How To Get A Lockdown Bar Mirror Shine?

[Ron]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

in the process of shopping out my tz, and everything is starting to look
great with exception of my scratched up lockdown bar. in addition the
metal is so thin, i can see indentations from the round studs that holds
it together from the back.

questions are:

1. is there a polish anyone could recommend to clean up scratches and
get this looking like a mirror finish?

2. i do not have a buffing wheel, but i can go to home depot and get one
if someone can share exactly what to get what kind of pad and polish) to
buff theirs out.

3. can i go to a car body shop and have the lockbar chromed? is this
expensive?

4. or should i just go out and buy a new one for my tz? suggestions on
where to find one appreciated!

any tips to polish up the side rails awarded extra credit points \-)


thanx!

\r


--
Sent via Gamer Newsgroups
http://www.gamernewsgroups.com

 

[karl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

ron wrote:
> in the process of shopping out my tz, and everything is starting to look
> great with exception of my scratched up lockdown bar. in addition the
> metal is so thin, i can see indentations from the round studs that holds
> it together from the back.
>
> questions are:
>
> 1. is there a polish anyone could recommend to clean up scratches and
> get this looking like a mirror finish?
>
> 2. i do not have a buffing wheel, but i can go to home depot and get one
> if someone can share exactly what to get what kind of pad and polish) to
> buff theirs out.
>
> 3. can i go to a car body shop and have the lockbar chromed? is this
> expensive?
>
> 4. or should i just go out and buy a new one for my tz? suggestions on
> where to find one appreciated!
>
> any tips to polish up the side rails awarded extra credit points \-)
>
>
> thanx!
>
> \r
>
>
> --
> Sent via Gamer Newsgroups
> http://www.gamernewsgroups.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Ahhh, Yes, we all will sorely miss Dave Chapelles' unique and
refreshing style of humor.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

I thought about getting them chromed, i think that would look sharp...I
dont know how much it would cost or how long the chrome would last, but
it would look nice...

bj

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

>the metal is so thin, i can see indentations from the
>round studs that holds it together from the back.

The metal isn't as thin as you may think. The indentations are spot
welds from the other side.

New bars are going to be grained like yours (without scratches).

Kirb

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Hours on a buffing wheel is not an undersight, it would take a very
long - long time to get the finish your looking for with that method.

zTim

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Often stainless has what is called a "brushed" finish. It's easy to do
and looks great. All you need to do is get a stiff wire brush, apply
firm pressure, and brush across the piece in ONE direction. Don't start
and stop on the piece itself or you could leave objectionable marks.
Practice on a scrap piece first.

I think brass bristles are too soft, you could certainly try it, but
steel bristles are probably better.

I understand coarse steel wool will also leave a nice finish on
stainless. Again, one direction only, no circular motion. If the marks
are too pronounced for your liking, you can graduate to finer steel
wool.

Terry.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

These are not SS, they are made from mild steel. I say this because I
have no problem getting a magnet to stick to it. There is a stainless
that is magnetic but it is VERY COSTLY and I can see no reason why they
would make them from magnetic SS. They will also rust and SS won't
rust so if you want to have them chromed by all means go for it since
they are just mild carbon steel.

Chris

 

[otto]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

You can always regrain the bar with some emory paper and elbow grease.

If you want shine, you might try simichrome. Available at most auto parts
stores in a tube. Takes elbow grease. If you are determined enough and have
the energy, it will turn the bar into a chrome lke shine where you can see
yourself in it.


Otto

CARGPB11

My web page: http://home.bellsouth.net/p/PWP-Ottoslanding

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Lockdown bars are stainless ! The welded part underneath the lockdown shell
is steel usually zinc plated steel. So a magnet would stick poorly to the
metal because its sticking to the welded part under the shell. Thats why
you never see a rusted lockdown bar. After 20 minutes of sweat from hands
it would be rusted otherwise. Lockdown bars would have to be replaced
weekly if they were made of steel !
You can still chrome stainless but its a more difficult/expensive
process.


--
Kerry Stair

Mantis Amusements "Its all about Pinball"


<pinballwizz@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1125414113.329859.54560@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> These are not SS, they are made from mild steel. I say this because I
> have no problem getting a magnet to stick to it. There is a stainless
> that is magnetic but it is VERY COSTLY and I can see no reason why they
> would make them from magnetic SS. They will also rust and SS won't
> rust so if you want to have them chromed by all means go for it since
> they are just mild carbon steel.
>
> Chris
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Kerry (and Donnie)

I disagree that these are SS. I can stick a magnet to the sides where
there is nothing underneath. I might be dead wrong but but I can
stick a magnet to anypart of the lockdown bar. Try it if you haven't
and then lmk what you think. I am not a Metalurigst nor do I have a
degree in metalology but I really think these are mild steel. Don't
kill me for my opinion, I am just trying to understand how this can be
SS and have a magnet fully adhehe to it.

CK

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Joe Mamma pinballwizz@gmail.com wrote:
> Kerry (and Donnie)
>
> I disagree that these are SS. I can stick a magnet to the sides where
> there is nothing underneath. I might be dead wrong but but I can
> stick a magnet to anypart of the lockdown bar. Try it if you haven't
> and then lmk what you think. I am not a Metalurigst nor do I have a
> degree in metalology but I really think these are mild steel. Don't
> kill me for my opinion, I am just trying to understand how this can be
> SS and have a magnet fully adhehe to it.
>
> CK

Doesn't all stainless have some Iron in it?Different grades/quality of
stainless with differing Iron amounts.
I just used a £25 inc postage polishing kit using polishing wheels and
wax and come up good.
You should see how the(originally thick)chromed Gottlieb leg came
up-wow.
wms/bally ones better too.Few hours work for one painted,teo
pitted/corroded and one scratched lockbar.
I'll post pics if anyone gives a damn and wants to see.
Gotta do the other 3 gtlb ones now!!(THINK it's gtlb-one half length
rib per side)

Chrispoibug

Chrispoibug

 

[karl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Joe Mamma
> Kerry (and Donnie)
>
> I disagree that these are SS. I can stick a magnet to the sides where
> there is nothing underneath.

I don't think (I'm not 100% sure either) a magent not sticking is the
only test of SS because there are many grades and qualities of SS. It's
like saying there is only one aluminum, they add stuff to aluminum
(alloy) to make it harder. Example Kirby vacuums for example, the old
ones are a soft thick aliminum very easy to buff out, the newer
"Generation" units are harder thinner to buff because the aluminum has
something else (nickle?) mixed in it to make it stronger and lighter
since it is much thinner.

I can't fathom regular steele not rusting to hell (or at least turning
all gray and nasty) with all the swet and acids slobered on it after
years of martian multiball! Oh, and SS CAN in fact rust, it is just
much more resistant (depending on grade and quality again) to
corrosion/rust.

My answer about buffing was the only correct one.

Have fun, Karl.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

What kinds of stainless steel are there?

Stainless comes in many grades. The different blends are distinguished
using several numbering systems. The most common in use in Canada and
the U.S. at this time is the AISI numbering system in which each
stainless alloy receives a three digit number starting with 2, 3, or
4, and ending with an optional postfix which indicates variations in
the alloy. For instance, you might have a plate of 304 stainless, but
you might also have 304L stainless or 304H stainless; each a little
different from regular 304.

Austenitic Stainless Steels
All of the alloys that start with 2 or 3 form a group known as the
Austenitic Stainless Steels. These alloys contain 16-26% Cr, 10-24% Ni
+ Mn, and up to 0.40% C. These alloys may also be doped with various
other elements as mentioned above.
The Austenitic group is tough, and has good strength at widely varying
temperatures. They are oxidation resistant to temperatures over 1000'F
(538'C). They are quite weldable, and resist strong corrosives.
Austenitic alloys are not magnetic; a magnet will not stick to them.
Austenitic alloys can not be hardened with heat treatment

Straight Chromium Stainless Steels
The remaining stainless alloys, those in the 400 series, are called
Straight Chromium Stainless Steels. They are not generally as
resistant to corrosion as austenitic grades, but some of them have
desirable mechanical properties. These grades are subdivided into
Ferritic and Martensitic.

Ferritic Stainless Steel includes 405, 430, 442 and 446 as examples.
The Ferritic grades contain 11.5-30% Cr, up to 0.2% C. These grades
are magnetic; a magnet will stick to them. Ferritic grades can not be
hardened with heat treatment. Ferritic grades are relatively low-cost,
but not easy to weld successfully.

Martensitic Stainless Steels comprise the rest of the stainless
grades. They all contain 11-18% Cr, up to 1.20% C, and a limited
quantity of Ni and Mn. Martensitic alloys can be hardened by heat
treatment. These alloys are quite strong, but expensive.

 

[karl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

> Doesn't all stainless have some Iron in it?Different grades/quality of
> stainless with differing Iron amounts.

I agree.

> Gotta do the other 3 gtlb ones now!!(THINK it's gtlb-one half length
> rib per side)

I know spiderman (widebody) is like that (seam in the middle) but Black
Hole (also wide body) is not like that(no seam in the middle).
>
> Chrispoibug
>
> Chrispoibug

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

On Tue, 30 Aug, Rockola wrote:
> Hours on a buffing wheel is not an undersight, it would take a very
> long - long time to get the finish your looking for with that method.

It's not *that* bad. I have one that was done that way by Bob Antleman and
while he said it was several hours, I don't think he would have done it had
it been more than three or so. It's on a TZ, too, and it does look great.


--Donnie

--
Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Friggin ell Ian,
you clever barsteward!!
Or is it sad git-LOL!!

Chrispoibug

 

[karl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Could you explain in a bit more detail please...

~

Q: Given your expertise, which SS grade (would you estimate) the lock
down bars are made of?

Thanks for the info, this group seems to have every specialty area of
info covered.... Well done sir, very well done.

Have fun, Karl.

TopLoser wrote:
> What kinds of stainless steel are there?
>
> Stainless comes in many grades. The different blends are distinguished
> using several numbering systems. The most common in use in Canada and
> the U.S. at this time is the AISI numbering system in which each
> stainless alloy receives a three digit number starting with 2, 3, or
> 4, and ending with an optional postfix which indicates variations in
> the alloy. For instance, you might have a plate of 304 stainless, but
> you might also have 304L stainless or 304H stainless; each a little
> different from regular 304.
>
> Austenitic Stainless Steels
> All of the alloys that start with 2 or 3 form a group known as the
> Austenitic Stainless Steels. These alloys contain 16-26% Cr, 10-24% Ni
> + Mn, and up to 0.40% C. These alloys may also be doped with various
> other elements as mentioned above.
> The Austenitic group is tough, and has good strength at widely varying
> temperatures. They are oxidation resistant to temperatures over 1000'F
> (538'C). They are quite weldable, and resist strong corrosives.
> Austenitic alloys are not magnetic; a magnet will not stick to them.
> Austenitic alloys can not be hardened with heat treatment
>
> Straight Chromium Stainless Steels
> The remaining stainless alloys, those in the 400 series, are called
> Straight Chromium Stainless Steels. They are not generally as
> resistant to corrosion as austenitic grades, but some of them have
> desirable mechanical properties. These grades are subdivided into
> Ferritic and Martensitic.
>
> Ferritic Stainless Steel includes 405, 430, 442 and 446 as examples.
> The Ferritic grades contain 11.5-30% Cr, up to 0.2% C. These grades
> are magnetic; a magnet will stick to them. Ferritic grades can not be
> hardened with heat treatment. Ferritic grades are relatively low-cost,
> but not easy to weld successfully.
>
> Martensitic Stainless Steels comprise the rest of the stainless
> grades. They all contain 11-18% Cr, up to 1.20% C, and a limited
> quantity of Ni and Mn. Martensitic alloys can be hardened by heat
> treatment. These alloys are quite strong, but expensive.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Well given the fact that lockbars are magnetic and the welds easily
break then I would imagine they are ferritic stainless steel, a low
cost material. Grade unknown, sorry.

There is a lot of rubbish posted on this group sometimes!

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

They are low nickel content stainless. Not a particularly expensive
grade at all. The high iron - low nickel allows spot welding and cold
forming.
Now, Bally was notorious for using mild steel lockdown bars in the 80's
and they were chromed. The chrome wears off from attack by salts in our
sweaty little hands and leaves the steel open to oxygen.... tada, rust.


Cliffy
A passion for pinball!
www.passionforpinball.com

Joe Mamma pinballwizz@gmail.com wrote:
> Kerry (and Donnie)
>
> I disagree that these are SS. I can stick a magnet to the sides where
> there is nothing underneath. I might be dead wrong but but I can
> stick a magnet to anypart of the lockdown bar. Try it if you haven't
> and then lmk what you think. I am not a Metalurigst nor do I have a
> degree in metalology but I really think these are mild steel. Don't
> kill me for my opinion, I am just trying to understand how this can be
> SS and have a magnet fully adhehe to it.
>
> CK

 

[karl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

TopLoser wrote:
> Well given the fact that lockbars are magnetic and the welds easily
> break then I would imagine they are ferritic stainless steel, a low
> cost material. Grade unknown, sorry.

Thank you.
>
> There is a lot of rubbish posted on this group sometimes!

Once again... Well said sir, very well said. 'Just gald I always steer
clear of that sort of thing. ;\

Have fun, Karl.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

First let's clarify what "stainless steel" is (and for that matter,
what is steel)...

Steel is essentially just iron with a little bit (usually a fraction of
percent) of carbon. The little bit of carbon makes a big change in the
properties of the iron. Of course, there are thousands of varieties of
alloys with differing levels of

Stainless steel is just an alloy of steel with chromium (typically 10%
or more) added (for corrosion resistance). As pointed out, there are
many many different "stainless steel" alloys...

As TopLoser notes, there are a number of primary divisions of types of
so-called "stainless" steel alloys.
The Martensitic and Ferritic varities *are* ferromagnetic. The
Austenitic SS is *not* ferromagnetic when annealed, but becomes
somewhat ferromagnetic with cold working. Also, many SS alloys contain
Nickel, which makes the alloy non-ferromagnetic. Read more about it
here: http://www.azom.com/details.asp?ArticleID=1140

Darren Finck, P.E.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

If I had to guess, I'd guess it's 430.

There are plenty of companies that'll do analysis on a sample for you,
and tell you the composition, from whick you can likely narrow it down
to a couple of specific alloys... for a few hundred bucks.

df

 

[karl]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Cliffy wrote:
> I'm aware of the benefits of simichrome, #11. I've had the same tube of
> it for damn near 10 years! And yes we will try it after the power
> scotchbrite wheel. I just have to babysit Ron with my tube of simichrome
> or he'll squirt it out like toothpaste and you really don't need much

Didn't you find the one gallon jug at CostCo / Sams Club? I have mine
with a squirt pump like mustard!

~

I agree again Cliffy, the 3M scotchbrite wheel is a perfect first step,
it will do most of the work for you before the final polish, if we a
really talking about true "ungraining" and not just grain reduction. I
think we are.

Best whishes, Karl.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

On Tue, 30 Aug, Kerry Stair wrote:
> You can still chrome stainless but its a more difficult/expensive
> process.

And I don't think it holds up to the hand oil...it'll just wear off quickly
at the corners unless you clearcoat the snot out of it, and then it doesn't
look right anyway.

Oh, and if you polish the SS, you'll have to do it fairly regularly to keep
it to a mirror finish. It doesn't start looking horrible and it doesn't
take much to get it back smooth once done, but it does need to be kept up.


--Donnie

--
Donnie Barnes http://www.donniebarnes.com 879. V.