First kill

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years. What
ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?

Anyway, onto main post...

Gimme an S!

Gimme a P!

Gimme an O!

Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...

..

..

..

..

..

..

..

..

First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the Guidebook
doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that satisfies both the
factors.

I remember there were two that I used to use - assassins and Gremlins.
Assassins were probably the better of the two, because you can always find
them at Lawenthiowhatever, they don't appear often in dungeons, and there's
one place in the game you can easily find at least 20 to kill. Of course,
there's then the whole difficulty of actually getting the Filk quest without
killing too many assassins... Strategic digging was my only solution, but
it was bloody difficult.

Gremlins I quite often found in the SMC, so it's possible to go there first,
pick up the blanky and find a gremlin to kill. Also means that all the
monsters generated there are all level 1, so when you come back later it
won't be so hard unless you start killing off the monsters that are already
there... (don't know if it still works like that) Only problem is if you
come across a lot of gremlins with a water trap randomly later in the game
(as can often happen) and you have to slaughter them all quickly to stop
them spreading... Again, you need to use invisibility in the gremlin cave
to make sure you kill only 20, and you have to put off getting the phial
till after Filk.

Are there any other better ideas that people have? I've sometimes thought
maybe outlaw leaders would be good, because they're rare, but you can find
some in the wilderness if you need to... A bit time-consuming to go through
lots of random wilderness encounters to get the required number of kills
though...

Oh, and what's with these new talent thingummies? I've looked at the
descriptions and stuff - starting with seven league boots as a Bard seems
like a nice thing, but requires a lot of talents used up at the start...
What talents do people find are best?

And these added descriptive bits on armour on stuff - didn't used to have
these in my days... *grumbles*

--
Darren Grey, aka Tekhne

A day without sunshine is like night.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:
> Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years. What
> ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>
> Anyway, onto main post...
>
> Gimme an S!
>
> Gimme a P!
>
> Gimme an O!
>
> Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the Guidebook
> doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that satisfies both the
> factors.

I usually go for a bandit or outlaw. That makes the Filk quest bearable,
but Courage still attainable. Sometimes I go for muggers, half-orc
bouncers or cloaked ratlings though -- ultra endings are more important
than a rarely needed convenience skill.

[snip assassin and gremlin suggestions]

I think your suggestions are too clever. ;-) While they might be perfect
fits for the purposes of being able to control the number of kills for
the Courage skill and Filk quest, they complicate other parts of the
game too much to be worth it.

Malte

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Malte Helmert <helmert@informatik.uni-freiburg.de> writes:

> Darren Grey wrote:
> > Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years. What
> > ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
> > Anyway, onto main post...
> > Gimme an S!
> > Gimme a P!
> > Gimme an O!
> > Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > .
> > First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the
> > Guidebook
> > doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that satisfies both the
> > factors.
>
> I usually go for a bandit or outlaw. That makes the Filk quest
> bearable, but Courage still attainable. Sometimes I go for muggers,
> half-orc bouncers or cloaked ratlings though -- ultra endings are more
> important than a rarely needed convenience skill.

Also, for extremely wimpy characters (like the Human Healer who was my
first ultra ending) the only real possibility is to lure a farmer,
goodwife or child out of Terinyo and kill them.
Eva.

--
Eva Myers, Computer Officer, Statistical Laboratory, University of Cambridge
Email: erm1001@cam.ac.uk WWW: http://www.statslab.cam.ac.uk/~eva/
Ignorance and deception can't save anybody. *Knowing* saves them.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

On 2005-02-19, Darren Grey <anything@darrenchaz.vispa.com$> wrote:
> Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years. What
> ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>
> Anyway, onto main post...
>
> Gimme an S!
>
> Gimme a P!
>
> Gimme an O!
>
> Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use

Frog, hobgoblin.

koctyxa

--
ga³êzie nagich drzew u¶miechaj± siê zalotnie

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

"Malte Helmert" <helmert@informatik.uni-freiburg.de> wrote in message
news:4217500e$1@olaf.komtel.net...
> Darren Grey wrote:
> > Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.
What
> > ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
> >
> > Anyway, onto main post...
> >
> > Gimme an S!
> >
> > Gimme a P!
> >
> > Gimme an O!
> >
> > Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the
Guidebook
> > doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that satisfies both
the
> > factors.
>
> I usually go for a bandit or outlaw. That makes the Filk quest bearable,
> but Courage still attainable. Sometimes I go for muggers, half-orc
> bouncers or cloaked ratlings though -- ultra endings are more important
> than a rarely needed convenience skill.
>
> [snip assassin and gremlin suggestions]
>
> I think your suggestions are too clever. ;-) While they might be perfect
> fits for the purposes of being able to control the number of kills for
> the Courage skill and Filk quest, they complicate other parts of the
> game too much to be worth it.

I like to be a perfectionist. Even if it makes parts of the game more
difficult I like to have a "best method" stuck in my head of how to do
things... And I don't like skipping out on a free skill, even if it isn't
worth much... I want to have it stuck in my head that every single
character I generates chooses <foo> as their first kill - that way it's a
little easier to remember for later (I don't like the idea of renaming your
character according to their first kill - it would annoy me to always go
round with a character named "Farmer" or whatever...)

But, hrm, I was curious about what people actually used, and if anyone had
any particularly clever suggestions that satisfy both quests.

I suppose hill orcs in the mountains are one thing - but they can be quite
tricky for a first encounter... Assassins are nice and weak - if only you
didn't have to plough through a few hundred of them to get the damned Filk
quest in the first place...

--
Darren Grey, aka Tekhne

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:
> "Malte Helmert" <helmert@informatik.uni-freiburg.de> wrote in message
> news:4217500e$1@olaf.komtel.net...
>
>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>
>>>Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.
>
> What
>
>>>ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>>>
>>>Anyway, onto main post...
>>>
>>>Gimme an S!
>>>
>>>Gimme a P!
>>>
>>>Gimme an O!
>>>
>>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the
>>>Guidebook doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that
>>>satisfies both the factors.
>>
>>I usually go for a bandit or outlaw. That makes the Filk quest bearable,
>>but Courage still attainable. Sometimes I go for muggers, half-orc
>>bouncers or cloaked ratlings though -- ultra endings are more important
>>than a rarely needed convenience skill.
>>
>>[snip assassin and gremlin suggestions]
>>
>>I think your suggestions are too clever. ;-) While they might be perfect
>>fits for the purposes of being able to control the number of kills for
>>the Courage skill and Filk quest, they complicate other parts of the
>>game too much to be worth it.
>
> I like to be a perfectionist. Even if it makes parts of the game more
> difficult I like to have a "best method" stuck in my head of how to do
> things...

It's hardly a "best method" if it makes some parts a bit easier for the
purpose of making others much more difficult, is it?

> And I don't like skipping out on a free skill, even if it isn't
> worth much... I want to have it stuck in my head that every single
> character I generates chooses <foo> as their first kill - that way it's a
> little easier to remember for later (I don't like the idea of renaming your
> character according to their first kill - it would annoy me to always go
> round with a character named "Farmer" or whatever...)

I usually use a pencil. Anyway, you cannot be a greater
perfectionist than me. If you are, I pity you. ;-) So truth be told, I
usually go for the barbarian quest even though it's not worth it and I
don't recommend it.

> But, hrm, I was curious about what people actually used, and if anyone had
> any particularly clever suggestions that satisfy both quests.

Kill a bandit.

> I suppose hill orcs in the mountains are one thing - but they can be quite
> tricky for a first encounter... Assassins are nice and weak - if only you
> didn't have to plough through a few hundred of them to get the damned Filk
> quest in the first place...

Hill orcs encounters are a *much* too great risk for most beginning
characters. The way I play ADOM, I want to win with every character. If
I had enough time for playing 200 games, I'd play each race/class
combination exactly once, with random stats, and try to win as many as
possible. By "trying to win as many as possible", I mean that the number
of winners would be the "score", and the objective would be to maximize
that score. I'll also try for an ultra ending whenever this is possible
without scumming.

Under this mode of play, if you also want to pursue the barbarian's
quest, I am convinced that killing a bandit first is the best thing to do.

Malte

 

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Malte Helmert wrote:
> Darren Grey wrote:
>
>> "Malte Helmert" <helmert@informatik.uni-freiburg.de> wrote in message
>> news:4217500e$1@olaf.komtel.net...
>>
>>> Darren Grey wrote:
>>>
>>>> Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.
>>
>>
>> What
>>
>>>> ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>>>>
>>>> Anyway, onto main post...
>>>>
>>>> Gimme an S!
>>>>
>>>> Gimme a P!
>>>>
>>>> Gimme an O!
>>>>
>>>> Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> .
>>>>
>> (I don't like the idea of renaming your character according to
>> their first kill - it would annoy me to always go round with a
>> character named "Farmer" or whatever...)
>
>
> I usually use a pencil. Anyway, you cannot be a greater
> perfectionist than me. If you are, I pity you. ;-) So truth be told,
> I usually go for the barbarian quest even though it's not worth it
> and I don't recommend it.

The other recommended method is to set the monster memory (&) to
whatever your first kill was (and set it back if you use it).

>> But, hrm, I was curious about what people actually used, and if
>> anyone had any particularly clever suggestions that satisfy both
>> quests.
>
>
> Kill a bandit.

Another option is to kill whatever, and just dive down to, say, ID:120
and go back up and find Filk in the Wilderness. Kinda tedious of course,
but enough of my characters tend to die early that it's often more of a
pain to worry about the first kill every time. But yeah, Bandit is good.

 

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Darren Grey wrote:

> Gimme an S!
>
> Gimme a P!
>
> Gimme an O!
>
> Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> Oh, and what's with these new talent thingummies? I've looked at the
> descriptions and stuff - starting with seven league boots as a Bard
> seems like a nice thing, but requires a lot of talents used up at the
> start... What talents do people find are best?

The most popular is probably 'Treasure Hunter'. To get it, you need to
take Alert (available only for new characters) as well as Miser...
basically, treasure hunter increases the amount of items that are
generated when you kill monsters (especially for more common monsters
which don't drop many items). Otherwise, there's a pretty good review of
talents on Andy William's Guidebook, check that out for more info. As a
final note, avoid the 'charged' talent; it's effect is extremely weak.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Eva Myers <erm1001@cam.ac.uk> wrote in
news:4tfyzse4el.fsf@chiark.greenend.org.uk:


> Also, for extremely wimpy characters (like the Human Healer who was my
> first ultra ending) the only real possibility is to lure a farmer,
> goodwife or child out of Terinyo and kill them.
> Eva.
>

I actually got into the habit where I'd do that every game I remembered,
generally with Goodwives or Children only (saving Farmers in case I needed
their corpses). Generally, the alignment drop isn't too severe in my
experience, and it really simplifies matters a great deal. My second
choice is generally a Mugger or Beggar, but I don't like having to run all
over Llawehtniell looking for one, especially if I've got bandits and
outlaws chasing me.

I'm certain there are character types whom would be badly hurt by the
alignment drop, and it immediately cuts off any possibility of the platinum
girdle, but most of the time, the strategy has worked beautifully, assuming
I do not want the Courage skill at all.

Brian

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey <anything@darrenchaz.vispa.com$> wrote...
> Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.
What
> ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?

*tips hat* Welcome back, from one returning player to another...

> Anyway, onto main post...
>
> Gimme an S!
>
> Gimme a P!
>
> Gimme an O!
>
> Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> .
>
> First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the
Guidebook
> doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that satisfies
both the
> factors.

I tend to avoid goblin rockthrowers (too bleeking rare) and have a
slight preference for rats, giant rats, or skeletons. Beyond that, I'm
not proud--while I'll try to avoid killing something if it's too rare, I
will happily zot something if I need to in order to survive. (And if I
run into Kranach and his merry band, he's going down first if it's at
all convenient, because he's too damn dangerous.)

> Gremlins I quite often found in the SMC, so it's possible to go there
first,
> pick up the blanky and find a gremlin to kill. Also means that all
the
> monsters generated there are all level 1, so when you come back later
it
> won't be so hard unless you start killing off the monsters that are
already
> there... (don't know if it still works like that)

I believe it does; at any rate, my tendancy to seed the SMC with a low
character level seems to pay off.

> Oh, and what's with these new talent thingummies? I've looked at the
> descriptions and stuff - starting with seven league boots as a Bard
seems
> like a nice thing, but requires a lot of talents used up at the
start...
> What talents do people find are best?

I like Healthy, and always try to pick it up. Beyond that, I like
Long-Lived for humans and orcs (I generally play either those or elves)
to balance out the aging effects of undead, and if I'm playing a priest,
I'll try to get Strong of Will, since it's a root talent for the
stronger Pious talents.

But the first one I always get is Alert, because when you combine it
with Miser (which can be picked up later), you can qualify for Treasure
Hunter. And I am at heart a magpie.

> And these added descriptive bits on armour on stuff - didn't used to
have
> these in my days... *grumbles*

*grin* Did you have to go upstairs both ways when heading to a new
dungeon level?

Love and coffee,
Frances

 

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"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
> Darren Grey wrote:
>
> > Gimme an S!
> >
> > Gimme a P!
> >
> > Gimme an O!
> >
> > Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > Oh, and what's with these new talent thingummies? I've looked at the
> > descriptions and stuff - starting with seven league boots as a Bard
> > seems like a nice thing, but requires a lot of talents used up at the
> > start... What talents do people find are best?
>
> The most popular is probably 'Treasure Hunter'. To get it, you need to
> take Alert (available only for new characters) as well as Miser...
> basically, treasure hunter increases the amount of items that are
> generated when you kill monsters (especially for more common monsters
> which don't drop many items). Otherwise, there's a pretty good review of
> talents on Andy William's Guidebook, check that out for more info. As a
> final note, avoid the 'charged' talent; it's effect is extremely weak.

Ah, I didn't notice them in the guidebook - was in an out of the way
section... Hrm, they're all pretty weak, really, by the looks of things. I
was thinking maybe they'd have a bit more effect, like the similar system
used in Fallout. But any bonus helps, I guess. And I always wanted to
complete the game with a Bard - now I have more reason to

--
Grey

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:
> "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
>
>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Gimme an S!
>>>
>>>Gimme a P!
>>>
>>>Gimme an O!
>>>
>>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>> What talents do people find are best?
>>
>> The most popular is probably 'Treasure Hunter'. To get it, you need
>> to take Alert (available only for new characters) as well as
>> Miser... basically, treasure hunter increases the amount of items
>> that are generated when you kill monsters (especially for more
>> common monsters which don't drop many items). Otherwise, there's a
>> pretty good review of talents on Andy William's Guidebook, check
>> that out for more info. As a final note, avoid the 'charged'
>> talent; it's effect is extremely weak.
>
>
> Ah, I didn't notice them in the guidebook - was in an out of the way
> section... Hrm, they're all pretty weak, really, by the looks of
> things. I was thinking maybe they'd have a bit more effect, like the
> similar system used in Fallout. But any bonus helps, I guess. And I
> always wanted to complete the game with a Bard - now I have more
> reason to

Yes, the overall effect of talents is fairly weak, but every little bit
helps. The next most useful IMO, even for non-archers (but DEFINATELY
for archers), are the talents which reduce the energy cost of missle
attacks. Mid-level archers with these talents can fire 3 shots in the
time an average enemy can attack once, and that's even with equal speed
=) Other than that, a lot of people like the book caster talents... I've
barely used them, personally, but they're decent.

If you want to play a bard/heir, try to start with 4 talents so you can
take alert to later get treasure hunter in addition to your SLB gift.

 

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"Frances Kathleen Moffatt" <torrain@yeahright.sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:ua2Sd.1153$uO.29532@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Darren Grey <anything@darrenchaz.vispa.com$> wrote...
> > Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.
> What
> > ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>
> *tips hat* Welcome back, from one returning player to another...
>
> > Anyway, onto main post...
> >
> > Gimme an S!
> >
> > Gimme a P!
> >
> > Gimme an O!
> >
> > Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > .
> >
> > First kills. I was just wondering what people tended to use - the
> Guidebook
> > doesn't actually give any suggestions for something that satisfies
> both the
> > factors.
>
> I tend to avoid goblin rockthrowers (too bleeking rare) and have a
> slight preference for rats, giant rats, or skeletons. Beyond that, I'm
> not proud--while I'll try to avoid killing something if it's too rare, I
> will happily zot something if I need to in order to survive. (And if I
> run into Kranach and his merry band, he's going down first if it's at
> all convenient, because he's too damn dangerous.)

What I meant was something that could be found in abundance for the Courage
quest, and is also very rare for the Filk quest. I think bandit's the best
suggestion I've heard so far, so I'll stick with that in future... It is
admittedly less complex than using gremlins or assassins... I understand
what you're saying about doing anything in a tricky situation, but
personally I try my best to get a good first kill - even if it means very
tedious use of Corward setting and Ventriloquism...

> > Oh, and what's with these new talent thingummies? I've looked at the
> > descriptions and stuff - starting with seven league boots as a Bard
> seems
> > like a nice thing, but requires a lot of talents used up at the
> start...
> > What talents do people find are best?
>
> I like Healthy, and always try to pick it up. Beyond that, I like
> Long-Lived for humans and orcs (I generally play either those or elves)
> to balance out the aging effects of undead, and if I'm playing a priest,
> I'll try to get Strong of Will, since it's a root talent for the
> stronger Pious talents.
>
> But the first one I always get is Alert, because when you combine it
> with Miser (which can be picked up later), you can qualify for Treasure
> Hunter. And I am at heart a magpie.

Aye, looking through them Treasure Hunter does seem to be the only decent
one... The Melee Master and Missile Master and most of the magis ones seem
to involve using way too many talents for far too little end result. The
only other decent thing seems to be the speed ones, and maybe the shield
bonuses... Blah.

> > And these added descriptive bits on armour on stuff - didn't used to
> have
> > these in my days... *grumbles*
>
> *grin* Did you have to go upstairs both ways when heading to a new
> dungeon level?

*laughs* I'm not that old a player...

--
Darren Grey, aka Tekhne

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
on Sun, 20 Feb 2005 01:50:02 +0100, Malte Helmert wrote:
>Darren Grey wrote:
>> I like to be a perfectionist. Even if it makes parts of the game more
>> difficult I like to have a "best method" stuck in my head of how to do
>> things...
>
> Anyway, you cannot be a greater perfectionist than me. If you are, I
> pity you. ;-)

Ah, perfectionism. Did you ever lament the fact that the 'w'alk
commands waste moves by not cutting off corridor corners?

starting using manual
situation 'w'alk walking
#@# #,# #,#
#######.# #######,# #######,#
#.......# #,,,,,,,# #.,,,,,.#
#.####### #,####### #,#######
#.# #@# #@#

Squares visited are marked by ','. This will save you one visited
square per corner in a corridor, with its obvious advantages of time
saving and avoiding traps.

Léon (aka Oliphaunt)
--
"Linux is very fast.
It can do an infinite loop in about 5 seconds."
-- Linus Torvalds

 

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bork bork bork Léon Planken bork 2:20:58 PM bork 2/21/2005 bork bork:

> I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
> on Sun, 20 Feb 2005 01:50:02 +0100, Malte Helmert wrote:
> > Darren Grey wrote:
> >> I like to be a perfectionist. Even if it makes parts of the game more
> >> difficult I like to have a "best method" stuck in my head of how to do
> >> things...
> >
> > Anyway, you cannot be a greater perfectionist than me. If you are, I
> > pity you. ;-)
>
> Ah, perfectionism. Did you ever lament the fact that the 'w'alk
> commands waste moves by not cutting off corridor corners?
>
> starting using manual
> situation 'w'alk walking
> #@# #,# #,#
> #######.# #######,# #######,#
> #.......# #,,,,,,,# #.,,,,,.#
> #.####### #,####### #,#######
> #.# #@# #@#
>
> Squares visited are marked by ','. This will save you one visited
> square per corner in a corridor, with its obvious advantages of time
> saving and avoiding traps.
>
> Léon (aka Oliphaunt)

It's also a good way to increase the likelihood of accidentally killing a
cat/killing a karmic lizard/running away from a threat one turn too late.

(I speak from experience, as I have used the same perfectionist movement type
many a time -- it still can be useful, though, when you're running short on
food and every turn counts.)

Erik

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
on Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:13:33 -0000, Darren Grey wrote:
> Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.

Welcome back!

> What ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?

Did you ever see these urls? They're a nice read.
http://www.students.tut.fi/~suvanto2/adom/mkoddd/drawing.html
and
http://www.students.tut.fi/~suvanto2/adom/mkoddd/masterk.html

> And these added descriptive bits on armour on stuff - didn't used to
> have these in my days... *grumbles*

You'll pretty soon find that there are a few very nice ones out there.
My current character found an adamantium halberd of devastation pretty
early and it's still the best weapon he has, damage-wise, even though
he's L39 already. It'll probably change when the twins are re-united,
which will be soon, hopefully.
Anyway, the prefixes and postfixes are described in the guidebook, too:
in the appendices on weapons and wearable items.

Léon (aka Oliphaunt)
--
"Linux is very fast.
It can do an infinite loop in about 5 seconds."
-- Linus Torvalds

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

"Léon Planken" <lplanken@opposite-of-coldmail.com> wrote in message
news:slrnd1jo1o.5od.lplanken@vulcanus.its.tudelft.nl...
> I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
> on Sun, 20 Feb 2005 01:50:02 +0100, Malte Helmert wrote:
> >Darren Grey wrote:
> >> I like to be a perfectionist. Even if it makes parts of the game more
> >> difficult I like to have a "best method" stuck in my head of how to do
> >> things...
> >
> > Anyway, you cannot be a greater perfectionist than me. If you are, I
> > pity you. ;-)
>
> Ah, perfectionism. Did you ever lament the fact that the 'w'alk
> commands waste moves by not cutting off corridor corners?
>
> starting using manual
> situation 'w'alk walking
> #@# #,# #,#
> #######.# #######,# #######,#
> #.......# #,,,,,,,# #.,,,,,.#
> #.####### #,####### #,#######
> #.# #@# #@#
>
> Squares visited are marked by ','. This will save you one visited
> square per corner in a corridor, with its obvious advantages of time
> saving and avoiding traps.

Yep, it's very irritting. I only ever use the 'w'alk command when going
down a straight corridor I've already been down before (so I know what's
coming). Time is a precious thing to waste...

--
Darren Grey

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:37ta2gF5h0nl2U1@individual.net...
> Darren Grey wrote:
> > "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
> >
> >>Darren Grey wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Gimme an S!
> >>>
> >>>Gimme a P!
> >>>
> >>>Gimme an O!
> >>>
> >>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>>.
> >>>
> >>> What talents do people find are best?
> >>
> >> The most popular is probably 'Treasure Hunter'. To get it, you need
> >> to take Alert (available only for new characters) as well as
> >> Miser... basically, treasure hunter increases the amount of items
> >> that are generated when you kill monsters (especially for more
> >> common monsters which don't drop many items). Otherwise, there's a
> >> pretty good review of talents on Andy William's Guidebook, check
> >> that out for more info. As a final note, avoid the 'charged'
> >> talent; it's effect is extremely weak.
> >
> >
> > Ah, I didn't notice them in the guidebook - was in an out of the way
> > section... Hrm, they're all pretty weak, really, by the looks of
> > things. I was thinking maybe they'd have a bit more effect, like the
> > similar system used in Fallout. But any bonus helps, I guess. And I
> > always wanted to complete the game with a Bard - now I have more
> > reason to
>
> Yes, the overall effect of talents is fairly weak, but every little bit
> helps. The next most useful IMO, even for non-archers (but DEFINATELY
> for archers), are the talents which reduce the energy cost of missle
> attacks. Mid-level archers with these talents can fire 3 shots in the
> time an average enemy can attack once, and that's even with equal speed
> =) Other than that, a lot of people like the book caster talents... I've
> barely used them, personally, but they're decent.

I've never liked the idea of casting out of books. Just has always seemed
wrong. Don't ask me why, it doesn't make sense to me either. I play
spellcasters a lot, so normally I just learn and cast spells normally. And
for non-casters, well, it seems silly to fork out 6 talents (that's 18
levels worth) just to cast spells from books quicker. The fighting talents
are more valuable, and I'd rather just go to the effort of boosting the
learning stat so you can learn and cast the spells properly...

> If you want to play a bard/heir, try to start with 4 talents so you can
> take alert to later get treasure hunter in addition to your SLB gift.

Yah, I've been debating in my head about that... A gnomish bard with the
right Mana boosts (ie careful selecting of questions at the start) could
possibly get 4 talents, with a 1 in 7 chance of getting an extra one... I
don't like Falcon and Candle much, and Raven's so perfect for Bards... Hrm,
wish there was a way of controlling the 1 in 7 chance - I always liked the
idea of a grey elven bard with a fairy dragon pet. A gnome with a giant
raccoon sounds good too though - the giant raccoon smashes walls and the
gnome has gemology to find the treasures...

You know, sometimes I spend a lot more time thinking about the game
statistics and planning out strategies and such than I ever actually do
playing the game... Which is why I always used to like posting here, I
guess

--
Darren Grey

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:
> "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:37ta2gF5h0nl2U1@individual.net...
>
>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>
>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Gimme an S!
>>>>>
>>>>>Gimme a P!
>>>>>
>>>>>Gimme an O!
>>>>>
>>>>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>>>.
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> But any bonus helps, I guess. And I always wanted to complete
>>> the game with a Bard - now I have more reason to
>>
>> Yes, the overall effect of talents is fairly weak, but every little
>> bit helps. The next most useful IMO, even for non-archers (but
>> DEFINATELY for archers), are the talents which reduce the energy
>> cost of missle attacks. Mid-level archers with these talents can
>> fire 3 shots in the time an average enemy can attack once, and
>> that's even with equal speed =) Other than that, a lot of people
>> like the book caster talents... I've barely used them, personally,
>> but they're decent.
>
>
> I've never liked the idea of casting out of books. Just has always
> seemed wrong. Don't ask me why, it doesn't make sense to me either.
> I play spellcasters a lot, so normally I just learn and cast spells
> normally. And for non-casters, well, it seems silly to fork out 6
> talents (that's 18 levels worth) just to cast spells from books
> quicker. The fighting talents are more valuable, and I'd rather just
> go to the effort of boosting the learning stat so you can learn and
> cast the spells properly...
>
>
>> If you want to play a bard/heir, try to start with 4 talents so you
>> can take alert to later get treasure hunter in addition to your SLB
>> gift.
>
>
> Yah, I've been debating in my head about that... A gnomish bard with
> the right Mana boosts (ie careful selecting of questions at the
> start) could possibly get 4 talents, with a 1 in 7 chance of getting
> an extra one... I don't like Falcon and Candle much, and Raven's so
> perfect for Bards... Hrm, wish there was a way of controlling the 1
> in 7 chance - I always liked the idea of a grey elven bard with a
> fairy dragon pet. A gnome with a giant raccoon sounds good too
> though - the giant raccoon smashes walls and the gnome has gemology
> to find the treasures...
>
> You know, sometimes I spend a lot more time thinking about the game
> statistics and planning out strategies and such than I ever actually
> do playing the game... Which is why I always used to like posting
> here, I guess

The problem with raven being your pets won't easily be able to keep up
with you because of the extra speed; that's the biggest reason I've
given up on using pets, too much of a pain. Your best bets for pets are
probably greater or killer claw bugs, since they do some pretty nasty
damage and have good speed. Fairy Dragons are especially unreliable in
my experience.

Don't worry about trying to control that chance -- there are too many
random factors to actually worry about doing the questions manually;
no one has mapped out what stat changes corespond to your background
history, AFAIK, which you'd need to combine with the question/answer and
the race/class starting charts.

Candle is an awesome birthsign, IMO. Being able to heal 2hp every 12
turns, guaranteed, is very nice, especially early on - and that's in
addition to the lower piety loss and talent.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 01:45:59 +0000, Darren Grey wrote:

>
> "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:37vfhlF5jjp48U1@individual.net...
>> Darren Grey wrote:
>> > "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> > news:37vc4cF5hs39uU1@individual.net...
>> >
>> >>Darren Grey wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>>news:37ta2gF5h0nl2U1@individual.net...
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>Gimme an S!
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>Gimme a P!
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>Gimme an O!
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>
> 10 speed stays as a reltively decent difference throughout the game. Not as
> great later on, obviously, but still makes a noticable difference. The
> extra skill advances every level from Book are damned handy I think - even
> later on when you have a much higher Le score. Cup and Book can both be
> good in making fightery types more effective at spells, and Sword can helps
> make non-combatants better with weapons.

I don't care for raven at all. it ups experience requirements by 10%, and
effectively maxing out your speed is easy later on (assuming you have food
preservation anyways).

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

"Léon Planken" <lplanken@opposite-of-coldmail.com> wrote in message
news:slrnd1jool.5od.lplanken@vulcanus.its.tudelft.nl...
> I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
> on Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:13:33 -0000, Darren Grey wrote:
> > Just come back to ADOM after not seriously playing for a few years.
>
> Welcome back!
>
> > What ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>
> Did you ever see these urls? They're a nice read.
> http://www.students.tut.fi/~suvanto2/adom/mkoddd/drawing.html
> and
> http://www.students.tut.fi/~suvanto2/adom/mkoddd/masterk.html

Yeps - the 4th pic's mine Did Adam ever submit an RFE?


Teensy

bit

of

spoily

space

....

just

in

case

....

> > And these added descriptive bits on armour on stuff - didn't used to
> > have these in my days... *grumbles*
>
> You'll pretty soon find that there are a few very nice ones out there.
> My current character found an adamantium halberd of devastation pretty
> early and it's still the best weapon he has, damage-wise, even though
> he's L39 already. It'll probably change when the twins are re-united,
> which will be soon, hopefully.
> Anyway, the prefixes and postfixes are described in the guidebook, too:
> in the appendices on weapons and wearable items.

Yeah, the "wicked" and "of devastation" seem particularly wow - can raise
some weapons to artifact level damage... I'm guessing it's not possible to
get a "wicked whip of slaughtering of devastation" - that'd mean more damage
than the ToTTR in just one hand (two of them would be... well, I daren't
think... and with the whips skill modifiers... *drools*)

By the way, has anyone ever actually quantimised (is that a word...?) the
extra increases the twins get when together?

--
Darren Grey, aka Tekhne

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:
> "Léon Planken" <lplanken@opposite-of-coldmail.com> wrote in message
> news:slrnd1jool.5od.lplanken@vulcanus.its.tudelft.nl...
>
>>I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
>>on Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:13:33 -0000, Darren Grey wrote:
>
>
> Teensy
>
> bit
>
> of
>
> spoily
>
> space
>
> ...
>
> just
>
> in
>
> case
>
> ...
>
>
>>> And these added descriptive bits on armour on stuff - didn't used
>>> to have these in my days... *grumbles*
>>
>> You'll pretty soon find that there are a few very nice ones out
>> there. My current character found an adamantium halberd of
>> devastation pretty early and it's still the best weapon he has,
>> damage-wise, even though he's L39 already. It'll probably change
>> when the twins are re-united, which will be soon, hopefully.
>> Anyway, the prefixes and postfixes are described in the guidebook,
>> too: in the appendices on weapons and wearable items.
>
>
> Yeah, the "wicked" and "of devastation" seem particularly wow - can
> raise some weapons to artifact level damage... I'm guessing it's not
> possible to get a "wicked whip of slaughtering of devastation" -
> that'd mean more damage than the ToTTR in just one hand (two of them
> would be... well, I daren't think... and with the whips skill
> modifiers... *drools*)

Nope, sure can't. Only 'regular' stuff can get modifiers; specific
equipment like whips of the snake or daggers of death can get no further
modification other than the normal + or - 3 ToHit and damage (and
Speed/Dex for WotS, I think) that nearly everything has.

Just be wary of 'trapped' armor; nasty stuff =) Devastation is an
awesome find, and a good reason to milk orc & gnoll vaults. Can still be
destroyed and won't have special bonuses (foo slaying, etc.) like most
artifacts do, though.

> By the way, has anyone ever actually quantimised (is that a word...?)
> the extra increases the twins get when together?

The ToHit increase is +50, and I believe the damage increase is the same.

Dwarven Artifact Shield & Spear get +10 (ToHit & Dam) when wielded
together as well.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:

>>>What ever happened to that Bitcliffe Beast...?
>>
>>Did you ever see these urls? They're a nice read.
>>http://www.students.tut.fi/~suvanto2/adom/mkoddd/drawing.html
>>and
>>http://www.students.tut.fi/~suvanto2/adom/mkoddd/masterk.html
>
> Yeps - the 4th pic's mine Did Adam ever submit an RFE?

I might be mistaken about this after all this time, but I seem to
remember that the monster description for killer bugs alludes to
Biltcliffe Beasts.

Memory is hazy though... it might help if someone could fetch that
monster description.

Malte

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

"frobnoid" <frobnoid@orders2.tmok.com> wrote in message
newsan.2005.02.21.15.08.13.971925@orders2.tmok.com...
> On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 01:45:59 +0000, Darren Grey wrote:
>
> >
> > "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:37vfhlF5jjp48U1@individual.net...
> >> Darren Grey wrote:
> >> > "Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >> > news:37vc4cF5hs39uU1@individual.net...
> >> >
> >> >>Darren Grey wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>news:37ta2gF5h0nl2U1@individual.net...
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>>Darren Grey wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>>>news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>Gimme an S!
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>Gimme a P!
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>Gimme an O!
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> > 10 speed stays as a reltively decent difference throughout the game.
Not as
> > great later on, obviously, but still makes a noticable difference. The
> > extra skill advances every level from Book are damned handy I think -
even
> > later on when you have a much higher Le score. Cup and Book can both be
> > good in making fightery types more effective at spells, and Sword can
helps
> > make non-combatants better with weapons.
>
> I don't care for raven at all. it ups experience requirements by 10%, and
> effectively maxing out your speed is easy later on (assuming you have food
> preservation anyways).

Normally I wouldn't bother either, but for Bards it's silly not to consider
it...

--
Grey

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.adom (More info?)

Darren Grey wrote:
> "frobnoid" <frobnoid@orders2.tmok.com> wrote in message
> newsan.2005.02.21.15.08.13.971925@orders2.tmok.com...
>
>>On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 01:45:59 +0000, Darren Grey wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:37vfhlF5jjp48U1@individual.net...
>>>
>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>news:37vc4cF5hs39uU1@individual.net...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:37ta2gF5h0nl2U1@individual.net...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>"Twinge" <homelesspete@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>news:37r6rtF5gmvutU1@individual.net...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Darren Grey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Gimme an S!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Gimme a P!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Gimme an O!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Gimme a - oh, just give me some spoily space...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>
>> I don't care for raven at all. it ups experience requirements by
>> 10%, and effectively maxing out your speed is easy later on
>> (assuming you have food preservation anyways).
>
>
> Normally I wouldn't bother either, but for Bards it's silly not to
> consider it...

Well, you don't have to tame animals even as a bard. Bards have many
other (rather random) talents as well =) One of which being the best PP
regeneration of any class (as long as they also have concentration) once
they get to level 40 (I think it was 40 anyway)... Bards are okay even
if you give up on taming animals, which can be a real pain.