, etc. LTG
>
> "ldnayman" <ldnayman@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:1121015799.309351.49120@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>> I have a short on F-14 that is driving me nuts - it's the upper right
>> playfield GI. The fuse doesn't blow during attract mode, it usually
>> goes within a couple games.
>>
>> If a socket does NOT have the bulb in it, can it still short? My plan
>> is to remove the bulbs and add them one by one untill I find the short.
>> Is this the way to go?
>>
>> Also, could it be any other ussue? Any ideas? All the board wiring
>> looks clean.
>>
>
>