Strategies for identifying items?

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Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best strategies for
identifying items? I typically like playing priests because of the
detect item status skill. I tend to be the least fearful about trying
blessed items, and paranoid about those that are cursed.
But, the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can be used for
example by a thief or fighter to keep from being stuck with a bunch of
cursed items? Also, how do you go about identifying the piles of
magical items you collect if you're afraid to use any of them until you
know what they do?

Thanks for any thoughts/tips,

Al
 
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Al Puzzuoli wrote:
> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best strategies for
> identifying items? I typically like playing priests because of the
> detect item status skill. I tend to be the least fearful about trying
> blessed items, and paranoid about those that are cursed.
> But, the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can be used for
> example by a thief or fighter to keep from being stuck with a bunch of
> cursed items? Also, how do you go about identifying the piles of
> magical items you collect if you're afraid to use any of them until you
> know what they do?
>
> Thanks for any thoughts/tips,
>
> Al

Drop the items in a shop - cursed items tend to be worth less than
uncursed, and blessed ones cost more(this is from my memory, so don't
trust me on it).
Dropping any item on a co-aligned altar will reveal its c/u/b status.
Don't drop things on non-co-aligned altars unless you like rats.
I've heard the skill of Appraising gives some insight into the status
of items, but don't trust it all the time.
As a last resort(or if you're really bored and enjoy some sport) drop
equipable items in front of a humanoid monster. It auto-identifies the
cursed status if the creature wears it. Unless I'm thinking of Nethack.
In which case this entire post is probably wrong to some degree...
 
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Al Puzzuoli wrote:
> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best
> strategies for identifying items? I typically like
> playing priests because of the detect item status skill.
> I tend to be the least fearful about trying blessed
> items, and paranoid about those that are cursed. But,
> the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can
> be used for example by a thief or fighter to keep from
> being stuck with a bunch of cursed items? Also, how do
> you go about identifying the piles of magical items you
> collect if you're afraid to use any of them until you
> know what they do?

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ID'ing items in ADOM is relatively easy compared to
NetHack and Crawl. Blessed scroll of identify *always*
identifies all of your carried items. To utilize this you
need three ingredients:

1. Literacy skill. Literacy 1 is enough in ADOM1.1.1, you
don't need any more if you only want to read scrolls. To
get Literacy you can:

a). Start with it. See ADOM Manual for races and classes
that start with Literacy. Also, any non-Barbarian,
non-Beastfighter char with Le of at least 10 will also
start with it.

(I'm not certain about Elven barbs/beastfighters, perhaps
someone who actually played them can clarify.)

b). Complete Thrundarr's first quest. The reward for
illiterate characters is the artifact potion of literacy,
which, when drunk, grants the said skill.

c). Eat a blessed dark sage corpse. Good luck with this
one, dark sages are rare and their - blessed - corpses are
even rarer.

2. Potions of holy water. Aside from finding them you can
create some by getting your piety to 'very pleased' at
least, then dropping your potions of water/unholy water on
a coaligned altar. Potions of water are easy to identify
themselves, they are always 'watery potions'. Getting
enough potions of water might be tricky, but Pick Pockets
skill should save the day. You can acquire this skill by
being non-lawful and talking to Yergius, the master thief
in Lawenilothehl.

You can also dip potions of water/unholy water into holy
water. This wastes a potion, though.

3. Scrolls of identify. To bless them dip them into holy
water. Identifying them: Barnabas in Lawenilothehl might
have some in his shop. If this is the case, your problem
is solved. Otherwise you might want to use-ID them. If you
still haven't identified them after completing the Terinyo
area, just bless and use your largest heap of scrolls.
They are likely to be either identifies or powers. If
they're not what you need, try the second biggest pile and
so on. Getting enough scrolls should be easy - they're
very common, and even more common with the aforementioned
Pick Pockets skill.

So mass identifying from early mid-game on shouldn't be a
problem at all. Of course, many characters really need
better armour/weapons in the early game to survive. If you
have found a coaligned altar, half your problem is solved,
just b/u/c-ID your items by dropping them on the altar,
then try them on. Once you've found a decent body armour,
consider sticking with it until you can mass identify your
stuff. Trapped/auto-locking ego clothes can be *really*
crippling. Be careful with gauntlets - gauntlets of peace
are rather dangerous for combat-types, be they fighters or
archers. Gloves are safe to try, though. Don't worry about
trying other pieces of armour - and weapons - these are
largely safe. You might avoid wearing unID'ed boots, but
nasty boots of slow shuffle seem to be extremely rare -
rarer even than 7LBs. (They also might be very useful
scumming for speed later in the game.)

If you can't b/u/c-identify: well, you can try a few
armours/weapons early on, but once you've got something
decent, be happy with it until you can find means of
reliable ID. Cursed stuff can kill you char (indirectly,
of course).

Only try wands in the wilderness. Wands of ball lightning
can be lethal when used in a dungeon. Generally, I'd
advise against trying wands at all, mass-ID is not that
far away, so don't waste those charges.

Use-ID'ing potions might be relatively safe, but I'd still
advise against ID. Sickness. Raw chaos (very rare, but
still...).

Only use-ID scrolls to find scrolls of identify - and only
once you've got enough scrolls to know which are common.

Don't try jewelry - it's not that helpful early in the
game, and there are some rather nasty items (although
they're uncommon too). Feel free to put on that glass
amulet, though, - it might be 'of light', and probably
won't kill you anyway.

There are great many methods of ID'ing items by
weight/appearance/something else, but in a normal,
non-challenge game all of those are superficial. Just get
your mass-ID engine running and you'll be golden.

Don't rely on Appraising, it can be very misleading.

Good luck.

Oh. And stop playing those Detect Item Status classes. Bad
habits are, well, BAD.

--
roy axenov
 
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Léon Planken wrote:
> I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read
> that on 24 Aug 2005 03:41:22 -0700, roy axenov
> <r_axenov@mail.ru> wrote:
>>
>> Al Puzzuoli wrote:
>>> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the
>>> best strategies for identifying items? I typically
>>> like playing priests because of the detect item status
>>> skill. I tend to be the least fearful about trying
>>> blessed items, and paranoid about those that are
>>> cursed. But, the detect item status skill aside, what
>>> strategies can be used for example by a thief or
>>> fighter to keep from being stuck with a bunch of
>>> cursed items? Also, how do you go about identifying
>>> the piles of magical items you collect if you're
>>> afraid to use any of them until you know what they do?
>>
>> [massive spoilers]
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>> Don't rely on Appraising, it can be very misleading.
>
> Well - in my current game I used it very reliably. I
> had three stacks of potions of water: one was {fair},
> another {mediocre} or {poor}, and the third unappraised.
> This led me to the conclusion that the third was holy
> water.

I'm not implying that Appraising is totally useless. ("Not
very useful" would be my definition.) It has its uses, but
there are certain quirks regarding wearables that you must
be aware of. I'm speaking of the fact that cursed
wearables can be rated {good}. Also, it's only useful very
early in the game. When Clvl reaches early teens mass
identify is usually available, or, at the very least,
b/u/c-ID using some altar. Both make Appraising kind of
obsolete in my opinion.

> By the way - I think the appraisal results may be
> identical throughout games.

I'm almost certain of that. But that changes nothing in my
evaluation of said skill.

> This means that they could be listed in the Guidebook,
> helping with finding out item status and identification.

This would only work for statless items*, and even with
them would only help very early in the game as I already
said. It's just not worth the work collecting that data.

* I hope you realize that finding out Appraising values
for all orcish knives from cursed (-2,1d3-1) to blessed
(+4,1d3+5) would be... not very smart, considering how few
chars *have* the skill, and how infinitesimal is the
number of chars actually *using* it. Oh. And I forgot to
mention ego items.

--
roy axenov
 
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I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
on Wed, 24 Aug 2005 01:07:10 -0400, Al Puzzuoli <alpuzz@comcast.net> wrote:
> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best strategies for
> identifying items? I typically like playing priests because of the
> detect item status skill. I tend to be the least fearful about trying
> blessed items, and paranoid about those that are cursed.
> But, the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can be used for
> example by a thief or fighter to keep from being stuck with a bunch of
> cursed items? Also, how do you go about identifying the piles of
> magical items you collect if you're afraid to use any of them until you
> know what they do?

If you can read, an old dwarf somewhere can help you, if you help him
first. Also, scrolls of identify obviously do the trick (you didn't
mention them, so I'm not sure whether you know of their existence), and
in some cases they'll even tell you whether stuff is cursed, uncursed or
blessed. Scrolls of identify are rather common, so it's often a safe
bet that they're the type of scrolls you've found the most (or
second-most) of.

Regards,
Leon (aka Oliphaunt)

--
I really didn't foresee the Internet. But then, neither did
the computer industry. Not that that tells us very much, of
course - the computer industry didn't even foresee that the
century was going to end. -- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)
 
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roy axenov wrote:

> Al Puzzuoli wrote:
>
>> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best strategies
>> for identifying items? I typically like playing priests because of
>> the detect item status skill. I tend to be the least fearful about
>> trying blessed items, and paranoid about those that are cursed.
>> But, the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can be
>> used for example by a thief or fighter to keep from being stuck
>> with a bunch of cursed items? Also, how do you go about
>> identifying the piles of magical items you collect if you're afraid
>> to use any of them until you know what they do?
>
> [massive spoilers]
>
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>
> ID'ing items in ADOM is relatively easy compared to NetHack and
> Crawl. Blessed scroll of identify *always* identifies all of your
> carried items. To utilize this you need three ingredients:
>
> 1. Literacy skill. Literacy 1 is enough in ADOM1.1.1, you don't need
> any more if you only want to read scrolls. To get Literacy you can:
>
> a). Start with it. See ADOM Manual for races and classes that start
> with Literacy. Also, any non-Barbarian, non-Beastfighter char with Le
> of at least 10 will also start with it.
>
> (I'm not certain about Elven barbs/beastfighters, perhaps someone who
> actually played them can clarify.)

I I don't normally play them, but I just created a gray elven
beastfighter to test, and he did start out literate. Presumably the same
would be true of other races of elves.

> So mass identifying from early mid-game on shouldn't be a problem at
> all. Of course, many characters really need better armour/weapons in
> the early game to survive. If you have found a coaligned altar, half
> your problem is solved, just b/u/c-ID your items by dropping them on
> the altar, then try them on.

Unless my memory is being even trickier than usual, this only works if
you're sufficiently close to your deity. I believe all characters start
out that way, but if you do enough praying and not enough sacrificing
before trying to get something's status identified, it may not work.

--
The Wanderer

Warning: Simply because I argue an issue does not mean I agree with any
side of it.

A government exists to serve its citizens, not to control them.
 
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I failed miserably to keep a straight face when I read that
on 24 Aug 2005 03:41:22 -0700, roy axenov <r_axenov@mail.ru> wrote:
>
> Al Puzzuoli wrote:
>> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best
>> strategies for identifying items? I typically like
>> playing priests because of the detect item status skill.
>> I tend to be the least fearful about trying blessed
>> items, and paranoid about those that are cursed. But,
>> the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can
>> be used for example by a thief or fighter to keep from
>> being stuck with a bunch of cursed items? Also, how do
>> you go about identifying the piles of magical items you
>> collect if you're afraid to use any of them until you
>> know what they do?
>
> [massive spoilers]
>
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> Don't rely on Appraising, it can be very misleading.

Well - in my current game I used it very reliably. I had three stacks
of potions of water: one was {fair}, another {mediocre} or {poor}, and
the third unappraised. This led me to the conclusion that the third was
holy water.

By the way - I think the appraisal results may be identical throughout
games. This means that they could be listed in the Guidebook, helping
with finding out item status and identification.

Leon (aka Oliphaunt)

--
I really didn't foresee the Internet. But then, neither did
the computer industry. Not that that tells us very much, of
course - the computer industry didn't even foresee that the
century was going to end. -- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)
 
G

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On 2005-08-24, The Wanderer <inverseparadox@comcast.net> wrote:
> roy axenov wrote:
>
>> Al Puzzuoli wrote:
>>
>>> Just wondering if anyone can offer tips as to the best strategies
>>> for identifying items? I typically like playing priests because of
>>> the detect item status skill. I tend to be the least fearful about
>>> trying blessed items, and paranoid about those that are cursed.
>>> But, the detect item status skill aside, what strategies can be
>>> used for example by a thief or fighter to keep from being stuck
>>> with a bunch of cursed items? Also, how do you go about
>>> identifying the piles of magical items you collect if you're afraid
>>> to use any of them until you know what they do?
>>
>> [massive spoilers]
>>
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
>> .
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>>
>> 1. Literacy skill. Literacy 1 is enough in ADOM1.1.1, you don't need
>> any more if you only want to read scrolls. To get Literacy you can:
>>
>> a). Start with it. See ADOM Manual for races and classes that start
>> with Literacy. Also, any non-Barbarian, non-Beastfighter char with Le
>> of at least 10 will also start with it.
>>
>> (I'm not certain about Elven barbs/beastfighters, perhaps someone who
>> actually played them can clarify.)
>
> I I don't normally play them, but I just created a gray elven
> beastfighter to test, and he did start out literate. Presumably the same
> would be true of other races of elves.

It's in the manual: high and gray elves (but not dark) start with
literacy, regardless of class.

One minor gotcha on the learning >= 10 bit: this is checked before
initial talent selection, so you can't get literacy by selecting the
'Learned' talent even if it brings you up to 10.

njm
 
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Nathan Miller wrote:

> On 2005-08-24, The Wanderer <inverseparadox@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> roy axenov wrote:

>>> [massive spoilers]
>>>
>>> .
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>>> .
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>>>
>>> 1. Literacy skill. Literacy 1 is enough in ADOM1.1.1, you don't
>>> need any more if you only want to read scrolls. To get Literacy
>>> you can:
>>>
>>> a). Start with it. See ADOM Manual for races and classes that
>>> start with Literacy. Also, any non-Barbarian, non-Beastfighter
>>> char with Le of at least 10 will also start with it.
>>>
>>> (I'm not certain about Elven barbs/beastfighters, perhaps someone
>>> who actually played them can clarify.)
>>
>> I don't normally play them, but I just created a gray elven
>> beastfighter to test, and he did start out literate. Presumably the
>> same would be true of other races of elves.
>
> It's in the manual: high and gray elves (but not dark) start with
> literacy, regardless of class.

I know about the skill listing for gray/high elves, yes (I'd forgotten
the difference for dark elves, and was too lazy at the time to check). I
presumed that the fact that elves start with literacy was the reason why
Roy mentioned being uncertain about elves at all; the question at hand
appeared to be whether "barbarians and beastfighters are illiterate"
trumped "elves are literate". The answer was "no", but I don't think
that the question was unreasonable.

--
The Wanderer

Warning: Simply because I argue an issue does not mean I agree with any
side of it.

A government exists to serve its citizens, not to control them.
 
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Wow, you guys are great! just wanted to say thanks for all the info.
I'm off to do some adventuring!

--Al