Non-standard power supplies in which systems?

[ted]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
non-standard [pinout] power supply?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension 8100.



"Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
> non-standard [pinout] power supply?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:2ih64uFmogllU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension 8100.
>
>
>
> "Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
>> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
>> non-standard [pinout] power supply?
>
>


Standard ATX supplies began with the Dimension 2300, the Dimension 4300, and
the Dimension 8200 systems. Any earlier systems were proprietary. Any of
these models or later are standard in connection.


Stew

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Why on earth and how in earth Dell managed to convince Intel, other mobo mfrs,
and the power supply manufacturers to make a non-standard pinout for an ATX
connector is beyond me. It was a lame and misguided attempt at proprietary
lock-in made famous back in the days of the large mainframes. Replacing a mobo
in an Dell box is a near-impossible proposition due to the wierd ATX connector
and the often equally wierd front panel wiring, not to mention the blatantly
obvious decidedly offbeat motherboard-riser physical layout of the Optiplexes.

Finally Dell got sense and went standard ATX. Or maybe they got CENTS when
their contract electronics manufacturers told them how expensive it would be to
continue to build the non-standard ATX pinout... Ben Myers

On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 22:56:25 -0500, "S.Lewis" <stew1960@mail.com> wrote:

>
>"Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote in message
>news:2ih64uFmogllU1@uni-berlin.de...
>> Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension 8100.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
>>> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
>>> non-standard [pinout] power supply?
>>
>>
>
>
>Standard ATX supplies began with the Dimension 2300, the Dimension 4300, and
>the Dimension 8200 systems. Any earlier systems were proprietary. Any of
>these models or later are standard in connection.
>
>
>Stew
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

What's your point, or did you just feel like venting?

Rocky

<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:40c46dc4.6076359@news.charter.net...
> Why on earth and how in earth Dell managed to convince Intel, other mobo
mfrs,
> and the power supply manufacturers to make a non-standard pinout for an
ATX
> connector is beyond me. It was a lame and misguided attempt at
proprietary
> lock-in made famous back in the days of the large mainframes. Replacing a
mobo
> in an Dell box is a near-impossible proposition due to the wierd ATX
connector
> and the often equally wierd front panel wiring, not to mention the
blatantly
> obvious decidedly offbeat motherboard-riser physical layout of the
Optiplexes.
>
> Finally Dell got sense and went standard ATX. Or maybe they got CENTS
when
> their contract electronics manufacturers told them how expensive it would
be to
> continue to build the non-standard ATX pinout... Ben Myers
>
> On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 22:56:25 -0500, "S.Lewis" <stew1960@mail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote in message
> >news:2ih64uFmogllU1@uni-berlin.de...
> >> Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension 8100.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> >> news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> >>> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
> >>> non-standard [pinout] power supply?
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >Standard ATX supplies began with the Dimension 2300, the Dimension 4300,
and
> >the Dimension 8200 systems. Any earlier systems were proprietary. Any of
> >these models or later are standard in connection.
> >
> >
> >Stew
> >
> >
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Ben Myers wrote:

> Why on earth and how in earth Dell managed to convince Intel, other mobo mfrs,
> and the power supply manufacturers to make a non-standard pinout for an ATX
> connector is beyond me.

Probably not very difficult - Dell sells millions of computers every
year, the mobo manfacturers fall over one another to get a piece of that
business.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

The issue of the connector is trivial to overcome.

http://www.endpcnoise.com/cgi-bin/e/dellconverter.html




<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:40c46dc4.6076359@news.charter.net...
> Why on earth and how in earth Dell managed to convince Intel, other mobo
mfrs,
> and the power supply manufacturers to make a non-standard pinout for an
ATX
> connector is beyond me. It was a lame and misguided attempt at
proprietary
> lock-in made famous back in the days of the large mainframes. Replacing a
mobo
> in an Dell box is a near-impossible proposition due to the wierd ATX
connector
> and the often equally wierd front panel wiring, not to mention the
blatantly
> obvious decidedly offbeat motherboard-riser physical layout of the
Optiplexes.
>
> Finally Dell got sense and went standard ATX. Or maybe they got CENTS
when
> their contract electronics manufacturers told them how expensive it would
be to
> continue to build the non-standard ATX pinout... Ben Myers
>
> On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 22:56:25 -0500, "S.Lewis" <stew1960@mail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote in message
> >news:2ih64uFmogllU1@uni-berlin.de...
> >> Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension 8100.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> "Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
> >> news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> >>> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
> >>> non-standard [pinout] power supply?
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >Standard ATX supplies began with the Dimension 2300, the Dimension 4300,
and
> >the Dimension 8200 systems. Any earlier systems were proprietary. Any of
> >these models or later are standard in connection.
> >
> >
> >Stew
> >
> >
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

There is not a motherboard manufacturer in the world that would walk away
from Dell, even if Dell said that all power supplies have to have connectors
made from Uranium.
"Vince McGowan" <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote in message
news:YC_wc.4071$IQ2.2910746@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
> Ben Myers wrote:
>
> > Why on earth and how in earth Dell managed to convince Intel, other mobo
mfrs,
> > and the power supply manufacturers to make a non-standard pinout for an
ATX
> > connector is beyond me.
>
> Probably not very difficult - Dell sells millions of computers every
> year, the mobo manfacturers fall over one another to get a piece of that
> business.
>

 

[ted]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message news:40c46dc4.6076359@news.charter.net...

> [] Replacing a mobo
> in an Dell box is a near-impossible proposition due to the wierd ATX connector
> and the often equally wierd front panel wiring, not to mention the blatantly
> obvious decidedly offbeat motherboard-riser physical layout of the Optiplexes.

> Finally Dell got sense and went standard ATX. []

While we're on the subject, I seem to recall that Dell also used narrower than
normal external 5.25" bays... 142mm vrs 146mm or something like that. By
any chance did they also correct that issue?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:40c4ff04$0$2928$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
>
> <ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
> news:40c46dc4.6076359@news.charter.net...
>
>> [] Replacing a mobo
>> in an Dell box is a near-impossible proposition due to the wierd ATX
>> connector
>> and the often equally wierd front panel wiring, not to mention the
>> blatantly
>> obvious decidedly offbeat motherboard-riser physical layout of the
>> Optiplexes.
>
>> Finally Dell got sense and went standard ATX. []
>
> While we're on the subject, I seem to recall that Dell also used narrower
> than
> normal external 5.25" bays... 142mm vrs 146mm or something like that. By
> any chance did they also correct that issue?


While I've never heard of this, if it did exist, it doesn't any longer.
I've not come across a Dimension or Optiplex with non-standard optical bays
(excepting the slimline cases which accept slimline/notebook drives).


Stew

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

True, Edward. But we're talking manufacturing here, and the managers of
manufacturing operations are notorious for squeezing every penny of cost, parts
and labor, from the overall cost of production. With new entry level Dell
2400's priced at $399 or less on promo deals, the added costs of non-standard
ATX power supply and connector eat into already slim profit margins, even when
millions of boxes are cranked out. To retool a production line (two, one for
mobo and one for PS) for even something so simple as a connector costs a sack of
money.

I'd be willing to bet that Dell marketing sat down in a meeting early in the
Pentium 4 timeframe with the manufacturing people (CEMs for sure) and asked how
to reach the $399 price point while still maintaining some respectable gross
margin. And I'm willing to bet that the answer came back to scrub the
non-standard ATX stuff... Ben Myers

On Mon, 7 Jun 2004 19:16:50 -0400, "Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote:

>The issue of the connector is trivial to overcome.
>
>http://www.endpcnoise.com/cgi-bin/e/dellconverter.html
>
>
>
>
><ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
>news:40c46dc4.6076359@news.charter.net...
>> Why on earth and how in earth Dell managed to convince Intel, other mobo
>mfrs,
>> and the power supply manufacturers to make a non-standard pinout for an
>ATX
>> connector is beyond me. It was a lame and misguided attempt at
>proprietary
>> lock-in made famous back in the days of the large mainframes. Replacing a
>mobo
>> in an Dell box is a near-impossible proposition due to the wierd ATX
>connector
>> and the often equally wierd front panel wiring, not to mention the
>blatantly
>> obvious decidedly offbeat motherboard-riser physical layout of the
>Optiplexes.
>>
>> Finally Dell got sense and went standard ATX. Or maybe they got CENTS
>when
>> their contract electronics manufacturers told them how expensive it would
>be to
>> continue to build the non-standard ATX pinout... Ben Myers
>>
>> On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 22:56:25 -0500, "S.Lewis" <stew1960@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote in message
>> >news:2ih64uFmogllU1@uni-berlin.de...
>> >> Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension 8100.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>> >> news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
>> >>> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with a
>> >>> non-standard [pinout] power supply?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >Standard ATX supplies began with the Dimension 2300, the Dimension 4300,
>and
>> >the Dimension 8200 systems. Any earlier systems were proprietary. Any of
>> >these models or later are standard in connection.
>> >
>> >
>> >Stew
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Tom Scales wrote:
> There is not a motherboard manufacturer in the world that would walk away
> from Dell, even if Dell said that all power supplies have to have connectors
> made from Uranium.

QED

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Ben Myers wrote:

> True, Edward. But we're talking manufacturing here, and the managers of
> manufacturing operations are notorious for squeezing every penny of cost, parts
> and labor, from the overall cost of production. With new entry level Dell
> 2400's priced at $399 or less on promo deals, the added costs of non-standard
> ATX power supply and connector eat into already slim profit margins, even when
> millions of boxes are cranked out. To retool a production line (two, one for
> mobo and one for PS) for even something so simple as a connector costs a sack of
> money.
>
> I'd be willing to bet that Dell marketing sat down in a meeting early in the
> Pentium 4 timeframe with the manufacturing people (CEMs for sure) and asked how
> to reach the $399 price point while still maintaining some respectable gross
> margin. And I'm willing to bet that the answer came back to scrub the
> non-standard ATX stuff... Ben Myers

Perhaps, or Dell might pull a Wal-Mart and squeeze their suppliers a
little more.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

My point is that Dell DID NOT or could not squeeze its contract manufacturers on
this one. Somebody at Dell woke up to the reality of manufacturing costs. Now
that Dell is there with standard P4-ATX power, it is unlikely they will return
to the more proprietary connector.

In fact, if one looks inside at the guts of ANY prominent name brand P4-class
desktop computer (Dell, IBM, Gateway, eMachine, HP, Compaq), one will find
standard P4-ATX power connectors in all, and very much vanilla ways of
installing and attaching the motherboards and peripheral devices. What are the
differences? Quality of parts inside. Quality of manufacture of chassis.
Different plastic on the front. Different size of power supply, ranging from
original large boxy ATX to various sizes and shapes of microATX. Dell, like
HPaq, has been forced by market realities and deathly competitive street prices
into using standard parts... Ben Myers

On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 08:35:23 GMT, Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:

>Ben Myers wrote:
>
>> True, Edward. But we're talking manufacturing here, and the managers of
>> manufacturing operations are notorious for squeezing every penny of cost, parts
>> and labor, from the overall cost of production. With new entry level Dell
>> 2400's priced at $399 or less on promo deals, the added costs of non-standard
>> ATX power supply and connector eat into already slim profit margins, even when
>> millions of boxes are cranked out. To retool a production line (two, one for
>> mobo and one for PS) for even something so simple as a connector costs a sack of
>> money.
>>
>> I'd be willing to bet that Dell marketing sat down in a meeting early in the
>> Pentium 4 timeframe with the manufacturing people (CEMs for sure) and asked how
>> to reach the $399 price point while still maintaining some respectable gross
>> margin. And I'm willing to bet that the answer came back to scrub the
>> non-standard ATX stuff... Ben Myers
>
>Perhaps, or Dell might pull a Wal-Mart and squeeze their suppliers a
>little more.
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

In the math world, QED (Quid erat demonstrandum) usually applies to real world
demonstrable proofs. QED does not quite fit here, since the previous statement
was entirely hypothetical and contradicted by reality... Ben Myers

On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 08:32:28 GMT, Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:

>Tom Scales wrote:
>> There is not a motherboard manufacturer in the world that would walk away
>> from Dell, even if Dell said that all power supplies have to have connectors
>> made from Uranium.
>
>QED
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:

>Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:

>>Tom Scales wrote:

>>> There is not a motherboard manufacturer in the world that would walk away
>>> from Dell, even if Dell said that all power supplies have to have connectors
>>> made from Uranium.

>>QED

>In the math world, QED (Quid erat demonstrandum) usually applies to real world
>demonstrable proofs. QED does not quite fit here, since the previous statement
>was entirely hypothetical and contradicted by reality... Ben Myers

Since we are not in the "math" world, but in the real world, and
even worse, in the Usenet section of the real world [where
hyperbole not only runs through the house but gallops] Vince
McGowan's exercise of hyperbole was not only understandable, but
commendable. Particularly since he winked as he did it.

Kindly take your math world and tuck it away somewhere.
Preferably somewhere extremely uncomfortable. And after folding
that world into a mass of sharp corners.

[Apologies to Joseph Kesselring for stealing/paraphrasing the
"gallops" line from his play {later film} "Arsenic and Old
Lace".]
--
OJ III
[Email sent to Yahoo address is burned before reading.
Lower and crunch the sig and you'll net me at comcast.]

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

....and people threatened to PLONK me for calling someone a nincompoop.

Rocky

"Ogden Johnson III" <oj3usmc@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6oqbc01ecfbdf3sb3vtretlqni63632tal@4ax.com...
> ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:
>
> >Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:
>
> >>Tom Scales wrote:
>
> >>> There is not a motherboard manufacturer in the world that would walk
away
> >>> from Dell, even if Dell said that all power supplies have to have
connectors
> >>> made from Uranium.
>
> >>QED
>
> >In the math world, QED (Quid erat demonstrandum) usually applies to real
world
> >demonstrable proofs. QED does not quite fit here, since the previous
statement
> >was entirely hypothetical and contradicted by reality... Ben Myers
>
> Since we are not in the "math" world, but in the real world, and
> even worse, in the Usenet section of the real world [where
> hyperbole not only runs through the house but gallops] Vince
> McGowan's exercise of hyperbole was not only understandable, but
> commendable. Particularly since he winked as he did it.
>
> Kindly take your math world and tuck it away somewhere.
> Preferably somewhere extremely uncomfortable. And after folding
> that world into a mass of sharp corners.
>
> [Apologies to Joseph Kesselring for stealing/paraphrasing the
> "gallops" line from his play {later film} "Arsenic and Old
> Lace".]
> --
> OJ III
> [Email sent to Yahoo address is burned before reading.
> Lower and crunch the sig and you'll net me at comcast.]

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

I missed the wink ... Ben Myers

On Tue, 08 Jun 2004 12:46:47 -0400, Ogden Johnson III <oj3usmc@yahoo.com> wrote:

>ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:
>
>>Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:
>
>>>Tom Scales wrote:
>
>>>> There is not a motherboard manufacturer in the world that would walk away
>>>> from Dell, even if Dell said that all power supplies have to have connectors
>>>> made from Uranium.
>
>>>QED
>
>>In the math world, QED (Quid erat demonstrandum) usually applies to real world
>>demonstrable proofs. QED does not quite fit here, since the previous statement
>>was entirely hypothetical and contradicted by reality... Ben Myers
>
>Since we are not in the "math" world, but in the real world, and
>even worse, in the Usenet section of the real world [where
>hyperbole not only runs through the house but gallops] Vince
>McGowan's exercise of hyperbole was not only understandable, but
>commendable. Particularly since he winked as he did it.
>
>Kindly take your math world and tuck it away somewhere.
>Preferably somewhere extremely uncomfortable. And after folding
>that world into a mass of sharp corners.
>
>[Apologies to Joseph Kesselring for stealing/paraphrasing the
>"gallops" line from his play {later film} "Arsenic and Old
>Lace".]
>--
>OJ III
>[Email sent to Yahoo address is burned before reading.
>Lower and crunch the sig and you'll net me at comcast.]

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Ben Myers wrote:
> My point is that Dell DID NOT or could not squeeze its contract manufacturers on
> this one. Somebody at Dell woke up to the reality of manufacturing costs. Now
> that Dell is there with standard P4-ATX power, it is unlikely they will return
> to the more proprietary connector.

Are you a high level executive at Dell or was there something about this
in the trade press? If not, how can you be so certain of Dell's reasons
for the change?

I'm speculating here and not claiming you're wrong, just pointing out
you might not be right.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

I am an independent reseller/dealer/service provider with no direct or indirect
ties to any name brand manufacturer. I am no longer a practicing member of the
trade press, having halted my professional writing activities about 10 years ago
after producing millions of forgettable words with thousands of hours of lab
work for a number of primarily Ziff-Davis trade rags. I worked nearly 20 years
for one of the old BUNCH companies that vainly tried to compete in the mainframe
business against IBM. In my past and current lives, I've been involved in many
parts of the computer industry, hardware, software, manufacturing, company
liquidations, spares and logistics, project management.

I handle a lot of Dell computers, because there are a lot of them out there.
Mostly, I upgrade them or service the software which is error-prone, unreliable
and highly insecure. I do not see very many broken down Dells. I DO see broken
down machines of other makes, most often with catastrophic hard disk failures,
but otherwise due to choice of poor quality parts.

What I have stated is not based on any inside info from Dell. But if you were a
betting man, and we placed a small wager on the accuracy of my assertion, and we
could find someone at Dell willing to talk, he/she would either corroborate what
I have stated or say that I am damned close, and I would win the bet. Following
the money in the computer production food chain is not rocket science either.
When a product becomes as much of a commodity item as computers have, there is
only one way to wring out extra costs. Use standard parts wherever possible.
No exceptions. Manufacturing computers today is more like manufacturing toilet
paper than automobiles.

If this all sounds arrogant, after 40+ years of diverse experience in the
computer biz, I've seen it all. So far, anyway. Well, I admit wasn't there
when Eckert and Mauchly built the first Univac beast, and I do not lay claim to
inventing the internet... Ben Myers

On Wed, 09 Jun 2004 02:18:10 GMT, Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com> wrote:

>Ben Myers wrote:
>> My point is that Dell DID NOT or could not squeeze its contract manufacturers on
>> this one. Somebody at Dell woke up to the reality of manufacturing costs. Now
>> that Dell is there with standard P4-ATX power, it is unlikely they will return
>> to the more proprietary connector.
>
>Are you a high level executive at Dell or was there something about this
>in the trade press? If not, how can you be so certain of Dell's reasons
>for the change?
>
>I'm speculating here and not claiming you're wrong, just pointing out
>you might not be right.
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

You ought to think about getting back into writing. You still have the knack
for it.

Rocky

<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:40c6866e.55642601@news.charter.net...
> I am an independent reseller/dealer/service provider with no direct or
indirect
> ties to any name brand manufacturer. I am no longer a practicing member
of the
> trade press, having halted my professional writing activities about 10
years ago
> after producing millions of forgettable words with thousands of hours of
lab
> work for a number of primarily Ziff-Davis trade rags. I worked nearly 20
years
> for one of the old BUNCH companies that vainly tried to compete in the
mainframe
> business against IBM. In my past and current lives, I've been involved in
many
> parts of the computer industry, hardware, software, manufacturing, company
> liquidations, spares and logistics, project management.
>
> I handle a lot of Dell computers, because there are a lot of them out
there.
> Mostly, I upgrade them or service the software which is error-prone,
unreliable
> and highly insecure. I do not see very many broken down Dells. I DO see
broken
> down machines of other makes, most often with catastrophic hard disk
failures,
> but otherwise due to choice of poor quality parts.
>
> What I have stated is not based on any inside info from Dell. But if you
were a
> betting man, and we placed a small wager on the accuracy of my assertion,
and we
> could find someone at Dell willing to talk, he/she would either
corroborate what
> I have stated or say that I am damned close, and I would win the bet.
Following
> the money in the computer production food chain is not rocket science
either.
> When a product becomes as much of a commodity item as computers have,
there is
> only one way to wring out extra costs. Use standard parts wherever
possible.
> No exceptions. Manufacturing computers today is more like manufacturing
toilet
> paper than automobiles.
>
> If this all sounds arrogant, after 40+ years of diverse experience in the
> computer biz, I've seen it all. So far, anyway. Well, I admit wasn't
there
> when Eckert and Mauchly built the first Univac beast, and I do not lay
claim to
> inventing the internet... Ben Myers
>
> On Wed, 09 Jun 2004 02:18:10 GMT, Vince McGowan <SPAMvincemcg@nada.com>
wrote:
>
> >Ben Myers wrote:
> >> My point is that Dell DID NOT or could not squeeze its contract
manufacturers on
> >> this one. Somebody at Dell woke up to the reality of manufacturing
costs. Now
> >> that Dell is there with standard P4-ATX power, it is unlikely they will
return
> >> to the more proprietary connector.
> >
> >Are you a high level executive at Dell or was there something about this
> >in the trade press? If not, how can you be so certain of Dell's reasons
> >for the change?
> >
> >I'm speculating here and not claiming you're wrong, just pointing out
> >you might not be right.
> >
>

 

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Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Ben Myers wrote:

<snip>

> and I do not lay claim to inventing the internet... Ben Myers

Well that's good, cause everyone knows Al Gore did.

 

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Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

On Wed, 09 Jun 2004 04:16:05 GMT, "Rocket J. Squirrel" <rocky@bullwinkle.com>
wrote:

>You ought to think about getting back into writing. You still have the knack
>for it.
>
>Rocky
>
Thanks. It's like riding a bike, I think. Once you learn, you don't forget
how. No money in writing any more, though. The computer trade rags are no
longer bloated and obese. The internet got them on a severe Atkins diet or
maybe eviscerated most of their stomachs and intestines. Remember Computer
Shopper at 600 pages or so, the size of the Manhattan yellow pages? PC Magazine
and PC World ran similar page counts in its best years... Ben

 

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ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers) wrote:

[Snip interesting c.v. summary]

>If this all sounds arrogant, after 40+ years of diverse experience in the
>computer biz, I've seen it all. So far, anyway. Well, I admit wasn't there
>when Eckert and Mauchly built the first Univac beast, and I do not lay claim to
>inventing the internet... Ben Myers

Well, that explains where that math world came from. Red-faced,
I take back my "where the sun don't shine' suggestion upthread.
Although I do stand by the "Usenet world" stuff; since I am
[probably unjustifiably] proud of the analogy drawn and the
insertion of the by-now-obscure line from Arsenic and Old Lace.
;->

[Note to self: Don't take on BM in the future. He's as old or
older than you are and has been doing computers a *lot* longer
than you have.]
--
OJ III
[Email sent to Yahoo address is burned before reading.
Lower and crunch the sig and you'll net me at comcast.]

 

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Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"S.Lewis" <stew1960@mail.com> wrote in
news:MzRwc.8964$Oc4.8222@bignews1.bellsouth.net:

>
> "Edward J. Neth" <ejn63@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:2ih64uFmogllU1@uni-berlin.de...
>> Everything from the Pentium Dimensions through the Dimension
>> 8100.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Ted" <nothanks@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:40c23d13$0$2925$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
>>> Has anyone come across a list of which systems were built with
>>> a non-standard [pinout] power supply?
>>
>>
>
>
> Standard ATX supplies began with the Dimension 2300, the
> Dimension 4300, and the Dimension 8200 systems. Any earlier
> systems were proprietary. Any of these models or later are
> standard in connection.
>
>
> Stew

.... minor nitpick: the Dimension 2200 also uses standard ATX
connections.