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Why Still Sluggish

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November 2, 2005 5:17:37 PM

Hello Everyone,

I have recently upgraded to this configuration:

Motherboard: Asus A8V Deluxe
Processor: AMD Athlon X2 3800+
Memory: Kingston 1024 MB PC3200 2 Pcs
Graphics Card:ATI Radeon All-in-Wonder 9600 XT
Primary Hard Drive: 30 GB Seagate Barracuda
Media Hard Drive: 160 GB Western Digital
Power Supply: Antec 350 Watt
Operating System: Windows XP Professional

Everything is working fine but it seems like my system is still running a little slow. I reinstalled the operating system after all the upgrades and all the software is also reinstalled. It seems like at times the RAM is just getting eaten up. I will go away from my computer for some time and when I come back the thing hardly moves and I have to restart. The boot up time also seems to be a little too long. I am just comparing it to similar systems that I have used. If anyone has suggestions on what I might want to check or of certain diagnostic steps that I might want to pursue, your help would be greatly appriciated.

Thank You,
Brian

More about : sluggish

November 2, 2005 5:26:23 PM

Your PSU might be the bottleneck in your system.



WOULD YOU LIKE TO BE A WELL FED SLAVE OR A HUNGRY FREE MAN?
November 2, 2005 5:33:24 PM

I agree that the PSU seems kind of small for that system.

It could also be any number of spywares, virii, etc.

Use CTRL + SHIFT + ESC and tell us what Processes are eating up your CPU and mem. (You may need to use View->Select Columns to show the memory usage. I can't remember if it's there by default.)


:evil:  یί∫υєг ρђœŋίχ :evil: 
The <b><font color=red>Devil</font color=red></b> is in my <b><font color=red>'98 Mercury Sable</font color=red></b>!
<b>@ 201K miles!</b>
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November 2, 2005 5:48:50 PM

Quote:
and all the software is also reinstalled

Did you test it before you installed all the apps?
That problem smells software related.
November 2, 2005 6:12:34 PM

Have you checked what windows automatically starts up for you? Because if you have several programs that like to start at bootup. I remove as many as i can that i dont need. I have 3 that i like to start automatically, but only because i am just going to start them up myself. (Winamp, Trillian, and sysmetrix)

Also check for spyware
Spybot Search and Destroy
Adaware
Spyware Guard
All programs that i use, and use often.

And check whats eating your CPU cycles like others have said. Click the top of the column to sort by most to least and also do the same for memory usage. On a fresh boot nothing should be using a lot of mem.

Report back and we'll see

_____________________________
Chaintech VNF3-250/A64 2800+/1GB(512x2) OCZ VX GOLD 2-2-2-5/BFG 6800GT/Thermaltake 420W/WD 200GB/Maxtor 300GB/Soon to include Z-5500...any ideas on which SC??
November 2, 2005 6:19:59 PM

<pre><font color=orange> ∩_∩
Ω Ω
(=¥=)</font color=orange> - Cedrik says that it's probably gremlins chewing on<font color=orange>
_Ū˘Ū_</font color=orange>   the cables again.</pre><p>

:evil:  یί∫υєг ρђœŋίχ :evil: 
The <b><font color=red>Devil</font color=red></b> is in my <b><font color=red>'98 Mercury Sable</font color=red></b>!
<b>@ 201K miles!</b>
November 2, 2005 9:58:56 PM

Your PSU should be fine. A bit less powerfull CPu run with almost the same system specs as yours, except with a 300w. So don't waste money on something bigger yet. What can make your system slow is like Siver said, spyware and viruses. Running on broadband without ant firewall is asking for trouble. I did some test here, on dial-up, and I'm getting hit almost every minute, according my firewall log. I suggest to do a clean install, without the computer connected to any network. Just a plain install with drivers. Install an antivirus, in case your drivers file are infected. Now leave the computer running. Is is still normal after a while? if no, then investigate overheating, or bad ram. memtest86 is a good test for RAM. google it and download it to check if your RAM are working good with your motherboard. If the system running fine, then it is software related. Something you install that cause problem. Get a good firewall. Zonealarm is good start. Use google to find it. You can get a free version of Avast antivirus. Google will help there too. Keep installing apps until you find the one that is causing problem.

(\__/)
(=<b>˚</b>.'=)That was my bunny..terminator!!! Now terminated...
November 3, 2005 5:58:49 AM

sometimes msmsgs.exe gets stuck and eats up CPU... like others said check task manager and see whats hogging it... could also be virus like others said. Your PSU should have no effect on that. Guys, he says when he leaves it for a while and comes back, not under heavy load. I'm running a similar comp (minus dual core, but i have 2 opticals + 2 HDDs)and have a 330W psu in it from Antec... no problems ever.



A64 3700 SanD / Asus A8N-SLI Prm / 2GB OCZ Pltnm Pc3200 / XFX 7800GT 256mb / Antec 550W

A64 3000 Ven / Epox 9npa-U / 1GB HyperX DDR 3200 / XFX 6600GT 128mb / Antec 330W<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by dannyaa on 11/03/05 03:00 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
November 3, 2005 12:57:27 PM

Quote:
Your PSU should have no effect on that. Guys, he says when he leaves it for a while and comes back, not under heavy load.

That's not necessarily true. Hot PSUs perform worse. Even on idle, a PC without good ventilation can heat up a PSU fairly well. While I agree that it doesn't seem likely to be the PSU at fault, I certainly haven't seen reason to completely rule it out yet either. I'd still look for a software explanation first, but I've personally seen hard drives underpowered from a PSU on edge cause similar behavior as to what is being described. (Damn cheap Celeron 500 box. I should fix it up and use it as a F@H/print server.)


:evil:  یί∫υєг ρђœŋίχ :evil: 
The <b><font color=red>Devil</font color=red></b> is in my <b><font color=red>'98 Mercury Sable</font color=red></b>!
<b>@ 201K miles!</b>
November 8, 2005 3:52:53 AM

Sorry about the delay everyone. I had to go away for the weekend. Well I just looked through all of your responses and here is some of the information that you requested. This is the list of processes that begin when I start my computer up:

DH EDIT: That link didn't work. Use http://www.imageshack.us/ to host your screenshot.

The time that it takes to boot up the machine seems a little sluggish. It may have run faster before I installed any software but I would assume that to be typical of all machines. The problem seems to be when I leave it be for some time. Also here is a list of what starts up from the registry:

ATI DeviceDetect
ATI Launchpad
ATI Remote Control
crfmon.exe
Acrobat Assistant 7.0
ccApp
HydraVisionDesktopManager
iTunesHelper
NeroFilterCheck
QuickTime Task
RemoteControl (PowerDVD)
SoundMan
SunJavaUpdateSched
zBrowser Launcher

And now for a list from the Start Menu Startup Folder:

Adobe Acrobat Speed Launcher
Adobe Gamma
AutoCAD Startup Accelerator
EPSON Status Monitor 3 Environment Check 2

I guess that whenever I experience the system lag again I will post information on what is running then. Also I do have an AntiVirus software that I installed before I connected to the network. I am running Norton Internet Securities 2005 AntiSpyware Edition. The Firewall is enables as well as almost all the other features. I am going to find and run that memory checker program when I get the free time. Thank you for all of your input so far.

Brian
November 8, 2005 3:57:21 AM

Also I would like to add that the power supply that I bought came with the case so I am assuming that has the proper amount of ventilation. The box is the SLK2650-BQE . Thanks again.

Brian
November 8, 2005 10:35:53 PM

Check device manager, for conflicts etc, and look for an event log.
November 9, 2005 7:44:35 PM

I was just using the computer today again and I noticed that when I was closing some applications that it was panning down like a line from the top to the bottom to close them. I remember this from a while ago but that was with an older computer. I am not sure what the cause of that could be. If it is the video card, then I have had problems with that once before and had to send it back to the company once already. If it is the lack of power though, I still don't know how to check what size I need to get. Should I be going out to buy a 500W power supply even if I don't know if that is the problem. I just bought this 350W supply with the case for all my new equipment. Thanks again for all of the input so far. I appriciate it.

-Brian
November 9, 2005 8:26:51 PM

I would say that powersource is fine.

This is what I would do.

Download the latest CATs and the previous version of MMC 9.06.1 (9.08 seems to have problems with some cards. Thanks ATI), DAO/MDAC, DVD player and Remote Wonder from ATI. Don’t get the CAT with hydrovision for everyone’s sanity.
Download Driver cleaner and follow the directions for removing all ATI drivers. Remember you have to boot in safe mode to do a proper cleaning and select multiple driver types!
When you uninstall all the ATI drivers and utilities before booting in safe mode, leave your Gemstar TV guide (just hit cancel during the uninstall) these have no effect and will not be installed by the new CAT drivers so if you want it don’t uninstall it.

Install in this order.
CATs
DAO/MDAC
DVD Player
MMC
Remote Wonder

If you continue to have problems, try running in AGP 4x mode. I’ve heard this is the solution to some problems with ATI cards and noisy VIA busses. Has very little effect on performance.
December 11, 2005 1:15:37 AM

Hello Again,

So I am sorry for my abcense but I have been busy with my school work and have ignored this situation for some time now. Well recently I got some free time and have played some games like Call of Duty 2, Madden 06, and Need for Speed Most Wanted. And while playing these games I started to see my problem resurface. I noticed every once and a while after playing for a long time the games would all of a sudden come to a slowdown in which they would keep moving forward but just at a very slow pace. After a while it would jump right back to normal like nothing happened at all. I found this to be very odd. I thought then that maybe something like Norton Internet Secutiries might be causing some lag but haven't gone through with doing anything about that quite yet. I am not sure what else it might be unless it is lack of more power. Well regardless, I just wanted to try and keep this open for some more suggestions because you guys really have been so very helpful so far. Thanks again.

-Brian
December 11, 2005 5:28:20 AM

Did you reinstall the ATI drivers like I said?
December 11, 2005 10:54:05 AM

Well, get Microsoft AntiSpyware, Ad-Aware, Spybot: Search and Destroy, and just download a trial version of Norton or McAffee, whichever you prefer. If its not a virus, try reinstalling Windows. If that doesn't work, you probably have a shitty power supply. The watts isn't the only thing that matters. Most power supplies that come with cases suck ass. Just order a new power supply from newegg.
December 15, 2005 9:16:57 AM

my suggestions:
first,i think ,you can find out which processes are eating your resources(CPU using rate,memory using rate etc)by openning task management.(ctrl+alt+del).
then you are advised to check the system configuration utility,and turn off some auto running programs and services that aren't required for you OS's normal start (start-run-msconfig)
futhermore,update you OS,install any securrty patches ,and make sure you are immune from viruses etc .
December 19, 2005 12:12:52 PM

The memory usage and processes look fine.
Does that 30GB Seagate spin at 5400 rpm?
a c 139 à CPUs
December 19, 2005 2:11:32 PM

I hate to be a pain, but does this happen when u are gone and the computer has done some TV recording? Since the 9600XT AIW uses your computer's CPU and ram to do it's bidding when it records it will use a good amount of cpu power and ram to record TV for you. Windows may have to transfer some of the programs you have in memory over to the pagefile on your hard drive. IF this happens when u come back to use it windows will go mad swapping back in the files it but into the page(swap) file easier. That would cause a lag. Now if your hard drive is some old 5400 rmp ata 66 drive you may have even longer lag times. the same can happen even with other programs running and eating ram. I do not think it is the power supply either.

Just my thoughts on it.

Hope this helps
December 19, 2005 2:54:57 PM

when i read that it was a 30gb drive, you know it's already several years older. i havnt seen a drive that small sold in years.

now keep this in mmind. EVEN if it is 7200rpm. older drives were still slower than newer ones at the same RPMs. there are other things that have been fixed. less platers. faster drive heads. better read access times. faster interfaces.

all these things have dramatically improved over the years. or even over the last year too! this could be the sign of your "sluggish" performance. I'd look into your swapping and monitor how much disk swapping you're allowing it to do.

other things of note. i'm not sure what CLI.exe is, but you've got two running. probably under two users. if this is software that uses interaction with you and one is idle, it may be being thrown to swap, which on the slower drive would slow ya down.

another thing to look at.. what is CCAPP.exe? it's taking almost 18mb of ram. is it a game? background application? whats it doing? is it disk swapping?
December 19, 2005 3:57:16 PM

BTW CLI.exe is the catalyst control center. CCAPP is norton anti-virus. His processes look fine to me. However, I don't think there should be a HydraDM.exe in the latest version of the ATI drivers. Again, please answer me this time, DID YOU INSTALL THE ATI DRIVERS THE WAY I STATED OR NOT???!!! If not that's fine but you can't eliminate the display driver as a problem unless you do it.
December 19, 2005 4:36:25 PM

If the PC slows after being powered on for a while, have you checked to make sure you're not overheating?

Hotter = Slower

I know you've stated that it is slow to boot up as well, but is that all the time or is that when the PC has been on a long time and is potentially "too hot"?

I have a friend who had a lot of problems with his 9800 AIW causing some of the same issues you are having so I would say that Schmide's idea would be another good way to go.
December 19, 2005 9:37:23 PM

Quote:
CCAPP is norton anti-virus. .


Well, I won't look further than that...
December 20, 2005 12:45:55 AM

ive seen this before
this might not be the case with you but - i will add my 2 copper peices

worms......

did a clean install on my sisters computer - she imediately got 5 worms by the end of the day

she had a slightly older system so she downgraded her XP to W2K after this happened - guess what, same crap

went to her house several days later to find 10 worms and 90 trojans/hijackers - and yes she had AV software - suposedly good AV software

had to manually delete all the worms in safemode - computer peped right up after that

it was always the same to - after the computer had been on for a while it would just get slower and slower - check out everything - that everyone has mentioned here make sure you have a *good firewall and anti virus software*
December 21, 2005 4:37:28 PM

I would take the graphics card out and reseat it. The PSU isn't the problem IMO. Check the BIOS settings for graphics and make sure they are correct. The other thing I would check are the RAM modules themselves.
Quote:
De Do Do Do, De Da Da Da, that's all I want to say to you ...
December 21, 2005 5:30:05 PM

I agree with EntityAnomly. It seems like this is an overheating issue.
The PSU should be fine, the 3800x2 takes 110W in its worst case scenario, and the 9600XT and HDD's shouldn't be overtaxing the PSU with 250W.

Where is your computer located? If its in some enclosed space, move it out. If that doesn't work, take off the side panel and see how that goes. You have, hopefully, updated anti-virus software and a firewall so worms and viruses shouldn't be affecting things.

When your system is slow, check your task manager, if some process is sucking up your processors, it should show in there.

Double check your BIOS settings - I've seen some ASUS boards don't recognize the processors correctly and because that happens, its severly underclocked.

Your HDD should be ok. Its true that HDD technology has made leaps and bounds, but seriously, your 30GB should have ATA100, I hope. If its ATA66, you definitely need to get a new one or use your other HDD. And if its 5400rpm, you should only use this drive for document storage.

You also said its slow on reboot. Is that a cold or hot reboot? Cold = computer is absolutely in its off state. Hot = you pressed the reset button.

If you're running Cool 'n Quiet, have that up to see where your processor's speed is.

Make sure you seated the CPU fan correctly and you used the right thermal paste - those make all the difference in the world, plus it might save your CPU from meeting a firey doom.

Also make sure Norton plays well w/ the ATI drivers. you may have to do some research online for that. Norton IMHO is a resource hog and has alot of conflicts with different softwares.

If things are happening absolutely randomly, check your PSU. It may be bad (altho its an Antec). Might want to snag a PSU checker from your friends or buy one.

Quote:
If the PC slows after being powered on for a while, have you checked to make sure you're not overheating?

Hotter = Slower

I know you've stated that it is slow to boot up as well, but is that all the time or is that when the PC has been on a long time and is potentially "too hot"?

I have a friend who had a lot of problems with his 9800 AIW causing some of the same issues you are having so I would say that Schmide's idea would be another good way to go.
December 21, 2005 6:45:53 PM

Another suggestion for you.

using msconfig.exe - disable the following startup programs:

crfmon.exe
Acrobat Assistant 7.0
QuickTime Task
zBrowser Launcher


And remove the following from your startup folder:
Adobe Acrobat Speed Launcher
AutoCAD Startup Accelerator

----------------------
The acrobat and quicktime stuff just "preload" their respecitve applications, and unless your entering and exiting these apps CONSTANTLY -- these applets serve no purpose.

also -- what is the 'zBrowser Launcher' ?? never seen that one before. Smells like spyware/malware to me.
December 22, 2005 3:07:57 PM

Quote:
did a clean install on my sisters computer - she imediately got 5 worms by the end of the day

...

that everyone has mentioned here make sure you have a *good firewall and anti virus software*
Yep. I couldn't agree more. Antivirus is useless if you don't have a good firewall and have configured that firewall to block everything that you don't use.

But, much more importantly than that, to emphatically state to everyone, is to run Windows Update. I can never stress that enough. If you don't apply the patches to all of those security holes in Windows, then you're just leaving yourself open to well documented hacks. Microsoft makes Windows Update pretty easy to use. There's just no reason not to do it.

(Well, unless you're running a pirated copy of WinXP, in which case you deserve all of the malware you're infected with.)
!