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HELP, 2.8 P4 shuts down

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March 16, 2004 11:27:18 PM

I just purchased an ASUS P4C800 Deluxe with a 2.8C P4 from New Egg. I also bought a generic case with a generic 350WATT PSU. Everything worked fine until I left it to idle. <b>The computer just shuts down</b>. So I started swapping out parts. Tried a bigger PSU (generic 400WATT) and still the same problem. Memory is fine and mother board is fine. BIOS has been updated to the very latest and NO OVERCLOCKING was ever attempted with the 2.8C P4. I installed my old P4 1.7 Williamette and the problem goes away. I even overclocked the heck out of the Williamette(2.0GHZ) and still everything worked fine. Could someone please help me???? I returned the first 2.8C P4 to New Egg and they sent me a new replacement. It also is doing the same thing. Is the PSU choking the 2.8C causing it to shut down? I can run intense games it seems but if I try to surf the web, the computer poops out. It shuts down, dosent reboot, just shuts down. Motherboard light stays on. As I am typing this I am using the 1.7 Williamette, I wouldnt make it this long on the 2.8C. Also, temps are not the problem as I yanked off the heatsink as soon as it shut down and the processor was still cool.

Any ideas????

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March 16, 2004 11:55:34 PM

I would check your power options in the control panel, and also the power management section in the bios. Could be a wrong setting. Also, be sure the heatsink fan is plugged into the correct header by the socket. Some motherboards have them double stacked. If that's the case, you just might have it plugged into the wrong one.
March 17, 2004 4:00:50 AM

mb is [-peep-]
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March 17, 2004 4:47:24 AM

>>>I can run intense games it seems but if I try to surf the web, the computer poops out.

That makes it sound like a software error. If you're running WindowsXP, it may be shutting down when it encounters an error. Try the following:

o Start -> My Computer
o Right-click, then click on Properties
o Go to the Advanced tab of the System Properties
o Under Startup and Recovery, click on Settings
o Under System Failure, deselect Automatically Restart

Cross your fingers and hope it is a software error, which you might now be able to catch and research...
March 17, 2004 5:07:52 AM

Are you sure your memory is pc3200/ DDR400? You are having a problem with the 200mhz fsb, but not with 133 right?
March 17, 2004 8:27:00 AM

Quote:
You are having a problem with the 200mhz fsb, but not with 133 right?

Do you mean 100Mhz FSB?

Abit IS7 @ 275 FSB, VAGP @ 1.65, OCZ PC4200 RAM @ 550Mhz, P4 2.4 @ 3.3Ghz Vcore @ 1.625, GeXCube Radeon 9600P @ 450/626.
Thermalright SLK-947U, P3 HS @ NB.
March 17, 2004 10:19:28 AM

Ok fellas, I have tried everything above and nothing fixes the problem. It has to be a mobo or PSU problem. I have checked and double checked all my componets for fit. Installation errors are not an issue. The 2.8C runs at 800mhz FSB and the 1.7 Williamette runs at 400mhz FSB, I have no idea what the last 2 posts are talking about. I was hoping that maybe someone here has run into this problem being as that I am on a time schedule and need to fix this fast. I am thinking that maybe something is wrong with the northbridge not allowing it to sustain 800FSB or maybe the 2.8C proc requires more juice than my generic PSU is willing to put out, but has just enuff to run the 1.7 just fine. Memory I know is not the issue here.
March 17, 2004 10:41:44 AM

Quote:
am thinking that maybe something is wrong with the northbridge not allowing it to sustain 800FSB

Unlikely - because it's the expensive 875P chipset and I've never heard about anything like it, but you can check: In the BIOS there should be something like "Strap NB/CPU as ..." and then 400Mhz, 533Mhz or 800Mhz. 800 is default for the 2.8C, 400 is default for the Williamette try running the 2.8C at different speeds and see if the computer is stable. By running the FSB as 400Mhz you're also running the CPU and memory and half the speed, but see if everything's stable.

Abit IS7 @ 275 FSB, VAGP @ 1.65, OCZ PC4200 RAM @ 550Mhz, P4 2.4 @ 3.3Ghz Vcore @ 1.625, GeXCube Radeon 9600P @ 450/626.
Thermalright SLK-947U, P3 HS @ NB.
March 17, 2004 3:01:30 PM

I saw nothing of that nature in the BIOS. I just installed a new PSU and the darn thing still shuts down on its own. I guess I am sending the mobo back, seems as though noone in the world can help me, sorry but I am just a little peeved at this moment.
March 17, 2004 3:41:56 PM

Your frustration at this point is certainly understandable.

What endyen was asking a bit earlier is are you sure the RAM is up to the task of running at the 200MHz speed. You've already indicated that everything seems to work reliably at an FSB speed of 133MHz. Some more details on the memory in the system might be helpful.
March 17, 2004 4:01:30 PM

Yes, I also agree with what Endyen said. Make sure the Ram is at least DDR400 (PC3200). PC2100 just won't run 1:1 with an 800 bus chip.

Also, he could try to lower his DRAM ratio from 1:1 to either 5:4 or 3:2. Running his 800bus chip but with slower memory speeds. Sure you want 1:1 for max performance, but it will help see if the memory is the issue.

Anyone have the same mobo?
I could walk him through the IS7 from memory, but would have to look up his mobo's manual to know on that board.

ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
March 17, 2004 4:28:24 PM

Yes, with a nice CPU and a very high end motherboard, we sure do understand your frustration. I am not sure why you feel it isn't the memory. Is it because it works with the 400bus chip, or is it because you know you purchased PC3200 or higher memory? But from what you have said, the memory needs to be ruled out first before trying other fixes.

Look In section 4.4 - Advanced menu of your ASUS manual. Page 4-15 in the english version I am viewing talks about setting the Dram frequency. By default, it is set to AUTO. Meaning the memory will run at the same setting as your cpu external frequency setting directly above it. So while your memory can run fine with the slower bus Pentium 4, it may not work with the 800 bus chip, because AUTO will make the memory run at 400MHZ (PC3200 spec). So I would try to set the DRAM frequency to 266MHz intead of AUTO and test the system with the P4- 2.8C in it. If it is stable, it was your memory. Then you can bump that up to 333MHz and again see if it is stable. If so, you can use your system this way, but aren't getting the full performance from the memory. Word of warning, do not set it to 400 or you may not boot with your other CPU. Intead if you remove the 2.8C, set it back to Auto or 266 first.

Does this make sense. If not, just read carefully that section of the manual about the advance menu in the bios. It could very well be the ram, but you need to either try this or try another stick of definate PC3200 to rule out it being a ram issue.


ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
March 17, 2004 4:52:00 PM

Sorry, I should have been a little more elaborate with the memory. The only reason I didnt go there is cuz i had 2 DIMMS of 256mb pc-2100 of different manufacturers and wanted to do the DUAL channel mode. CPUZ read that it was still in single channel mode, so I bought 2 brand new sticks of MUSKIN 256MB DDR pc-3200, installed them and it displayed as dual channel running at 799.6 BUS SPEED. I didnt really mess around with the settings in BIOS as far as the memory was concerned, left them at default. But I will try the advice given and post my results. Just for giggles and being ticked off,after I posted my last response, I overclocked it to 20% which was 3.3GHZ. my benchmarks dropped a few points, went in and played LO-MAC with max everything for about 30 minutes, the game locked up forcing me to shut down the computer, I reset the BIOS overclocking back to default, restarted and the computer has stayed on ever since. I am unsure if it fixed itself, but it has stayed running longer now then it ever has. I am afraid it wont rear its ugly head again until I give this man his computer to take home. I still have 5 days to test it. Thanks gentlemen, I'll keep you updated.
March 17, 2004 8:26:14 PM

OK, yes that is good ram. First thing I would try given that you have Mushkin PC3200, is to slightly boost the Ram voltage. I'd try 2.6v, 2.65v, or 2.7v bumping up 1 at a time until tested stable. That alone may solve your problems. Certain ram just seems to need 2.7v to run well.

Second thing i would try is to look at the memory timings and maybe relax them just a bit more. But if you have not made performance tweaks in your bios so far, it is odd that it would be set too aggresive by SPD. Especially since Mushkin often relaxes their SPD timings compared to advertised ratings to ensure compatibility. ie., usually with Mushkin low latency ram their is alot of room to manually tweak the memory timings. This corsair twin-X PC3200LL runs 2-2-2-6 without a problem. My Geil runs 2.5-3-3-7.

Next thing I would try is to run 1 stick in single channel seeing if that gives 100% stability. If a dual channel system isn't stable, try working on stability in single channel fist and only then go back to dual channel. If you can't get ram or a system stable in single channel mode, forget dual channel.

Yeah, strange it fixed itself, except that maybe your memory timings were automatically relaxed by increasng the fsb. I have a hunch the answer to you problem lays in the bios settings.



ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
March 17, 2004 8:58:16 PM

Is that Mushkin's Blue line or Black? If it is the blue, you may not want to raise it over 2.6v or 2.65 max. The Black can handle more voltage.

ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
March 17, 2004 11:59:37 PM

you know, I actually think it is the green line of RAM. Oh and the problem didnt go away, it shut down later on when i wasnt watching it.
March 18, 2004 12:19:58 AM

Being as it's the green, i would try running just 1 stick and stress test it for stability. Try some 3dmark2001se and sisoft sandra burn in loops. i realize you don't have much time before dropping it off to your customer, but by all means buy some time and give him stability. if one stick works just fine, then try 2 but in single channel mode not dual. Stable single channel sure beats a crashing dual channel setup. The green isn't sold as a dual pack to the best of my knowledge. Maybe it's like kingston valueram where it is good ram but struggles often in dual channel. It may not even be a perfectly matched set. have you compared the chips?

Again give 1 stick single channel a try and see if your problems go away.


ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
March 18, 2004 10:14:11 AM

I was running single channel when the problem arose. I only forked out the extra cash for new ram to see if running dual channel would fix the problem, which it didnt. I did a Sandra burn in but I dont know much about that program and how to read the darn thing. after it did its run, all it said was burn in completed successfully. 10 runs was all i did. I do notice that the northbridge heatsink is running pretty hot, alot hotter than the CPU heat sink. I have basically come to the conclusion that the memory is fine. I have a feeling that the mobo needs replaced, thats really my only option left.
March 18, 2004 4:19:43 PM

Wouldn't hurt to try a high quality power supply.
I had similar problems a few years ago and went with a enermax 431 watt power supply and it fixed problem.
Bob
March 18, 2004 6:46:30 PM

You said you didnt change anythingin bios, but what is your vcore? Almost sounds like the processor is not getting enough voltage. Your mobo might be undervolting.
March 18, 2004 7:27:58 PM

try reseting the memory timings to the worst possible and see how it runs.

Oh aye its guaranteed, but I'm not too sure about the stuff inside. - Scotty
March 19, 2004 10:50:49 AM

Well gentlemen, the mystery has been solved. All of you who said memory was the problem get to go home with party gifts, all of those who said the motherboard was at fault win the jackpot. Although unknown on the exact where-abouts of the problem itself, the failure was in the motherboard, this sounds a little far fetched but I think this particular mobo's chipset had issues, only allowing it to run a 400MHZ BUS Speed(1.7 Williamette). Dropping the 2.8C in caused a spike in the chipset temp and the motherboard itself telling the motherboard to shut down. This is not technical know how, this is just a common sense guess. If anyone else has a better more technical explanation please post it as I am interested. I just went out and bought an exact duplicate board and dropped it in, left it on for 12 hours, came home and it was still purring. Talk about 2 weeks of living hell. I thought I was going to have give up computer building. And for the record, the computer never rebooted, it just shut down. No matter what I was doing and when I was doing it. Does anyone know of a way or any tools that can be used to test the components of a motherboard for functionality. I would just like to know for future use. Thanks fellas, the help has been greatly appreciated.
March 19, 2004 4:04:26 PM

Well, glad you got it solved. I don't think anyone would have denied that it could be the mobo. But I still say you have to take the necessary steps to rule out the memory/ bios settings and other components before just RMA'ing your mobo. So many people RMA components that are perfectly fine, because they don't know how to properly diagnose. But at least we get to buy them as refurbs for a discount. :smile: Having a stable spare system/systems and other components for testing can help alot too. Again, glad it's working, now you can enjoy it rather than growl at it.

ABIT IS7, P4 2.6C, 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200LL, Radeon 9800 Pro, Santa Cruz, TruePower 430watt
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