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AMD Will Move to DDR2 When?

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August 22, 2005 2:22:04 PM

I would like to buy some RAM if I can make my system run a bit faster, but I am thinking that I can hold off for the eventual system overhaul in Spring. By then it will be between a dual core or FX CPU. In any event, It would be nice if the RAM I buy now with still be relevant in Spring. It seems the industry is moving toward DDR2 now and I have read rumors that AMD will make the move too, so when do you think it will happen and do you think AMD CPU's will get a big performance boost from DDR2?

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August 22, 2005 2:47:26 PM

The most recent rumor that I heard was the M2 socket would not be implemented until late calender year 06. Do some searching on M2 socket to get more details or take a look on AMD....

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August 22, 2005 7:18:34 PM

I thought that if anything, DDR2 would slow down AMD CPUs. (And at best there'd be no difference.)

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August 22, 2005 8:53:19 PM

Quote:
I thought that if anything, DDR2 would slow down AMD CPUs. (And at best there'd be no difference.)


Probably could since DDR2 still uses piss-poor timmings but you gotta love that low voltage req.

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August 22, 2005 11:58:35 PM

At the present mem bus, DDR2 does nothing for Amd. Nor is bandwidth as important to A64s, as latency.
I would think the M2 chips would have an odmc that can be run at 266, and by then latencies would be low enough to work for them.
DDR2-400 @ 4,4,8,4 does bad things for Amd, DDR2-667 @ 3,3,6,3 should be pretty good.
August 25, 2005 12:25:33 PM

it's not as if the migration to DDR2 for everyone was swift. My question is, what does DDR3 offer that necessitates migration towards it?

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August 25, 2005 1:13:02 PM

I thought that DDR3 had fixed the latency problems of DDR2? At least that's what GDDR3 was invented for.

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August 26, 2005 4:16:42 AM

Will DDR2 supportive AMD CPU's use the 939 socket as well, or only the new M socket? Also, does anybody know if PCIe is here to stay for a while?
August 26, 2005 5:34:18 AM

No, and yes.
August 26, 2005 1:41:33 PM

Quote:
I heard everytime you increase the generation of DDR the latency increases.

Well, that's at least not true with GDDR. That was why the graphics manus pushed so hard for GDDR3, because they desperately needed to <i>reduce</i> those latencies. DDR2 was designed for more stability, especially in a PC environment where the RAM is so physically distant from the memory controller and bridged through a non-permanent connection. Where as a graphics card has RAM soldered right next to the GPU, so needs none of the latencies for that protection. At least that's what I've read. :) 

Quote:
To be honest the technology behind DDR sux arse.

I certainly can't argue there. The whole memory bus itself is in need of an overhaul. And hell, for that matter I'm still surprised at how much physical space is put between the RAM and the memory controller. :o 

I hate to say it, but there really are some interesting concepts coming from serial technologies. It's really too bad that Rambus is the company working so hard on serial stuffus.

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August 26, 2005 1:51:25 PM

From what I read, DDR3 is only a "speed bump" it will run as high as 1.6ghz and will have a significant voltage reduction...
No word on latency, micro-threading(doubt they would license somethign from rambus hehe) and the like, if anyone has a good read I'd like to see it!

Quote:
If you're not up on the tech specs for DDR3, it's basically just an incremental improvement over DDR2, which is itself an incremental improvement over DDR. DDR3 will come in the now familiar DIMM package, with a few extra pins. It'll also support the same options and organizations. The main differences in DDR3 will spring from the process improvements, which will allow the new memory to run at higher frequencies and lower voltages than DDR2.


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August 26, 2005 2:27:28 PM

Okay, but what about latencies? :\

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August 26, 2005 2:28:16 PM

No official JEDEC standard yet...so unknown!(as far as I can tell/read)

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August 26, 2005 2:48:16 PM

That's the problem with open standards. It's the same with Open GL. They're just too damn slow to change when compared to the hardware that is (should, or is ignoring) using them.

Don't get me wrong. Standards are good. But slow moving standards with too many chefs stirring the broth hurt as much as they help.

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August 27, 2005 11:21:20 AM

Quote:
Nor is bandwidth as important to A64s, as latency.

Doesnt bandwidth become more important to AMD with dual cores though?
August 27, 2005 12:13:17 PM

>I heard everytime you increase the generation of DDR the
>latency increases.

In relative terms, yes. In absolute terms, no. CAS latencies will over time only go further up with each new generation , but as long as the clock increases keep pace or outpace it, absolute latencies will continue to drop, so there is not that all that much to complain about. CAS latencies of DDR2-667 suck compared to 66 MHz EDO RAM, but that EDO RAM still used 4-1-1-1 timings resulting in an absolute latency that is around 10x worse than DDR2.

If you want better latencies and higher clockspeeds, you would have to give up socketed modules and solder the RAM on the MB. (To be honest, Im a bit surprised no one has done this yet, it would be nice to have a fixed 1GB of uber fast RAM and the ability to add some more slower ram..)

As for DDR3, afaik it certainly doesnt solve the latency problem; GDDR3 already used in videocards though because these dont need modules (soldered) and videocards dont care about latency but very much about bandwith since they are highly serial and parallel by nature and not much random reading (let alone writing) goes on in a GPU.

Still its a fact RAM is not keeping up with cpu speed increases, just like the FSB could no longer keep up after the 486 DX2. That hasnt really stopped progress though :) 

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August 27, 2005 4:03:05 PM

Late 2006 when AMD move to SKT M2 CPU's. I think anyways. A question. Is this move worth waiting for? How long will the current standard 939 hold up after it's release?

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August 27, 2005 7:36:29 PM

I upgrade when my system needs to be updated. I usually have a long time in between PC builds so can rarely use much of the hardware that is in the old system. I personally don't wait for new tech to upgrade, because there is always something new and shiny around the corner...

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