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XPS 15 vs Sager NP5135

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Last response: in Laptops & Notebooks
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November 21, 2010 5:23:05 PM

So, my old Dell i9300 is beginning to crap out on me, so I've been looking at some of the recent releases from Dell and XoticPC. Right now, I'm considering the XPS 15 and the Sager NP5135.

Below are the configurations I'm looking at:

1. XPS 15
* Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium, 64bit, English
* Intel® Core™ i5-560M (2.66GHz, 4 threads, turbo boost up to 3.2GHz, 3M cache)
* 6GB Shared Dual Channel DDR3 Memory
* Backlit Keyboard - English
* NVIDIA® GeForce® GT 420M 1GB graphics with Optimus
* 500GB 7200 RPM SATA Hard Drive
* Silver Anodized Aluminum 15.6" FHD (1080p) B+RGLED Display with Facial Recognition
* Integrated 10/100/1000 Network Card
* Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0
* 8X Tray Load CD/DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-R Drive)
* JBL 2.1 Speakers with Waves Maxx Audio 3
* Intel© Centrino© Advanced-N 6200
* McAfee Security Center with VirusScan, Firewall, Spyware Removal, 30-Day Trial
* 92 WHr 9-cell Lithium Ion Primary Battery
* 1 Year Basic Service Plan
* Dell Online Backup 2GB for 1 year
* Dell Bluetooth 3.0

2. Sager NP5135
* 15.6” FHD 16:9 LED Backlit Wide screen (1920x1080) Super Clear Glare Type Screen
* Standard Dead Pixel Policy
* Intel® Core™ i5-560M, 2.66-3.2GHz, (3MB L3 cache)
* IC Diamond Thermal Compound - CPU + GPU
* nVidia GT 425M 1024MB PCI-Express GDDR3 DX11 with Optimus™ Technology
* 8,192MB DDR3 1066MHz Dual Channel Memory (2 SODIMMS) - Special!
* Combo 8x8x6x4x Dual Layer DVD +/-R/RW 5x DVD-RAM 24x CD-R/RW Drive w/Softwares
* 500GB 7200RPM (Serial-ATA II 300 - 16MB Cache)
* Internal 4-in-1 Card Reader (SD/MMC/MS/MS PRO)
* Internal Bluetooth + EDR
* Intel® Ultimate-N 6300 - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN Module
* Built in 2.0 Megapixel Camera
* Sound Blaster Compatible 3D Audio - Included
* Integrated Fingerprint Reader
* No Operating System Standard - Drivers & Utility Software Only (gonna get W7 Pro through MSDNAA)
* 3 Year Labor 1 Year Parts, Lifetime Sager Toll Free Tech Support

- I'll mainly be using this laptop for school (AutoCAD, Solidworks) and some gaming (WoW, MW2, etc).

Thanks for the input!

*EDIT*: Took out Envy 14, XPS 14 configurations as 720p isn't quite enough.

More about : xps sager np5135

Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 21, 2010 5:30:43 PM

I get this question a lot, watch this laptop guide http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qE5IQ9tyAE

If you're gonna do CAD or Premiere work, then you don't want the software to scream at you for buying a 1366x768 screen. So the HP is out of the race.

Now here's the bit I don't know about Dell. Do they solder the GPU to the motherboard or do they have a special slot-in GPU board. I've been told it's the latter in some laptops. This is crucial if you're thinking about upgrades.

Seems like if we want 1080p, your choice is the XPS 15, but I'd rather go for the XPS 14.
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a b D Laptop
November 21, 2010 8:37:59 PM

I'm in agreement with LemonadeStand. You'll definitely get the most out of the XPS 15 for your particular uses. Not to mention that I personally find Dell's to be far more reliable than HP's.
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 21, 2010 9:53:47 PM

@buwish Do you know if Dell XPS series have their GPU soldered to the mobo or do they come on special boards, like PCI-e ones?
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a b D Laptop
November 21, 2010 10:22:56 PM

Quote:
Do you know if Dell XPS series have their GPU soldered to the mobo or do they come on special boards, like PCI-e ones?


Why does this matter?


Lotri: Go over to Anandtech and read the review on the XPS 15. They said the JBL speakers were about the best speakers in a laptop that they had ever heard (they haven't reviewed the Envy Beats edition yet). They also love the 1080p screen on the Dell: http://www.anandtech.com/show/3999/dell-xps-15-l501x-re...
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 21, 2010 10:32:17 PM

lostandwandering said:
Why does this matter?



Use your brain, why would anyone want to know if the GPU is upgradeable eh?
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a b D Laptop
November 21, 2010 11:55:50 PM

Quote:
Use your brain, why would anyone want to know if the GPU is upgradeable eh?


Most people go into buying laptops knowing they aren't going to upgrade them. Even if you can upgrade it, good luck finding a replacement and then have fun paying for it. I know of one place to buy them new (not ebay) and they aren't exactly cheap.
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 12:15:50 AM

lostandwandering said:
Most people go into buying laptops knowing they aren't going to upgrade them. Even if you can upgrade it, good luck finding a replacement and then have fun paying for it. I know of one place to buy them new (not ebay) and they aren't exactly cheap.

Well I know a lot of people who would disagree with that statement. 3 years down the line, not really playing games, they don't want to throw away a laptop that's working just fine. Then they ask me for upgrade tips.

I paid $100 for a new CPU and it really feels like a new lease of life for my laptop. Remind me, how much does a new laptop cost? Upgrade is the only way to stick it to those manufacturers. And am not spending on a new laptop just because a $50 game demands it. F-off Blizzard.
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a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 1:32:03 AM

Yes, but keep in mind that we are talking graphics cards here and specifically laptop cards that can't be bought retail in most cases. Not to mention that I never suggested that you "throw away" the laptop. A new mid-level GPU is going to run you much more than $100. From the one place that I know of online that you can buy these cards new, you are looking at close to $350 for a GTS 250. Putting that kind of money into a 3 year old system isn't really up my ally. I'd spend the money on a CPU or RAM before I bothered with that kind of cash for the GPU.
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a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 1:55:45 AM

I guess it is a matter of personal opinion in regard to the GPU. Chances are because it is a Dell that the GPU is soldered onto the motherboard. You'll only find upgradeable slots on high end gaming machines.
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November 22, 2010 2:55:08 AM

Well, here's the weird marketing thing with the Dells. If you want the 435M, you MUST upgrade to the i7, which negates the Optimus capability. So basically, I'm looking at:

1. Envy 14: smaller form, 720p, longer battery life, better graphics than the 420, no Optimus
2. XPS 14: smaller form, 720p, quad-core, good sound, no Optimus
3. XPS 15: good sound, 1080p, Optimus, lower battery life

If I take the XPS 14, would you guys recommend upgrading the battery. I have the 9-cell on my I9300, but I don't go portable that often. It's usually stuck into a wall due to CPU underclocking (and being too lazy to force it to higher speeds). The larger battery sticks out from the bottom, but that also allows for some airflow. I already do that to my laptop, using some blocks to lift the rear by about 1".
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 6:47:15 PM

lotri said:
Well, here's the weird marketing thing with the Dells. If you want the 435M, you MUST upgrade to the i7, which negates the Optimus capability. So basically, I'm looking at:

1. Envy 14: smaller form, 720p, longer battery life, better graphics than the 420, no Optimus
2. XPS 14: smaller form, 720p, quad-core, good sound, no Optimus
3. XPS 15: good sound, 1080p, Optimus, lower battery life

If I take the XPS 14, would you guys recommend upgrading the battery. I have the 9-cell on my I9300, but I don't go portable that often. It's usually stuck into a wall due to CPU underclocking (and being too lazy to force it to higher speeds). The larger battery sticks out from the bottom, but that also allows for some airflow. I already do that to my laptop, using some blocks to lift the rear by about 1".

If you've used CAD or Adobe CS5 before, you'll know that you need a roomy screen. Will an external monitor do? Use the chat button on the HP/Dell site and ask if you can return the laptop based on unsatisfactory performance with the software/game you use.

Anyway, according to NoteBookCheck, HD5650 and GT 425M have pretty similar ratings with GDDR3 memory.

If you're looking at a desktop replacement, then I think battery life shouldn't be too much of an issue. I mean, there're more important things to consider here. Someone mentioned Asus G53, did u check that? It's 1080p, is butt-ugly but comes GTX 460M.



___________________________________________________________________
Laptop advice guide: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qE5IQ9tyAE
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a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 9:20:16 PM

In easy words: Dell XPS 14, because it has i7 processor and gt425 (which is slightly behind 5650 but it produces very good battery standby plus it can surpass 5650 easily because it has nice overclocking ability.
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November 22, 2010 9:24:50 PM

Quote:
If you've used CAD or Adobe CS5 before, you'll know that you need a roomy screen. Will an external monitor do? Use the chat button on the HP/Dell site and ask if you can return the laptop based on unsatisfactory performance with the software/game you use.

Anyway, according to NoteBookCheck, HD5650 and GT 425M have pretty similar ratings with GDDR3 memory.

If you're looking at a desktop replacement, then I think battery life shouldn't be too much of an issue. I mean, there're more important things to consider here. Someone mentioned Asus G53, did u check that? It's 1080p, is butt-ugly but comes GTX 460M.


Well, the thing with the 425M is that it requires the i7, which doesn't allow for Optimus. Is it annoying to keep having to manually switch between Intel and ATI graphics? I'm also worried about overheating with the i7. The XPS 16 had some heat problems, and I know some HPs have the same problem with i7.

Regarding the battery, I was looking at the bigger battery to improve air flow. I could probably do the same thing I'm doing now, so the 9-cell isn't a must-have.
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 9:52:59 PM

lotri said:
Well, the thing with the 425M is that it requires the i7, which doesn't allow for Optimus. Is it annoying to keep having to manually switch between Intel and ATI graphics? I'm also worried about overheating with the i7. The XPS 16 had some heat problems, and I know some HPs have the same problem with i7.

Regarding the battery, I was looking at the bigger battery to improve air flow. I could probably do the same thing I'm doing now, so the 9-cell isn't a must-have.

Actually yeah, I've read about heating problems with Core i7 and apparently when it switches to turbo-boost, the fan goes loud and stays loud. That's surely not good design.

Looking back at your specs, I have to agree with raza715, the XPS14 is better... Check if you can connect an external display to get the 1080p. I'm sure this will benefit your CAD experience. Adobe CS5 requires a min 1280x900, my 1280x800 screen is no good, will 1366x768 (720p compliant) be any good?

I don't know about the connection between air-flow and battery size. I thought laptops have standard designs. The big battery just sticks out a little. Maybe it's different with Dell laptops.
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November 22, 2010 9:59:21 PM

Quote:
Actually yeah, I've read about heating problems with Core i7 and apparently when it switches to turbo-boost, the fan goes loud and stays loud. That's surely not good design.

Looking back at your specs, I have to agree with raza715, the XPS14 is better... Check if you can connect an external display to get the 1080p. I'm sure this will benefit your CAD experience. Adobe CS5 requires a min 1280x900, my 1280x800 screen is no good, will 1366x768 (720p compliant) be any good?

I don't know about the connection between air-flow and battery size. I thought laptops have standard designs. The big battery just sticks out a little. Maybe it's different with Dell laptops.


I think the newer batteries for both HP and Dell stick out downwards instead of towards the rear. Thus, it helps with air flow a bit.

I wonder if taking the XPS 15 for the subwoofer and 1080p is worth the size increase and processor downgrade. The Core i5 should be enough for most applications.. and the two configurations have around $50 difference in price.
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 22, 2010 10:08:35 PM

lotri said:
I think the newer batteries for both HP and Dell stick out downwards instead of towards the rear. Thus, it helps with air flow a bit.

I wonder if taking the XPS 15 for the subwoofer and 1080p is worth the size increase and processor downgrade. The Core i5 should be enough for most applications.. and the two configurations have around $50 difference in price.

Ah now I get it... I have a tic-tac box under my laptop to allow just that kind of airflow. :lol: 

Hey am looking at the Dell XPS15 config page. If you can stretch that little bit for a Core i7 & GT 435M 2GB, then you'll be happy from Day-1. I can't believe they charge an extra $130 for 1080p, isn't how much an external monitor costs? ...their screen has facial recog too, lol.
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November 23, 2010 1:15:40 AM

Quote:
Ah now I get it... I have a tic-tac box under my laptop to allow just that kind of airflow. :lol: 

Hey am looking at the Dell XPS15 config page. If you can stretch that little bit for a Core i7 & GT 435M 2GB, then you'll be happy from Day-1. I can't believe they charge an extra $130 for 1080p, isn't how much an external monitor costs? ...their screen has facial recog too, lol.


I guess I'm just worried about heat problems with the i7. I've been hearing about some memresistors that will revolutionize computers by making things so much faster.

Anyways, are there any engineers out there who might be able to chip in on i5 vs i7? If the i7 has heat issues, I'd rather just take the i5 and worry about power later when I build a desktop (eventually).

P.S. I took a peek at the Asus. It's a little out of my budget range and I'm sure it'll run super hot. I'm not looking to run games at native 1080p. Just something that will chug along at medium settings at 720p or 900p (like my 5-year-old laptop does). Oh, and something that will run CAD modeling smoothly as well. =P
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a b D Laptop
November 23, 2010 1:25:46 AM

Quote:
I can't believe they charge an extra $130 for 1080p, isn't how much an external monitor costs?


It's a decent penny to pay, but having used a 1920x1200 screen for the last few years on my Sager it is so worth it. That particular screen is getting some really good reviews too.
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 23, 2010 1:31:04 AM

I've never done any research on Sager and this name keeps coming up in these forums, maybe i should look into it. Thanks.
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a b D Laptop
November 23, 2010 1:40:54 AM

Quote:
I've never done any research on Sager and this name keeps coming up in these forums, maybe i should look into it. Thanks.


They are a good company. Their chasis are built by a Taiwanese company called Clevo. They are really into building some of the best price/performance gaming machines out there (they also offer a bunch of midrange systems as well). There are also a lot of companies that resell these laptops such as Xotic PC, Eurocom and Pro-star. Some others that have recently picked up the brand include I Buy Power and CyberPower. If you want a little more info on them, the NBR forum has a good (though somewhat outdated) thread on them: http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo/264311-clev...
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November 23, 2010 5:50:16 AM

So, I've been reading some forums where XPS 15 owners talk about their new babies. It looks like I'll probably have to apply some thermal paste to the CPU/CPU, depending on how crappy Dell's application is. Also, the official Dell forum lists problems with the webcam not being recognized and the USB 3.0 not working properly... :3

krilos on YouTube has a few videos showing vids of him playing various games. Of course, he has the i7-820QM and 8 GB of RAM, but he claims that temperatures don't get TOO hot (though outgoing air does get warm). Of course, he DID get a cooling pad.

I guess I'm just thinking.. i7 + better graphics + more heat vs i5 + okay graphics. I think Dell will have a "sale" on the XPS on Black Friday. They have an E-Value code with 6 GB of RAM for $899, I think. I was hoping to decide by then. Please post any constructive comments here. ^^

*EDIT*: What might be the advantages of waiting until Q1 2011 for the Sandy Bridge?
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 23, 2010 7:07:56 PM

lotri said:
So, I've been reading some forums where XPS 15 owners talk about their new babies...

That's some good research you're doing. I think it's great how people post comments and videos about their experience with laptops.

About applying better thermal-paste, I'm wondering if this will void the warranty?

As for the GPU, make a list of games that you might want to play (e.g. Starcraft 2 in high detail and ~30fps) and see which GPU fits the bill. Even if you aren't a gamer, you need some performance basis to choose that GPU. As for i7 + 6GB RAM ddr3, i think it's a good start. You can always upgrade those. The RAM should be 1x4GB + 1x2GB, so in year-2 you can replace that 2GB stick and check eBay for better-cheaper i7.

When Sandy Bridge comes out, expect the same high-price you're seeing now with a top Core i7.
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November 24, 2010 1:07:17 AM

I wonder how this stacks up to the XPS. Aside from the lower resolution screen, slower HD and 425M vs 435M, this ASUS N53JQ has those Bang & Olufsen speakers which appears to be competition for the JBL?

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=115962...

I guess the above link is comparable to the XPS 14 configuration I've listed, except for the screen size. Also, the Dell comes with a free, albeit probably crappy Sony camera and costs $100 more.

If anybody is wondering why I like Dell, it's because they send a tech out to service your system at your home. It's a lot better, imo, than having to send them your laptop and wait for it to come back. I've heard stories of people waiting weeks or months for their laptop to be returned.
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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2010 1:38:05 AM

lotri said:
I wonder how this stacks up to the XPS. Aside from the lower resolution screen, slower HD and 425M vs 435M, this ASUS N53JQ has those Bang & Olufsen speakers which appears to be competition for the JBL?

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=115962...

In Eric Cartman's own words "Ouch U Breakin' My Balls" ;)  It has 2 negatives, the screen & 5400rpm drive. But if price is an issue, then...


_______________________________________________________________________________
Laptop Advice: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qE5IQ9tyAE
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November 24, 2010 3:47:55 PM

I think right now, the main thing I'm looking for is 1080p. Does anybody have laptop suggestions around $1000 that have 1080p, dedicated graphics, Core i5/i7? The Dell seems good, but hearing more and more problems with heat possibly due to poor thermal paste application by Dell... though most of those are due to the i7.

For HP/Asus, if you need a laptop serviced, do you have to send it to them? Do they lend you a replacement? Would they let you install the component yourself?
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Best solution

a b D Laptop
November 24, 2010 4:42:10 PM

here you go http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np5125-built-clevo-b1500m-... just customize the screen the to full hd for another 60$
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a b D Laptop
November 24, 2010 6:43:26 PM

raza715 said:
here you go http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np5125-built-clevo-b1500m-... just customize the screen the to full hd for another 60$


Here's a review for that one: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4027/clevo-b5130-geforce-...

Quote:
If Dell had never released the XPS 15, this Clevo unit would probably have garnered an Editors' Choice award. It has a solid value proposition and brings a lot to the table. The problem is that Dell did release the XPS 15, and it consistently does everything else just a little bit better. Dell's 1080p screen may be a $150 upgrade, but the XPS 15 starts with comparable specs and a lower price, and the difference winds up being a wash. Dell also lets you upgrade the XPS 15 with a 740QM or better and offers a faster GPU in the form of the GeForce GT 435M, and the XPS' JBL speaker system easily trumps the Clevo speakers.

Ultimately, we would encourage consumers to comparison shop between the two notebooks. The B5130M is one of the better Clevo units we've tested, and ordering from AVADirect gets you worlds more flexibility with the components you can configure the system with along with the better customer service that can come from going with a smaller vendor. We know plenty of readers disliked the Dell aesthetics, and perhaps the Clevo system will win a few points there.
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November 24, 2010 11:51:27 PM

Ah... the Anandtech review said it had pretty poor build quality. But another review done by an owner said it's a pretty good laptop overall.

link: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1559931

As I continue my search, it seems that 1080p limits my options a lot. How drastic is the switch from 1080p back to 720p? Btw, xoticpc has a freebie sale from Black Friday to Cyber Monday. If I'm gonna grab the Sager, that might be a good time to do so and get a free USB flash drive or a free wireless mouse. O_O

*EDIT*: I've been taking a closer look at the Sager. It looks like a really good laptop, though the video reviews I found were only for the older 5125. How much better is an aluminum chassis than a plastic one? (Heat, sturdiness, etc)
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a b D Laptop
November 25, 2010 10:58:51 AM

Just go with the reviews of owners, and as far as i asked to the owners of sager 5135, all are happy, if you go with the reviews of these websites, then you are totally depening on them, i mean gamespot reviewed Fallout new vegas as 7.5 but i would say it is as good as fallout 3, so it should have gotten atleast 8.5, same for Army of two, they gave 7.5 rating i will rate as 9. So just dont depend on these marketing monopolies, you dont know whats behind their reviews. Like i found some websites only preferring nvidia over ati, but infact both are great and almost equal. They are just marketing monopolies.

And anandtech didnt write poor or bad, they write "Conclusion: Good but not Great" means 8/10 which is still a good for 9/10 or 10/10 you will have to spend at least 1200$ so considering the price you cant go wrong here, plus they are comparing it with 1000$+ XPS 15 so it is obvious that it will lack behind it as xps contains GT435m in it.
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a b D Laptop
November 25, 2010 12:25:32 PM

lotri said:
Ah... the Anandtech review said it had pretty poor build quality. But another review done by an owner said it's a pretty good laptop overall.

link: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1559931

As I continue my search, it seems that 1080p limits my options a lot. How drastic is the switch from 1080p back to 720p? Btw, xoticpc has a freebie sale from Black Friday to Cyber Monday. If I'm gonna grab the Sager, that might be a good time to do so and get a free USB flash drive or a free wireless mouse. O_O

*EDIT*: I've been taking a closer look at the Sager. It looks like a really good laptop, though the video reviews I found were only for the older 5125. How much better is an aluminum chassis than a plastic one? (Heat, sturdiness, etc)


Anandtech only mentioned that the build was on the weaker side and that was only because it's an all plastic chassis. As far as durability goes, it all depends on how you treat your laptop. The Sager in my signature is the same way, it's all plastic. However, it's pushing 3 and a half years of solid use. It's gone with me to and from class and from school to home and has held up rather well. If you treat it right, a plastic body will last as long as you need it to.
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November 25, 2010 5:13:33 PM

Yeah, I guess so. My plastic Dell has survived almost 5.5 years without many problems. I've got a little crack on one side from when it slipped and hit a table, and the palm rest and touchpad buttons are a little worn down from gaming.. and the screen has lots of vertical lines.. but it's still mostly alive. :D 
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a b D Laptop
November 25, 2010 5:15:01 PM

exactly what i was saying
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November 25, 2010 6:02:32 PM

Now... Sager lifetime support or xoticpc lifetime support? Xotic costs $29 to upgrade
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a b D Laptop
November 25, 2010 6:35:56 PM

sager lifetime would be better. But if there is a difference in price then go with lower one
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November 26, 2010 4:43:24 AM

And... I'm gonna ask one of those facepalm questions. Do you think 4 GB is enough for 64-bit W7 and some CAD work (Solidworks / AutoCAD)?

Also saw some G-Skill 2 x 4 GB DDR3 1333 on sale for $90 on Newegg. I know the Sager is limited to 1066 but would that be a problem? I don't usually upgrade things on my computers, but it seems like a good deal. The xoticpc upgrade is $100.
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November 26, 2010 3:06:34 PM

raza715 said:
you can add more ram in customize options upto 8GB and also processor upto i7 640M

check it out http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np5125-built-clevo-b1500m-...

Yeah, I was just thinking of buying some RAM from newegg as opposed to buying it from xoticpc.

So.. I talked to a Dell rep. I can grab the XPS 15 for ~$100 more than the Sager. Key differences:

1. Sager has GT425m, versus Dell's GT420m.
2. Dell has B+GR LED screen, while Sager has a "normal" one.
3. Sager config has 8 GB, while Dell has 6 GB.
4. Dell's audio is supposedly the best people have heard, while Sager has subpar, oddly-placed ones.
5. Dell has in-home warranty versus mail-in for Sager.
6. Sager has 6300 wireless, while Dell only goes up to 6200.
7. Sager is cheaper.
8. Dell's webcam appears to be better than Sager's, though that's not really important.

Looking to make a purchase today while deals are still hot.
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November 27, 2010 12:07:33 AM

Best answer selected by lotri.
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November 27, 2010 12:08:02 AM

Well, thanks for the help guys. I decided to pull the trigger for the Sager.
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a c 244 D Laptop
November 27, 2010 6:21:31 AM

This topic has been closed by Maziar
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