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the death of wintel

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October 30, 2003 2:38:17 AM

Does anyone remember back when wintel was actually the system of choice of intelligent computer users? The blue screens of death, slow and expensive pentium platform and unstable meltdown prone AMD cpus? The terrible virus prone and hacker prone windows platform?

With the g5 and OS X, there is really no reason for anybody to be using wintel anymore, at least not intelligent, advanced users... My g5 has not crashed since I bought it, and my platform is virus and worm free, I laugh at all you wintel users... The g5 is 64-bit and kicks wintel's ass.

More about : death wintel

October 30, 2003 2:59:14 AM

Hummm... how fast is your G5. How much did you pay? That's a Mac right? What makes you say AMD processors are unstable?

Scout
700 Mflops in SETI!
October 30, 2003 3:02:18 AM

oh lookie here...a new troll.

Don't get me wrong, I find ppc970 quite interesting. Can't say the same for you though.

*plonk*

<i>I can love my fellow man...but I'm damned if I'll love yours.</i>
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October 30, 2003 5:02:50 AM

How long did it take you to finish the 5 or so games available for your mac?

Dichromatic for your viewing plesure...
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
October 30, 2003 6:05:47 AM

Don't feed the trolls..

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
October 30, 2003 6:07:43 AM

I say this G5 are too slow and to High price for what speed they are. When a Amd Proven faster when it has Dual cpu running. And I seen 90% of test. On 20 differnt sites. And apple disabling stuff on Intel and amd to make them look alot slower. Then having the same test done on a differnt site and having Intel and Amd or intel be 5% or even 20% faster on that same test of Amd of the same cpu.

So g5 shove your G5 (_|_)
October 30, 2003 6:46:05 AM

oh come on guys... don't scare the poor critter away...its more fun to teese them...



ASUS P4S8X - P4 2.4B - 2 x 512M DDR333 - ATI 9500 Pro(Sapphire) - WD 80G HD (8M Buffer) - SAMSUNG SV0844D 8G HD - LG 16X DVD - Yamaha F1 CDRW - Iomega Zip 250 int.
October 30, 2003 6:54:09 AM

We may not have a lot of pretties, but gosh darnit we've got bigger titties!


Oh baby yeah.
October 30, 2003 11:14:27 AM

*yawn* Here trolly trolly trolly...

I can honestly think of only one good reason to run a Windows OS period. Games. Once mac or linux gets a good selection of current, new games, I'll probally never run windows again, but on the other hand I don't see that happening anytime soon.

Let me know once you get to a two year uptime... that would be a good match for linux, although of course, by then the uptime (baring 1h+ power outages) will be much higher... funny, my uptime is longer than your os has been out...

Shadus
October 30, 2003 12:07:23 PM

As much as I like Linux and free/open-source software (I'm even running GIMP and OpenOffice at home) I still don't see Linux as being even close to acceptable for the common PC owner. It's just too complicated and there really are a lot of simple things missing still.

Ideally I'd like to see something replace Windows. I love M$ about as much as I loved my root canal. That aside though, I just don't see Linux as being that replacement.

As long as Linux is developed by and driven by a community that lauds itself for its technical prowess Linux simply won't have the necessary laymen driving advances in the simple little things that make an OS usable for non-experts. I hate to say it, but it's the Linux community itself that is Linux's own worst enemy. Until they can learn to get off of their high horses and come down to the level of a typical Windows user, Linux will never be easy enough to use for a typical Windows user, and thus will never croach into that market share in any meaningful way.

<pre><b><font color=red>I've always wondered why people liken the taste of blood to copper.
It tastes much more like iron to me.
<- :evil:  - :evil:  - :evil:  - :evil:  - :evil:  -></font color=red></b></pre><p>
October 30, 2003 12:45:19 PM

Nod, I'm in agreement for the most part :) 

I just prefer it for several reasons, 1 its customizeable to the extreme, 2 its fast as hell especially when you compile your stuff for your processor and hardware, 3 Its stable, 2 year uptimes arent uncommon in any variety of unix including linux.

I don't think it's so much that the developers are on a 'high horse' so to speak, but rather they don't have any expertise in the matter. It doesn't take technical skill to make a good interface it takes understanding ergonomics, style, and an artistic flair almost... something most technical people are entirely devoid of :p 

If you haven't tried Linux in the past year or so give suse a try, my mother set it up and uses it on her machine with me only going back in to optimize after it was entirely setup (compile hardware into kernal instead of using modules and yank a few things outta the startup scripts.) My mother is by no means technically above normal. She still confuses memory and drivespace :p  I personally went from Slack->Debian->Gentoo, but I prefer speed and configurability over ease of use.

Shadus
October 30, 2003 2:43:01 PM

oh cool, a mac troll, havent seen one of them in a long time. they are still as stupid as ever.

wpdclan.com cs game server - 69.12.5.119:27015
October 30, 2003 4:06:57 PM

Trust me, that's one troll from a user here. Let's just cuddle him.

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
October 30, 2003 4:23:40 PM

It isn't me, btw - I do make the odd mac nutcase post/reply from time to time, but under this name...

"Some mice have two buttons. Macintosh has one. So it's extremely difficult to push the wrong button." - Apple ad. circa 1984.
October 30, 2003 6:47:57 PM

Jobs doesn't even believe this crap. Troll is a superlative for this cat!

Where there's a will, there's a way-even when it comes to screwing up.
October 30, 2003 11:02:47 PM

<A HREF="http://www.tech-report.com/" target="_new"> TechReport </A> has a nice little article on their front page about mac. Apparantly, Apple will only offer security patches to it's newest os, Panther. Despite only being an upgrade to os X, that's no reason to not support older versions of os X. As terrible as Windows might be, at least they offer FREE security patches and fixes.

Quote:
The g5 is 64-bit and kicks wintel's ass

Oh, and by the way? The chip is 64 bit, Panther is not a true 64 bit os, it only has 64 bit extensions. So if you believed you were getting a fully functional 64 bit computer, you just got screwed, and you're going to have to wait till they release a true 64 bit os

Error: Keyboard not attached. Press F1 to continue
October 31, 2003 12:29:06 AM

yes micro$oft has to offer free patches because without them all windows systems would be broken from the PLETHORA of worms and viruses that are native to that OS...
October 31, 2003 12:35:33 AM

Lol, a troll who has no idea what he's talking about! This one's fun!
Now you see, a virus or worm is written by a mischevious programmer who probably doesn't use a mac cause he has a thing called a brain. Now, although your os may be perfect and all, it is still vulnerable to worms and virusses! The coding can have nothing to do with how well written the os is. Holy sh!t, ain't that a revelation?? Would u like me to write something to take down an OS X comp? It can be done.

The one and only "Monstrous BULLgarian!"
October 31, 2003 12:42:55 AM

I am sure that one day a pc user will get mad and write a virus for macs. Nothing is perfect.

<font color=blue>"You know, that my backstab attack does double the damage. I can make an off button for him." </font color=blue> :cool:
October 31, 2003 1:04:54 AM

I would if I wouldn't be arrested. Heheh

The one and only "Monstrous BULLgarian!"
October 31, 2003 2:48:31 AM

hehehe another idiot buys a mac! i have been running win98SE for over 3 years and i have NOT had to reformat it in that time period. its all about being a smart user and not jumping on every lame program that comes down the pike. use it like a competent person should and you wont have those problems, keep antivirus up to date, run a firewall, defrag once a week and dont open unknown emails with attachments, basic common sense. i have all kinds of games, apps, that i use on a daily basis, surf the web , etc... but i will give the mac its just dues, they are great for one thing..........they make a great boat anchor!

Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life Son.
October 31, 2003 2:59:34 AM

Quote:
As long as Linux is developed by and driven by a community that lauds itself for its technical prowess Linux simply won't have the necessary laymen driving advances in the simple little things that make an OS usable for non-experts. I hate to say it, but it's the Linux community itself that is Linux's own worst enemy. Until they can learn to get off of their high horses and come down to the level of a typical Windows user, Linux will never be easy enough to use for a typical Windows user, and thus will never croach into that market share in any meaningful way.

This is an extremely perspicacious observation. Linux is basically for geeks and old UNIX guys which make up an extremely small percentage of PC users. When Red Hat IPO'd they should have taken all that dough and put it into R&D and came out with an easy to use, widely available, and cheap Windows alternative. They didn't. All they did was package up something that you could get for free and charged $30 for it.

Here's an interesting thought. What if M$ got into the Linux game? They could make it better, easier to use, and provide good driver support. They could package it together with Windows with a handy partitioning tool so that everyone can have it both ways. Imagine. Microsoft Linux.

Okay, brain. You don't like me, and I don't like you, but let's get through this thing and then I can continue killing you with beer. -- Homer Simpson.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
October 31, 2003 3:05:35 AM

Try out Lindows one day; it doesnt get any easier than that really. Its not free, but its a hell of a lot cheaper than Windows + office, and arguably far superior as long as gaming is not your thing.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
October 31, 2003 3:21:45 AM

i have lindows 3.0 i got it for 8.95! it is ok, similar look to windows, has alot of mac shortcuts, but like you stated is weak in the games area, it was touted as built for broadband technology and would be lightning fast...BS! it didnt load my web pages any faster, i have cable connection, windows 98se was still faster. i still have the disc around somewhere....i will probably use it for a coaster.

Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life Son.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
October 31, 2003 3:32:03 AM

well, an OS is not likely to increase webpage rendering speeds :| but I've found Lindows pretty fast if you have enough RAM. I gave it a testride on 512 MB system, and there really wasnt a whole lot to complain about. Using Opera isnt any slower than my opera under windows. But then, any browser, be it opera, mozilla even firebird loads slower than IE on windows, cause 90% of IE is already loaded when you boot windows. Hardly a fair comparison or a real issue IMHO. Just load Opera upon boot and get the same effect :)  Opera rocks hard btw, once you've tasted tabbed browsing,mouse gestures, and popup killing, there is nothing that will make me switch to IE again.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
October 31, 2003 3:50:51 AM

I was thinking the same thing. Once(If) Linux becomes a big enough threat, the best way to fight it would be to join it. MS Windows LX.

<font color=blue>
The farce is ended; draw the curtain </font color=blue>
October 31, 2003 3:56:19 AM

well to each his own, i guess im just old and set in my ways, new things usually dont work for me, i am used to my system the way it is, and i do minimal things on it anyway, once in awhile i do intensive gaming, flight sims, 1st person shooters....etc... and it performs great for me as is, thing is, the other operating systems i have tried wouldnt play my games, due to various problems, winxp was a prob with my sidewinder joystick, no xp driver, winxp said it had one already, but it was unstable as hell, one of my games wouldnt work unless i was in win98 compatability mode and then it was unstable, linux was complete gibberish to me, and lindows was a pain, didnt have drivers for all my stuff, had to try and find them on their site, just to find out they didnt exist, etc....you get the picture, so i went back to win98se and everything works like its supposed to, and i am happy again. moral of the story, if it aint broke, dont fix it:)  dont get me wrong, im glad this stuff worked for you and others, just wasnt my cup of tea. i have often wondered about the people complaining about the instability of win98se and problem this and problem that, i have never experienced these problems with my system, i am an auto tech by trade, ASE Certified Master with 23 years experience, i liken it to people who neglect their cars, then complain that they are always breaking down, computers are much the same, maintain them and take care of them and they will work. do the routine maintnence on them, defrag, antivirus, firewall, excercise common sense when downloading and opening email, dont rush out and install every little program that comes down the pike...do this and everything should be fine, and yes i know things will eventually fail in my computer, but i am confident they will be of a hardware nature, not software or operating system related, no probs for 3 years now.

Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life Son.
October 31, 2003 9:27:59 AM

well Allanon you are right Most people are Dumb on installing software. Even if they run Mac Crap computers. They think there super fast and end up in a month or so super slow.
October 31, 2003 11:07:29 AM

> Here's an interesting thought. What if M$
> got into the Linux game? They could make it
> better, easier to use, and provide good
> driver support.

Like windows? *snicker* Uh, thanks but no thanks. Remember ME? 98FE? 95? I'll admit 98SE and XP are pretty fair, as far as windows goes, but Microsoft is known for making unuseable crap that the hardware community has to jump through hoops to make useable drivers for.

Also based on your comment I'd say you haven't used linux in AGES, most default kernels now load and configure as much hardware as Windows in many cases and when it comes to older hardware considerably more. Like I said, my entirely non-technical mother set it up.

> They could package it together with Windows
> with a handy partitioning tool so that
> everyone can have it both ways. Imagine.
> Microsoft Linux.

Shadus
October 31, 2003 12:59:21 PM

It easy to say Linux/macOSX is better that Windows XP as they are post-unix but none of them make real improvement just base them self on unix 1 and best os for long. Personnaly i found windows 2003 better that unix-post unix OS they are fast port to many platform and the best of all MS dont fear cutting in old stuff.

On a possible treat to wintel never in historie you can go vs intel and Ms in the same time bolt are at 90% of market share.Exception Us anti-trust.

I dont like french test
October 31, 2003 1:10:29 PM

actually, i've been running this windows install for over two months and never updated a thing...never had a virus or worm or trojan or anything. Like I said before, nobody cares enough about OSX users to write any sort of virus or worm for them.

RDRAM = ENEMY
October 31, 2003 3:06:50 PM

Quote:
Also based on your comment I'd say you haven't used linux in AGES

True. I haven't touched it in over a year. My hair has barely grown back from me pulling it all out. My point is simply that Microsoft has the $$$ to do R&D and marketing. They can also bully their way into the Linux market and shove it down our throats the way they do with Windows. And if Microsoft put out Linux then I'm sure every software maker and their mothers would then jump on the bandwagon and produce software for it.

Hell, the whole reason I even tried Linux was because the older versions of Windows were so damned buggy. Then Windows 2000 came out and now XP. Once they deep-sixed the DOS shell, these OS's got significantly more stable. I am now at peace with Microsoft and accept the fact that XP is the best thing out there. But I will give Linux another shot.

Okay, brain. You don't like me, and I don't like you, but let's get through this thing and then I can continue killing you with beer. -- Homer Simpson.
October 31, 2003 8:17:14 PM

Nobody would write a worm or virus for OS X because it would be TOO HARD.. that's the problem with a SECURE, well-constructed, OS!
October 31, 2003 8:54:14 PM

Right, that's also why Apple just released some security patches...for their 'SECURE, well-constructed, OS!' Also, the only reason why it would be at all more difficult to write a worm or virus for OSX is because all the good writers have focused on the wintel group due to it's greater share of the market, therefore making them learn new methods and holes in the OSX structure. OSX is hardly perfect, just nobody cares enough to take the time to learn how to corrupt so few computers...if you wanted to randomly kill as many people as possible, would you attack a professional football stadium or a pop warner football stadium???

RDRAM = ENEMY
October 31, 2003 10:59:51 PM

that's bull! The best coders have always been on the unix platform.. if it were possible to create a worm or virus for OS X someone would have done it by now.. As for security updates, every OS needs them, even OPENBSD has updates...
November 1, 2003 12:01:24 AM

You are such a tool.

First the best programmers don’t stick to one OS, they can make their code as portable as possible or as specific as needed. I’ve programmed mac, unix, windows, vms, etc and the mac is no special platform. Although the unix roots of OSX and recent hardware improvements have made the mac a bit more attractive.

As for mac viruses there have been a few…

<A HREF="http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data..." target="_new">http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data...;/A>
<A HREF="http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data..." target="_new">http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data...;/A>
<A HREF="http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data..." target="_new">http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data...;/A>
<A HREF="http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data..." target="_new">http://securityresponse.symantec.com/avcenter/venc/data...;/A>

The rule of thumb is develop for the least common denominator and 5% is a bit too small of a market. Especially if your writing a game and only 5% of that 5% plays games.

Dichromatic for your viewing plesure...
November 1, 2003 3:34:32 AM

Guys, leave it alone. The guy's a user here playin' us, for sure.

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
November 1, 2003 5:34:36 PM

You must be right, no one is truly that much of a maclover. Especially when we have so much fact to disprove everything he says.

RDRAM = ENEMY
November 1, 2003 6:19:48 PM

Actually there are MUCH worse zealots that almost would die for Apple. I simply base myself on how someone that loves Macs would visit PC forums to bug us. Troll.

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
November 1, 2003 6:30:48 PM

What do they see in Apples that they would die for?? If Apples didn't cost so much and offered better performance and offered more customization and more software I might actually go for one...but there is no reason. Maybe G5_inside can help me with this: Why would anybody want an Apple?

RDRAM = ENEMY
November 1, 2003 6:37:41 PM

just wondering...

How old are you?

Do you even own a G5?


If it isn't a P6 then it isn't a procesor
110% BX fanboy
November 1, 2003 8:12:19 PM

why own a apple?

If you want to actually get things done with your computer, not have to worry about worms or viruses or an insecure OS.. Long shelf life.. apple systems are good for many years after you buy it.. and best of all.. They are just faster..

Why is it faster? Unix command line is always faster than NT command line, and the g5 is a faster chip in general.. so you get a faster chip running a faster OS. Trust me.. PCs even FEEL slow.. In OS X everything is responsive and quick.. in windows XP, even on a 3ghz + system (which is slower than a 1.6 ghz g5 even!) it runs like molasses.
November 1, 2003 8:25:58 PM

Can you at least PROVE anything you're saying?

How can I buy a G5 if I get no proof that it beats the 3GHZ+ systems!

Oh and btw, how can we be posting on the boards here and having fun if you say viruses run amok and ruin everything?

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
November 1, 2003 8:32:34 PM

i love how you didnt answer my question. Ya ur righ man apple runs the world, thats why 90+ percent of people run pc's.


If it isn't a P6 then it isn't a procesor
110% BX fanboy
November 1, 2003 8:41:18 PM

90% of the world isn't smart either..

Apple satisfies a niche of true computer users, who want the best system for their money.. Unfortunately, some people are either too ignorant or, sadly, too poor to afford the superior platform.
November 1, 2003 9:46:47 PM

If there faster why on PC Mag and PC Mac saying AMD faster. Start reading please. Read other fourms. One thing to remember is this computers Leap frog each other. One day Mac. Might be the fastest and the Next Intel and then Amd. Its game to each of them. Its like the cars Fastest with Lowest gas Mileage.

Its the need for speed.
November 1, 2003 10:40:42 PM

Amazing that a post with so little thought could have so many replies.

In regards to any future posting by obvious trolls.....don't feed the troll....geez

"We are Microsoft, resistance is futile." - Bill Gates, 2015.
November 2, 2003 2:01:57 AM

Yea.. i would like to see G5 guy provide some PROOF next he's on... but that won't happen.

I personally would love to see apple out do intel or amd... but i don't see that happening...i have looked around for evidence that the G5 is faster,(no point in looking for anything else as stability or easy of use is all subjective) and only found a few things where only the dual 2 Ghz G5(because apple is too STUPID to alow for people to choose dual 1.6 or 18...or choose ANY type of variation on any of their products for that matter, but thats a whole other thread) could beat out a dual xeon or P4 3.x Ghz or some AMD's(can't remember what AMD's where used)

At that, it only beat them out in a few of the test, and only maginally...

If Pather is all that it is made out to be... then perhaps some of the tests can be updated now and may show some real compition...

But thats only for a few weeks, till AMD or Intle release the next thing. and it'll be months before 10.4 will be out and that little lead that Mac MIGHT of had will be all but GONE... and like always, they will tail behind for another year or so before they leep frog to a on Par possition.



<b>on the verge of catastohy (y1.999...k)</b>
ASUS P4S8X - P4 2.4B - 2 x 512M DDR333 - ATI 9500 Pro - WD 80G HD(8M) - SAMSUNG SV0844D 8G HD - LG 16X DVD - Yamaha F1 CDRW
November 2, 2003 3:30:18 AM

The college will update next year to Panther due to licenses and support dropping.
Oh well, hopefully it'll be good.

Jaguar actually CRASHES often! We were doing Design exams in InDesign and many had crashed systems. But it's so bad with OSX IMO, because it quits and completely destroys your work. It does it outta nowhere too! I was damn lucky to have saved, because one minute after I finished my exam and was revising, it crashed. Lucky save!

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
November 2, 2003 9:46:28 AM

You only get crashes because the Psychic Engine™ in the G5 realises that you are a PC user and punishes you for using an inferior platform.

When you see sense and join the Master Race, your Macs will love you and never crash again.

"Some mice have two buttons. Macintosh has one. So it's extremely difficult to push the wrong button." - Apple ad. circa 1984.
!