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Doom 3 and other next-gen games

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  • CPUs
  • Games
  • Next Generation
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August 9, 2004 1:20:34 AM

I am about to build an Athlong 64 system. I am looking at a 3400+ clawhammer or a 3500+ socket 939. It will be mainly a gaming computer. I have read anandtechs doom3 article and they recommend the 3400 over the 3500 because of the extra cache. I won't play Doom 3, but I will play HL2 and other games of the demanding nature. Will cache be as important in next-gen games, what do you guys think? I will be getting a 6900 GT so gfx aren't a problem.

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton

More about : doom gen games

August 9, 2004 1:51:17 AM

it is a hard question... if you have the money, go 939, cause it will be faster in other apps, but for gaming, well, you'll get very good play with both.



-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!
August 9, 2004 2:37:46 AM

You might want to check with the guys in the graphics forum about a video card. The nforce does great in Doom3, but the X800 is expected to do the same in HL2. I'm thinking that this group of graphics cards will be short lived, and may be out of date by xmas.
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August 9, 2004 3:10:55 AM

I doubt they will be out of date, and I am pretty set on the graphics card. I just want to know if cache is going to as helpful with other games as it is in Doom 3.

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton
August 9, 2004 4:20:08 AM

so Doom 3 isn't a reflection of things to come in your opinion?

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton
August 9, 2004 4:33:06 AM

Almost half the games coming out over the next 2 years will be Doom3 based. Will they be cache hogs, is a different question. Probably not to the same extent, but it's all a guess at this point. Truth is that the A64s get by quite well, because of the ondie mem controller, so cache just isn't that critical with an Amd system.
August 9, 2004 6:57:17 AM

Flip a coin.

considering how small the difference between both chips is anyhow, I wouldn't buy one over the other just for perfomance (you're talking about what, 1-2% ?). Besides, I'm not sure what article you're referring to, but have a look here:
<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=214..." target="_new"> anand </A>
from single channel to dual channel ->+3%
From 1MB to 512Kb ->-4%
Seriously, if you add those up, you're looking at statistical noise. Get the S939 for its better upgradepath.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
August 9, 2004 7:11:10 AM

That was the article. But the 3400+ is cheaper :-/...In 2 years will I really wanna just pop in a new cpu (if I go 939) and not build a whole 'nother computer anyway?

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton
August 9, 2004 9:35:59 AM

Depends on your "refresh" rate.

If you stick to a 2 year life span then it might be possible to ignore upgrading (barely, though), 1.5 years is safer. This is from a gamer perspective.

For all kinds of reasons I try to maintain a 3 year lifecycle, and then upgradeability is a must. For (CRT) monitors I aim at a 9 year life cycle.


BigMac

<A HREF="http://www.p3int.com/product_center_NWO_The_Story.asp" target="_new">New World Order</A>
August 9, 2004 11:19:51 AM

Doom3 seems to love cache size , Anandtech's article on doom3 and cpu gaming shows, that Doom3 runs better on more cache on Intel P4s.

However for AMD systems, the gains are much less, since AMD systems don't depend on cache as much as the P4 due to its architecture. "Bottom line: cache size is far less important for the Athlon 64 than on the Pentium 4 as you would expect thanks to the on-die memory controller. "
<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=214..." target="_new">http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=214...;/A>

------
Prescott 3.2E 1MB L2 HT
1GB PC 3200 Dual channel(PAT)
Asus P4P800 Bios 1016
PNY Geforce 6800 GT 256MB DDR3
60,823 Aquamarks
August 9, 2004 12:19:04 PM

Must resist...must..resist.... I can't help myself, here is the quote of the conclusion of the article Kanavit posted:

Quote:

In the end, the winner of the final battle is clear: the AMD Athlon 64 is the processor for Doom 3.


BigMac

<A HREF="http://www.p3int.com/product_center_NWO_The_Story.asp" target="_new">New World Order</A>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
August 9, 2004 1:44:11 PM

Quote:
that Doom3 runs better on more cache on Intel P4s.

Thats misleading! Make you think your saying D3 run better on P4. I know that you mean it runs <b>slightly</b> better on prescott with <b>1meg!!!!</b>L2 cache.

Will you upgrade to a <b>2meg!!WOOOT</b> prescott when it comes out Kanavit?

On a side note you username should be KanaBis cuz you must be stoned to upgrade from a 3.0 to a 3.2e!!!!
lol sorry couldnt resist

Asus P4P800DX, P4C 2.6ghz@3.25ghz, 2X512 OCZ PC4000 3-4-4-8, Leadtek FX5900 w/ FX5950U bios@500/1000, 2X30gig Raid0
August 9, 2004 2:08:58 PM

AMD Athlon 64 is the processor to get for gaming, no P4
August 9, 2004 2:58:34 PM

yes, the onboard memory controller on the A64 makes doom3 see system memory as cache!! DOom3 loves cache. So , definitely A64 is better than P4 for Doom3 gaming. Of course with same video card.

------
Prescott 3.2E 1MB L2 HT
1GB PC 3200 Dual channel(PAT)
Asus P4P800 Bios 1016
PNY Geforce 6800 GT 256MB DDR3
60,823 Aquamarks
August 9, 2004 4:12:17 PM

> But the 3400+ is cheaper :-/.

Oops, I figured they would cost about the same, but I just checked, and you're right. price difference definately isn't warranted for the tiny performance gain. That leaves the upgrade path of socket 939 as potential bonus, but as you pointed out yourselve, its quite possible you'll want to move to PCI-E next upgrade roud.. So I'd say, get the 3400+
:) 

btw, why ask for advice ? Seems you're pretty well informed allready :D 

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
August 9, 2004 4:22:28 PM

Re: "yes, the onboard memory controller on the A64 makes doom3 see system memory as cache!! DOom3 loves cache. So , definitely A64 is better than P4 for Doom3 gaming. Of course with same video card."

Atta boy,

Don't p4's in general have = or more cache? over amd.


If I glanced at a spilt box of tooth picks on the floor, could I tell you how many are in the pile. Not a chance, But then again I don't have to buy my underware at Kmart.
August 9, 2004 4:41:02 PM

Here is the deal...in 2yrs will DDR2 be in every board and double the speed of current RAM? In 2years will PCI-E be commonplace, and for some graphic cards a MUST??

In two years you could pop out the 3500+ from you're 939 and put in a 4500+ or whatever is out then. But you would be missing the speed of DDR2 and PCI-E.
If you want a longer upgrade path choose the 939. but i think the 754 socket is good enough because in two years i think you will *WANT* a whole new setup to get the advantages of future hardware.
August 9, 2004 4:41:34 PM

Here is the deal...in 2yrs will DDR2 be in every board and double the speed of current RAM? In 2years will PCI-E be commonplace, and for some graphic cards a MUST??

In two years you could pop out the 3500+ from you're 939 and put in a 4500+ or whatever is out then. But you would be missing the speed of DDR2 and PCI-E.
If you want a longer upgrade path choose the 939. but i think the 754 socket is good enough because in two years i think you will *WANT* a whole new setup to get the advantages of future hardware.

i dont know the timelines of this hardware but since DDR2 is out now and PCI-E is on the horizon i would exspect them to be around in 2yrs.
August 9, 2004 5:17:26 PM

re: btw, why ask for advice ? Seems you're pretty well informed allready

2 Heads > 1 Head :) , more opinions usually doesn't hurt. And I was wondering if any of you guys would happen to know if cache will be important in other new games.

"Go forward until the last round is fired and the last drop of gas is expended...then go forward on foot!" -Patton
August 9, 2004 5:26:43 PM

>And I was wondering if any of you guys would happen to know
>if cache will be important in other new games.

Oh, that's an easy one: it will one some, it won't on others. So I guess it depends if you prefer to play some or other games :D 

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
August 9, 2004 9:46:09 PM

I'd go 939...

<font color=blue>AthlonXP-M 2500+(12x211)</font color=blue>
<font color=green>Abit NF7-S</font color=green>
<font color=red>Kingston DDR400 2x256Mb</font color=red>
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