Can a cpu "upgrade" reduce performance?

[usernamenumber]

Has anyone here ever heard of a system performing worse after a cpu upgrade? I've seen systems become unstable, with crashes and lockups due to cpu/motherboard issues, but I recently upgraded my wife's system from a 1.3ghz/200mhz fsb athlon to a 2ghz/266 fsb and suddenly games like KOTOR run unplayably choppy. No crashes, just lousy gaming performance. She wants to replace the mobo[1] and ram, which admittedly are old, but I'm really wondering if it will make a difference.

Anybody have ideas what might be up? Or anything else I could try to troubleshoot this problem without replacing the motherboard? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

--Brad

[1] In case it makes a difference, the motherboard in question is an Amptron K7-825LU with a VIA KM266/VT8235 chipset and pc133 RAM. I think someone once told me about that particular chipset having issues with processorts above a certain clockspeed, but I'm not sure about the details. Full mobo info is here:

http://www.amptron.com/html/MB-K7-825LU.html

 

[usernamenumber]

Ah, this brings up an important point that I'd completely forgotten. While attaching the heatsink it slipped and two of the rubber risers on the cpu got partially scraped off. I could definitely go back and apply a new layer of thermal paste, but is it possible (or necessary) to replace the risers as well? I asked at Frys and they said that they didn't carry them anymore.

Thanks for the reply,
--Brad

 

[endyen]

Wow did wusy get that right, on the first shot.
Without those spacers, the heatsink is not sitting square on the chip. You may be able to pick up a shim. You are very lucky that you didn't crack the ceramic on the chip. Get the shim before you do anything else. In the mean time, see if the chip will run slower, like 100mhz fsb. What you want now, is something like <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=list&catalog=151&DEPA=1" target="_new">http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=list&catalog=151&DEPA=1</A>

 

[tweebel]

Also remember that most XP cpu's dont start with optimal settings. For safety they choose lowest FSB possible, you'll have to check that in the BIOS.

 

[jihiggs]

ummmm, a cpu thats running a bit hot doesnt run noticably slower.

this is my boomstick!

 

[usernamenumber]

Regarding the comment about a hot cpu not running slower:

That's what I would have thought, but there seem to be a lot of experienced people saying otherwise. Maybe I'm just missing something?

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by usernamenumber on 01/18/05 12:17 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[sobelizard]

It would be a good place to start eliminating problems. You can buy aftermarket shims all over the net. Even pressure on the die is the only way to go. If this wasn't necessary, I'm sure we'd have all sorts of hsf and irregular mounts on the mb's.

The BIOS would be a quick check - updating to the newest version. If both of those check out, ensure the BIOS and OS recognize your cpu. Run some benchmarks and see if you can pinpoint a specific area.

Did you blow out the socket with canned air before you put in the new cpu? Not a bad time to do the same with the memory and the case/components in general.

<font color=green><b><i>Lizards</font color=green></b> do <b>not</b> taste like <b><font color=yellow>chicken</font color=yellow></b>,<b> <font color=yellow>chicken</font color=yellow></b> tastes like <font color=green><b>lizard.</b></font color=green></i>

 

[usernamenumber]

If I was to get and apply one of those shims, would I want to remove the remaining risers so that it sits flat on the cpu or just set it on even if it's a bit lopsided? If the former, is there a recommended way to get them off other than to just try and get under them and through the epoxy with the tip of a knife?

 

[tweebel]

If a cpu gets warm, it won't slow down. If it get's hot, the CPU might downclock itself (only new CPU's) to make sure it will not be damaged by the heat.

 

[usernamenumber]

Well, this is an athlon XP mobile 2600, I think. So it's newish, I guess. The diags I ran showed it running at 2ghz, but maybe it only clocked down after enough load was put on it (by the game) to cause its temp sensors or whatever to go off.

 

[justaguy]

What diagnostics said it was @ 2 GHz? TMK, the AXP's don't throttle when they're hot. At least the one that I burned up when the fan failed didn't throttle. Run a benchmark or two and see if the low performance is limited to certain apps or what. Also, since you apparently went to a mobile, your board may not be detecting the chip correctly which could cause a multiplier or FSB to be off the mark. The rig in my sig would have a default multi of 16, but it's 12 in a desktop mobo because the desktops don't have Speedstep or in your case, Powernow.

Mobile P4 1.6 @ 2.4 - Gigabyte 8ipe-1000 Pro - 4x256 Corsair Value PC3200 - MSI 128 MB 9800Pro @ 435/730 - 80Gb WD 8Mb Cache -

 

[usernamenumber]

I haven't flashed the bios yet (been out of town a lot lately). However, there's been a wierd development. I changed the FSB back to 100mhz and the performance problems persist. The system is now configured exactly how it was when it worked properly (1.5ghz/100fsb), only now it's acting like it did at the higher settings (2ghz/133fsb).

All my attempts to deduce a cause for this lead back to the processor having been damaged. I set the FSB back because I haven't been able to go out and get thermal paste or a shim yet, so nothing's been done about whatever cooling issues there might have been. But if it's heat damange everybody seems to be in agreement that choppy gaming performance is a really wierd way for it to manifest its self. There are no crashes, the game just freezes for a couple of seconds and then suddenly your character is on the other side of the room, like network lag but it's not a networked game. It's also not particular to KOTOR. We installed Deus Ex 2 and it has the same sort of problems.

Does anyone have suggestion as to how I can troubleshoot this further instead of shelling out to replace ram/mobo/cpu? Someone suggested running a benchmarking tool. Could I get a recommendation? I've never used one before. What should I be looking for when I run it?

Thanks to all who have helped.
--Brad

 

[tweebel]

You can try the CPU with CPU burn, Prime95, Setiathome or folding@home for maximum load over a long period of time

3dmark 03 will nicely stress gpu but also mem and cpu. dxdiag could do something for you.

Test the RAM with memtest86.

Mobo is hard to test. Are you already monitoring voltages and temps?

 

[endyen]

That may not be a great idea, if the hsf is not sitting square on the chip.

 

[endyen]

You do see those same symptoms if the chip is giving errors.

 

[Clob]

Ok. Seeing how your current motherboard does not like your new chip and your ram is so slow it hurts, heres what you do.

Go to your local computer shop, but a new motherboard that supports the chip. Nforce 3 is nice. Buy some 3200ram and overclock that chip to 3200+ speeds and be much much more happy.

1gig of value ram and the mobo = $250 or less.

"If youre paddling upstream in a canoe and a
wheel falls off, how many pancakes fit in a doghouse? None! Icecream doesn't have bones!!!"

"Battling Gimps and Dimbulbs HERE at THGC"
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Clob on 01/23/05 12:06 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[pat]

"Go to your local computer shop, but a new motherboard that supports the chip. Nforce 3 is nice. Buy some 3200ram and overclock that chip to 3200+ speeds and be much much more happy."

And how would you make a socket a to fit on tha AMD64 nforce3 mobo??? They are either socket 754 or 939.

I hope you meant nforce2.

-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!