BTX and AM64

I just saw something on X86 secret.

BTX form factor put the memory module futhers from the cpu.So does A64 intergrade controleur will still work.

i need to change useur name.

i think btx needs to go away and never come back.(make smeagol happy) there must be a better solution than btx, it just doesn't look like it has the potential it should...and im talking cooling AND expandability.

I've got a book of matches,
I've got a can of kerosene,
I've got some bright ideas involving you and me.

For OEM that a others story.For them is just better.

i need to change useur name.

it enables them to make a quieter computer for less money. it also improves case airflow to reduce thermal mechanicla failures-wich is a huge problem in OEM's(we enthusiasts have that fixed though)

plus, it makes their computers less upgradable so that customers will be forced to buy a brand new system from them every time.

I've got a book of matches,
I've got a can of kerosene,
I've got some bright ideas involving you and me.

and why was this whole btx craze started? becuase intel apperently needed it. heat has always been an issue, now intel needs a new form factor to help cooling and keep thier systems quiet, but that doesnt mean amd needs that as well. and really i think btx is not the best standard to be migrating to, it still needs work. as far as airflow goes, btw may line up the cpu for better cooling, but it isnt neccesarily better overall.

for instance, the new lian li cases in the atx form factor provide excellent airflow in a very unusual design, check out the pc-v1100 to see what im talking about. My point is, atx can work if case designers think things through like lian li did. this change doesnt neccisarily benefit consumers.

well the CM stacker is kind of an odd case. It is an atx case by defualt, including eATX, but it can be converted into a btx form factor case. i really dont consider it a btx case since its a 30 minutes- 1 hour chore to convert the thing to btx.

exactly! lian li started thinking outside of the box to make a better box. i think that before we switch to btx, or any other form factor for that instance, we should exaust the new layout presedented by lian li.

on a side note: i actually made a case that had the lian li setup a few months before they did. it works very well. and the possibilites are endless!

for instance, you could even have a water cooler's radiator in a completly seperate compartment from the motherboard and psu/drives.

with reversed airflow(back to front instead of front to back) the processor gets nice cool air all the time, lian li's desighn is much better than btx could ever hope to be.

I've got a book of matches,
I've got a can of kerosene,
I've got some bright ideas involving you and me.

and what do you mean by that? you cant deny the lian li case is a superb atx design that shows atx doesnt need to be changed, just rethough. there is no reason to force everyone to change over to btx at this point.

and as far as why intel pushed it, maybe it wasnt thier own chip's heat, but it certainly wasnt amd's heat. intel can market it how ever it wants, im just saying its not critical at this point and i think more thought needs to be put into btx first.

Juin's response was to your question, why is BTX better.
I will field that question, if you dont mind?
All components inside your case generate some heat. Much of this is spread, or diffused by the mobo. Some is released into the air. With the processor at the top, it has less board around it to take the heat. It is also the recipient of much of the airborn heat. With the chip in the centre of the board, it will be better able to loose heat to the board, and will be better able to access cooler air. The chip is the most important component, so it should be given priority cooling.
To all you gamers who have dumped a lot of money into your video card, kiss it goodbye, cause it's not that important. Now it's turnaround time. Used to be that the graphics card gave heat to the processor, but now it's payback time.

well oyu know id agree wiht that premise and i never said that a new form factor wouldnt be beneficial, but i think the btx form factor doesnt do ti justice. i think the case manufacturers can improve airflow and heat dissapation just as much as a new form factor can, lia li was just my example of where case inginuity can overcome a form factor design.

i think the problem is that the btx standard leaves alto of problems in usage and conflicts with hardware. for instance, amd is going to have more trouble then intel implimenting a btx standard with its memory controller. thats been discussed in other threads. while i think a new standard could help, i think there would need ot be a more drastic architecture change to actaully make things easier in the long run. why do we not see more btx cases and btx motherboards, becuase either they arent expecting popularity or slow adoption, or there are hardware issues to be solved. i dont know which, but i have a feeling btx may go the way of wtx awhile ago.

Juin calling someone a lemming, thay is cute. Before they bury him, the will no doubt pry the itanics from his cold dead hands. Guess that makes him the foremost anti-lemming, guaranteed no-one else is going to follow that route.

This is hardly a problem with AMD. It's a problem with BTX. BTX is nice, but the whole keep-things-in-line bit is just asinine.

At worst, though, all that will happen is mobo makers will just snidely disregard that requirement when making AMD64 BTX motherboards. Maybe put the DIMM slots on the upper/lower sides of the CPU socket. What's the worst that might happen if they took that route? Volumetrics requirements, at least, should still be within spec.

Hell, it might actually cool things *better* like that.

<i>"Intel's ICH6 SouthBridge, now featuring RAID -1"

"RAID-minus-one?"

"Yeah. You have two drives, neither of which will boot."</i>

Is not impossible but AMD or mobo maker will have to retouch the standart a bit.

i need to change useur name.

well i still dont see a system putting out 500+W of heat.

i agree that cooling is always an issuem, but what im trying to say is you dont need btx in order to improve it. case deseingers could make changes that could help the problem just as much.

BTX is about heat distribution and central air flow.

http://www.formfactors.org/develop [...] cification v1.0a.pdf

http://www.formfactors.org/formfactor.asp


You can compare that to SATA cable and PATA ribon cable.Sata cacble still do a better job and are much longer that ribon cable.At lease does that i have see were very small.

i need to change useur name.

ok if you think btx is better so be it, i just dont see it yet...