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UPGRADING IBM APTIVA WITH AMD-K6-2/450

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December 7, 2004 6:28:18 AM

I want to know how hard it would be for a rookie like me to upgrade a IBM Aptiva with a Acer V58XA motherboard to the AMD-K6-2/450 CPU?
Is the board compatable with the chip? will I have to change jumpers? Will I have to change the bios or anything?
PLEASE HELP THANKS
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by russell on 12/07/04 03:35 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
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December 7, 2004 8:49:54 PM

What chip is in it?

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December 8, 2004 1:55:37 PM

Thanks for responding.
I looked under system properties and it has a AMD-K6 and I know that it's running at 233 MHZ so I'm thinking that if I swap it with the AMD-K6-2/450 it shpuld run faster (maybe 450 MHZ).
I dont know anything else about the current chip OR EVEN HOW TO FIND ANYTHING ELSE about it without removing the heatsink and looking. Anything you can suggest to help me in this first time endever would be appreceated.
THANKS
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December 8, 2004 4:06:52 PM

I think that you are looking at this problem the wrong way, even if you already have the K6-2 450 in your posession, that Motherboard won't clock a CPU any higher than 300MHz.

You would be better off buying new parts from regular retail channels, you need another old motherboard anyway, finding obselete parts is a tedious process, chances are that you will be paying a huge premium for them.

If you still want to go through all this for a mere 66MHz, start by locating and reading the the V58XA User's Manual although only a simple jumper layout diagram is really needed.

As you can see by clicking <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Acer+V58XA+jumper&..." target="_new">Here</A> a simple Google search allowed me to locate the information you need in a matter of seconds, that lead me to beleive that you are not trying very hard.

I don't mind helping people who are doing efforts on their own but I don't have a lot of sympathy for someone who can't do a simple search by himself.

Would have been a completely different story if you provided a link to the V58XA jumper layout and asked "Will a K6-2 450 work ?"



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December 8, 2004 4:29:10 PM

Quote:
As you can see by clicking Here a simple Google search allowed me to locate the information you need in a matter of seconds, that lead me to beleive that you are not trying very hard.

I don't mind helping people who are doing efforts on their own but I don't have a lot of sympathy for someone who can't do a simple search by himself.


Arn't you being a little harsh?

I doubt he even knows what a Jumper layout diagram is (No offence).

It's not like he was flaming anyone, he was just asking a question. Until about a year ago, I didn't even know that some motherboards have a max clock speed.

Lay off him man.

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December 8, 2004 5:15:36 PM

It is insulting to realise that the information someone is after happen to be the very first hit from the most popular search engine and is found in the first few pages of the motherboard User's Manual.

IMHO this is sufficient ground for me to support the belief that he did'nt try very hard to come up with the information he is after, just another RTFM case.

Although I went ahead and freely expressed how I felt about the situation at hand, I provided him with helpfull and relevant information to answer his queries.

Considering your tendency to post vulgar and out of context material on legitimate threads, I think you should stand down and avoid pretending that you are THGC "White-Knight-In-Shiny-Armor"

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December 8, 2004 7:41:38 PM

This is really crash country. But I've heard that selection of the 2x multiplier on a k6 II or III, will produce a 6x multiplier; thusly, producing a 66x6=400mhz operation. I believe it is possible with that board. Still not worth the money though.

Dichromatic for your viewing plesure...
December 8, 2004 7:47:09 PM

Then again the <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti..." target="_new">$15</A> chip at newegg, has a review of a guy who operated it at 6x66=400. It might be worth it for that price.

Quote:
I upgraded an old IBM Aptiva 2137-E26 with an Acer V58XA motherboard with this chip; it had a K-6 233 in it originally. I thought I would be able to get up to 500mhz with the 83mhz bus x 6 trick, but even with PC100 SDRAM I got lots of memory errors and Windows was very unstable. I dialed it back to 66mhx x 6, or 400mhz, and it works fine. This chip uses 2.2V, which a lot of older mobos don't support, so check that first.

Dichromatic for your viewing plesure...
December 8, 2004 8:30:50 PM

His post does not warrent you flame as a response.

Think about that before you reply.

Quote:
Considering your tendency to post vulgar and out of context material on legitimate threads, I think you should stand down and avoid pretending that you are THGC "White-Knight-In-Shiny-Armor"

Now where did that come from? All I asked is that you back off him a little.

Someone woke up and got out the wrong side of the bed today I guess ? :lol: 
...and the fell down the stairs?
...onto some broken glass?
...from last nights party in which your guests were sick everywhere?
...including on your new Living Room carpet?
...AND IN YOUR BED?! :lol: 

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December 8, 2004 10:31:34 PM

Look at that, the pot calling the kettle black, read my replies again, no flamable material whatsoever, on the other hand, you're the one playing around with matches...



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December 8, 2004 10:53:52 PM

Thanks guys for the constructive help with my question? I guess that I wont bother to try the 450 MHZ cpu change. I just thought that it would be a good learning experince and that some insite from some guys that know the ropes better than I do would be nice.
I did visit the web site with the jumper info on the motherboard a couple of days ago even though Mr.Vicious did'nt give me credit for enough brains to think of that. I also read the article on the clock speed multplier the same day (before the post), but being a novice (and not ashamed to admit it), relized that I dont know how to change those settings, with this realization I didnt bother to find the manuel.
This is my first time posting on this site and I was under the impression that the sites purpose was to share knowledge and give advice.
Thank you for your effort and help, (even you Mr Vicious),I will learn all there is to know about computer hardware one day but it will take longer than the few months that I've been involved.
THANK YOU
Russell
December 8, 2004 11:28:46 PM

Quote:
Since when did it become acceptable to reply in gibberish riddles?


I don't expect the newbie that once posted about the <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">"penis cooling method"</A> and whose signature used to link to deviant pr0n to make much sense out of literary artefacts, let alone computers.



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December 9, 2004 3:22:33 PM

I was just looking for K6-III chips at Newegg.com but happened upon K6-2 500 chips. I noticed in the <A HREF="http://secure.newegg.com/app/CustratingReview.asp?DEPA=..." target="_new">user reviews</A> that one person installed the chip in his Acer Aspire 2197 which I belive uses the same V58XA motherboard. He runs the chip at 6 x 83 Mhz = 498 (and yes 2X gets 6X with K6-2 and K6-III chips. It doesn't matter which motherboard you use. The multiplier remap is internal to the CPUs).

Another guy installed the same chip in his Aptiva and specfically mentions he has the V58XA motherboard. Unfortunately, he wasn't as lucky. His system wasn't stable at 83 Mhz so he's running it at 6 x 66 Mhz = 400 Mhz. Not great but it does prove that K6-2 can work on the V58XA.

Here's a link for jumper information for that board.
<A HREF="http://assist.acer.com/public/articles/2222.htm" target="_new">http://assist.acer.com/public/articles/2222.htm&lt;/A>

Notice one variant, PCB-2, supports the 2.2 Volts that the K6-2 500 requires. Not a big deal though as plenty of people have K6-2s on old Socket 7 motherboards, running them at 2.8 volts, just with extra beefy heatsinks to keep them cool.

<b>A mind is a terrible thing</b>
December 10, 2004 1:10:51 PM

I'm jumping in!!!
I read that review and I've never tried anything like this before but I'm going to put the /450 chip in and try to get it to run as fast as possible.
I've got a older, slower system up and running so I can get help from you guys while I'm tinkering with the AMD-K6-2/450.
I'll let ya know how it goes.......
December 10, 2004 1:53:19 PM

It should be pretty easy. Since you have a K6 233 already installed your motherboard will be set to 66 Mhz FSB and 3.5X multiplier. Leave the FSB for now. Set the multiplier to 2X. Set CPU voltage to the 2.2V setting as per the diagram I linked earlier. If you have a retail K6-2 you can use the HSF (heatsink + fan) that came with it. If your CPU didn't come with a HSF then I advise you to purchase a small Socket A HSF. They fit Socket 7 CPUs as long as you use a 60x60mm heatsink. (Some motherboards may accomodate larger ones but none of mine do). Plus 60x60 is adequate for K6-2. Don't use the HSF that you have on the K6 233. It won't cool well enough, IMO.

Your new CPU will be running at 400 Mhz.

If the above config seem unstable then raise the CPU voltage to the next level. I think that is 2.8 volt. If you do have to do this you definitely need the better HSF.

Once you get everything stable then you can play with other FSB speeds. 75 Mhz would put your CPU speed at 450 Mhz (stock speed but lower FSB than designed). 83 Mhz would get your CPU to 500 Mhz, slightly overclocked but achievable for many users.

<b>[EDIT]</b>
Hmmm, I'm not sure what you should use for the CPU jumper settings.

OK, I looked at that user review again. The person with the Aptiva started with the same K6 233 as you. Give it a go without changing the CPU jumpers, but do change the multiplier and CPU voltage.

If you have PCB 2, that's actually PCB 97114-<b>2</b>, then you might be able to get 4.5 x 100 working which would be completely stock for your K6-2.

Good luck!


<b>A mind is a terrible thing</b><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by phsstpok on 12/10/04 11:14 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
December 10, 2004 5:03:53 PM

Here is what I did:
I set the CPU jumpers to the AMD-K6 PR 300 settings, changed the core voltage to 2.2V (the specs. for the new chip say 2.4 V) and set the multiplier to 4.5 and it only ran at 300MHZ.
Then I read your post and droped the multiplier to 2 and just like you said I,m at 400MHZ right now (I dont get that).
Next step is to try for the more MHZ (the chip is only rated at 450 MHZ).
I'll let ya know but I'm pretty happy with my first attempt at this stuff!!!!!
December 10, 2004 6:50:53 PM

Quote:
I set the CPU jumpers to the AMD-K6 PR 300 settings, changed the core voltage to 2.2V (the specs. for the new chip say 2.4 V) and set the multiplier to 4.5 and it only ran at 300MHZ.
Then I read your post and droped the multiplier to 2 and just like you said I,m at 400MHZ right now (I dont get that).

The standard bus speed for K6 is 66.666 mhz (66 mhz for convenience sake). A multiplier of 4.5x gets you 4.5 x 66 = 300 Mhz.

K6-2 was designed to be a drop in replacement for K6. However, some of the older motherboards only went up to 3.5x making 233 Mhz the top speed (3.5 x 66 = 233 Mhz). AMD took this into account and remapped the 2X multiplier which now becomes 6X and so for your current configuration you get 6 x 66 = 400 Mhz.

I was kind of afraid your K6-2 450 was a 2.4 volt processor. I was hoping it was 2.2 volt like the 500 Mhz model. Because of this it might not reach full speed at the lower 2.2 volts. However, it's probably worth a try. Keep it cool and it might work.

If it turns out to be unstable you'll probably need the higher voltage with a better heatsink, or you could just live with 400 Mhz. It will run nice and cool at the lower voltage (assuming it actually is stable).



<b>A mind is a terrible thing</b>
a b à CPUs
December 10, 2004 10:00:42 PM

Quote:
I think that you are looking at this problem the wrong way, even if you already have the K6-2 450 in your posession, that Motherboard won't clock a CPU any higher than 300MHz.

He's proved otherwise, the 2x=6x multiplier conversion is a well-known fact. He can get 450MHz from 6x75.

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a b à CPUs
December 10, 2004 10:05:02 PM

I'd just take it up to 75MHz bus. 6x75=450.

Multipliers never were on the board, at least since the Pentium was introduced. Instead, they're on the CPU. They are accessed as a function of certain pins on Socket 5 and Socket 7. The multiplier setting on the board simply turns these pins on or off.

The same pins the Pentium uses for turning on the 2x setting is used by the K6-2 for the 6x setting. So that explains how it's possible that 2x is actually 6x on that CPU.

AMD made that change to the core around 350MHz, so while your 450 does the 6x conversion, a 300 probably wouldn't.

Which gets back to where I started, I'd leave the multiplier where it is and increase the bus speed to 75MHz. That's a stable setting for most chipsets.

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>
December 11, 2004 3:42:28 AM

Here's the end result, I could'nt get it to boot at 500 MHZ and I tried voltages up to 3.2v with the multiplier at 6 and the bus freq at 83MHZ.It's now set at 2.8v with 6x75=500MHZ, and it's running cool (I'll let you know if it crashes).
Anyway, I've went from 233MHZ to 450MHZ just with junk that was lying around (actually found in the dumpster)and now I should be able to run fs 2000 but will need a graphics card.
Thanks everyone for the help.
Russell
December 11, 2004 4:00:34 AM

Quote:
don't expect the newbie that once posted about the "penis cooling method" and whose signature used to link to deviant pr0n to make much sense out of literary artefacts, let alone computers.


HAHAHAHAHAHA, that's so cool. Well, that certainly was 'back in day!

Also, I know more about computers than you. But thanks for the link :lol: 

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December 11, 2004 6:18:10 AM

Yeah, but it’s that UK computer knowledge so it’s all buggered up prim and proper stiff upper lip and such.

Dichromatic for your viewing plesure...
December 11, 2004 6:46:37 AM

Hey guys,
How about a little pat on the back here....I know that It's no big deal for you pros to do mods & upgrades and I thank you for the help,but you know there was'nt any jumper settings on that board for that chip and I was able to gain over 200MHZ on my old junk system.
signed
proud
December 11, 2004 2:04:15 PM

Quote:
Also, I know more about computers than you.


Suuuure you do, THGC has yet to see a relevant post from you...



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December 11, 2004 3:28:09 PM

Quote:
and THGC has yet to see 400posts from you.

Unlike you, I don't feel the need to spam every single thread I see with a meaningless one-liner to artificially inflate my post count.

Quote:
and I know a lot of people that can vouch for my contributions to the forum.

I seriously doubt that your <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?nam..." target="_new">Puppet Logins</A> testimonials would have any credibility whatsoever.

Quote:
Your fighting a loosing battle my friend

You might as well threaten me with a plastic spork.



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December 11, 2004 7:09:33 PM

Quote:
Wow, you keep digging up old classics. Thanks again.


Full of yourself are'nt you ? Out of the pile of filth that you spewed all over THGC since you joined 11 months ago, nothing you wrote actually come close to being a classic...



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!