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Anand 64-Bit Windows Preview

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February 7, 2004 6:28:04 AM

I don't know if anyone has posted this yet, don't think so, but Anandtech has posted a preview of the 64-Bit Windows Preview, including benchmarks.
http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.html?i=1961
"The actual performance under Windows XP 64-bit Preview showed great promise, but it is still something of a mixed bag. We were impressed that the CPU, Floating Point, and memory ALL showed performance improvement in XP64 compared to regular XP... We were also impressed with the 15%+ improvement in Media Encoding when running the same 32-bit encoding program under XP and XP64. Performance of current 32-bit games under SP64, however, was below expectations."


Anxiously awaiting yamhill....is it here yet?
February 7, 2004 10:53:35 AM

I think it was posted alright.

It's an interesting promise. However, the gaming benchmarks are so terribly dismal (this is really dismal, 4-51% slower or 20% on average) that no sane gamer would consider using XP64 right now.

Until they've ironed out their drivers, that is.
February 7, 2004 11:01:01 AM

Is not just graphic driver is every driver around.unless POW64 make some miracle.

Just to show bad
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February 7, 2004 12:16:45 PM

The software is not ready for a smooth transition to 64-bit technology yet. Hopefully, we'll be seeing software that gives 64-bit more of a boost in a matter of few months... (or maybe several). Right now, if you try to exploit 64-bit, you'll end up with bigger disadvantages than the rather small advantages. Gaming performance is lousy. :frown:

In any case, new technologies usually require a maturing time until they're truly worthwhile.
February 7, 2004 1:28:24 PM

What I noticed, somewhat, is on the more processor oriented benches, the preview showed some impressive results...especially impressive were the media encoding benches.

Where the preview did poorly was games. Games are often notorious for showing performance according to video card as much as or more than processor. So, the *driver* needing most work right now is the video driver. My guess is nVidia already has significant updates in progress and 3-4 months will show major improvements, bringing Win64 at least up to par with XP32.

Refer to Anands comments about the earlier preview they tested when A64 first came out little more than 4 months ago....the difference is significant and I fully expect a similar performance improvement in the next 3-4 months.

Mark-

<font color=blue>When all else fails, throw your computer out the window!!!</font color=blue>
February 7, 2004 3:34:00 PM

These results don't really surprise me, with the exception of the media encoding.. +15% is a *lot*, more than 2 cpu speed grades (!), for just changing the OS and running old 32 bit code through an extra emulation layer (WOW64). Impressive; I can't wait what a 64 bit codec will do. It may well ruin intel's last benchmarking stronghold for good.

As for the gaming results; I think its obvious either those video drivers are immature (likely) or the windows 64 AGP drivers need work (also likely). I wouldnt expect 32 bit games to gain all that much -if anything-, but a >20% performance drop is not something that is to be expected. I wouldnt draw any conclusions yet (remember those early K8 ES benchmarks ?).

>no sane gamer would consider using XP64 right now

No sane gamer should run a (early) beta windows, unless to just satisfy his curiousity.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 7, 2004 3:40:49 PM

BTW, I just saw this linked on aces:

Quote:
Will Half-Life 2 have any special optimizations for 64-bit processors?

Gabe Newell: I would expect we would run about 30% faster clock for clock comparing an Athlon running 32-bit code and an Athlon 64 running 64-bit code. Release of the 64-bit client will be gated on MS releasing 64-bit Windows.


I'd guess Gabe would be in a position to give estimates. To put this into persprective, +30% is as much difference as there is between Unreal II scores of a P42.4C and a P43.4C. Ouch...

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 7, 2004 4:59:21 PM

I dont see why encoding goes faster on win XP64 if the codec are just 32 bit they still do the same instruction and they have install 32 bit driver in that the case there about 50% extra performance on the OS side as the apps dont go faster tecnically.

I under the impression that win XP64 is faster that win XP.MS seem very friendly with free trial version and backward support.Backward support was so important as HP will not be in a rush to introduce 64 bit driver for there printer scanner ...For software support like 3DS it may take a very long time.I under the impression that the final version will be release before 2004 Q4 like there a rush or something.

Just to show bad
February 7, 2004 5:00:29 PM

I think he might be giving the best case scenario there; I thought 30% was a little beyond reach... Time will tell, though... (how can he actually truly estimate this, anyway?... does he have the very-latest drivers?... how can he?...)

In any case, high numbers like those suggest that Intel must be working with a AMD64-compatible extension set or they will be in serious trouble in the next few years or so.
February 7, 2004 5:05:45 PM

One more thing: be careful with that quote. It refers to a comparison between a regular Athlon (probably Barton) to an A64 running 64-bit code - however, Athlons and A64s are already highly different. A64s are already much faster per clock than Athlons...
February 8, 2004 11:14:06 AM

>It refers to a comparison between a regular Athlon
>(probably Barton) to an A64 running 64-bit code

Would be a meaningless comparison; its not impossible, but if that is what he meant, its an inappropriate answer to the 64 bit support question.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 8, 2004 11:35:41 AM

That is what he said, yes. The aceshardware forum has lots more info.

I mean, 20 or so of those 30% are because A64 is faster than AXP...
February 8, 2004 11:53:01 AM

I read the thread on aces'. I think the only thing that is really certain, is we don't know what he meant. i choose to believe he compared A64 in 32 bit to A64 in 64 cause its the only relevant comparison, and because 30% is not all that unlikely if you are talking about executing 3D engine code, not necessarely resulting frame rates (where lots of other things play a role, most notably videocards/drivers/..). Since he wouldnt have had access to fully developped GPU and OS drivers, he would only been able to give a credible estimate of his game engine performance.

but feel free to believe the other interpretation. Time will tell, as always

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 8, 2004 11:22:46 PM

We know what he ment. Gabe is not in the habit of comparing apples to mars probes. Anyone who tries to say that he is not talking about improvements due to 64 bit, is just being an intel fanboy. Sorry Mephistopheles but, while you might say Valve is being over-enthusiastic, or that this perf may not translate into fps you cant say he has no ability to compare.
February 9, 2004 12:11:55 AM

Should I be insulted with that post of yours or what?

Quite honestly though, there are two logical possibilities here. Either he doesn't know how to compare 64-bit and 32-bit performance on the same processor, or the guy can't appropriately answer a question - because his english is misleading, yes! No doubt about that.

There is no way in hell that you're going to convince me that I'm a fanboy because I'm being careful in interpreting everything I read. The sentence he used <i>was in no way precise</i>, so don't go telling me that I should trust it to be one way or another because we should have faith in the almighty Gabe. Don't you sometimes think about the possible meanings of what you're reading? Or do you use your faith in other people to guide your understanding?

Sorry about being a bit agressive here, but I don't recall calling anyone at all a fanboy. This has been, until now, a perfectly reasonable discussion. You started throwing insults around... Explaining them only by your trust in the infallible Gabe. I'm not saying the guy's incompetent at all; I'm just admitting the real possibility that his answer should be understood slightly differently. Like P4Man. I could be right; you could be right, but don't go around calling anyone who considers alternative interpretations a fanboy... this is not a welcome attitude.

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Mephistopheles on 02/09/04 00:15 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
February 9, 2004 12:33:59 AM

Since I have heard the same numbers for a Doom 3 port to 64 bit, and seem to remember your name on the same post, who is kidding who. Yes indeed you are very polite so maybe calling you an intel fanboy isn't proper. Lets just say that if an anti Amd viewpoint is possible, you are there.
February 9, 2004 6:38:39 AM

A 64 bit doom3 port ? that is news to me.. got a link?

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
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