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AMD vs Intel Which to Choose?

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July 7, 2004 4:22:39 PM

I am in the process of researching a new machine. I am considering a P4 3.4 Ghz prescott and an AMD 64 3500. The primary use will be gaming and some video editing. Which is the better choice? I am open to other options but I dont want to sepnd the $ on P4 extreme or AMD FX.

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July 7, 2004 4:33:05 PM

If primary use is gaming, I think most would say the amd.

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July 7, 2004 4:47:38 PM

I would go for the athlon 64 3200. Make sure your memory is compatable with your motherboard. Tom's did an extensive test of memory brands with socket 754 boards. Some are picky, so choose the memory carefully.
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July 7, 2004 5:05:01 PM

Is the 3500 a good choice then?
July 7, 2004 5:16:16 PM

if you can afford the 3500+ then i say its the best choice becuase it gives a longer term upgrade path, with the possibility of using dual core next year. plus for gaming, the athlon 64 has no match right now.
July 7, 2004 6:20:29 PM

GAMING = AMD

So the choice is obvious! And as other have mentionned, the upgradability of Socket939 is better than P4 unless you get a new LGA775 based board.

Of course, some will argue that the P4 is faster in Video Editing, but it's not your main use and P4 are not much more faster anyway. But, on the other hand, it's hard to find a game that is faster on P4 today. The AMD architecture is more gamer-friendly! :smile:

--
It's tricky to use words like <b><font color=green>AMD</font color=green></b> or <b><font color=blue>Intel</font color=blue></b> in a signature some users could think your are biased.
July 7, 2004 7:02:52 PM

Get AMD for your case. Try to find the clawhammer core, has more cache.

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July 7, 2004 8:10:12 PM

Yes but sledgehammer has 200 MHz more, and games and all that like 200 MHz more then 512 kb more cache.


Toms Hardware Site is a joke !
Looks like intel spent more on bribing reviewers to cover up it aint that great than they did in R&D, you know what im talking about Tom !
July 7, 2004 8:46:19 PM

Overclocking the clawhammer core by 200mhz is usually childs play!

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July 7, 2004 8:58:12 PM

I say buy Intel, their better and have high integrity.

<A HREF="http://www.clan-chaos.com" target="_new">clan CHAOS</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by PeteRoy on 07/08/04 00:06 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
July 7, 2004 9:08:59 PM

*watches the flame warriors preparing for attack*

He that but looketh on a plate of ham and eggs to lust after it, hath already committed breakfast with it in his heart. -C.S. Lewis
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July 7, 2004 9:37:12 PM

[grub attempt] DID NEWBIE DIE [/Grub attempt]
learn before you answer

I aint signing nothing!!!
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July 7, 2004 10:15:06 PM

heh

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July 7, 2004 10:15:14 PM

For gamming most likely you will not miss that extra cache.

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July 7, 2004 11:38:05 PM

I'd go with the A64, but only if you get a top quality board like the MSI K8N Neo Platinum.

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July 11, 2004 2:51:50 AM

yes indeed.... Via is just......................I dont wanna talk about it *runs off into the nearest corner*

nForce 3 250GB is the way to go, or u should get P4! :D  Atleast its not Via!

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July 11, 2004 3:18:51 PM

Any Athlon 64 is great for gaming right now, but I recommend at least a 3000+. Intel aren't in the game for full on gaming machines right now, they will just have to catch up later.

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July 11, 2004 7:14:14 PM

PeteRoy, I think that by 'their' you really meant to say 'they're'. Also, both Intel and AMD are regular publicly traded companies in it for profit alone, I wouldn't trust Intel's integrity anymore than I would AMD's.
July 11, 2004 7:21:55 PM

I say buy Intel, their better and have high integrity.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


Take note here guys! This man knows his CPU's! :lol: 




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July 11, 2004 8:31:40 PM

Quote:
[grub attempt] DID NEWBIE DIE [/Grub attempt]
learn before you answer

Search for PeteRoy's posts on <A HREF="http://forums.anandtech.com" target="_new">AnandTech Forums</A> sometime. It's quite enlightening.

<i>"Intel's ICH6R SouthBridge, now featuring RAID -1"

"RAID-minus-one?"

"Yeah. You have two hard drives, neither of which can actually boot."</i>
July 11, 2004 9:41:39 PM

So the 1-15 frames per second difference are that much of a difference now? I have seen A64's they aren’t bullet proof in UT2004 add some bots in an onslaught match and you’ll be been the 40's like on a P4.

But on the positive side the A64 is better equipped to deal with the gaming aspect. Even though in the end they all play it about the same since non stress bond rails do not impress me.

Also do you intend to get into PCI-X, DDR2, or perhaps Wi-Fi? With considerations to that the Intel solution might be more to your taking since the new platform is filled with new technologies.

Xeon

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July 11, 2004 10:31:50 PM

I'm faster now than I was with the 875P board, and yea, I can run with the nephew's A64-3000+. I'm still real impressed with it though and it was by far the easiest build I've ever done. Intel's still selling the hell out of the Northwoods and prices are still where they are, but if I had to build new today, I would still build an A64. It just wouldn't be sitting on an MSI board! :lol: 


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July 11, 2004 11:07:10 PM

Quote:
Also do you intend to get into PCI-X, DDR2, or perhaps Wi-Fi? With considerations to that the Intel solution might be more to your taking since the new platform is filled with new technologies.

PCI-X? I think you mean PCI-E. PCI-X is basically 64-bit PCI clocked at 100 or 133 MHz, and it's been around for both Intel and AMD for a while now.

PCI-E is nice tho. Not so much benefit for graphics yet, but GigE can definitely use the extra bandwidth.

WiFi on Intel chipsets is non-functional though. DDR2 isn't even worth touching yet.

<i>"Intel's ICH6R SouthBridge, now featuring RAID -1"

"RAID-minus-one?"

"Yeah. You have two hard drives, neither of which can actually boot."</i>
July 12, 2004 12:29:41 AM

actaully 15fps can make the differnce ian game, and as many have found by actual use, the ahtlon 64s actaully feel faster in gaming nad have a hgiher top end for maxing our versus the p4, this comes in handy for games liek hl2, doom3, far cry, that already push the envelope.

but you are right, either would be fine for gaming in most cases, but if oyu say that, then you can say the same thing about video editing or 3d rendering,w here there is never a huge differnce between amd and intel. you can say both do those things fine as well.

as for wnating pci-e,ddr2,and wi-fi. pci- doesnt give any performance boost at thsi point, so since amd will have pci-e capable boards in 2-3 months, there is nothing worng with upgrading to that later on when pci-e video cards are more mainstream. as for ddr2, please tlel me what is good about buying into ddr2 right now? what performance increase are you getting for the extra price? by the time ddr2 is useful, he would have to upgrade to a new intel baord anyway, as the current doesnt have a 1066fsb. as far as wifi goes, thats not really a buying decision, for one its not evne implimented yet, secondly, similar solutions from via are on the horizon and today you can buy asus boards with special addon wifi cards.
July 12, 2004 12:33:38 AM

i really think the idea that intel has more integrity then amd is a bit off base and outlandish. that has fanboy written all over it. perhaps he isnt, but that sure was not an objective answer based on facts. i dont care how much experience a person has, statements like that arent helpful.


whenever i hear someone say something is just better and doesnt have any proof to back that up, i think fanboy, wether its amd or intel.
July 12, 2004 12:50:58 AM

Quote:
i really think the idea that intel has more integrity then amd is a bit off base and outlandish. that has fanboy written all over it. perhaps he isnt, but that sure was not an objective answer based on facts. i dont care how much experience a person has, statements like that arent helpful.

Judging from PeteRoy's comments on AnandTech forums, he's either a very dumb fanboi or a very lazy troll. His apparent ignorance seems to extend beyond Intel and AMD, so I suspect the former.

<i>"Intel's ICH6R SouthBridge, now featuring RAID -1"

"RAID-minus-one?"

"Yeah. You have two hard drives, neither of which can actually boot."</i>
July 12, 2004 1:06:12 AM

Quote:
PCI-X? I think you mean PCI-E. PCI-X is basically 64-bit PCI clocked at 100 or 133 MHz, and it's been around for both Intel and AMD for a while now.

Oh ya thx for getting that for me.

Quote:
WiFi on Intel chipsets is non-functional though. DDR2 isn't even worth touching yet.

Ya I know but Q3 is right around the corner so I brought it in since he might not go out and buy it 10 seconds after he reads all the posts. But good of you to bring it out I tend to butter up Intel too much.

On the DDR2 thing I tend to agree but things are improving, believing its going to get better is better than not even thinking it’s a viable technology.

Quote:
actually 15fps can make the difference in a game,

Oh I know that but it has to be constantly there, which in the case of the Unreal engine isn’t the case. Especially doing what I commented on is one case where the both of them all settle at a point, and to me that’s more realistic look than saying the A64 dominates games and P4's dominate encoding.

Quote:
but you are right, either would be fine for gaming in most cases, but if you say that, then you can say the same thing about video editing or 3d rendering here there is never a huge difference between amd and intel. You can say both do those things fine as well.

We agree...*flips threw bible*

Quote:
as for wanting pci-e,ddr2,and wi-fi. pci- doesn’t give any performance boost at this point, so since amd will have pci-e capable boards in 2-3 months, there is nothing wrong with upgrading to that later on when pci-e video cards are more mainstream. As for ddr2, please Intel me what is good about buying into ddr2 right now? What performance increase are you getting for the extra price? By the time ddr2 is useful, he would have to upgrade to a new Intel board anyway, as the current doesn’t have a 1066fsb. As far as wifi goes, that’s not really a buying decision, for one its not even implemented yet, secondly, similar solutions from via are on the horizon and today you can buy asus boards with special add-on wifi cards.

Just mentioning technologies some people tick off that, but good points none the less.

Xeon

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July 12, 2004 2:45:35 AM

Quote:
On the DDR2 thing I tend to agree but things are improving, believing its going to get better is better than not even thinking it’s a viable technology.


see this is a touchy point though . will things improve dramatically? we still dont know, things are way too up in the air to say for sure. i do belive it wil improve, it has to, but will it improve so much that it gives intel an edge of ahtlon 64, no one can say. and right now, even 2 months donw the road, dd2 will stil cost way more then ddr, how much do you think ddr2 667 will be? ddr2 needs time, it wont be mainstream level till next year probably.

Quote:
Oh I know that but it has to be constantly there, which in the case of the Unreal engine isn’t the case. Especially doing what I commented on is one case where the both of them all settle at a point, and to me that’s more realistic look than saying the A64 dominates games and P4's dominate encoding.


ok again, this is tricky. do you mean the Unreal 2k4 game or are you talking about the new Unreal Engine? either way, i agree the numbers you see are many times close together, sometiems showing amd wiht more of a lead, sometimes with less. also oyu have to define what dominating means. does it mean it hasa higher score, no matter how much, across several games, or that it beats out the competion by a large margin. both are possible and i think the majority of ppl define dominating by in how many places does one lead over the other, no matter how large or small the lead is.

in the end, both cpus can do the jobs of rendering/editing/serving/gaming fine if your the casual user and not doing any of these things on a high scale, you wont notice the slight variations, but if you narrow it to an app or the like, and your focused on one of those things, any lead is a lead and you can take advantage of it, so hense areas many ppl talk about when comparing amd to intel.
July 12, 2004 2:51:51 AM

Can you run the Gaming Enhancment at either Speed Racer or F1 settings on that Mushkin PC4000?

I could run F1 settings on my 512MB Corsair TwinX PC3200 LL memory. But I upgraded to 1GB Corsair 4000 Pro to overclock at 1:1, which can't run Cas 2 or Gaming enhancment. My P4 2.6C maxes out just above 3.0GHz, which isn't real good, and the no gaming enhancement hurts the performance boost over no overclocking and F1 settings. I was kinda bummed about that. I was hoping for 3.2GHz and keeping the Gaming enhancment on.



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July 12, 2004 3:37:07 AM

No I can't, Pualdh. The fastest I can run this stuff at a 200mhz fsb is 2,3,3,6. That may get me into Turbo, but only at stock speeds. I can run manually at a 230mhz FSB at 2.5,3,3,7 and up to 240mhz at 2.5,8,8,4. I went over this in detail with the Mushkin boys (kudos due) and we decided that a 230mhz - 240mhz FSB was better than the PAT mode or the GE mode. These are the Hynix DW-43 chips. They're good clockers but they ain't BH-5! :frown:

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July 12, 2004 8:20:50 PM

Quote:
see this is a touchy point though . will things improve dramatically? we still dont know, things are way too up in the air to say for sure. i do belive it wil improve, it has to, but will it improve so much that it gives intel an edge of ahtlon 64, no one can say. and right now, even 2 months donw the road, dd2 will stil cost way more then ddr, how much do you think ddr2 667 will be? ddr2 needs time, it wont be mainstream level till next year probably.

I agree 100%, but some people don’t mind the price and if 667 does give the Prescott a edge then yah otherwise crummy. But with dual Prescott’s due in Q3 hopefully that could very well be useful too.

Quote:
ok again, this is tricky. do you mean the Unreal 2k4 game or are you talking about the new Unreal Engine? either way, i agree the numbers you see are many times close together, sometiems showing amd wiht more of a lead, sometimes with less. also oyu have to define what dominating means. does it mean it hasa higher score, no matter how much, across several games, or that it beats out the competion by a large margin. both are possible and i think the majority of ppl define dominating by in how many places does one lead over the other, no matter how large or small the lead is.

in the end, both cpus can do the jobs of rendering/editing/serving/gaming fine if your the casual user and not doing any of these things on a high scale, you wont notice the slight variations, but if you narrow it to an app or the like, and your focused on one of those things, any lead is a lead and you can take advantage of it, so hense areas many ppl talk about when comparing amd to intel.

Yes I mean UT2004, also with note to the unreal engine it has always been sensitive to clock speed, IPC, and cache sizes and latencies. But it also has insanely sloppy AI code, and anyone that has played through single player Onslaught matches know how stupid they are.

As for dominating its tough to say but 1-15 FPS isn’t what I call dominating. Even the 3-10 min in encoding advantage that the P4's show really doesn’t say dominating to me.

I also agree in the end they are the same when it comes to code execution. Both cant breaks past the 3 retires per clock cycle... Odd we agree though...

Xeon

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July 12, 2004 9:55:13 PM

Quote:
I agree 100%, but some people don’t mind the price and if 667 does give the Prescott a edge then yah otherwise crummy. But with dual Prescott’s due in Q3 hopefully that could very well be useful too.


you mean dual on the mobile side right? i didnt hear anything about dual prescotts on the desktop in Q3 '04.
July 12, 2004 11:56:22 PM

Oh-oh said too much maybe I shouldnt have mentioned that...

Xeon

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July 13, 2004 1:24:10 AM

lol actaulyl now that i look around, i do see what your talking about, but i wouldnt put much credence to these rumors just yet. the prescott needs alot of work to pull of that trick.
July 13, 2004 4:27:32 PM

Thanks for the info. Sorry to hear that, but I am glad it's not just my corsair that can't run the GE.


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!