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Omid Editorial

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February 18, 2004 3:19:57 PM

http://www.tomshardware.com/column/20040218/index.html

Interesting read atleast, but i think this is more more speculations and personal opinion than it is about facts..

Personally i don't agree with the editorial and he only looked at the first side of the coin, there are also Irking self righteous Intel lovers. Personally i think AMD made a marketing mistake about the 64bit matter - they should instead have advertised what was previously unique to notebooks - aka. Cool 'n Quiet. The 64 bit part is mainly for the cool-factor and a nice addition for future performace increases.

I really don't agree with Omid on the matter about that AMD should be the low end <cheap> brand they are today - and their strategy have clearly changed - from top to bottom not from bottom to top... Give them credit for atleast trying to do so! :) 

If AMD can maintain current Marketshare of 15% and maintain the increased ASP's on processors i think i know which way would be more profittable...

Omid speaks about low-end segment, a place where AMD clearly do not belong..for 2 reasons:

1)AMD can't compete with the celeron marketing//coorporate wise

2)AMD's "celeron" chips perform a whole lot better than Intels intels celeron chips.

So where should AMD put themselves?...that's right in the mainstream segment.

Then there's the FX chip a niche product which deserves it's place the high end market/enthusiasts - they can still sell those babies in limited quantities but they earn alot
for each unit sold.

More about : omid editorial

February 18, 2004 3:34:19 PM

I also think omid misses the ball a few times. he brings up a few correct issues, but fails to see the bigger picture. I posted this on Aces':

> The 64
> bit stuff and who did it first is not critical

No, not who did it first, but it is critical that intel is doing it as well. Without AMD64, they wouldnt have done it, and this is definately not irrelevant. One of the "victories" for AMD lies not in having been the first, or having intel clone its ISA now, but in making sure there will still be a x86 market 10 or even 20 years from here in which they can compete. Without AMD64 there would never have been this market in the first place, and everything would have moved towards IA64.

As usual Omid rants about fanboy feelings, but fails to see the relevant issues. (opteron succesfully entering the tier 1 servermarket, technological innovation beyond just the 64 bit such as ondie MC, HyperTransport, cool& quiet, SOI,..)

I had an email exchange with him once, not a year ago, in which he proclaimed it would be better for AMD to ignore the tier 1/2 market all together, and focus on its fanbase or something. Go figure..

-- what new idea ?

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 18, 2004 3:39:23 PM

I think its the most awful editorial I've seen in THG. What is he talking about?
My main gripe is his ridiculous (imo) opinions of AMD and Linux. He says that Linux is the future - and soon, and is nasty about amd because it is the enthusiasts' choice. But surely Linux is the enthusiasts' choice also?
Also he argues AMD could have owned in Linux, forget windows. Clearly he is a bit stupid. Does he SERIOUSLY think AMD could have survived this long (and be winning) had it stuck to Linux?? My Dad wouldnt have a clue what it is, and in fact nor would average joe buyer! Even the enthusiasts (eg on this board) for majority run xp, not linux. So where is AMD supposed to get its buyers??

To me the article comes across as linux / intel fanboy -ism, nothing more. It just reads as a hastily typed rant at AMD, and for what?

IMO, I don't understand how this got onto the site.

XP2000, 256ddr 2100ram, GF4 MX440, XP Pro
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February 18, 2004 3:44:57 PM

Toms try to explain few thing to AMD useur.I guess he can say bye to half of click/day.By now aces forum is allready bashing toms like is Satan.

The list of thing toms will be call

stupid
clueless
how have you receive
Does andy suck good.
What a pile of drivel
He's useless and offensive
The man is a complete idiot
pompous self inflated Omid


Edit new insult add release 1.11

Come on amd flamer Aces have found about 10 time more insult.<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by juin on 02/18/04 02:56 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
February 18, 2004 3:51:10 PM

The man is a complete idiot. I thought this was understood. He's gotta be the biggest fanboy I've ever seen of course he would not see it that way.

He lives in a delusional world, a very delusional world indeed.

If I glanced at a spilt box of tooth picks on the floor, could I tell you how many are in the pile. Not a chance, But then again I don't have to buy my underware at Kmart.
February 18, 2004 3:56:46 PM

Oh for the love of god... cry me a river...Omid said AMD is in trouble.......BOO HOO frikkin HOO!

Here, take a tissue after finishing whining about that editorial!


<pre>See, I can get pissed too! </pre><p>--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol:  <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Eden on 02/18/04 12:59 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
February 18, 2004 4:14:29 PM

Cheer up Eden, I'd say anyone defending that delusional rant needs a little more than a tissue.

Just think of it as constructive critisism.

If the guys going to voice his strong (how ever misguided) opinion on how bad amd is he can expect a little backlash. how else is the guy ever going to learn?

If I glanced at a spilt box of tooth picks on the floor, could I tell you how many are in the pile. Not a chance, But then again I don't have to buy my underware at Kmart.
February 18, 2004 4:24:32 PM

It wasn't what he wrote that bothered me, it was the way in which he wrote it. If we look at the gist of the article, Intel is bigger than AMD so AMD is in trouble, nothing's changed. If you check the semantics of the article though, it reads like it was designed to piss people off. After reading this one and the old whitebox one (from around new years?) I think he enjoys it. And the fact that the Time's checks stuff over and you don't is not something to be proud of.
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February 18, 2004 5:03:22 PM

Hmmm, what a short memory Omid has. I recall nay-sayers expounding at great length about how we don't need 32 bit on the desktop. I remember 640k pain in the ass barriers due to short sighted views. Let the 64 bits come. There is always a better way to do something (like risk). 64 bit processing will be massified regardless of Omid being happy with his P4. We will see benefits of the migration! It is our desire.
February 18, 2004 6:22:49 PM

I just think that if you put what is essentially an editorial at the top of the homepage, then people will think it is the view of the whole site's staff, much like if a newspaper writer wrote a story about how great nuclear bombs are, and it was on the front page, there'd be uproar - and it would never happen.

TBH I just think it reflects badly on THG - already known to love intel over amd.

XP2000, 256ddr 2100ram, GF4 MX440, XP Pro
February 18, 2004 7:34:07 PM

>Omid said AMD is in trouble

He is entitled to his opinion wether or not AMD is in trouble (personally, I doubt it. an incompatible IA32e would have spelled trouble, not this), and like I said, he makes a few valid points; but I'm not sure if language such as:
Quote:
They are the freaks of low-cost computing, the poor, downtrodden users of products that never seem to be able to match PR numbers to actual performance, now almost beaten into marginality for all time.

is anything but drivel, trolling and showing imaturity. Not to mention a complete lack of understanding of the market. Thinking Windows was a non issue because of Linux is sort of delusional as well. If not for windows, I can only wonder why intel would have adopted AMD's standard, and not created a new one.

His comparison with the cold war is simply laughable and grotesque.

Finally, its ironic how he tends to enjoy ridiculing his beloved "delusional AMD lovers", while at the same time being one of the worst public fanboys I am aware off. Van Smith comes second, Ed Stroglio third (though he gets bonus points and a second place after Omid for cluelessness)

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 18, 2004 7:48:24 PM

Does Omid even read what he types? Hypocrite sounds about right.

This has to be one of the most hilarious and misguided articles I've read. The thing here is some people will actually will believe what he is saying. Then they'll go around talking like this and humiliate themselves.

Years ago I was very impressed with the wealth and factual information that was here @ THG. Today this site continues to loose any legitimacy in the community.
February 18, 2004 7:53:55 PM

I agree with this Editorial in several ways, however I found it to be very opinionated and harsh toward AMD Lovers. I myself am a convert from AMD to Intel, but I dont like to take sides very much. From my point of view, The AMD64 platform is a very scalable 32-bit platform. As more and more software is released to take advantage of the 64-bit extensions, we may see more from this platform. Also, 64-bits primary advantage is the amount of physical memory it can address, which is why its best for servers, where 4 Gigs just wont cut it. How many desktop users do you know that even have 4 Gigs of memory. It is also unlikely that desktop motherboards will support more than 4 or perhaps 8GB in the near future. One last comment from a review around new years: "Revving up in the New Year: AMD Athlon64 3400+ versus Intel's P4 3.2 GHz" I also saw this comparison in a couple more recent reviews (such as the prescott). Why cant an AMD be rated against the PR that its model name suggests? Sure, the 3400+ might put up a good fight against a 3.2Ghz P4, but 3400+ suggests that it should be compared to a 3.4Ghz P4. Hmmmm....
February 18, 2004 8:01:04 PM

>How many desktop users do you know that even have 4 Gigs of
>memory.

Oh no, not again.. I should really write a 64 bit FAQ or FPE (frequently posted errors). Its not about addressing RAM, even a Pentium II can address up to 64 GB of RAM. 64 bit is about a flat, <b>virtual</b> memory addressspace, allowing apps to break through the usual 2 GB per process virtual memory limit of 32 bit OS's. This limit is just as real with only 512 Mb or 1 Gb of RAM. Or 64 Gigs for that matter.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by P4Man on 02/18/04 05:03 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
February 18, 2004 8:01:21 PM

ohbie, it puts "up a good fight" ???????????? You have been reading the articles here too much... I don't know of anyone that takes their comparisons here seriously, for example they use slower RAM timings on the AMDs than Intels here... WTF is up with that? THG for some reason has some very Intel biased reviews, their comparisons hardly concur with other sites/users.
February 18, 2004 8:02:04 PM

INTEL Fanboy nº1 Column

Poor AMD, Big INTEL is coming… coming… almost… wait… oh no! Prescott just burn! you bastards!

It's impossible to make a serious reply.
You know why?
Because your column, it's not serious journalism!

Try to be less philosophic and more objective.
Like this:
Fanboys should not write column's.

AMD, could simply follow Intel steps, but instead, they choose innovation, bringing 64bits CPUs to the masses.
And yes! 64bits brings performance, unlike Intel MHZ, that are nothing more than marketing.

“…that makes one love the monopolists.”
I hope you're happy in your little, little, little world.
February 18, 2004 9:21:40 PM

This is the last time i will come to this site/forum.


THG : The last 5-6 reviews have allways either had skewed results, or just somehow strangely come to a completly diferant conclusion then all of the other sites around.
February 18, 2004 9:46:15 PM

This article proves again Omid is a moron and have no qualificaion of being THG Editor.

I agree with drako21. He surely lives in a delusional world. I don't think anyone should doubt about this after reading his comments about Linux in this article.

Omid is comparable to SoDNighthawk. SoDNighthawk is not editor of THG or a harware website. Think SoDNighthawk as THG editor. IMO, he won't do much worse than Omid, only with a different flavor (AMD instead of Intel)

I request Omid to post his BS in forums instead of posting as Editorial.

----------------
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February 18, 2004 9:47:03 PM

Quote:
I had an email exchange with him once, not a year ago, in which he proclaimed it would be better for AMD to ignore the tier 1/2 market all together, and focus on its fanbase or something. Go figure..

I bet it was the worst use of your time

----------------
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February 18, 2004 11:25:12 PM

I have a slight personal preference for Intel, but I can't agree with that article at all. This is a milestone in history, for the first time it's not Intel who determines what the x86 code will look like for a whole decade. It's definitely a victory for AMD. And now that we know Intel's 64-bit extensions are completely compatible, I see no reason why anyone would hesitate to buy an Athlon 64. Even under the best circumstances, I don't expect Intel to actually bring 64-bit processors in stores that run as fast and as cool as the Athlon 64, for at least half a year. After that period, things might turn around but right this moment AMD owns the complete x86-64 market. Amen.
February 18, 2004 11:33:37 PM

The dude writes to piss people off. There really is no apparent point in the editorial. A lot of big colorfull words, an insinuation that AMD suxxors-Intel haxxorz and... thats it. While it maybe fun, Omid says so himself d'ailleurs, and I do like to do the same thing myself sometimes, the place for it is the 'Other' sction on this here forum, not the front page of a hardware review site.



A long long time ago, but I can still remember, how that music used to make me smile... <A HREF="http://www.nexus.hu/zonix/DIGGER.MID" target="_new"><b><font color=blue>Digger rulz</font color=blue></b></A>
February 19, 2004 12:10:27 AM

I wish I had gone to high school with Omid- apparently he was the guy in the corner at the school dances, maniacally plotting the day when he would be with the popular kids and could then do his best to look down at the rest of the world, but not at too sharp of an angle, because the reflection from his balding head would cause them all to go blind. Honestly. I *never* post in forums, and I am an intel owner (for the time being, I would add), but after spending 15 minutes trying to decipher his column, and after 10 more minutes of adjusting my language settings to make sure that yes, it was english, just the most broken and gramatically heinous version I've ever seen, I finally came to this forum to see what people who know what the hell they are talking about on either side of the coin felt.

I would not say I'm pissed about what he wrote, I guess I'm just pissed he's getting paid for it. Give me a search engine and a word processor and I could write a halfway decent article that's based upon fact and devoid of grammar homicides about how Omid would look better dressed in a blue and white cheerleading outfit next to the intel spokesman at their next big meaningless release.

There is something you should know though- If you look closely enough at Omid's balding features (but avert your eyes slightly for purposes of intact vision) you will see what most of us have suspected- an Intel Inside sticker right above his temple. It is an aging 486 sx2 processor, but it still tries to pummel AMD like it did in '95, 66mhz at a time.
February 19, 2004 1:29:53 AM

hmmm...torture foremost on my mind.(big grin)

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by orcman on 02/18/04 10:30 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
February 19, 2004 5:18:22 AM

Omid hates people like me.

He cant stand the AMD crowd.
I'd better backup my claims with a-
<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">source!</A>
Read that, and tell me how many things are still true?
Quote:
This is where I just get tired of all the pro-AMD64 sentiment.

Quote:
At the end of the day, for the next couple of years, the market is going to be so overwhelmingly 32-bit that the 64-bit feature set is not a compelling argument for anyone to switch to AMD.

REALLY??!!!
ROFL, now that Intel themselves have switched.

He might not need firing, but I dont know if hes of the caliber to be the editor-in-chief.

I think BB would utterly destroy him in an editorial debate or in the forums.

I have sent emails to THG asking if certain articles or reviews could be done, and I have recieved no response.
I find that unprofessional.
The whole organization is getting unprofessional.

Unless the pretense to a given enthusiast site is fanboyism (AMDZone, Rage3D, NVNews), then they are attempting to give an illusion of unbiasedness.
Using that in a subversive way to smear individual companys, merely because you are too petty and let your annoyance with a given companys fanbase get in the middle of your reviews-
<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">such as Omid including the overclocked P4EE results in the A64 launch article. In which this given link I challenged him and pretty much embarassed him.</A>

<b>There is a difference between an editorial (or opinionated rant), and a review.</b>

The line at THG has been infinitely blurred.
Remember the Geforce 5600 NU being recommended as a 'best buy'??
Ridiculous.
And this is a dyed in the wool Nvidia fanboy speaking. I think NV products and support in general is the greatest thing since sliced bread.. but I'm not dellusional as Omid and crew are getting.

They are probably taking money under the table.
Nothing else but financial incentive could warrant such "[-peep-] happens" (as Omid put the O/C P4EE A64 launch article), that leaves only immaturity and unprofessionalism.

I think we ALL know HOW, WHEN, and WHY we need to strive for unbiasness in reviews.
If I were the head of this organization, I could certainly do a better job of that than I'm seeing done here.

Yep, I'm a dyed in the wool AMD/NV/IBM contingent devotee. And many of you are but for another camp..
but we all know how relatively easy it is to set aside bias in reviews when you really want too....

unless one of the reasons above applies to you (financial gain, unprofessionalism, or immaturity).

HardOCP does opinion the correctly... first and foremost.. their reviews actually COINCIDE with ANOTHER REVIEW THAT CAN BE FOUND ONLINE!
Not the case all the time with THG lately.
Then including a little rant on NVs failures might be allowed or warranted.

It comes down to the eyes of the beholder on what degree is acceptable.
But I think most would agree that being a 'lone wolf', constantly, starts to show you are not so much a brave soul but a oddball in the community with ulterior motives.

As P4Man theorizes, it might get THG a few more hits for a while... sure.

But its not winning them any long time devotees that butter their bread visiting everyday.
Including not winning any extra love from this 5 year+ THGC reader and forum member.
I've visited everyday for 5 years.

And the other long term effects are exponentially profound, ie. people quit recommending the site in RL and on forums across the net, but rather turn to an alternative that does the things I've outlined above in this post.

----
RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
Support the terrorists, vote democrat
NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
February 19, 2004 6:03:26 AM

>I wish I had gone to high school with Omid-

Has he finished high school yet ? A year and a half ago he posted this in a discussion about my spoof:

Quote:
<b>I just want to leave high school, and join the adult world.</b>


Well.. I guess he is not there yet, is he ?

<A HREF="http://home.pi.be/~bbaeyen2/forum/" target="_new">link</A> (it should be in the forum archives here also somewhere but the thread was well hidden, if not removed, so I copied it to my webspace.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 19, 2004 6:11:35 AM

> This is a milestone in history, for the first time it's
>not Intel who determines what the x86 code will look like
>for a whole decade

Well, actually, this is something where I can follow Omid for a change. It may be a "milestone", but that is not much use for AMD. They also first reached the 1 GHz milestone, but these kind of things just don't matter in the long run.

As I wrote above, the import thing is not AMD did it first, not that it forced intel to clone it, the import thing is this will pretty much guarantee the survival of x86 for decades to come, and therefore, allow AMD to compete. THAT is AMD's victory, and what is significant about this episode.

Regardless of what Omid claims, there is just no way Intel could now cripple x86 without shooting itself in the head.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 19, 2004 7:17:32 AM

Quote:
Well, actually, this is something where I can follow Omid for a change. It may be a "milestone", but that is not much use for AMD. They also first reached the 1 GHz milestone, but these kind of things just don't matter in the long run.

In the long run, I don't expect AMD to get more than half market share. But I do believe these things matter. They change the way people look at AMD significantly. Now they don't only have best performance per dollar, they also show to be capable of extending the x86 instruction set successfully. Technically it's not a gigantic step, but they're getting better every day. They also got a seat right next to Intel when talking to Microsoft. So, yes, this milestone doesn't seem that significant in itself, but it's definitely the start of many other milestones.
Quote:
As I wrote above, the import thing is not AMD did it first, not that it forced intel to clone it, the import thing is this will pretty much guarantee the survival of x86 for decades to come, and therefore, allow AMD to compete. THAT is AMD's victory, and what is significant about this episode.

That's the only critique I have against AMD... 64-bit could have been a whole new architecture with <i>all</i> the flaws of x86 solved. AMD chose an easier path, and not so surprisingly, many followed them on that path. But that whole new superiour architecture could only have been created by Intel. So it's a victory for AMD, but we might have been better off with a new architecture. But of couse we'll never know if Yamhill was actually supposed to be much different from what it turned out to become...

Either way, Omid is wrong about many things. Just completely denying Athlon 64's succes is living outside of reality.
February 19, 2004 7:32:53 AM

> But that whole new superiour architecture could only have
>been created by Intel

Intel had their shot at that with IA64. So far, its anything but a stellar success. It seems x86 in spite of all its quircks isnt all that bad. Could you imagine how a xeon or opteron core would perform with the same power enveloppe, L2/L3 cache and memory bandwith that Itanium enjoys ?

> So it's a victory for AMD, but we might have been better
>off with a new architecture.

I say, let the market decide. If a new architecture is so much better that it offsets the costs involved in throwing away trillions of lines of code, and coding everything for this new platform, than it will happen, simple as that. IF its not worth it, we'll continue using our x86 legacy because its better and/or cheaper. x86-64 doesnt take away options, it adds another one. Probably, a very good one, I can't see what is wrong with that.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 19, 2004 3:16:25 PM

Intel had their shot at that with IA64. So far, its anything but a stellar success. It seems x86 in spite of all its quircks isnt all that bad. Could you imagine how a xeon or opteron core would perform with the same power enveloppe, L2/L3 cache and memory bandwith that Itanium enjoys

???? except bigger L3.Itanium have major disavantage vs desktop low frenquency slower ram systemes.

Just to show dad
February 19, 2004 3:32:34 PM

Itanium 2 has a whopping 6.4GB/s memory bandwith, Opteron 5.3, Xeon MP/400 2.6.

Clock frequency is irrelevant, its a design trade off. Its not like a 3 GHz Itanium would be possible. A 6 MB Xeon would be perfectly possible.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 19, 2004 4:51:51 PM

?? no

Just to show dad
February 19, 2004 5:08:05 PM

You mean the FSB bandwith.

Itanium platform on ZX1 have acces to 8 channel of DDR PC 2100.Prestonia on GC-LE have access to 4 channel DDR PC2100.On IBM chipset Xeon have acces also to a offf die 64 MB of L4 cache by is FSB.Itanium have a much smaller L2 cache that any CPU unlike what you just say.L3 cache effect is not really big as most think it just help reducing lantency of a really 100 mghz fsb compare to 200 mghz FSB and to PAT

Just to show dad
February 19, 2004 6:29:36 PM

I think that I like Omid. I cannot say that I <i>agree</i> with him, but he <i>is</i> funny. :lol: 

You guys need to relax more. It was an editorial. Editorials do not have to reflect the views of publisher. (In fact often they do not, but then often they have a disclaimer saying exactly that.) Editorials are opinionated flamebaits written by people who are so fed up with the way things are that they cannot help but laughing. So complaining about that column is like arguing with a preacher on a street corner: It might be fun, but it gets you nowhere. :tongue:

True, editorials do not generally go on the front page, but then the website is obviosuly not laid out like a newspaper. It is clearly controlled with a lot of forms and dynamic server code. The most recent updates are always put at the top simply because that is how the automation code is written. Writing some sort of special-case exceptions would be unlikely to be worth anyone's time. Besides, where could you <i>safely</i> put the editorial section anyway? I suppose one could argue that they do not need to write opinionated columns, but what would be the fun of that?

I would also wager that the staff (and thus style) of Tom's Hardware Guide is heavily European, if not specifically German. Omid's column just has that German-sarcasm <i>feel</i> to it. I bet that any Germans who read it are rolling on their floors with laughter, at least on the inside. :wink:

That would also explain Omid's Windows/Linux delusions. As I understand it Linux is a lot stronger there than it is here in the United States. Perhaps from his point of view his delusions even have a fraction of merit, though even in Europe I doubt that Linux is <i>that</i> far along in the market yet. :eek: 

Anywhy, I do not know which is funnier: Omid's editorial or you all getting so uptight. Maybe if you had just laughed it off then you would have proven Omid's opinion of AMD owners to be wrong. Maybe then we all could have downed a pint in harmony. Instead you reacted exactly like the "pompous, self-righteous head-in-the-sand-ostriches of the alternative chip lifestyle" that he called you. :lol:  Go figure.

Relax. Laugh a little. If we cannot laugh at ourselves then who can we laugh at? No one said that he had to be right. It was humor and I for one found it to be immensely funny. It was clearly an editorial. No one ever said that it was the One True Religion or that you had to agree with it. I highly doubt that Omid even expects you to agree with it. I do not even think that he does entirely.

Oh sure, he had some good points buried in there somewhere, but for the most part I saw it as just trying to make people laugh. (Or to make those who forgot how to laugh angry, which is almost as entertaining.) So nuts to you, nuts to Omid, and bollocks to the whole computer industry. I am just a silly twit and I say that I like Omid's column just the way it is. :tongue:

(Err, well, almost anyway. I do have to say that Tom's Hardware Guide could definately benefit from hiring a new proofreader. Good grief!)


"Sad is the elephant upon the ice who went to put on his wooly coat only to realize that he left it in his other trunk." - DeEvolution
February 19, 2004 7:51:32 PM

Omid hasnt got a clue, I couldnt help but laugh at some of his ridiculous comments and opinions.

This guy shouldnt be commenting about the weather never mind about computer technology on one of the most well known hardware sites. How on earth that 'article' found its way to the top of the main page on the website is amazing.

I have for a long time respected the views of the publishers on this web site, but if they've started employing clueless monkeys that just write flamebait, I wont be reading the acticles here anymore.

Lately I've been reading the articles on anandtech.com, they seem to be much more informative, about more relevant subjects and a lot more truthfull and unbiased than the articles here.

I couldnt care less what processor is in my computer as long as its fast, value for money and reliable. I come here to make my puchasing decisions and if the staff are obviously biased one way or another then the hardware reviews on here many also not be representative of the truth.

I think editorials belong in the forums or somewhere else, not in amongst the technical articles where people go to be informed, not misled and ridiculed.

Yes that article got a reaction from its readers, but for all the wrong reasons. If I want to read flames I'll go to alt.flame or something, I come here to read informed, educated and unbiased articles that I can base my purchasing decisions on.

<rant over> :o )
February 19, 2004 8:10:31 PM

Quote:
I think editorials belong in the forums or somewhere else, not in amongst the technical articles where people go to be informed, not misled and ridiculed.

Yes that article got a reaction from its readers, but for all the wrong reasons. If I want to read flames I'll go to alt.flame or something, I come here to read informed, educated and unbiased articles that I can base my purchasing decisions on.


Then stay out of the editorials. I think everyone who reads this sight even semi-regularly is familiar with Omid's style / bias / opinions. I don't read editorials to be informed, I read them for a good laugh.

<font color=red> If you design software that is fool-proof, only a fool will want to use it. </font color=red>
February 19, 2004 8:51:19 PM

Quote:
I would also wager that the staff (and thus style) of Tom's Hardware Guide is heavily European, if not specifically German. Omid's column just has that German-sarcasm feel to it. I bet that any Germans who read it are rolling on their floors with laughter, at least on the inside

What?

That is the worst sense of humor on the planet if that is the case.
I would wager most germans are thinking to themselves... NO, thats NOT our humor..

Although now that I think about it, the Germans were never known for their humor.
But it seems timed to have been released just as AMD has performance supremacy once again, and will for the foreseeable future...
that guy CANT STAND this!

But somehow I doubt he is very ethnically German, Omid Rahmat??
Sounds middle eastern to me, possibly one of the arabian/muslim immigrants that are running over France.

Now, imagining him having an upbringing by the FRENCH would explain that editorial!

ie. completely out of reality, irrelevant in modern times, and lost the recent culture wars.. in this case, the recent performance wars.

Cry me a river THG and intel apologists.

Quote:
Relax. Laugh a little.

Thatd be easy if ANYONE else had wrote it.

Quote:
I do have to say that Tom's Hardware Guide could definately benefit from hiring a new proofreader. Good grief!)

Yeah, thats kind of our general sentiment.

You would be correct in your view of the editorial... but if you check any other enthusiast site's forum you'll see we are the butt of all jokes.
So yea, its funny... to everyone else laughing at THG and THGC.

I suppose I did get a laugh from it here and there-

Omid was not kidding when he said THG had no expensive fancy-pancy fact checkers!!!
:lol: 

----
RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
Support the terrorists, vote democrat
NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
February 19, 2004 9:03:18 PM

The problem is not specifically with this editorial.
Its a sad and telling piece to a much larger overall problem that will eventually destroy THG.

A quote from my first post in this thread above-
Quote:
There is a difference between an editorial (or opinionated rant), and a review.

The line at THG has been infinitely blurred.

This 'editorial' (if you can call it that), is no different than the reviews on the site.
Theres your overall problem in case you couldnt figure out what I was referring to earlier.
We can now see why the extreme slant exists in THG articles.. and why they have more frequently been the 'lone wolf' in their conclusions and ideas versus all the other sites.

I have no problem with the editorial, I dont think anyone here really thinks that is the issue at hand..
This is just opening the blinds a little bit more on a growing problem..

unprofessionalism, increasing blatant bias seeping into reviews and possibly even maturity issues.

Alright, dont take my word for it bud.
Go to hardocp, anandtech, aces and probably even sites like firingsquad and see what the masses are saying.
Its THG vs the world (nazi-THG??)
and unfortunately its only going to hurt them in the end.

But you will get your 1000 extra hits a day for a bit. :lol: 

----
RESIDENT FORUM WARRIOR
Support the terrorists, vote democrat
NV/AMD/IBM axis of evil team leader
Who cares about HL2/D3 when we have Call of Duty today!!
February 19, 2004 9:23:46 PM

>I would also wager that the staff (and thus style) of Tom's
>Hardware Guide is heavily European, if not specifically
>German.

Tom is german, Frank & Bernie are. Omid is very much american AFAIK.

> Omid's column just has that German-sarcasm feel to it. I
>bet that any Germans who read it are rolling on their
>floors with laughter, at least on the inside

Have you ever even spoken to a German ? Judging by your post, I think not. I don't like sweeping generalizations, especially not ethnical or by country, but if anything, Germans tend to completely *lack* any sense of humour (or at least, I don't get theirs), but at the same time, they are almost as obessed with "grundlicheit" (~quality, and sorry for the spelling) as the Japanese. Hardly something you'd associate with Omid's latest drivel.

Also, if "Germans" would have a different bias than other people, its most likely towards AMD, not intel. AMD cpu's are designed and produced in Dresden, Germany after all. AMD historically, has also done a lot better here than in the US. If I recall correctly, they even had ~70% marketshare in the european homemarket a few years back. I like to think we are less influenced by television adds, and marketing in general as Americans, but it could also be we're just cheapskates :) 

>As I understand it Linux is a lot stronger there than it is
>here in the United States.

Not on the desktop. Some governmental organisation and institutions are beginning to switch, but we're still very much a Microsoft region like the rest of the world.

> I do have to say that Tom's Hardware Guide could
>definately benefit from hiring a new proofreader.

Yeah and let that proof reader handle the editorials and CPU reviews as well; doesnt matter if he/she has never opened a computer case before, it can't be worse as it is anyway.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 19, 2004 9:40:26 PM

Re: Then stay out of the editorials. I think everyone who reads this sight even semi-regularly is familiar with Omid's style / bias / opinions. I don't read editorials to be informed, I read them for a good laugh.

I'll stick to the funnies if I want a laugh. I do realise editorials can be controversial as its not all based on fact but opinions and such. The problem is Omid is looking to antagonize it's almost written like he is pissed off at the forum community at large.

If he is so pissed at THGC let him come hear and show his face. Yet he is a coward posting and ridiculing THGC from the untouchable comfort of the front page.

I'd say omid is childish for taking his gripes about THGC into the front page of THG. and an even weaker person for not venting his frustrations here in THGC where he could expect a rebutle and a serious azz kicking from the community at large.

If I glanced at a spilt box of tooth picks on the floor, could I tell you how many are in the pile. Not a chance, But then again I don't have to buy my underware at Kmart.
February 19, 2004 9:45:42 PM

To me it sound more like french type of writing.Maybe that why American have some probleme with is style.

Sounds middle eastern to me, possibly one of the arabian/muslim immigrants that are running over France.

It not just france

Just to show dad
February 19, 2004 10:14:21 PM

From Omid's post in earlier "Should Tom fire Omid" poll :

<i>I am so touched, but just in case the poll doesn't go my way, I have pepper spray in hand, and my belongings packed for a speedy exit.</i>


That poll was going in his favor. But the scene has changed completely now.

<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/modules.php?name=Forums&..." target="_new">Result of the earlier poll</A>

<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/modules.php?name=Forums&..." target="_new">Result of the current poll</A>

Maybe you can find reason here, why Omid isn't showing himself yet.

----------------
Please vote in this poll: <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/community/modules.php?na..." target="_new">Should Tom Fire Omid?</A>
February 19, 2004 10:27:19 PM

Last time I had a converstation with him, his signature said "General Manager THG publications" or something.. so,.. should he fire himself ? :) 

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 19, 2004 10:28:57 PM

I have nothing against him or his articles persay.

I do not think, however, that he should be editor of THG. A person in his position has more obligations than the average writer. He is in charge(sort of), and must make sure THG stays the great site it is. Even though they are humorous, his articles are not part of his job description.

If he cannot remain neutral, he should a) quit his post as editor and just stick to writing editorials b) Write under an alias, so as not to tarnish the name of this site. Because he does.



A long long time ago, but I can still remember, how that music used to make me smile... <A HREF="http://www.nexus.hu/zonix/DIGGER.MID" target="_new"><b><font color=blue>Digger rulz</font color=blue></b></A>
February 19, 2004 10:30:23 PM

I think Tom is still the owner of THG. He can fire his general manager.

BTW, what kind of conversation you had with Omid?

----------------
Please vote in this poll: <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/community/modules.php?na..." target="_new">Should Tom Fire Omid?</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Spitfire_x86 on 02/20/04 01:31 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
February 19, 2004 10:49:59 PM

>BTW, what kind of conversation you had with Omid?

The only kind you can have with him I guess :) 
Well, I was once threatened with a lawsuit when making a satire, you might remember.. the most interesting part of that was him saying he just wanted to leave high school and join the adult world (I linked it somewhere else in a recent thread, it is still priceless)

On one or two occasions I jumped on his posts in this forum but these discussion usually don't last long and end in him running out of arguments and trying to insult me for being Belgian or something.. And I mailed him once ot twice after yet another nonsensical "column", and got a reply much to my surprise, which kind of showed he really believed the things he wrote (like AMD having to focus on its fanboys instead of the oem's and sort of, well,.. rather "uninformed" idea's).

I respect Omid about as much as I respect Ed Stroglio, trust Van Smith or admire Jenna Jamesons acting talent.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
February 20, 2004 12:15:38 AM

Excuse me but a poll's votes cannot be retracted. How in the heck did the NOs get reduced and there are less votes now?

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
February 20, 2004 12:17:32 AM

So I'm not the only one here in the CPU forum who liked his editorial!

Finally someone with some humor. Geez people!

Quote:
I would also wager that the staff (and thus style) of Tom's Hardware Guide is heavily European, if not specifically German. Omid's column just has that German-sarcasm feel to it. I bet that any Germans who read it are rolling on their floors with laughter, at least on the inside.

Forum Shrink took a wild guess on that one though eh? :tongue:

--
<A HREF="http://www.lochel.com/THGC/album.html" target="_new"><font color=blue><b>This just in, over 56 no-lifers have their pics up on THGC's Photo Album! </b></font color=blue></A> :lol: 
!