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27" monitors

Last response: in Computer Peripherals
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December 13, 2010 7:32:50 AM

I'm considering buying an LCD monitor. I started looking and liked the idea of a big 27" monitor for my computer room. I have a glass open top L shaped desk so I have room. 50lb weight limit. I currently have an IIyama Vision master 454(HM903DT B) CRT (working from a gigabyte 8800gt 512mb vid card if it matters) and have never owned an LCD or anything besides crts. I'm considering finally getting one. What are the realities of the current 27" monitors. I understand a bit about them from reading stuff (I think) but I can't quite tell enough to see what I'm choosing from enough for me to make a purchase or am struggling for some reason. I started comparing the Asus VK278q and HP 2710 since they caught my eye for one reason or another at first and have been going over statistics and the aspects of monitors for about the last day or two to try to figure out enough to understand the monitors to give myself the knowledge to actually make a purchase. I was wondering if anyone could help explain the differences of the monitors and what to look for and not look for? All of it seems to be garbled in exaggerations market grub so it's hard to tell. For instance those two monitors claim to be 16.7m color but I have seem things indicate they might or might not be. Most things said no but one thing generically indicated that some of the technology improved and made me wonder if they were just newer models and the 16.7 was accurate compared to the 16 or 16.2 label somehow. I know most of them are TN but i don't know that much bout what it means. Only what I have read in the last two days. All help would be appreciated. A break down would be great. I'm looking for what would be practically and what the technology means. I've read some of the stuff here but I still felt I should ask. Probably thought I could ask more specifically than this but it's not turning out that way.8)

I'm specifically looking at ones between 250 - 400 or 400 and below. I know they are cheaper but I'm on a budget so I'm trying to pick straws between what i can get. So I'm trying to find out stuff to avoid problems especially with the monitor and get the nicest one I can get. I mostly play wow currently and would love to watch TV and movies on it. Eye problems are a concern so large text or enlarging of text is good(partly why I want a 27" so I can have stuff enlarged on a bigger surface for my eyes). And the most functionality possible is good. Not sure how much image quality changes between them so I don't know if I can go for the most features or is one going to look a lot better. Or would general quality lead me to want to get one because the others would have issues of some sort visually? not sure how the technology is practically.

Other consideration. I'm assuming something like the OLEDs won't be in my price range for at least the next 5-10 years or more or anything similar sadly. If they will be I may get or wait for one of those if it's less than a year. 8p

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a b C Monitor
December 13, 2010 12:10:42 PM

They don't make OLED monitors yet so don't worry about that.

The only thing you need to be concerned about is which type of LCD screen. There is 3; TN, VA, and IPS.

TN is the cheapest panel type, only cappable of 256k colors, crappy viewing angles especially in the vertical range, but has a little faster response time. Manufacturers report 16.7 million possible colors because all TN panels emply dithering (basically displaying a checkerboard of colors to mimick colors it cannot display, the overall effect isn't very good)

VA is not a common panel type. Its not the cheapest and its not the best either, kinda of a middle ground and has been ignored in the monitor market since most people are looking for cheap and professionals are looking for the best. Many TVs use this panel type though. There different types of VA panels; MVA and PVA and there are different variants of both. S-PVA panels are professional quality but samsung has stopped developing it. MVA is cheaper and used in a few monitors. VA panels are 8-bit and has 16.7 million colors without dithering, they have good viewing angles, and their static contrast ratio is higher (actually higher, not dynamic contrast marketing grub). They have the slowest response time of all the panel types but good enough for games.

IPS is the last type. H-IPS is preferred by professionals because of their color accuracy, low gamma shift, and more uniform colors. They have response time almost as good as TN panels, the widest viewing angles you can find, and contrast ratio second to only the vest VA panels. Any IPS panel is at least 8-bit (16.7 million colors) some more expensives ones are 10-bit (10.7 billion colors). However this is also the most expensive panel type, nearly twice as expensive as any TN panel of the same size. There is e-IPS which stands for "economic", it is a more affordable version of H-IPS with nearly all the benefits.

27" is a hard place to look for mointors. Theres only 2 types on monitors currently available. 27" TN panels with 1920x1200 resolution or the 27" H-IPS monitors with 2560x1440 resolution which cost $800 - $1000.

There are plenty of good 23" - 24" 1080P monitors I can recommend, but at 27", it is either the cheapest or the best.
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December 13, 2010 5:49:06 PM

So If I know the viewing angle is going to be straight on does it matter if the viewing angle is less(or is it that bad?). Or are the other panel types that much better(I'll only need to consider if the stand tilts slightly downward for my sitting arrangement and if it's enough for the width of the screen I"m assuming. And the bad viewing angle might be good for privacy. (lol not sure if that's a consideration. 8p Not saying that is what I should get but I thought it was funny.). Would that make a weaker 27"ok? And is that better for HD since it's native resolution(I'm assuming). I've seem some of the smaller ones but I thought they were mostly TNs. I guess I didn't look at enough 8). I thought the 27" screen size would be nice for my eyesight and stuff. Would a smaller one with the other panel be that much better? How big of a difference is the quality practically for say movies? Are they bad at anything or good or are the the better panel types blatant improvements? Is gtg ratings that important for games also? and how much is the new 3d thing going to matter?

And what is the difference between companies? Is there any? I saw a 24" Asus for the same as the 27" with the new 3D. Again how big is the difference in viewing between the TN and non TN. I think it was TN also so which reminds me.. is TN bad at 3d or is the same as other aspects of the monitor when switching panel type?(or would that have to be non TN for a 3d monitor. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...) How does it affect you practically? Will you notice it in movies badly? I'm assuming WOW won't be hurt by it? But will the other stuff? And are there any big downsides of the other panel types to worry about?

Odd consideration here I have to worry about. I couldn't find much about tilts in any searches. I sit in a large comforter chair that is light enough to move around to get in and out and it site nice and low compared to the desk. My arms are slightly facing up(maybe 5-15 degrees) when I type on the below desk keyboard slide out. Do the normal tilt stands go low enough to compensate for that. How much do they tilt down normally? At the distance I don't think it will have to tilt down much. I will have the monitor as back far as possible.

Sorry if this sounds funny or really simple. I have some health problems that slow my mind down a bit. I meant to ask much more specific questions about stuff but my mind just won't spew it out atm....8) Makes it more drawn out when I type too. Can't seem to shorten it up nicely.

edit again: I forgot. If I got a 3d monitor would I even be able to utilize it without special vid cards or something? And what about the HD. Can normal older PC run it or do I need hardware for it? I have the 1066 quad core that was popular some time back from intel and a motherboard of the same era. Do I have to watch anything on newer monitors in regards to hardware?
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a c 195 C Monitor
December 13, 2010 11:29:39 PM

Viewing angles will matter even when you are sitting right in front of the monitor. Some people may not care too much though. For example, I have an Asus VK246H TN panel monitor which I use a few hours per month. When I sit directly in front of it and simply rolls my eye to look at different sections of the screen I can notice some color shifting. However, I have friends who did the same thing with my monitor and either it didn't really bother them at all, or they did not notice the shifting. To me it was easily notice, but not enough to irritate me since it was only a $240 monitor.

Here's a comparison of IPS vs TN panels. The IPS panel is on the left.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BG7XNwbUYEM&feature=rela...

I believe monitors with tilt capabilities can be adjusted by 10° - 15° in the up and down direction

All 3D capable monitors run at 120Hz and they all use TN panels. You need to purchase a nVidia 3D kit which has the video card and glasses. While ATI Radeon cards are capable of 3D, the drivers have not been developed yet.
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December 14, 2010 4:52:01 PM

Do you guys know of any videos comparing or showing the Asus VK278Q or the HP2710. I can't find anything on those for some reason. Especially that asus one? it's like a ghost of a monitor when it comes to searches. Any idea how that 10Mill dynamic contrast works out or what it does?What does it do on a more technical level. Why did they put it in there. Or was it just for market gimmicks. I'm assuming it fits with the monitors functionality somehow? Like compensating for something else in the monitor or something like that or is it to get a lot more brightness for some other intended use of the monitor? Any idea? Is there some other more technical reason they put it in that would tell how the monitor works practically?
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a b C Monitor
December 14, 2010 6:01:04 PM

Let me explain static contrast first and why you would want it. Contrast is good, higher the better.

Static contrast is the difference in luminecence between a off pixel and an on pixel.
Screens with higher static contrast can produce very dark blacks while still produce good whites and grey tones at the same time.
This is desireable in video games and movies with night scenes which are very dark but theres always some grey details or light sorces for you to look at.
Screens with lower static contrast will produce the details with a lower visibility or rather produce the blacks as greys instead to preserve visibility.

Dynamic contrast on the other hand is actually a completely different measurement.
It is a measurement of the brightest whites versus the blackest blacks. Not produced at the same time but produced at different times.
The backlight is maxed out when taking measurement for white and the backlight is turned nearly off or actually off for measurement of blacks.
By enabling dynamic contrast the monitor would turn brightness up and down depending on how much black/white is on the screen. Dark scenes would dim the backlight to produce blacker blacks and bright scenes would up the backlight to produce whiter whites.

The end result is a screen flickering in brightness depending on how bright or dark the scene is.
If you are playing a game and in a really really dark scene. You would notice the scene is now even darker. Since the entire screen loses brightness by the same factor, everything loses visibility. It doesn't make greys and light sources pop out like static contrast would.

I my experience bright screens appear blindly bright and dark scenes appear impossibly dark to a point I can't see anything. There is also the problem when there is fast trasnsitions between dark and bright scenes which results in the backlight going up and down constantly, like flickering in brightness.

Bascially dynamic contrast is worthless. Its doesn't matter in the same way static contrast does and it improves nothing you want. Dynamic contrast does produce a really really big number to print on boxes.
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December 17, 2010 10:18:40 PM

Here is another question slightly off the topic.

Is It possible to use the new 3d stuff on my Iiyama Vision master pro 454 (HM903DT B). Can you use it without the new Nvidia hardware with just software on other vid cards? I have an 8800GT. Or could it be used with "proper" hardware etc. I was trying to see if it could be used with my setup through more open means besides just sold stuff. Not sure if anyone else has written software to do stuff like that seperately from major companies etc. And if it can be run in 32bit windows xp?

I'm still looking at LCDs. Going to go to a store to do visual comparisons.
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