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Report: All Nvidia G84/G86 Chips Defective

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August 12, 2008 11:42:24 PM

I'm not surprised by this. It makes sense that if the mobile chips on that architecture fail so should logically the desktop chips. I have also experienced it first hand. My 8600gt (G84) Gigabyte Silent pipe, Started Making noises from the GPU itself after 1 month and after 2 months it broke completely. I was very disappionted
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August 12, 2008 11:49:25 PM

random1283I'm not surprised by this. It makes sense that if the mobile chips on that architecture fail so should logically the desktop chips. I have also experienced it first hand. My 8600gt (G84) Gigabyte Silent pipe, Started Making noises from the GPU itself after 1 month and after 2 months it broke completely. I was very disappionted


Last time I checked silicon doesn't make noise. You "first hand experience" had to be a mechnical issue and thus not the same problem as the one mentioned here.
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August 12, 2008 11:52:03 PM

So does this mean a product recall ?


Well i own an XFX 8600GT @ 620Mhz (over clocked by manufacture)touch wood its still ok...

But everest give me tempratures of between 50 - 55 degress celcius. Is this one of the issues?
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August 13, 2008 12:11:44 AM

50-55c doesn't sound bad. My 7900gt and 8600m gt both max at about 70c.
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August 13, 2008 12:18:47 AM

Trueeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
I had (had) 2 HP laptops ,DV 6599ee and DV6899ee ,both coasted me a fortune,both have the same nvidia disasterus 8400m GS,both now defective.
The problem shows itself as a crash in the OS (regardless of OS type itself) whenever you try to run any Graphics card-related aplication,such as Videos and games,the OS crashes n a message notifys you that ( nvdllmkm has crashed and recovered).
youcan actually bypass this problem by uninstalling the GC Driver,yet,you will notbe able to run any games or videos any more.
Soooooooooooory,but now I really hate nvidia,I had to pay 3000 $ for my laptops,now I just gave them to my chuld n my youngest bro to learn using PCs,n also,I am learning them to hate nvidia!!!!
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August 13, 2008 12:19:31 AM

hey, my 4850 runs 80C full load, you are fine...
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August 13, 2008 12:34:53 AM

I would take anything the inquirer says with a grain of salt, or a whole ******* shaker.
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August 13, 2008 12:38:19 AM

8800gt's are G92 right? Certainly hope I dont have to deal with this crap...
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August 13, 2008 1:00:51 AM

yay, my 9800 GTX+ is G92!
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August 13, 2008 1:14:31 AM

^Inquirer reported G92 and G94 chips as effected as well... but, as others have pointed out in the past, Charlie Demerjian seems to have a personal vendetta against Nvidia. Read some of his other work, its hilarious. To be honest, I'm not sure why the Inq site hasn't been sued for slander yet. Remember when he claimed EVGA was going to "defect" and stop selling NV boards? This guy will exaggerate any story he can to make Nvidia look a in worse light.

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August 13, 2008 1:36:36 AM

sphericalineLast time I checked silicon doesn't make noise. You "first hand experience" had to be a mechnical issue and thus not the same problem as the one mentioned here.


It's typically not the cpu itself, it's the motherboard. A lot of 680i boards suffer from the squeaky cpu problem. I had an old motherboard that had noisy ram slots, it was a commonly reported issue. I don't understand how but its true.
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August 13, 2008 2:35:59 AM

Silicon will normally not make any noise, but pump enough voltage and heat and it will buzz or "I don't know how to describe it sound". Most people will never ever hear this happening, but some, mostly unlucky, people will get this behavior followed by the component failing.
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August 13, 2008 3:01:34 AM

The Inq is full of !(@*& as always. I stopped reading that trash site long ago.

I've been hammering away at my 8800 for a year and a half, no problems whatsoever. I've never had a high-end graphics card stay on the leading edge of speed for so long (well over a year before they beat it by any real margin!)

It has a lifetime warranty from eVga anyway, so who cares? I'll just get the latest greatest for free when this one bites the dust someday.

I'd like ATI/AMD to survive just to give nVidia/Intel competition, but at the time the 8800 was the fastest thing on the planet by a large margin. 100% solid and reliable for me. =]

Inq shouldn't even be lining the bottom of birdcages, it's that poor.
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August 13, 2008 4:19:43 AM

extremely disappointing to see tomshardware believe the nonsense of the Inquirer with Charlie Demerjian.

As we have heart today from the CC, the Quarterly results and answers given on the questions asked by the analysts, this is absolutely not the case.
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a b Î Nvidia
August 13, 2008 4:27:23 AM

The buzzing is a vibration. The most common cause is the coils in the power regulation system on the card. This is normal as the coils are sold as low vibration. It will vary from card to card since no 2 coils are exactly the same.

My X1900XT buzzes, replaced it with a 8800GTX, it buzzes even louder. so far the 4870 has not made a peep, its just luck. I have a motherboard that does it too.

I never noticed the X1900XT making noise until i moved it out of my Sonata case. so many users with quiet or noise dampening cases will not hear it. Now the 8800GTX lives in a Sonata II and you would be hard pressed to hear it now.

I do not think the buzzing had to do with the dead card, just bad luck.
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August 13, 2008 5:06:30 AM

This report is completely false. Listening to the Q2 2009 Conference Call today, Jen-Hsun answered point blank that this issue was only with the notebook chips that they had earlier identified to be defective and thus took a $197 million write down for Q2.

Unless he would like to be thrown in jail by the SEC for saying something completely blatantly wrong to Nvidia shareholders, the real press (unlike The Inquirer) and analysts and then hiding an issue that's much more severe (all desktop GPUs in the G84 and G86 family being defective), I'm pretty sure it's just Charlie's vendetta against Nvidia at this point.
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Anonymous
August 13, 2008 6:06:03 AM

@sgmeridia of course the "whoop ass"-man says the desktop chips all ok. If he would admit it the stocks would plummet and nvidia should immediately prepare for huge refunds.
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August 13, 2008 6:16:55 AM

well maybe it's not the GPU problem, but the cooling. because my dell xps laptop started to act strange, downclocking and laging games after half year of usage. i did my research, and found out that the CPU unit was overheating, not the GPU. i dissasembled the laptop and the thermal paste on cpu and gpu was all dry, so i replaced it with new paste, cooling problems solved, and all went ok again.
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August 13, 2008 8:26:35 AM

have to agree with random - i had alot of high pitched electrical sounds coming from alot of 8600's (perhaps one of the resistors, but only ever seen on the 8600's and one 7600GT - DEFINITLY NOT A FAN OR VIBRATION NOISE, and was even louder during 3D load) and just yesterday yet another dud 8600GT (asus this time) and when they were first out we had a large batch of dead albatron 8600's, at first we blamed albatron and they were releasing new revision cards every few weeks (different coolers, pcb designs etc) it was odd but now it makes sence.

...... This cant be good for Nvidia
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August 13, 2008 8:32:52 AM

oh, not to mention the large batch of dead hp's which oddly all had Nvidia chipsets or GPU's, and today the first 9800GTX+ i used in a build was a dud - failed after installing vista (30 minutes) - asus branded.

Failure rates for the 8600's are the worst i have ever seen, but as for the rest of the series from various brands, no wide spread failure, couple of ASUS/HP 7200/7300's (hp uses asus - poor hp dont have much luck...)
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August 13, 2008 9:11:35 AM

I get high-pitched noise from my 9600GT (G94), a sort of hiss/whine hybrid.
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August 13, 2008 11:20:48 AM

Good thing I just replaced my 1+ year old 8800GTX!
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August 13, 2008 12:30:01 PM

@crapvidia - Actually, he would go to JAIL for covering this up if indeed it was a much larger issue. I would also be very pissed as a shareholder.
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August 13, 2008 12:36:02 PM

oh for christs sake, my 8600gt is pushing 1 1/2 years old already. the hissing sound you guys hear is the fan adjusting itself accordingly when its being used extensively. my 8600gt is dead quiet btw.
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August 13, 2008 1:36:38 PM

I have a kettle pot that when it gets really hot makes this whistling sound. I can figure it out. I returned it for the silent X model and swore never to buy from that kettle company again.


Noisy kettle pots... what next, a toaster that is also an oven? Yeah, ok!
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Anonymous
August 13, 2008 2:21:53 PM

Charlie could be full of it, but someone point me to a page on the web that lists serial numbers of affected parts. Unless that is published by NVidia, we are to presume any part can be defective. Any problems with this logic? Consider this, I walk into a local store and ask if the part in the notebook I'm to buy is affected or not and they tell me to call customer service! This is nonsense.
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August 13, 2008 2:58:55 PM

Seems very likely, but my 8800GTS 640 broke recently, it's RMA:D ..
(Just like every other Nvidia card I have ever had)

I really never expect my Nvidia cards to last an entire year, and I never have seen one last more than two.

The 7900GT I'm on right now are having "dead" pixels and will start to stutter and splutter like a car that's out of gas in games that are too demanding...

This year, I'm going ATi
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August 13, 2008 3:32:05 PM

Those of you with 8800s need not worry... It's only the G84 and G86 chips that are (supposedly) defective. The 8800 is from the G80 core, which is completely fine and dandy (and also one of the best GPUs ever).
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August 13, 2008 4:07:00 PM

My, my god! ITS THE STIG!

I dont care what you say, I beleive you.
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Anonymous
August 13, 2008 4:41:45 PM

@Denka: Sales people in stores usually don't know anything specific about components inside - much less about parts that have problems or are recalled.

Them telling you to contact the manufacturer's customer service is a correct response. You are a moron.
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August 13, 2008 4:49:30 PM

bdw G84 and G86, are they refering to the nvidia Geforce 8400series and Geforce 8600series video cards?

wh3resmycaroh for christs sake, my 8600gt is pushing 1 1/2 years old already. the hissing sound you guys hear is the fan adjusting itself accordingly when its being used extensively. my 8600gt is dead quiet btw.


mine have been running for a year, no trouble so far, touch wood.
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August 13, 2008 5:50:46 PM

Hellscream@Denka: Sales people in stores usually don't know anything specific about components inside - much less about parts that have problems or are recalled.Them telling you to contact the manufacturer's customer service is a correct response. You are a moron.


Well, imagine a scenario when a customer walks into a store, picks a notebook to buy, asks sales rep to open the box, boots the notebook up, checks the serial ID of the video board, calls the NVIDIA service, gets their response and only then proceeds to checkout... At which point does a customer starts being a moron? I'm afraid it is at a point when customer even considers buying a notebook with NVidia graphics.

P.S. Please reply without personal attacks next time, if you can.
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August 13, 2008 7:23:39 PM

By using aftermarket cooling and never going above 52c full load is my 8800GT safe?
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August 13, 2008 10:34:36 PM

ModtechBy using aftermarket cooling and never going above 52c full load is my 8800GT safe?

Nope It'll be dead tomorrow.....;)

Personally my 8800GTS 512 is under a year old, and since i bought MSI I have 3 years till i would have to replace it at my own cost(fully) And by then it will be on its last leg anyway if i still own it. So not really worried.
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August 14, 2008 1:21:05 AM

Lol wow the inquirer lol. dont you people know what kind of garbage they publish? Finally all the amd/ati fanboys crawl out of that hole they dug themselfs when amd was in the shitter a few months ago. LOL AT YOU FANBOYS
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August 14, 2008 4:24:43 AM

wh3resmycar - we were still selling a few as of last month (crap choice, but still people wanted them etc) - brand new cards making electrical high pitched noises that change on load etc (3D/2D etc) - DEFINITELY NOT THE FANS, and only effecting a few, most were PERFECT.
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August 14, 2008 6:10:45 AM

If you have an 8800 non-G92 card, install the most recent drivers and attempt to run ATI Tool's artifact scan. I did this and errors were showing up all over the place. I reverted back to the previous driver, and it was just fine. I figured maybe I had a bad driver download, so I re downloaded the new driver and was getting errors again after installation. I uninstall old drivers before installing the new ones every time. Either my card was having an issue which was being covered up with a driver work around, or the current set of drivers are bad. Anyone else with experiences like this, please post.
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August 14, 2008 8:30:59 AM

dmacfour50-55c doesn't sound bad. My 7900gt and 8600m gt both max at about 70c.

Holy crap. Seriously? My 7900gt idled at 40, and under load when the fan kicked up went *down*. It was a KO edition with a better cooler than a lot of them, but still. And now that I bolted a hr-03gt on it it idles at 32 loads at 38 (loads about the same, but minus the noise of the tiny fan; It's only cooled by case fans now)

asdasd123123I really never expect my Nvidia cards to last an entire year, and I never have seen one last more than two.

An ancient geforce3 I had ket working for years after the fan died. I finally replaced it with a 5500 that still runs. And the aforementioned 7900gt is going after two years. Anecdotes are great!

Nevertheless, I'm sure avoiding nVidia for the time being. Chips dying, poor performance in UT200x and related games, no bump mapping in Republic Commando on the 8 series and above, crap 2d performance in KDE.. Im just enjoying the low end with my eee for now.
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August 14, 2008 9:02:42 AM

All chips are not equal: some overclock well, some heat a lot even at stock voltage, etc... All the NV84/86 have a flaw. It does not mean that all will defect. The true question is: what proportion?
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August 14, 2008 9:18:33 AM

asdasd123123I really never expect my Nvidia cards to last an entire year, and I never have seen one last more than two


oh come on buddy, u must have been doing somthing wrong. I have a Nvidia Geforce 2MX 200 which i used back in the pentium 3 era, this week i hooked it up in a Pentium 4 system and it was still working after 5 yrs of non use. BDW the system was of a non gamers

Although i tend to prefer AMD and ATI stuff Nvidia do some good crap. At the moment i own the 8600gt and the Asus Nvidia 590chipset np so far.

Although i might give the ATI chiset a try for my next build
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Anonymous
August 14, 2008 10:21:11 AM

Um, i just bought a 2700$ hp pavilion dv9880ee. Sporting a 8600, am i screwed?
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August 14, 2008 1:14:21 PM

Since Geforce 6 none of my cards have outlived a full 12 months without developing errors. And I mostly had ATi before that, and a GF3 that blew its caps.

My error must be in putting card in -> playing games for 12 months.
I rarely touch the rig after assembly.
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August 14, 2008 1:54:14 PM

While it's extremely fair to be critical of the Inquirer it doesn't mean they're wrong. Where did the huge $200 million dollar check from nVidia come from if not for a genuine problem?
It's like Microsoft, they have always maintained there wasn't any problem with the xbox 360s yet the scores of people with red ring of death, the fact that it was proven they would change the cooling in refurbished systems, AND then coincidentally extend their warranty to 3 years.

Is this panic-worthy? Certainly not, at the end of the day Nvidia will do the right thing so the worst I think most are in for is an inconvenience but the Inq could be guilty for in this place is trying to cause panic.

Is this a proven track record of diminishing reliability from nVidia? Since the nforce4 which was extremely solid, their latest chipsets have had numerous documented problems ranging from general reliability to heat. Honestly, I just think it's growing pains. I think this is more due to the fact that since the nforce4, nvidia had been the de-facto chipset for AMD and the massive numbers of nvidia boards flooding the market has just magnified the amount of issues reported.

The seediest part of this article is:
Quote:
While evidence may point to only notebook chips being afflicted, one theory is that notebook chips go though more stress than their desktop counterparts. Notebooks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laptop are power cycled more often, and by extension the GPUs go through more heat cycles – quickly exposing the defect. GPUs in notebooks may also be harder to cool, with less space for elaborate heatsinks and fans.


That's the old "people are saying" BS. It's a specious and rediculous argument that they cannot possibly backup, nor can nVidia realistically deny. The cooling profile in a desktop is galactically different than the cooling profile in a notebook. I wouldn't be concerned about your desktop part, even if it's fanless, as long as you have decent airflow.
Overheating in notebooks is really not a surprise and it does look like nVidia is trying to man-up about it.

Unlike some people I don't see everything as black and white, and it's amazing, when you think about it, how many times depending on perspective someone can be a fanboi for like 30 different and conflicting companies.

I don't think Inq is specifically "anti-anyone" so much as "pro-sensationalism" like... all journalists and pseudo-journalists which naturally, and should, destroy credibility.

This fan bios fix will work just fine if heat is the actual issue, and IMO if you were buying a laptop with dedicated graphics engines in it like the 8600 you probably weren't too concerned with battery power anyway. Me, I'd deal with it and still have confidence in nVidia though I'm more of an ATI guy myself. I wouldn't blame anyone for a Class Action suit to get their money back for a more power conservative laptop either. Specifically reducing battery consumption to fix their mistake AFTER you bought it sounds is kindof iffy to me.

And the buzzing noises are more often leaky caps or vibrating power coils like others have suggested. Often you can touch or hot glue said coils and fix the problem. leaky caps... bad... vibrating coils, not really a sign of a bad thing, albeit annoying.
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August 14, 2008 4:48:30 PM

modtechBy using aftermarket cooling and never going above 52c full load is my 8800GT safe?


this is what's sad... you are using aftermarket cooling and ur 8800gt runs at 52c. My stock 8800GTS OC 512 has no aftermarket cooling and runs at 52c.

G92's and 94's should not be a affected.

By G84 and G86 they mean that chipset style (found in 8400-8600 chips both desktop and laptop).

I have only had Nvidia cards, my last 6600GT lasted me 4 years and I'm already on 7 months with my new 8800GTS OC and its been great.

Just a streak of bad luck for Nvidia... ATI has it ALL THE TIME!
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August 14, 2008 10:02:39 PM

my xfx 8600 GT us gone :(  256MB
got a new 8600GT 1GB but it is modified version of 8500GT i didnt chech b4 now i see its specification r less than that of the previous one :@
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Anonymous
August 14, 2008 10:22:46 PM

I have a gateway 6860FX that has a 8800M GTS (g92) and my temps never went more than 78 on the table with out cooler after 6 hours of playing COD4.

I don't think that G9x is defective.
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August 15, 2008 3:20:32 AM

Got some bad news its not just the G84 and G86 notebooks.... I have a notebook with an intergrated go 6150 and it suffers from the same problem what makes you think nvidia has fixed this issue... My notebook died within a year. I was having graphical problems and my wireless card stoped functioning. I've done a bit of searching and I've read the 9 series could be affected also as well as many Nvidia chipsets. Oh and my latest bio's flash was listed "Critical"
Quote:
Release Date: 2007-11-30 Version: F.3D

Description


PURPOSE: Critical



Fixes



Updates the fan control algorithm of the system to reduce the likelihood of future system issues.
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