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zone problems!!

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Anonymous
March 27, 2005 1:09:03 AM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.games.zone (More info?)

Hello, i own a pentium 4 personal laptop with an isdn internet
connection. My operating system is windows xp home edition sp2(just recently
updated) through windows update. Also, i use norton antivirus 2005, spybot
sd, and adaware se for security. My computer is stand alone and i connect
from home. I am your simple everyday computer user, with minimum computing
experience, who checks his email, surfs a few pages here and there, and plays
online games.

Even before updating my computer to sp2, i have noticed strange behavior
when i play competitive backgammon on the zone. Frequent disconnects while
playing and even while chatting in the lobbies, game rooms take long time to
load, and when i try to sign out of zone i get a passport error message,
asking me what i was trying to do. Is this normal? I doubt it. I read some
people are having similar problems lately.

I went to the zone moderated help chat service and they told me to visit
nibblesnbitts help sites(e.g. portroutes, iesettings, and a few others which
i put in favorites for easy reference). The sites are very informative and to
the point, although not updated lately.

Specificaly, i have optimized explorer by following the guidelines, and
downloaded the patch to reset rooms. In the past i have reinstalled zone
software many times in an effort to correct missing or corrupt files but
nothing seems to work!

Currently, i am trying to open ports in windows firewall which will
hopefully solve my problem. I read that the following tcp ports should be
open:
80 Msn games
443 Net passport
6667 chat
28000-29100 game access

Direct x based games:
6073 udp
47624 udp
2302-2400 udp

A few more questions please! How should i enter 2800-29100 and 2302-2400.
When i try to type these two port ranges, i am told i should only type
numbers and - is not acceptable. Please dont tell me i have to type each
single port from 28000 to 29100 and from 2302 to 2400. There must be some
mistake here!! Also, i would prefer chosing which programs to have access
rather than opening ports individually, but dont know exactly which
files/programs to chose.

Before i go to zone, i disable norton antivirus 2005 auto protect and
have allowed zone, passport, skilljam popups to load. In the top part of my
post i mentioned that i have optimized explorer for zone. However, when i go
to zone, the web content zone is unknown (mixed zone) and not trusted sites
as it should be. I believe that the reason for this is that the advertisement
banners which are built into the zone site are listed in the restricted sites
zone (spybot sd immunization feature), and thus creating a mixed zone. I
could be wrong its just my guess!! My security settings and privacy in
internet options are all at default levels . Hearbeat object and all other
internet objects are installed and ok. What else can i possibly do?

Several months ago i was told by nibbles to check my connection for
instability(have it constantly pinged by isp), however, i dont have any
problems when i surf the web. All my pages load fast and normal. The only
problem i have detected is that when i try to download a very large
file/program say 30, 40 mbs or longer my modem hangs and i
have to reboot. Is this a tail tail sign? When i download files the data
transfer rate is about 15 KBs/sec. Could my LSP be damaged, because i have
removed spyware/adware
and viruses in the past? I read that if this scumware is not properly
removed it is possible to damage the LSP! Although i doubt this is the case,
because i let security software deal with it or worst case scenario i get
expert advise from security forums, i cant rule it out.

Thanks for your attention in this matter and sorry for the length of this
post, but i am trying to give you as much insight so you can help me best.
If you like i can provide hijackthis, dr watson, or any other logs you think
are necessary.

ps. My display name is in greek because i participate in their discussion
groups also.

More about : zone problems

Anonymous
March 27, 2005 3:58:41 PM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.games.zone (More info?)

ahristosTelios wrote:
>
> Hello, i own a pentium 4 personal laptop with an isdn internet
> connection. My operating system is windows xp home edition sp2(just recently
> updated) through windows update. Also, i use norton antivirus 2005, spybot
> sd, and adaware se for security. My computer is stand alone and i connect
> from home. I am your simple everyday computer user, with minimum computing
> experience, who checks his email, surfs a few pages here and there, and plays
> online games.
>
> Even before updating my computer to sp2, i have noticed strange behavior
> when i play competitive backgammon on the zone. Frequent disconnects while
> playing and even while chatting in the lobbies, game rooms take long time to
> load, and when i try to sign out of zone i get a passport error message,
> asking me what i was trying to do. Is this normal? I doubt it. I read some
> people are having similar problems lately.

Frequent disconnects aren't caused by the Zone software, or blocked
ports. Blocked ports would prevent entry to that room.

> I went to the zone moderated help chat service and they told me to visit
> nibblesnbitts help sites(e.g. portroutes, iesettings, and a few others which
> i put in favorites for easy reference). The sites are very informative and to
> the point, although not updated lately.
>
> Specificaly, i have optimized explorer by following the guidelines, and
> downloaded the patch to reset rooms. In the past i have reinstalled zone
> software many times in an effort to correct missing or corrupt files but
> nothing seems to work!

IE settings could help if cached documents are cleared, and checked for
updated material every time. But this won't help with delays.

> Currently, i am trying to open ports in windows firewall which will
> hopefully solve my problem. I read that the following tcp ports should be
> open:
> 80 Msn games
> 443 Net passport
> 6667 chat
> 28000-29100 game access
>
> Direct x based games:
> 6073 udp
> 47624 udp
> 2302-2400 udp
>
> A few more questions please! How should i enter 2800-29100 and 2302-2400.
> When i try to type these two port ranges, i am told i should only type
> numbers and - is not acceptable. Please dont tell me i have to type each
> single port from 28000 to 29100 and from 2302 to 2400. There must be some
> mistake here!! Also, i would prefer choosing which programs to have access
> rather than opening ports individually, but dont know exactly which
> files/programs to chose.

I believe there are step-by-step instructions here:
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;q308127 It
appears you have to open the ports individually, and can't open a range
of ports. But I think you can give access to these files and you won't
need to open the individual ports:

Lobby.exe, Zclient.exe, and Zone.exe

This won't help with slow access though.

> Before i go to zone, i disable norton antivirus 2005 auto protect and
> have allowed zone, passport, skilljam popups to load. In the top part of my
> post i mentioned that i have optimized explorer for zone. However, when i go
> to zone, the web content zone is unknown (mixed zone) and not trusted sites
> as it should be. I believe that the reason for this is that the advertisement
> banners which are built into the zone site are listed in the restricted sites
> zone (spybot sd immunization feature), and thus creating a mixed zone. I
> could be wrong it's just my guess!!

I think you're right. That shouldn't slow access though. Are you
getting a prompt?

> My security settings and privacy in
> internet options are all at default levels . Hearbeat object and all other
> internet objects are installed and ok. What else can i possibly do?

A ping of the ip address where you have high latency will show the
delay:

Rated Room 1 - Cat's Eyes

When I look at the shortcut, it shows:

javascript:RaiseLobby_V2('zbckg_rt_x10','game=<backgammon>dll=<backgammon.dll>datafile=<nofile.zrs>logo=<zonelogo.809dll>','207.46.203.17:28834','Rated
Room 1 - Cat\'s Eyes','BACKGAMMON',false, true,
0,'E93B5D9F-46DD-11d3-8B98-00C04F8EF2FF','Backgammon')

So the current IP address for that room is 207.46.203.17 and it uses
port 28834. A ping of 207.46.203.17 from a CMD (MS-DOS) prompt shows:

C:\WINDOWS>ping 207.46.203.17

Pinging 207.46.203.17 with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=84ms TTL=54
Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=81ms TTL=54
Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=86ms TTL=54
Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=80ms TTL=54

Ping statistics for 207.46.203.17:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 80ms, Maximum = 86ms, Average = 82ms

To see exactly where the delay lies, I do a tracert:

C:\WINDOWS>tracert 207.46.203.17

Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 13 ms 13 ms 13 ms loudsl01.lou.02.gateway.iglou.com
[64.253.100.1]

2 13 ms 14 ms 15 ms lou1-fe4-1-0.lou.iglou.com
[204.252.74.6]
3 19 ms 21 ms 18 ms 500.Serial3-6.GW1.IND6.ALTER.NET
[157.130.99.21]

4 19 ms 20 ms 19 ms 505.at-5-0-0.CL2.IND6.ALTER.NET
[152.63.68.166]

5 69 ms 65 ms 65 ms 0.so-4-0-0.XL2.PAO1.ALTER.NET
[152.63.54.82]
6 65 ms 67 ms 70 ms 0.so-7-0-0.GW12.PAO1.ALTER.NET
[152.63.144.98]
7 66 ms 69 ms 65 ms
microsoftOC48-shadow-gw.customer.alter.net [208.214.136.242]
8 65 ms 66 ms 66 ms ten7-1.pax-76cb-1a.ntwk.msn.net
[207.46.34.98]
9 82 ms 81 ms 82 ms pos6-2.tuk-76cb-1a.ntwk.msn.net
[207.46.34.173]

10 82 ms 82 ms 82 ms pos1-0.iuskixcpxc1202.ntwk.msn.net
[207.46.36.146]
11 86 ms 84 ms 83 ms pos1-0.iuscixtukc1202.ntwk.msn.net
[207.46.155.37]
12 84 ms 84 ms 86 ms gig6-0.iuscsecurc1205.ntwk.msn.net
[207.46.129.179]
13 83 ms 82 ms 82 ms chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]

Trace complete.

With the tracert, I can find out exactly where the big delay is.
Between Hop #4 and #5, is a 40 millisecond increase in latency. (Can
you tell I have dsl by these times?) This is within the west coast hub,
ALTER.NET and there's nothing my ISP, or the Zone could do about this.
Basically, if this was a problem, I would just have to wait for the
particular server or router to be repaired.

> Several months ago i was told by nibbles to check my connection for
> instability (have it constantly pinged by isp), however, i dont have any
> problems when i surf the web. All my pages load fast and normal. The only
> problem i have detected is that when i try to download a very large
> file/program say 30, 40 mbs or longer my modem hangs and i
> have to reboot.

This can be caused by a buffer overflow where, with a slow modem,
computer, or interface between the two, and a high security level such
as 128 bit can't keep up with the data flow. Possibly lowering the
security to 32 bit could prevent this from happening. I don't know any
more about it than that.

> Is this a tell-tale sign? When i download files the data
> transfer rate is about 15 KBs/sec. Could my LSP be damaged, because i have
> removed spyware/adware
> and viruses in the past? I read that if this scumware is not properly
> removed it is possible to damage the LSP! Although i doubt this is the case,
> because i let security software deal with it or worst case scenario i get
> expert advise from security forums, i can't rule it out.
>
> ps. My display name is in greek because i participate in their discussion
> groups also.

HTH,

--
+Elmo_Tech
MSN® Gaming Zone™ - Technical Support
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 12:07:02 AM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.games.zone (More info?)

Hello elmo.

I did a ping and tracert on 207.46.203.17, which is cats eyes backgammon
rated room ip address.
You will find that i got a huge amount of request time outs and huge delays.
Also, to be sure i did multiple tracert on the same ip address and on other
rated room ip addresses which i will not include(dont think its really
necessary). I understand the time measurements but i dont understand why i
get the request time outs. Also why after i run multiple pings and tracerts,
the time values and routes followed can be so DRAMATICALY different. What
kind of problem do you think we are dealing with here? I am connecting from
the islands of greece(very long distance from west coast usa maybe that
explains part of the problem). Also, i think its worth mentioning at this
point that my isdn modem drivers(i am connected at 128kbps)are not certified
by windows. When i called intracom and told them to give me certified xp
drivers they told me that was not necessary and that they cant. However,
they assured me that their prepackaged in a cd modem drivers were tested by
intracom and that they are absolutely ok with win95, win98, win2000 and xp.

In my last post i mentioned that when i download a large program or
files(30mb or larger) my modem tends to hang and i have to reboot. Could it
be that my uncertified xp modem drivers are causing the lag or at least
contributing to the problem besides the long distance?

OK here are my ping and tracert logs:
Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>ping 207.46.203.17

Pinging 207.46.203.17 with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53

Ping statistics for 207.46.203.17:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 256ms, Maximum = 256ms, Average = 256ms

C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>tracert 207.46.203.17

Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 * 2088 ms * dial-syr-01L0.forthnet.gr [194.219.252.73]
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 * * * Request timed out.
4 * * * Request timed out.
5 * * * Request timed out.
6 * * * Request timed out.
7 * * * Request timed out.
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 * * * Request timed out.
10 * * * Request timed out.
11 * 3539 ms * microsoftOC48-shadow-gw.customer.alter.net
[208.
214.136.242]
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 * * * Request timed out.
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 * * * Request timed out.
23 * * * Request timed out.
24 * * * Request timed out.
25 * * * Request timed out.
26 * * * Request timed out.
27 * * * Request timed out.
28 * * * Request timed out.
29 * * * Request timed out.
30 * * * Request timed out.

Trace complete.

C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>tracert 207.46.203.17

Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 * * * Request timed out.
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 * * 1909 ms feidiass0-0.forthnet.gr [194.219.199.181]
4 * * * Request timed out.
5 * * * Request timed out.
6 * * * Request timed out.
7 * * * Request timed out.
8 * * * Request timed out.
9 3991 ms 2976 ms * 0.so-1-3-0.XL1.PAO1.ALTER.NET [152.63.50.205]
10 * * * Request timed out.
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 * * * Request timed out.
13 * * * Request timed out.
14 359 ms * * pos1-0.iuskixcpxc1202.ntwk.msn.net
[207.46.36.14
6]
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 * * * Request timed out.
23 * * * Request timed out.
24 * * * Request timed out.
25 * * * Request timed out.
26 * * * Request timed out.
27 * * * Request timed out.
28 * * * Request timed out.
29 * * * Request timed out.
30 * * * Request timed out.

Trace complete.

C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>



"Elmo" wrote:

> ahristosTelios wrote:
> >
> > Hello, i own a pentium 4 personal laptop with an isdn internet
> > connection. My operating system is windows xp home edition sp2(just recently
> > updated) through windows update. Also, i use norton antivirus 2005, spybot
> > sd, and adaware se for security. My computer is stand alone and i connect
> > from home. I am your simple everyday computer user, with minimum computing
> > experience, who checks his email, surfs a few pages here and there, and plays
> > online games.
> >
> > Even before updating my computer to sp2, i have noticed strange behavior
> > when i play competitive backgammon on the zone. Frequent disconnects while
> > playing and even while chatting in the lobbies, game rooms take long time to
> > load, and when i try to sign out of zone i get a passport error message,
> > asking me what i was trying to do. Is this normal? I doubt it. I read some
> > people are having similar problems lately.
>
> Frequent disconnects aren't caused by the Zone software, or blocked
> ports. Blocked ports would prevent entry to that room.
>
> > I went to the zone moderated help chat service and they told me to visit
> > nibblesnbitts help sites(e.g. portroutes, iesettings, and a few others which
> > i put in favorites for easy reference). The sites are very informative and to
> > the point, although not updated lately.
> >
> > Specificaly, i have optimized explorer by following the guidelines, and
> > downloaded the patch to reset rooms. In the past i have reinstalled zone
> > software many times in an effort to correct missing or corrupt files but
> > nothing seems to work!
>
> IE settings could help if cached documents are cleared, and checked for
> updated material every time. But this won't help with delays.
>
> > Currently, i am trying to open ports in windows firewall which will
> > hopefully solve my problem. I read that the following tcp ports should be
> > open:
> > 80 Msn games
> > 443 Net passport
> > 6667 chat
> > 28000-29100 game access
> >
> > Direct x based games:
> > 6073 udp
> > 47624 udp
> > 2302-2400 udp
> >
> > A few more questions please! How should i enter 2800-29100 and 2302-2400.
> > When i try to type these two port ranges, i am told i should only type
> > numbers and - is not acceptable. Please dont tell me i have to type each
> > single port from 28000 to 29100 and from 2302 to 2400. There must be some
> > mistake here!! Also, i would prefer choosing which programs to have access
> > rather than opening ports individually, but dont know exactly which
> > files/programs to chose.
>
> I believe there are step-by-step instructions here:
> http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;q308127 It
> appears you have to open the ports individually, and can't open a range
> of ports. But I think you can give access to these files and you won't
> need to open the individual ports:
>
> Lobby.exe, Zclient.exe, and Zone.exe
>
> This won't help with slow access though.
>
> > Before i go to zone, i disable norton antivirus 2005 auto protect and
> > have allowed zone, passport, skilljam popups to load. In the top part of my
> > post i mentioned that i have optimized explorer for zone. However, when i go
> > to zone, the web content zone is unknown (mixed zone) and not trusted sites
> > as it should be. I believe that the reason for this is that the advertisement
> > banners which are built into the zone site are listed in the restricted sites
> > zone (spybot sd immunization feature), and thus creating a mixed zone. I
> > could be wrong it's just my guess!!
>
> I think you're right. That shouldn't slow access though. Are you
> getting a prompt?
>
> > My security settings and privacy in
> > internet options are all at default levels . Hearbeat object and all other
> > internet objects are installed and ok. What else can i possibly do?
>
> A ping of the ip address where you have high latency will show the
> delay:
>
> Rated Room 1 - Cat's Eyes
>
> When I look at the shortcut, it shows:
>
> javascript:RaiseLobby_V2('zbckg_rt_x10','game=<backgammon>dll=<backgammon.dll>datafile=<nofile.zrs>logo=<zonelogo.809dll>','207.46.203.17:28834','Rated
> Room 1 - Cat\'s Eyes','BACKGAMMON',false, true,
> 0,'E93B5D9F-46DD-11d3-8B98-00C04F8EF2FF','Backgammon')
>
> So the current IP address for that room is 207.46.203.17 and it uses
> port 28834. A ping of 207.46.203.17 from a CMD (MS-DOS) prompt shows:
>
> C:\WINDOWS>ping 207.46.203.17
>
> Pinging 207.46.203.17 with 32 bytes of data:
>
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=84ms TTL=54
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=81ms TTL=54
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=86ms TTL=54
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=80ms TTL=54
>
> Ping statistics for 207.46.203.17:
> Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
> Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
> Minimum = 80ms, Maximum = 86ms, Average = 82ms
>
> To see exactly where the delay lies, I do a tracert:
>
> C:\WINDOWS>tracert 207.46.203.17
>
> Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
> over a maximum of 30 hops:
>
> 1 13 ms 13 ms 13 ms loudsl01.lou.02.gateway.iglou.com
> [64.253.100.1]
>
> 2 13 ms 14 ms 15 ms lou1-fe4-1-0.lou.iglou.com
> [204.252.74.6]
> 3 19 ms 21 ms 18 ms 500.Serial3-6.GW1.IND6.ALTER.NET
> [157.130.99.21]
>
> 4 19 ms 20 ms 19 ms 505.at-5-0-0.CL2.IND6.ALTER.NET
> [152.63.68.166]
>
> 5 69 ms 65 ms 65 ms 0.so-4-0-0.XL2.PAO1.ALTER.NET
> [152.63.54.82]
> 6 65 ms 67 ms 70 ms 0.so-7-0-0.GW12.PAO1.ALTER.NET
> [152.63.144.98]
> 7 66 ms 69 ms 65 ms
> microsoftOC48-shadow-gw.customer.alter.net [208.214.136.242]
> 8 65 ms 66 ms 66 ms ten7-1.pax-76cb-1a.ntwk.msn.net
> [207.46.34.98]
> 9 82 ms 81 ms 82 ms pos6-2.tuk-76cb-1a.ntwk.msn.net
> [207.46.34.173]
>
> 10 82 ms 82 ms 82 ms pos1-0.iuskixcpxc1202.ntwk.msn.net
> [207.46.36.146]
> 11 86 ms 84 ms 83 ms pos1-0.iuscixtukc1202.ntwk.msn.net
> [207.46.155.37]
> 12 84 ms 84 ms 86 ms gig6-0.iuscsecurc1205.ntwk.msn.net
> [207.46.129.179]
> 13 83 ms 82 ms 82 ms chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
>
> Trace complete.
>
> With the tracert, I can find out exactly where the big delay is.
> Between Hop #4 and #5, is a 40 millisecond increase in latency. (Can
> you tell I have dsl by these times?) This is within the west coast hub,
> ALTER.NET and there's nothing my ISP, or the Zone could do about this.
> Basically, if this was a problem, I would just have to wait for the
> particular server or router to be repaired.
>
> > Several months ago i was told by nibbles to check my connection for
> > instability (have it constantly pinged by isp), however, i dont have any
> > problems when i surf the web. All my pages load fast and normal. The only
> > problem i have detected is that when i try to download a very large
> > file/program say 30, 40 mbs or longer my modem hangs and i
> > have to reboot.
>
> This can be caused by a buffer overflow where, with a slow modem,
> computer, or interface between the two, and a high security level such
> as 128 bit can't keep up with the data flow. Possibly lowering the
> security to 32 bit could prevent this from happening. I don't know any
> more about it than that.
>
> > Is this a tell-tale sign? When i download files the data
> > transfer rate is about 15 KBs/sec. Could my LSP be damaged, because i have
> > removed spyware/adware
> > and viruses in the past? I read that if this scumware is not properly
> > removed it is possible to damage the LSP! Although i doubt this is the case,
> > because i let security software deal with it or worst case scenario i get
> > expert advise from security forums, i can't rule it out.
> >
> > ps. My display name is in greek because i participate in their discussion
> > groups also.
>
> HTH,
>
> --
> +Elmo_Tech
> MSN® Gaming Zone™ - Technical Support
>
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 4:02:28 AM

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.games.zone (More info?)

ahristosTelios wrote:
> Hello elmo.
>
> I did a ping and tracert on 207.46.203.17, which is cats eyes backgammon
> rated room ip address.
> You will find that i got a huge amount of request time outs and huge delays.
> Also, to be sure i did multiple tracert on the same ip address and on other
> rated room ip addresses which i will not include(dont think its really
> necessary). I understand the time measurements but i dont understand why i
> get the request time outs. Also why after i run multiple pings and tracerts,
> the time values and routes followed can be so DRAMATICALY different. What
> kind of problem do you think we are dealing with here? I am connecting from
> the islands of greece(very long distance from west coast usa maybe that
> explains part of the problem). Also, i think its worth mentioning at this
> point that my isdn modem drivers(i am connected at 128kbps)are not certified
> by windows. When i called intracom and told them to give me certified xp
> drivers they told me that was not necessary and that they cant. However,
> they assured me that their prepackaged in a cd modem drivers were tested by
> intracom and that they are absolutely ok with win95, win98, win2000 and xp.
>
> In my last post i mentioned that when i download a large program or
> files(30mb or larger) my modem tends to hang and i have to reboot. Could it
> be that my uncertified xp modem drivers are causing the lag or at least
> contributing to the problem besides the long distance?

Sorry, I don't know. I suspect that could be the cause of the lockups,
but merely because a modem, or router I read about awhile ago had a
similar problem and either a driver or a new modem solved the problem.

> OK here are my ping and tracert logs:
> Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
> (C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.
>
> C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>ping 207.46.203.17
>
> Pinging 207.46.203.17 with 32 bytes of data:
>
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
> Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=256ms TTL=53
>
> Ping statistics for 207.46.203.17:
> Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
> Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
> Minimum = 256ms, Maximum = 256ms, Average = 256ms

256 ms is not a bad time.. It suggests that the traceroute to the same
site is meeting interference from servers that ignore this type of
packet, to improve connectivity. There is much more on the tracerts
below. After reading it, I'm as confused as you will be, I'm sure.

> C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>tracert 207.46.203.17
>
> Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
> over a maximum of 30 hops:
>
> 1 * 2088 ms * dial-syr-01L0.forthnet.gr [194.219.252.73]
> 2 * * * Request timed out.
> 3 * * * Request timed out.
> 4 * * * Request timed out.
> 5 * * * Request timed out.
> 6 * * * Request timed out.
> 7 * * * Request timed out.
> 8 * * * Request timed out.
> 9 * * * Request timed out.
> 10 * * * Request timed out.
> 11 * 3539 ms * microsoftOC48-shadow-gw.customer.alter.net
> [208.
> 214.136.242]
> 12 * * * Request timed out.
> 13 * * * Request timed out.
> 14 * * * Request timed out.
> 15 * * * Request timed out.
> 16 * * * Request timed out.
> 17 * * * Request timed out.
> 18 * * * Request timed out.
> 19 * * * Request timed out.
> 20 * * * Request timed out.
> 21 * * * Request timed out.
> 22 * * * Request timed out.
> 23 * * * Request timed out.
> 24 * * * Request timed out.
> 25 * * * Request timed out.
> 26 * * * Request timed out.
> 27 * * * Request timed out.
> 28 * * * Request timed out.
> 29 * * * Request timed out.
> 30 * * * Request timed out.
>
> Trace complete.
>
> C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>tracert 207.46.203.17
>
> Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
> over a maximum of 30 hops:
>
> 1 * * * Request timed out.
> 2 * * * Request timed out.
> 3 * * 1909 ms feidiass0-0.forthnet.gr [194.219.199.181]
> 4 * * * Request timed out.
> 5 * * * Request timed out.
> 6 * * * Request timed out.
> 7 * * * Request timed out.
> 8 * * * Request timed out.
> 9 3991 ms 2976 ms * 0.so-1-3-0.XL1.PAO1.ALTER.NET [152.63.50.205]
> 10 * * * Request timed out.
> 11 * * * Request timed out.
> 12 * * * Request timed out.
> 13 * * * Request timed out.
> 14 359 ms * * pos1-0.iuskixcpxc1202.ntwk.msn.net
> [207.46.36.14
> 6]
> 15 * * * Request timed out.
> 16 * * * Request timed out.
> 17 * * * Request timed out.
> 18 * * * Request timed out.
> 19 * * * Request timed out.
> 20 * * * Request timed out.
> 21 * * * Request timed out.
> 22 * * * Request timed out.
> 23 * * * Request timed out.
> 24 * * * Request timed out.
> 25 * * * Request timed out.
> 26 * * * Request timed out.
> 27 * * * Request timed out.
> 28 * * * Request timed out.
> 29 * * * Request timed out.
> 30 * * * Request timed out.
>
> Trace complete.
>
> C:\Documents and Settings\nick magos>

The few times shown on early hops, before the trans Atlantic cable (if
that's the route), are all high. I expected to see very low ms till you
made it to the trans Atlantic cable, or at least till you left Greece.
That suggests to me that yours is a local problem, that could be the
modem, computer, or ISP. The Zone does one thing that a normal site
doesn't do; if you don't respond in 4000 ms (4 seconds), the Zone
disconnects you (if I heard correctly). That's why you don't have the
same problem with other sites where connectivity isn't paramount.

From what little I know, high latency can be caused by high traffic,
bad connectivity, and hardware along the route, starting with your
machine. Before you insist to your ISP that it's the modem, or a
connection very near them, you might look the subject up to see what the
experts say. Here are some sites I found with a Google search:

I found this explanation of the timeouts:
"If you get some entries using a tracert that show three * asterisks and
report timeouts but the report goes on to show more information 'beyond'
that point, it means that point is set up to ignore the ping command. No
big deal - they're just reducing the workload on that router. But if you
get some points with one or two times reported and an asterisk or two
tossed in, it means there's a problem at that point. Could be hardware,
could be just really busy."
"Things look pretty good until I hit that second hop in NAC.net
territory - looks like it may be a touch busy: notice that 126ms time,
which is almost twice the delay that the other two test signals took to
get a reply out of. Not a great concern unless I happened to be doing
on-line gaming through that point."
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,12646813~mode=fl...

Tracert Tutorial:
http://us.geocities.com/Petsburgh/1174/help/pingtr/trac...

Don't completely trust traceroute:
"Routing problems TCP/IP's sinister and ubiquitous routing problems may
cause the router not to have a route back to the sender, or to have a
route through some interface other than the one it received the packet
on. In these cases, you will either receive no reply at all (no route),
or a reply showing an IP address that never handled the original packet
(it was handled by some other interface on the same router). In short,
don't completely trust traceroute."
http://vbnet.mvps.org/index.html?code/internet/tracert....

Continue the search here:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a...

> "Elmo" wrote:
>
>
>>ahristosTelios wrote:
>>
>>> Hello, i own a pentium 4 personal laptop with an isdn internet
>>>connection. My operating system is windows xp home edition sp2(just recently
>>>updated) through windows update. Also, i use norton antivirus 2005, spybot
>>>sd, and adaware se for security. My computer is stand alone and i connect
>>>from home. I am your simple everyday computer user, with minimum computing
>>>experience, who checks his email, surfs a few pages here and there, and plays
>>>online games.
>>>
>>> Even before updating my computer to sp2, i have noticed strange behavior
>>>when i play competitive backgammon on the zone. Frequent disconnects while
>>>playing and even while chatting in the lobbies, game rooms take long time to
>>>load, and when i try to sign out of zone i get a passport error message,
>>>asking me what i was trying to do. Is this normal? I doubt it. I read some
>>>people are having similar problems lately.
>>
>>Frequent disconnects aren't caused by the Zone software, or blocked
>>ports. Blocked ports would prevent entry to that room.
>>
>>
>>> I went to the zone moderated help chat service and they told me to visit
>>>nibblesnbitts help sites(e.g. portroutes, iesettings, and a few others which
>>>i put in favorites for easy reference). The sites are very informative and to
>>>the point, although not updated lately.
>>>
>>> Specificaly, i have optimized explorer by following the guidelines, and
>>>downloaded the patch to reset rooms. In the past i have reinstalled zone
>>>software many times in an effort to correct missing or corrupt files but
>>>nothing seems to work!
>>
>>IE settings could help if cached documents are cleared, and checked for
>>updated material every time. But this won't help with delays.
>>
>>
>>> Currently, i am trying to open ports in windows firewall which will
>>>hopefully solve my problem. I read that the following tcp ports should be
>>>open:
>>>80 Msn games
>>>443 Net passport
>>>6667 chat
>>>28000-29100 game access
>>>
>>>Direct x based games:
>>>6073 udp
>>>47624 udp
>>>2302-2400 udp
>>>
>>>A few more questions please! How should i enter 2800-29100 and 2302-2400.
>>>When i try to type these two port ranges, i am told i should only type
>>>numbers and - is not acceptable. Please dont tell me i have to type each
>>>single port from 28000 to 29100 and from 2302 to 2400. There must be some
>>>mistake here!! Also, i would prefer choosing which programs to have access
>>>rather than opening ports individually, but dont know exactly which
>>>files/programs to chose.
>>
>>I believe there are step-by-step instructions here:
>>http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;q308127 It
>>appears you have to open the ports individually, and can't open a range
>>of ports. But I think you can give access to these files and you won't
>>need to open the individual ports:
>>
>>Lobby.exe, Zclient.exe, and Zone.exe
>>
>>This won't help with slow access though.
>>
>>
>>> Before i go to zone, i disable norton antivirus 2005 auto protect and
>>>have allowed zone, passport, skilljam popups to load. In the top part of my
>>>post i mentioned that i have optimized explorer for zone. However, when i go
>>>to zone, the web content zone is unknown (mixed zone) and not trusted sites
>>>as it should be. I believe that the reason for this is that the advertisement
>>>banners which are built into the zone site are listed in the restricted sites
>>>zone (spybot sd immunization feature), and thus creating a mixed zone. I
>>>could be wrong it's just my guess!!
>>
>>I think you're right. That shouldn't slow access though. Are you
>>getting a prompt?
>>
>>
>>>My security settings and privacy in
>>>internet options are all at default levels . Hearbeat object and all other
>>>internet objects are installed and ok. What else can i possibly do?
>>
>>A ping of the ip address where you have high latency will show the
>>delay:
>>
>>Rated Room 1 - Cat's Eyes
>>
>>When I look at the shortcut, it shows:
>>
>>javascript:RaiseLobby_V2('zbckg_rt_x10','game=<backgammon>dll=<backgammon.dll>datafile=<nofile.zrs>logo=<zonelogo.809dll>','207.46.203.17:28834','Rated
>>Room 1 - Cat\'s Eyes','BACKGAMMON',false, true,
>>0,'E93B5D9F-46DD-11d3-8B98-00C04F8EF2FF','Backgammon')
>>
>>So the current IP address for that room is 207.46.203.17 and it uses
>>port 28834. A ping of 207.46.203.17 from a CMD (MS-DOS) prompt shows:
>>
>>C:\WINDOWS>ping 207.46.203.17
>>
>>Pinging 207.46.203.17 with 32 bytes of data:
>>
>>Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=84ms TTL=54
>>Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=81ms TTL=54
>>Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=86ms TTL=54
>>Reply from 207.46.203.17: bytes=32 time=80ms TTL=54
>>
>>Ping statistics for 207.46.203.17:
>> Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
>>Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
>> Minimum = 80ms, Maximum = 86ms, Average = 82ms
>>
>>To see exactly where the delay lies, I do a tracert:
>>
>>C:\WINDOWS>tracert 207.46.203.17
>>
>>Tracing route to chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
>>over a maximum of 30 hops:
>>
>> 1 13 ms 13 ms 13 ms loudsl01.lou.02.gateway.iglou.com
>>[64.253.100.1]
>>
>> 2 13 ms 14 ms 15 ms lou1-fe4-1-0.lou.iglou.com
>>[204.252.74.6]
>> 3 19 ms 21 ms 18 ms 500.Serial3-6.GW1.IND6.ALTER.NET
>>[157.130.99.21]
>>
>> 4 19 ms 20 ms 19 ms 505.at-5-0-0.CL2.IND6.ALTER.NET
>>[152.63.68.166]
>>
>> 5 69 ms 65 ms 65 ms 0.so-4-0-0.XL2.PAO1.ALTER.NET
>>[152.63.54.82]
>> 6 65 ms 67 ms 70 ms 0.so-7-0-0.GW12.PAO1.ALTER.NET
>>[152.63.144.98]
>> 7 66 ms 69 ms 65 ms
>>microsoftOC48-shadow-gw.customer.alter.net [208.214.136.242]
>> 8 65 ms 66 ms 66 ms ten7-1.pax-76cb-1a.ntwk.msn.net
>>[207.46.34.98]
>> 9 82 ms 81 ms 82 ms pos6-2.tuk-76cb-1a.ntwk.msn.net
>>[207.46.34.173]
>>
>> 10 82 ms 82 ms 82 ms pos1-0.iuskixcpxc1202.ntwk.msn.net
>>[207.46.36.146]
>> 11 86 ms 84 ms 83 ms pos1-0.iuscixtukc1202.ntwk.msn.net
>>[207.46.155.37]
>> 12 84 ms 84 ms 86 ms gig6-0.iuscsecurc1205.ntwk.msn.net
>>[207.46.129.179]
>> 13 83 ms 82 ms 82 ms chat.zone.com [207.46.203.17]
>>
>>Trace complete.
>>
>>With the tracert, I can find out exactly where the big delay is.
>>Between Hop #4 and #5, is a 40 millisecond increase in latency. (Can
>>you tell I have dsl by these times?) This is within the west coast hub,
>>ALTER.NET and there's nothing my ISP, or the Zone could do about this.
>>Basically, if this was a problem, I would just have to wait for the
>>particular server or router to be repaired.
>>
>>
>>>Several months ago i was told by nibbles to check my connection for
>>>instability (have it constantly pinged by isp), however, i dont have any
>>>problems when i surf the web. All my pages load fast and normal. The only
>>>problem i have detected is that when i try to download a very large
>>>file/program say 30, 40 mbs or longer my modem hangs and i
>>>have to reboot.
>>
>>This can be caused by a buffer overflow where, with a slow modem,
>>computer, or interface between the two, and a high security level such
>>as 128 bit can't keep up with the data flow. Possibly lowering the
>>security to 32 bit could prevent this from happening. I don't know any
>>more about it than that.
>>
>>
>>>Is this a tell-tale sign? When i download files the data
>>>transfer rate is about 15 KBs/sec. Could my LSP be damaged, because i have
>>>removed spyware/adware
>>>and viruses in the past? I read that if this scumware is not properly
>>>removed it is possible to damage the LSP! Although i doubt this is the case,
>>>because i let security software deal with it or worst case scenario i get
>>>expert advise from security forums, i can't rule it out.
>>>
>>>ps. My display name is in greek because i participate in their discussion
>>>groups also.
>>
>>HTH,

+Elmo_Tech
MSN® Gaming Zone™ - Technical Support
!