A64 3000+ K8T800 or P4 630 i925X?

tluxon · Oct 22, 2005

I've been reading posts saying I'd get more bang-for-the-buck with and AMD setup than a similarly priced Intel setup, so I'm looking into it.

The CPU/board combinations I listed in the subject line seem to be similarly priced as near as I can tell. However, when I compare them at <A HREF="http://www23.tomshardware.com/index.html?modelx=33&model1=64&model2=112&chart=21" target="_new">http://www23.tomshardware.com/index.html?modelx=33&model1=64&model2=112&chart=21</A>, it looks like they perform pretty equally with games and the P4 630 finishes quite a bit higher than the A64 3000+ on video encoding.

Also, what's the difference between socket 754 and 939?

Again, I've always been an Intel guy but am looking for an excuse to switch to AMD. Can someone please explain this to me?

Thanks!

Tim

HardWareBoss · Oct 22, 2005

What's your price ramge? Go with the 939 for AMD.

Edited by HardwareBoss on 10/22/05 03:45 PM.

endyen · Oct 22, 2005

it looks like they perform pretty equally with games

That was hard to rig. Every other site has the Amd 10% or better, in games.
As far as encoding goes, where the files are set up nicely for SSE2, the prescott wins. Where you are dealing with personal videos, the higher ipc of the A64s shine.
The A64 3200 is usually closer in price to the 630. Esp when you take into account the price of DDR2 ram.
I also award points to Amd for thier hsf. The stock 630 fan is loud and whinie.
You can also expect the mobo for the Intel chip will wear out a lot faster, with that kind of load on the mosfet cct.

tluxon · Oct 22, 2005

As far as my budget goes, this is our 4th PC for a family of 4 and I'm not sure I should go all out on it. I was thinking a good price point for decent performance would be about $175 for the CPUs. Both of the CPUs I listed can be had for under $174 at ZipZoomFly.com.

I'd be surprised if the PC in consideration will ever be overclocked (or at least not until our 9yr old takes full responsibility for it), as our boys use it more for internet stuff and my oldest boy wants to use if for Lego Digital Designer.

I'm considering this because I was trying to extend the life of a Asus P2B-F P3 550MHz -based system. I discovered the power supply couldn't support a Radeon 9800 Pro I have (which would be way overkill for the system) and the motherboard didn't have the PCI rev.2.2 slots I needed for a wireless NIC. I just want to put something intelligent together that'll be bulletproof and not require any of my troubleshooting time.

So if I decide to stick with a P4 630 it'll be mostly because I'm familiar with Intel products. I have a concern with how hot the CPU runs, but I thought Intel had slightly mitigated some of the heat issues with the 600 series processors. It sounds like you're saying that's not quite true. I have a number of friends that always buy Dell computers and some of them are using 600 series processors and don't say anything about problems with heat. Is it because they just don't know? Or has Dell incorporated extra cooling in their systems to negate the issue of heat in their systems? Or perhaps this heat is only a factor when using 100% CPU time for extended periods of time?

I like everything I've read about AMD and their widespread use in the overclocking community and will give it serious consideration when upgrading my current computer. I'm just not as sure if it's the best direction to go for upgrading the family's #4 PC that probably won't be overclocked and I don't really want to put much time into.

Thanks for any advice you can provide at this lower price point.

Tim

phial · Oct 22, 2005

Its hard to say if they are the same price...

Hyperthreading IS nice. This is coming from a fan of AMD processors.. my fiance has a 3ghz P4c, and man.. when it comes to tabbing in and out of games and having more than one thing on the go, hyperthreading really does make a difference. Of course my A64 is faster for pure gaming speed, but that doesnt mean the P4 is a slouch.. it is still quite fast.

of course, if you dont have something very memory and cpu intensive running, A64's have no problem running more than one thign at once..

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Crashman · Oct 22, 2005

Pop in a Tualatin Celeron 1.4 on an adapter card and enjoy your old P2B-F. Use a USB 2.0 wireless NIC by adding a USB 2.0 card.

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tluxon · Oct 23, 2005

That's definitely a tempting way to go for the short term, Crashman. I just don't know how long it's going to be before the boys want to take advantage of the Radeon 9800 Pro and run a bunch of games through it. If and when they do, it would be nice to already have the system set up so I don't have to spend time upgrading again.

Rugger · Oct 23, 2005

Tell them that patience is a virtue and they'll really appreciate the system when you finish the upgrade...

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endyen · Oct 24, 2005

Did you find a 925 board that uses agp?
My 13 year old has a s754 A64 3000+. It was cheap, and works great.
Pick up this <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813127190" target="_new">board</A> and this <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103483" target="_new">chip</A> and your boy will be happy for a few years, maybe even till he's 13.

Spitfire_x86 · Oct 24, 2005

yepp, ABIT and nForce is the way to go.

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tluxon · Oct 24, 2005

That looks like a good way to go for him, but I read that socket 754 has been phasing out in favor of socket 939. Shouldn't I pay just a few more bucks to get s939? Or is the RAM for that board more as well?

Rugger · Oct 24, 2005

RAM is the same price. The mobos/CPUs may be a little less, but you could get a <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813152049" target="_new">Chaintach VNF4 Ultra</A> for $73 and a <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103537" target="_new">A64 3000+</A> for $146 or the <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103535" target="_new">A64 3200+</A> for $190. The way to pay less with s754 is to go with a Sempron, but you lose a lot of gaming performance and 64bit.

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Spitfire_x86 · Oct 24, 2005

How can he use his Radeon 9800 Pro with PCI express mobos? And there's 64 bit Semprons available, too.

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Spitfire_x86 · Oct 24, 2005

You should consider getting a Sempron 64. They're cheap, and practically as good as A64s for almost everything except gaming. In games, it's not as fast as A64 but good enough to compete with P4s. And for the latest games, R9800 Pro will be the bottleneck, not the CPU.

Sempron 64 will be good enough for a 4th home computer, and it will be a long time before this PC will need to upgrade it's CPU or Graphics card. By then, S939 will become a discontinued socket just like S754.

Get ABIT NF8 and consider getting one of these Semrron 64s. You can get Sempron 64 2600+ for only $64 (<A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819104249" target="_new">link</A>). I would recommend getting either <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819104237" target="_new">3100+</A> or <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819104229" target="_new">3300+</A>

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Rugger · Oct 24, 2005

Better option for the mobo, then is the <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813157081" target="_new">Asrock 939Dual</A> for $69.99 and future upgradeability to PCIe. I hadn't caught that the Semprons were in 64bit now. What's the best review you've seen comparing their gaming perf to the A64s?

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Rugger · Oct 24, 2005

Another really good option.

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tluxon · Oct 24, 2005

Thanks for the links - I would never have thought of the Sempron 64, but these look like great choices for the price.

I'm curious about one thing, though. I do quite a few video projects and would consider borrowing some my kid's CPU time in running a low-requirement minimized task while he's browsing the net or playing a lower-requirement game. Is this something that all these processors can handle pretty well, or should I be looking for something in particular if I want to do that.

Thanks!

Tim

Spitfire_x86 · Oct 25, 2005

Asrock 939Dual seems to be a good choice. I've only seen the Anandtech review. AGP and PCIe performance was practically equal.

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endyen · Oct 25, 2005

The semprons have a small line2 cache. It does tend to slow down video encoding. OTOH, the system does run quiet enough that you could leave it to encode overnight, and not have it disturb the kid's sleep.

Spitfire_x86 · Oct 25, 2005

You can go with either the "Asrock board + A64 3000+ (venice)" or "ABIT NF8 + Sempron 64 3100+/3300+", it's mainly your choice. While I doubt that this PC will ever use the extra upgrade potential provided by the Asrock board, it's still better to have upgrade options. On the other hand, you're getting a motherboard from a more reliable manufacturer and a proven chipset with Socket 754 route.

Sempron 64s performs nearly as good as equally clocked A64s in most apps (without gaming). For multimedia stuff, cache size doesn't matter much. So Sempron 3100+ will be nearly as good as A64 3000+ (socket 939) and Sempron 3300+ will be equally good or slightly better (due to it's extra 200 MHz clock speed).

<A HREF="http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/sempron-3000.html" target="_new">This article should give you some idea about Sempron vs. Athlon 64 performance</A>

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tluxon · Oct 25, 2005

I was just about to plop down the money for a socket 754 Sempron 64 when I read the test in your link. Do you know if anybody's seen a socket 939 Sempron in stores yet?

I figuring on sticking with ASUS or Abit with an nForce chipset. Any recommendations for a motherboard with LAN, audio, and firewire onboard?

endyen · Oct 25, 2005

That would put you mostly in the PCI-express lane. What would you do with that 9800pro?

Rugger · Oct 25, 2005

NF3 Ultra is an option. <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813123222" target="_new">Epox 9NDA3+</A> meets his listed rqmts.

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Spitfire_x86 · Oct 25, 2005

Socket 939 Semprons isn't available at Newegg.com. I think it's not very widespread yet, AMD doesn't have this CPU yet "officially".

Today AMD dropeed prices for A64 X2 and Sempron processors (<A HREF="http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20051024PR206.html" target="_new">Click</A>). So I think going with ABIT NF8 and one of the faster Semprons make sesnse.

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tluxon · Oct 27, 2005

Well, as much promise as the socket 939 Sempron 64 might have, I think I need to get something ordered so my kids can get to using the upgraded computer.

I've narrowed my choices down to two with apparently comparable performance and on newer platforms that may survive a little longer before being phased out. I have an AGP Radeon 9800 Pro I want to use, so I'm looking at AGP motherboards.

The AMD configuration I'm considering will run about $240 for the CPU and motherboard. The CPU is the AMD Athlon 64 3200+ Venice 1GHz FSB 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103535" target="_new">http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103535</A> and the motherboard is the ASUS A8V Socket 939 VIA K8T800 Pro <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131541" target="_new">http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131541</A>.

The Intel configuration I'm considering runs about $270. The CPU is the Intel P4 630 Prescott 800MHz FSB 2MB L2 Cache LGA 775 <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819116198" target="_new">http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819116198</A> and the motherboard is the ASUS P5P800 Socket T (LGA 775) Intel 865PE <A HREF="http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131511" target="_new">http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131511</A>.

Both of these configurations are 64-bit compatible. The AMD appears to be a little stronger on graphics-intensive things like games while the Intel seems to have the upper hand on more CPU-intensive tasks such as video encoding. I understand the Prescott can get pretty hot, but is it really that big a problem? - Especially with a well-ventilated case such as the Antec Sonata?

I don't consider myself an "Intel guy" even though I've only bought Intel processors from my very first 8088 and I don't have any aversion to going AMD. I just want the kids' computer to be rock solid and trouble-free and offer a potentially significant upgrade path in the future.

Assuming that cost is not a factor, which way should I go? Got any other suggestions I should consider?

Thanks!

Tim

A64 3000+ K8T800 or P4 630 i925X?

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