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Doom and gloom in palm world?

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Anonymous
January 5, 2005 8:14:24 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

I've just been reading these sites:

http://www.faughnan.com/palm.html
http://onetruepda.blogspot.com/

They paint a very negative picture of the Palm world at the moment.
Do many people here agree with this point of view? I have just bought
my first palmos pda (waiting for it to arrive) and I would hate to
think that the whole idea is on its deathbead :) . Are people generally
worried about the future of palm pdas?

Richard

More about : doom gloom palm world

January 5, 2005 11:22:37 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

They have been preaching the death of the palm for many years. Sales
are up. Stocks are up. Yup, they gonna go chapter 11 tomorow.

Its best to see *who* write articles and what their credentials are.
Just because its in print, doesn't make an editorial gospel

Richard Hunt wrote:

> I've just been reading these sites:
>
> http://www.faughnan.com/palm.html
> http://onetruepda.blogspot.com/
>
> They paint a very negative picture of the Palm world at the moment.
> Do many people here agree with this point of view? I have just bought
> my first palmos pda (waiting for it to arrive) and I would hate to
> think that the whole idea is on its deathbead :) . Are people generally
> worried about the future of palm pdas?
>
> Richard
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 4:22:30 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article <18ae804a.0501051714.489945ea@posting.google.com>,
0102806h@student.gla.ac.uk (Richard Hunt) wrote:

> I've just been reading these sites:
>
> http://www.faughnan.com/palm.html
> http://onetruepda.blogspot.com/
>
> They paint a very negative picture of the Palm world at the moment.
> Do many people here agree with this point of view? I have just bought
> my first palmos pda (waiting for it to arrive) and I would hate to
> think that the whole idea is on its deathbead :) . Are people generally
> worried about the future of palm pdas?

Why do you think those sites have anything more legitimate to say than any
other?
Related resources
January 6, 2005 5:05:03 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On 5 Jan 2005 17:14:24 -0800, Richard Hunt wrote:

> Are people generally
> worried about the future of palm pdas?

Yes, and they tend to be Microsoft, its employees, consultants,
flacks, customers or the Gartner Group.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 5:05:04 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

"BillB" <rainbose@earthlink.newt> wrote in message
news:1v6pt05puf4usiqe6vjecl89a67j6sdavr@4ax.com...
> On 5 Jan 2005 17:14:24 -0800, Richard Hunt wrote:
>
>> Are people generally
>> worried about the future of palm pdas?
>
> Yes, and they tend to be Microsoft, its employees, consultants,
> flacks, customers or the Gartner Group.
>

Just like my doctors and their PDA med apps, they're all going belly up.
Never mind the discussion we had during my stress test...
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 10:31:26 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

"Richard Hunt" <0102806h@student.gla.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:18ae804a.0501051714.489945ea@posting.google.com...
: I've just been reading these sites:
:
: http://www.faughnan.com/palm.html
: http://onetruepda.blogspot.com/
:
: They paint a very negative picture of the Palm world at the moment.
: Do many people here agree with this point of view? I have just bought
: my first palmos pda (waiting for it to arrive) and I would hate to
: think that the whole idea is on its deathbead :) . Are people generally
: worried about the future of palm pdas?
:
: Richard

I actually think Palm is in trouble (maybe not financially) Cobalt is vapor
ware. Very few of the available Palm OS units have what I think many people
now expect from a handheld. That is built in Wifi if for nothing else
syncing and web access. Bluetooth for mobile connectivity, web, email, and
PIM, Mp3 and Video.
I read somewhere might have been Brighthand, that more Windows mobile
devices were now shipping per quarter than Palm OS devices. Sony has left
the Palm OS device business that leaves PalmOne and some small companies
(like Tapwave). Also rumor has it PalmOne is looking around at other OS
options for their devices.

I have both, a Sony Clie TJ37 and a Dell Axim X50V both are good units but
the Axim approaches the functionality of a laptop while the Sony requires
more work to get similar but not equivalent functionality.
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 10:43:40 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article <isBDd.64974$KO5.35013@clgrps13>, "Amphora"
<FJ10000PANTS@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I actually think Palm is in trouble (maybe not financially) Cobalt is vapor
> ware.

Vaporware is something that was announced but does not exist or hasn't
shipped. Neither of which applies to Cobalt, which shipped over a year
ago. Samsung will be releasing a couple of Cobalt devices soon.

> Very few of the available Palm OS units have what I think many people
> now expect from a handheld. That is built in Wifi if for nothing else
> syncing and web access. Bluetooth for mobile connectivity, web, email, and
> PIM, Mp3 and Video.

Don't know if "many people" expect all of these in the same device.

> I read somewhere might have been Brighthand, that more Windows mobile
> devices were now shipping per quarter than Palm OS devices.

Shipping, not selling.

> Sony has left
> the Palm OS device business that leaves PalmOne and some small companies
> (like Tapwave).

Sony is still in the Palm OS business, just not in North America. Plus the
business is moving toward smartphones.

>Also rumor has it PalmOne is looking around at other OS
> options for their devices.

They're looking at the Linux *kernel*, which is not the same thing as a
Linux OS.
Anonymous
January 8, 2005 7:11:39 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Guy Bannis wrote:

"Don't know if "many people" expect all of these in the same device."

Wow, that's quite an interesting observation.

....And quite oblivious of the mobile market today.
Anonymous
January 8, 2005 8:58:02 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Ned Buntline wrote:
> Guy Bannis wrote:
>
>> "Don't know if "many people" expect all of these in the same device."
>
> Wow, that's quite an interesting observation.

It might just be the usual behavior of generalizing own reflexes.
Some of these reflexes are trained a long way of Palm following. ;-)


Gruß
Uwe
Anonymous
January 8, 2005 10:26:24 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article <%CTDd.3920$4b.3259@trndny09>, "Ned Buntline"
<ned.buntline@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Guy Bannis wrote:
>
> "Don't know if "many people" expect all of these in the same device."
>
> Wow, that's quite an interesting observation.
>
> ...And quite oblivious of the mobile market today.

So where is your market research to think otherwise?

PalmOne has claimed their research indicates that people want different
things in different devices.

You can believe them or not, but it would be useful to see customer
research to support your assumption.
Anonymous
January 8, 2005 11:05:20 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Guy Bannis wrote:

"You can believe them or not, but it would be useful to see customer
research to support your assumption."

My customer research lies in the speed at which PPC is catching up, passing,
and soon to be dominating the market. And I say this as a Palm user since
the Pilot days.

I guess the PPC manufacturers have done no market research and are
addressing features that no one cares about.

Go ahead and wave that hat. Ride that bomb all the way to the ground.
Anonymous
January 9, 2005 1:29:03 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article <42XDd.426$7b.40@trndny05>, "Ned Buntline"
<ned.buntline@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Guy Bannis wrote:
>
> "You can believe them or not, but it would be useful to see customer
> research to support your assumption."
>
> My customer research lies in the speed at which PPC is catching up, passing,
> and soon to be dominating the market. And I say this as a Palm user since
> the Pilot days.

This really doesn't say anything about preferences for features. PPC sells
very well in the corporate market because it comes from Microsoft.

> I guess the PPC manufacturers have done no market research and are
> addressing features that no one cares about.

Actually, Microsoft dictates hardware features in the PPC world.

How much profit do you think HP or Dell makes on a PPC device?
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 3:46:04 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

It was a time of great turmoil. The strong preyed on the weak, dogs
and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness:
guy@ether.net (Guy Bannis) wrote in
<guy-0701051143400001@192.168.1.100>:

> In article <isBDd.64974$KO5.35013@clgrps13>, "Amphora"
> <FJ10000PANTS@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I actually think Palm is in trouble (maybe not financially) Cobalt is vapor
> > ware.
>
> Vaporware is something that was announced but does not exist or hasn't
> shipped. Neither of which applies to Cobalt, which shipped over a year
> ago. Samsung will be releasing a couple of Cobalt devices soon.

This is true. But the fact that there are no actual Cobalt devices out
yet would seem to be a reason for concern. Samsung has always been
slow to get its devices to market.
>
> > Very few of the available Palm OS units have what I think many people
> > now expect from a handheld. That is built in Wifi if for nothing else
> > syncing and web access. Bluetooth for mobile connectivity, web, email, and
> > PIM, Mp3 and Video.
>
> Don't know if "many people" expect all of these in the same device.

Take a closer look at some of the capabilities mentioned by the
previous poster:

Built-in Wi-Fi: Tungsten C only, point conceded.

Bluetooth: Except for the TE and TC, the entire Tungsten line has it
as do the Zire 71 and Treo 650.

Web/e-mail: Pretty much every Palm being sold today can connect to the
web using various means. Naturally the easiest are through Bluetooth,
Wi-Fi or GPRS but IR, cable, and dial up are also options for Palms
and have been for years.

PIM: Has there ever been any Palm which doesn't have built-in PIM
applications?

MP3: Every Palm sold today, except for the Zire 21 can play MP3s. The
TC only has mono sound but all others have stereo.

Video: YMMV but I can play video on my Tungsten E and Treo 600 with
Kimona player and both machines are pretty much the bottom of the Palm
lineup in terms of processor speed.

So except for the Wi-Fi, pretty much all these features which "many
people" want are covered by many Palm devices. They may not always be
built-in but they're usually easy to add -- even Wi-fi is available as
an add-on for many devices.
>
> > I read somewhere might have been Brighthand, that more Windows mobile
> > devices were now shipping per quarter than Palm OS devices.
>
> Shipping, not selling.

The numbers, generated by Gartner, include Wi-fi devices but exclude
smartphones like the Treo which now makes up about a third of Palm's
annual sales.
>
> > Sony has left
> > the Palm OS device business that leaves PalmOne and some small companies
> > (like Tapwave).
>
> Sony is still in the Palm OS business, just not in North America. Plus the
> business is moving toward smartphones.

I've never owned Sony PDA but I miss Sony's contribution. It's nice to
know that they are still building nice Palm PDAs in Japan but I'd like
to see that kind of aggressiveness in the U.S. Sony could put pressure
on Palm in a way that smaller companies like Tapwave cannot.
>
> >Also rumor has it PalmOne is looking around at other OS
> > options for their devices.
>
> They're looking at the Linux *kernel*, which is not the same thing as a
> Linux OS.

Actually PalmSource is looking at the Linux kernel. PalmOne was
mentioned as possibly looking into PocketPC but this became an option
as soon as Palm split into a hardware company and an OS company.

--
Roberto Castillo
robertocastillo@ameritech.net
http://www.freewebs.com/robertocastillo/
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 8:54:18 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article <ur4cu0pu3h0s9q6dkj5iapn6603uj311oi@4ax.com>,
robertocastillo@ameritech.net wrote:

> guy@ether.net (Guy Bannis) wrote in
> <guy-0701051143400001@192.168.1.100>:
>
> > In article <isBDd.64974$KO5.35013@clgrps13>, "Amphora"
> > <FJ10000PANTS@hotmail.com> wrote:

> > >Also rumor has it PalmOne is looking around at other OS
> > > options for their devices.
> >
> > They're looking at the Linux *kernel*, which is not the same thing as a
> > Linux OS.
>
> Actually PalmSource is looking at the Linux kernel. PalmOne was
> mentioned as possibly looking into PocketPC but this became an option
> as soon as Palm split into a hardware company and an OS company.

You're right. I mixed the Palms up and never thought PocketPC was a true
alternative.
Anonymous
January 27, 2005 8:54:28 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Guy Bannis napsal(a):
> In article <isBDd.64974$KO5.35013@clgrps13>, "Amphora"
> <FJ10000PANTS@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>I actually think Palm is in trouble (maybe not financially) Cobalt is vapor
>>ware.
>
>
> Vaporware is something that was announced but does not exist or hasn't
> shipped. Neither of which applies to Cobalt, which shipped over a year
> ago. Samsung will be releasing a couple of Cobalt devices soon.

The problem is, the PalmOne announced last summer the T3 and T5 would
run Cobalt. It's next January by now, and T3's and T5's still ship with
Garnet, and when I asked at PalmOne, they replied there was no date
scheduled for T3/T5 switch to Cobalt. When I asked if there will be
T3/T5 upgrade to Cobalt available, the answer was "no comment on this".
I'm rather disappointed.
Mark
Anonymous
January 27, 2005 8:57:58 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Zombie Elvis napsal(a):
> It was a time of great turmoil. The strong preyed on the weak, dogs
> and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness:
> guy@ether.net (Guy Bannis) wrote in
> <guy-0701051143400001@192.168.1.100>:

>>>Also rumor has it PalmOne is looking around at other OS
>>>options for their devices.
>>
>>They're looking at the Linux *kernel*, which is not the same thing as a
>>Linux OS.
>
>
> Actually PalmSource is looking at the Linux kernel. PalmOne was
> mentioned as possibly looking into PocketPC but this became an option
> as soon as Palm split into a hardware company and an OS company.

Thw Cobalt AFAIK is based on BeOS kernel, which is a POSIX compliant
UNIX. So why another UNIX port?
Mark
!