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Its an AMD world afterall

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Last response: in CPUs
September 3, 2003 4:19:05 AM

rejoice

the HAMMER cometh

the PRESsHOTT burneth

muuahahahahahah

More about : amd world afterall

September 3, 2003 5:26:40 AM

It's AMD's time now. Northwood will die sooner, even soonest with prescott.

-J<font color=red>//\</font color=red>ECOR™ -
-J<font color=purple>//\</font color=purple>ECOR™ -
September 3, 2003 5:51:03 AM

let's just wait for the release.

-J<font color=red>//\</font color=red>ECOR™ -
-J<font color=purple>//\</font color=purple>ECOR™ -
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September 3, 2003 6:01:18 AM

In the past AMD have let intel take the lead and have sat fair on their butt making sure intel dont drop the pace. This has given AMD the advantage of selling at a lower price and getting a hold of the market. Do you think AMD are going to go out in front of intel, i think they will, and this could be the downfall of intel as they attempt to sell us their budget line of celerons. The question is do intel have what it takes to keep a foothold in the face of AMD s inevitable dominance.

If he doesn't die, he'll get help!!!
September 3, 2003 6:15:29 AM

prescott's heat will surely kill intel next year.
And AMD must learn from Intel's mistakes in 90nm in their next core (SAN DIEGO).

-J<font color=red>//\</font color=red>ECOR™ -
-J<font color=purple>//\</font color=purple>ECOR™ -
September 3, 2003 11:41:13 AM

ho hum... This is getting boring..

I reckon VIA will suddenly come up trumps with their new unannounced core design, which will run at 5Ghz and have 5x the IPC of an AXP.*

<pre>* statement as easily proved as all others on this topic, until the f&^$ing things are released</pre><p>

---
The end is nigh.. (For this post at least) :smile:
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
September 3, 2003 1:34:51 PM

True dat chip
September 3, 2003 2:04:33 PM

Quote:
This has given AMD the advantage of selling at a lower price and getting a hold of the market.

What?

I think you and I are on different planets. On mine, AMD has less than 20% of the market, and Intel has over 75%. This is not a hold on the market.
Quote:
The question is do intel have what it takes to keep a foothold in the face of AMD s inevitable dominance.

This has to be a joke. If so, then... :lol: 

:evil:  <font color=red><b>M</b></font color=red>ephistopheles
September 3, 2003 2:24:35 PM

The guy lives in his own little AMD/Nvidia world. The twat.

<font color=blue>"Some people believe football is a matter of life and death. I'm very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that" - Bill Shankly</font color=blue>
September 3, 2003 2:56:45 PM

<font color=green><b>It's An AMD World After All</b>
Quote:
It's a world of marketing, a world of lies;
It's a world of FUD where the rumor flies.
There's so much AMD learns from Apple's burns.
It's an AMD, AMD world.

</font color=green>

<b>Everybody sing along!</b>
<pre>...and let us hope that Disney doesn't notice...</pre><p>
<font color=blue>If you look <font color=purple>The Devil</font color=purple><font color=red>®</font color=red> straight in the eye and only see yourself then you must be standing in front of a mirror.</font color=blue>
September 3, 2003 3:00:13 PM

Aha! a man of many talents....
LOL :lol: 

---
The end is nigh.. (For this post at least) :smile:
September 3, 2003 3:17:52 PM

You know, I was thinking... All of this "The A64 kicks the P4s arse in X benchmark" is cool and all ... until one considers just how parallel AMD and Apple marketing have been lately and how 'honest' (and with Apple I use that term extremely loosely) Apple's G5 benchmarks have actually been when examined closely.

So then we get back to the point ... if AMD is indeed taking their marketing lessons from Apple then just how much <i>can</i> we trust the benchmarks that are out there right now? It truly could be an AMD world, as expressed in the above song. And then again maybe AMD is more honest than Apple. We'll just have to wait and see.

<font color=blue>If you look <font color=purple>The Devil</font color=purple><font color=red>®</font color=red> straight in the eye and only see yourself then you must be standing in front of a mirror.</font color=blue>
September 3, 2003 3:47:42 PM

Quote:
The twat.

Some people spend way too much time on their putdowns when sometimes the shortest of phrases will suffice...nay,even say more than any essay.All credit to you,RobD.I am very happy to note that that lovely English word of ours is not banned on here.
Oh, and nice sig.Fellow Liverpool fan?

no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
September 3, 2003 4:50:04 PM

Robd i can just imagine you, some pretentious little spoilt boy, or man, who is so consumed with his own self importance it make everyone around him wonder if the world has a sense of humour. Such a sad sad soul it must be...

If he doesn't die, he'll get help!!!
September 3, 2003 5:04:58 PM

LOL! Sorry, not a Liverpool fan, but a Birmingham fan, although I do have a certain affinity for the reds.

He's just trolling and is wasting a lot of people's time here who simply want to help people and pass on their knowledge to others. There are no rationale to his statements either. I've sat back and watched for a while in here and in the Graphics forum.

You never know, I may actually get back to helping folk again, whilst still posting in the Other.

<font color=blue>"Some people believe football is a matter of life and death. I'm very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that" - Bill Shankly</font color=blue>
September 3, 2003 5:07:11 PM

Why don't you try and post constructively? You might find people take things you say more seriously.

<font color=blue>"Some people believe football is a matter of life and death. I'm very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that" - Bill Shankly</font color=blue>
September 4, 2003 12:06:47 AM

.......It's a lame thread afterall! It's a lame thread after all! It's a lame thread afterall! It's a lame, lame, thread!!!!!!!!!

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
a b à CPUs
September 4, 2003 8:49:39 AM

Quote:
I think you and I are on different planets. On mine, AMD has less than 20% of the market, and Intel has over 75%. This is not a hold on the market.

ROFLMAO!!!

Its amazing how some people think that AMD, with very little money, and serious cash/resource and management/PR issues within their own company, is going to take on, and easily defeat Chipzilla ...er...oops...Intel, which has enough money ON HAND to easily buy AMD out 5 times over, AND has a stranglehold on the CPU market. Like any BUSINESS...Money talks...BULLSH*T walks...

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
September 4, 2003 9:49:49 AM

This just shows that AMD has a chance in making these 50% - 50%.

-J<font color=red>//\</font color=red>ECOR™ -
-J<font color=purple>//\</font color=purple>ECOR™ -
September 4, 2003 1:37:36 PM

Quote:
This just shows that AMD has a chance in making these 50% - 50%.

AMD <i>had</i> that chance in the past. For a good year straight at least they had that chance. Heck, at one point they had the chance to completely take the market from Intel. At one point AMD had held the 'performance crown' for a significant period of time and Intel had goofed a double-blunder of rushing their first P4 core to the market (which was a complete PoS at that time) <i>and</i> boffing up their 1.13GHz P3 release. On top of that Intel was pushing their customers into the highly-priced RDRAM while AMD stuck to the lower cost DDR SDRAM. AMD had every conceivable advantage while Intel was making mistake after mistake and was a veritable joke to enthusiasts.

So where is AMD now? Why is it that with <i>soooooo</i> many advantages then, AMD hardly gained any market share on Intel at all? It certainly wasn't Intel's superiority at the time. It certainly wasn't that Intel customers were happy customers. So why didn't AMD, with all of those advantages, take the market from Intel?

If the scales were so very tipped towards AMD then and they still couldn't even take a significant market share from Intel, what makes you think that AMD even has a smidgeon of a chance of taking any market share from Intel now? Fifty/fifty? Ha!

If I pick up a rock and throw it with all of my strength into the woods, what chance do I have of hitting the fox that stole a chicken from my grandpa's coop? Probability states that there <i>is</i> in fact a chance, albeit an incredibly small one. AMD taking 50% of the market? Same chance.

<font color=blue>If you look <font color=purple>The Devil</font color=purple><font color=red>®</font color=red> straight in the eye and only see yourself then you must be standing in front of a mirror.</font color=blue>
September 4, 2003 2:47:00 PM

> So why didn't AMD, with all of those advantages,
> take the market from Intel?

Because their board has a love for shooting themselves in the foot and not putting enough into advertising budget and marketing.


Shadus
September 4, 2003 3:52:32 PM

Quote:
Because their board has a love for shooting themselves in the foot and not putting enough into advertising budget and marketing.

This is certainly part of the truth. There are also other significant factors. For example, even <i>if</i> AMD reached out and convinced 50% of x86 customers that they wanted to buy AMD products, just how many could? Production is a key factor here. AMD can't take a significant market share from Intel because even if customers wanted AMD products, they couldn't produce nearly enough CPUs to take that market share. That's the main reason why AMD had so much trouble breaking into the major OEM's product lines.

<font color=blue>If you look <font color=purple>The Devil</font color=purple><font color=red>®</font color=red> straight in the eye and only see yourself then you must be standing in front of a mirror.</font color=blue>
September 4, 2003 6:46:36 PM

Nod very true and unfortunate really, be nice if a third chip manufacturer sprung up to help fill up the arena for competition... I'd like to see intel loose about 35% more market share see amd gain a few percent and another company gain about 30%... but I dont see that happening anytime in the reasonably forseeable future. *sigh*

Shadus
September 4, 2003 7:08:23 PM

Dont know yer guys beef with Intel, just a damned company that markets better has more money and has friends in the big OEM's oh and has 13+ fabs 2 on the go last I checked.

Oh ya has the best chipsets of any manufacture, best support, best warrenty, and when you think about it best ideology make money and more money and some more money.

People that hate companies like that baffle me they are successful because they want to be not thinking they could be. AMD is ass backwards busines practices, monkey upper management, and bad hardware support leaves you to wounder why why on why are they in the situation they are in.

-Jeremy

:evil:  <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=5341387" target="_new">Busting Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil: 
:evil:  <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?pcm=1400777" target="_new">Busting More Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil: 
September 4, 2003 7:41:11 PM

I have to say that I agree with a lot of sentiments just expressed. On one hand I'd like to see Intel face more serious competition. On the other hand AMD definately isn't doing a good job (as a company) to be that competition since Intel runs a solid business.

Which is why, I guess, that I'd rather prefer that AMD financially fail and have their intellectual property bought out by someone who actually knows how to produce and market CPUs and doesn't have management and shareholders who are afraid of actually spending money to make money. Ideally I personally would prefer IBM, though realisticly I've seen some good arguments for it to be HP instead. But it certainly would be the most interesting if it were nVidia.

Now <i>that's</i> a company that has thrown the industry quite a number of curve balls. I mean besides their graphics department having virtually rewritten what a graphics card should be, to then vault themselves into the mobo business using Microsoft to help them finance the shift and Intel to teach them how, and then to turn around and latch onto AMD instead of Intel and move in to become AMD's best chipset provider and taking the title away from the evil VIA in the process. Who'd 'a thunk it? Frankly I'm surprised that nVidia hasn't turned their onboard sound chip into a PCI card yet. They have the knowledge and it's a good enough sound chip.

So it'd be even weirder to see nVidia producing Athlons in the future. They would practically produce entire PCs then. Graphics, sound, northbridge, CPU... It'd be weird, but it could be very cool. And then again it could just be spreading their resources into too many markets.

Well anywho, I'm rambling now. But I guess the point is that I'd really like to see <i>something</i> in the industry change. Intel does business well so to give them any real competition (which would be nice) <i>something</i> has to change. Otherwise it's just a matter of time before New Intel goes back to being Old Intel.

<font color=blue>If you look <font color=purple>The Devil</font color=purple><font color=red>®</font color=red> straight in the eye and only see yourself then you must be standing in front of a mirror.</font color=blue>
September 4, 2003 8:35:48 PM

No euducated person here should have a beef with intel...just like slvr. i would like to see more competition...

when amd first introduced the athlon and intel and amd got into that little race up and over 1ghz...it was amazing how fast computers developed...now intel has no "real" compitition and is just taking it easy...


Proud owner of DOS 3.3 :smile:
September 4, 2003 9:05:15 PM

What a load of crap!!!

If he doesn't die, he'll get help!!!
September 4, 2003 11:46:21 PM

"Oh ya has the best chipsets of any manufacture, best support, best warrenty, and when you think about it best ideology make money and more money and some more money."

There's just something missing there......hmm.....oh yeah! "best price" =/ and quite soon, AMD will outperform Intel, not that I have any beef against intel.
September 4, 2003 11:57:38 PM

that's kinda of correct. MONEY is the key.
September 5, 2003 3:29:43 AM

Now is the time for the race to 5 Ghz.
a b à CPUs
September 5, 2003 5:56:52 AM

Quote:
There's just something missing there......hmm.....oh yeah! "best price" =/ and quite soon, AMD will outperform Intel, not that I have any beef against intel.

But how much longer can AMD run while losing money or barely gaining any profits? Will it do a bit of good to outperform Intel if the company has gone bankrupt while getting to the point where they can outperform Intel?

Look at AMD and how they are basically working with roughly the same "basic" core design that they started with when they introduced the Athlon. You would think that AMD would have at least put something better out than the current cores, considering all the time that has lapsed since the advent of the Athlon. How much more is that "basic" core design gonna ramp in speed/performance?

Intel saw this years ago when they first started developing the P4 series, and they introduced the early P4 Williamettes, (which weren't fully developed yet, possibly due to AMD breaking the 1 Ghz barrier first). But even now, the P4 has matured and anybody who thinks straight is not laughing at the current top of the line Northwood core P4's and their current dominance of the desktop CPU market.

And the P4 has the capacity to ramp higher in speed and performance, whereas most of AMD's processor cores are reaching the limits of their capabilities. And if you were to ask me, I would say that Intel is using DAMNED good business practice and business foresight in preparing for the future as they have. I wish I could have as much foresight into the future as this, then I would be very rich too!

And since this time, Intel has improved upon the new designs, added things such as SSE, SSE2, HT, etc... Intel has actually diversified their research and come up with some pretty interesting additions to their processors. I cannot say that I have seen as much from AMD, although they have come up with a few things. Since the advent of the P4, AMD has been fraught with paper launches, bad publicity, a bad PR system, and bad management decisions. And of course, this all sets Intel up in a VERY good and enviable position. Intel has the leisure to develop new processes and additions at will, and releasing them to the public only as they feel threatened by AMD's developments.

As I see it at this point, unless A64 gains a QUICK foothold on the market, and the software developers support it by writing 64 bit optimized code, Intel has the future in their sights(and hands), and will remain dominant in the desktop CPU segment. AMD will fall further behind in their research, and eventually AMD will become a second-rate processor developer, and will never be able to truly compete for the "performance" crown again.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
September 5, 2003 1:40:38 PM

> Dont know yer guys beef with Intel, just a damned
> company that markets better has more money and has
> friends in the big OEM's oh and has 13+ fabs 2 on
> the go last I checked.

I have absolutely NO beef with intel... or AMD (well other than a total bs pr rating.) I just would like to see more real comp for intel AND amd to drive both companies futher and harder.

Shadus
September 5, 2003 2:10:15 PM

I agree with everything that you said, Groveling_Wyrm. ... Except the end bit.

Quote:
AMD will fall further behind in their research, and eventually AMD will become a second-rate processor developer, and will never be able to truly compete for the "performance" crown again.

As you said, <i>if</i> the Opteron and/or A64 don't end up catching on enough to take back a bit of the market and make AMD some money, then yeah AMD will probably fall behind in their processor R&D. But I find it hard to forsee AMD going back to being a second-rate processor developer.

I mean AMD is a pretty big company that processor development is only a small division of. I think AMD would rather just cut the red out of their budget by selling off their processor intellectual properties and stop producing processors themselves. They have plenty of other things that they <i>do</i> make money on to keep around a lame department that'll always be sapping their finances. Which is why I see another company eventually buying the right to produce Athlons (or use some of the tech, or whatever) instead of AMD becoming VIA. (Here's a scary thought: a VIA Athlon.)

But other than that tiny difference I completely agree with you. It's all about business. No matter how good a future Athlon may or may not perform, so long as the company itself is so piss poor then the quality of their product is inconsequential to their survival.

<pre><A HREF="http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20030905" target="_new"><font color=black>People don't understand how hard being a dark god can be. - Hastur</font color=black></A></pre><p>
September 5, 2003 3:05:56 PM

:D  this is funny.
AMD will release their new chips, which will be drooled over by enthusiasts alone... (a VERY small part of the market) and these guys moaning about the price of a P4- are you SERIOUSLY thinking you will be able to afford the new athlons when they are released?!!
Nope.... didnt think so.
Then Intel will release the Prescott, with a blaze of publicity and a blitz of advertising, most family systems will ship with this "amazing new Intel that you can burn cds with, rip music with, as it gets your kids into college, whilst it simultaneously walks the dog, does the dishes etc etc" (thats advertising talk there! :)  )....

and Intel will retain a massive chunk of the market, probably maturing the chip until it gathers appreciation from enthusiasts (much like the 800fsb HT P4's).

Its great that AMD have devoted fans, and Intel needs some competition to prevent it getting sloppy, but bashing Intel is just rediculous when you consider what they have brought to the pc world we all enjoy.

............................................
Render times? You'll find me down the pub...
a b à CPUs
September 6, 2003 7:43:40 AM

I will agree, Intel has brought some amazing new technologies to the world. However, with AMD being more of a "thorn" in Intel's foot, rather than a complete and truly consistent competitor, Intel has been lucky enough to remain the master of the CPU market. When they lost the race to 1 Ghz, Intel should have lost more marketshare, but AMD floundered an opportunity to strip Intel of MASSIVE amounts of marketshare, rather than 1-10 percent.

A better business would have been more effectual against Intel, and would have maximized on the opportunity and weakness that Intel had shown. And by bringing more competition to Intel, not only will Intel be forced to introduce new technologies quicker, but the competing company will surely have good offerings for us consumers too...

So, to sum it up, Intel has given us much, but they could have been forced to give us more, by more competition.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
September 6, 2003 10:18:32 AM

Somehow, I can't see it happen, no matter how the Scotty will will stink and dissipate as much heat as a nuclear reactor, AMD doesn't seem to me like a company that can rule a market...

Roses are <font color=red>red</font color=red>, violets are <font color=blue>blue</font color=blue>, post something stupid and I won't reply to you!
September 6, 2003 1:31:32 PM

It’s funny that you truly believe that Intel could have lost market share when the 1ghz race was lost and the willy was out. Intel is very future set in their business projections. You should take the time and listen to one of the web casts that they have for their quarterly results. They know what’s coming before we even consider it. Like IBM they are probably one of the best run companies around.

The willy was a bump and it was obvious they knew what the core was like compared to AMD's offerings since they got all major OEM's less HP to dump AMD before they even got into full production of the core. They were guaranteed sales just because of that. Also they can out produce AMD 12x over something that companies like Dell like. Dell “We need 300,000 of yer newest 3.2’s”. Intel “be there Monday”.

People that underestimate Intel as a business or their strategies need to take some more time and look at the company as a company not as a CPU like some people do.

-Jeremy


:evil:  <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=5341387" target="_new">Busting Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil: 
:evil:  <A HREF="http://service.futuremark.com/compare?pcm=1400777" target="_new">Busting More Sh@t Up!!!</A> :evil: 
September 6, 2003 3:41:44 PM

I predict the Commodore will make a stunning comeback and best intel and amd by 200-300%.

my sig left me for an Honorary Guru...
September 6, 2003 4:08:21 PM

Quote:
So it'd be even weirder to see nVidia producing Athlons in the future. They would practically produce entire PCs then. Graphics, sound, northbridge, CPU... It'd be weird, but it could be very cool. And then again it could just be spreading their resources into too many markets.


ROFL, nVidia reseraching, developing, & manufacturing Athlons instead of AMD!?!? That day would <b><i>ultimately</i></b> suck if/when nVidia ever had that kind of monopoly & marketing power. Y'all are correct, some legal countermeasures must be taken in order to prevent the hardware market to get so out of whack that one hardware company( or especially Graphics Chip developer) has THAT dominant of a hold that it can obliterate the competition like a breeze. We need competition to some extent. And actually, some monopolies are actually much better for the public than having competion in certain circumstances. But this circumstance does not apply.

In honesty, I'm not dissapointed at all with situation as of now. It's good for companies to work together to acheive the ultimate quality product, interfacing with one another is of vital importance. BUt if companies start forming such strong alliance where it beomes A + B + C vs. X + Y + Z, then that will be dreadful because each company will only provide decent support for its rival companions.


My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
September 6, 2003 4:17:31 PM

Quote:
And since this time, Intel has improved upon the new designs, added things such as SSE, SSE2, HT, etc... Intel has actually diversified their research and come up with some pretty interesting additions to their processors. I cannot say that I have seen as much from AMD, although they have come up with a few things.

Although this statement is definately true, AMD can't be entirely to blame for the lack of extra R&D. Intel just has so much more muscle power & resources than AMD that I am very surprised they were even capable of inventing thhe 3D-NOW extension technology.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
September 6, 2003 4:21:55 PM

Also, PopeGoldX has 4 threads that are on the frontpage of the threadlist here in the CPU forum. GROAN!!!!! Is this ever going to end Pope?????? I'm not trying to put the boy down for his opinions or anything, but every thread this dude posted is equivalent to "Intel sucks" or "AMD rules" I use mostly AMD myself, but I have plenty of good things to say about Intel too.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
September 7, 2003 3:48:24 AM

I read about that. Commodore is comming back real soon. Wirh the brand new C6400.
a b à CPUs
September 7, 2003 4:56:21 AM

I am not knocking Intel's marketing capabilities, nor their business practice. In fact, I believe that Intel has one of the best and most farsighted business practices in the market today. However, as a business owner myself, I have become practiced at spotting weaknesses in my competition. When Intel "hiccuped" and switched to the P4, they were at a weak spot. The real saving grace was, in fact, their marketing, and bullying power (IMO), and that is why AMD did not gain marketshare at that time.

However, as I had stated, a more aggressive company could have taken advantage of this, and moved in for more marketshare than AMD actually did grab. This period in time was AMD's "Golden opportunity" to grab the attention of the world, and they almost did, but they didn't quite get there.

AMD may not have had the production capabilities to produce as many processors as Intel, but they didn't need to either. All they had to do was produce as many processors as they could sell, and they could have sold more, with a more aggressive legal and marketing campaign, thus taking more marketshare. AMD failed to do this, thus my statement about a better company taking better advantage of this.

And to answer your other statement, I own stock in Intel. I know Intel's business strategies and for the most part, attempt to emulate many of these strategies in my own business practices, as they have many sound business strategies.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
a b à CPUs
September 7, 2003 4:59:34 AM

I agree with that statement, and in fact, was trying to extrapolate the same idea...

However, in making that statement, I was merely pointing out that Intel had much more R & D muscle to flex, and it showed in all these developments.

<font color=blue> Ok, so you have to put your "2 cents" in, but its value is only "A penny's worth". Who gets that extra penny? </font color=blue>
September 7, 2003 5:10:54 AM

Cool, I didn't realize that. Do you think AMD will pull off better marketting with their AMD64? Afterall, the Enthusiast community has been drooling over Hammer for more than 2 years now. Surely, some attentian has been drummed up in the marketting world by now. But then again, I could be completely wrong.

My OS features preemptive multitasking, a fully interactive command line, & support for 640K of RAM!
September 7, 2003 2:15:36 PM

Quote:
Afterall, the Enthusiast community has been drooling over Hammer for more than 2 years now.

Well, I don't know... Because of the delays, I get the impression that some of the drooling has already dried out...

Let's wait and see...

:evil:  <font color=red><b>M</b></font color=red>ephistopheles