[V] Poll. Average winning speed

[Guest]

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Hi all.

In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
particulary slow player.

So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
that I'm actually pretty slow.

My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some of
those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do others do?

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

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Timo Pietilä <timo.pietila@helsinki.fi> writes:

> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some
> of those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do
> others do?

I aim for .5M, and generally try a new game [via diving too quickly
] if it appears it will take anywhere near 1M. I do not use any
"generate small level" options.


Eddie

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Well my last win was in under 1.6m turns, which is very fast for me. In
my 5 wins so far at V, the longest was around 3.5m. So I guess an
average of 2.5-3m for me. Mind you, I find warriors much quicker to
play.

Ed


Timo Pietilä wrote:
> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some of
> those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do others do?
>
> Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Timo Pietilä wrote:
> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some of
> those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do others do?
>
> Timo Pietilä

I may be the only one who's this bad.. but I've been playing the game
for years now and have yet to win a single game.

I have several times lasted as long as 1M turns or there abouts, but I'm
usually level 40 or so at that time and in or just past stat-gain.

I realize this was a poll for winners, but I thought I'd remind other
readers that there are still those of us who haven't done it yet.

--
Wil Hunt
Geek in training.
Jack of few trades, master of none.

 

[Guest]

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On 2005-09-07 13:35:45, =?ISO-8859-15?Q?Timo_Pietil�?=
<timo.pietila@helsinki.fi> wrote:

> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some of
> those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do others do?
>
> Timo Pietil�
>
>

Early wins used to be around 2.5M turns (since I played really carefully) in NPP
0.3.4. Nowadays I'd propably win around turn 1M if I played a bit more
carefully, but I tend to die all the time when I'm shooting for 0.5M turns.

Average would propably be around 1.75 for all my wins.

--
--

Anssi Ramela

anssi.ramela@myy.helia.fi

 

[Guest]

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"Timo Pietilä" <timo.pietila@helsinki.fi> wrote in message
news:dfmjah$4a5$1@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...
> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some
> of those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do
> others do?
>

I don't have any concrete data on hand. In 3.0.5 I had a few winners
and I think they were all around the 700k turns mark. But, then again,
I had many more deaths. Still not the fastest ever, but fast enough to
keep my attention.

One of the winners (a dwarf priest, for fun...) found BoS early, and
his turncount was a mere 500k. But that's just luck.

--
Glen
Lyt E+++ T-- R+ P+++ D+ G+ F:*band !RL RLA-
W:AF Q+++ AI++ GFX++ SFX-- RN++++ PO--- !Hp Re-- S+

 

[Guest]

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Cliff Stamp wrote:
> On Wed, 7 Sep 2005, [ISO-8859-15] Timo Pietil� wrote:
>
>> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some
>> of those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do
>> others do?
>
> This is way faster than average, there was a time when winning in 1M turns
> was considered insanely fast. How often you can win is kind of critical
> though, if you are willing to die then you can move really fast.

I usually play safe. If I can get thru few first levels I usually don't
die at all, unless I try something new.

> For example I just ran a Paladin down to Dl38 in 25k turns. Nothing
> exceptional luck wise except a cold brand well balanced dagger.

This is NPP obviously. In NPP I can dive fast too. It is easier than
vanilla despite some _really_ dangerous monsters.

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

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Timo Pietilä wrote:
> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.

Clarification: Even that I'm talking about NPP above poll is for Vanilla.

I seem to always revert back to vanilla after I have tried some variant.
NPP is fun, but not for me, unless I turn all non-vanilla like features
off. And then it is like playing challenge char. NPP isn't really well
balanced. OTOH it is being developed faster so fine-tuning
balance-issues cannot be vanilla level.

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

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"Timo Pietilä" <timo.pietila@helsinki.fi> wrote in message news:dfon7h$rg1$1@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...
> Timo Pietilä wrote:
>
> I seem to always revert back to vanilla after I have tried some variant.
> NPP is fun, but not for me, unless I turn all non-vanilla like features
> off. And then it is like playing challenge char. NPP isn't really well
> balanced. OTOH it is being developed faster so fine-tuning
> balance-issues cannot be vanilla level.
>
That's the problem. I think up until 0.3.4 it was close to vanilla in balance, but all the new features in the 0.4.x series was too much. Plus, I barely played 0.4.x before I started on 0.5.0. 0.5.0 has the last of the major features I intend to add. Then I am going to stop development for about 6 months and just play NPP & work on the balance.

Oh, and to answer the original post question, I usually take about 4-5 million turns to win. But I don't really play right. I take kind of a tourist approach where I go everywhere and fight everything to check things out to see if they work right. I also place an extremely high value on telepathy so I can be sure the monsters are moving through the dungeon correctly.

In Vanilla, my first win was something like 10 million turns, & my quickest was around 2 million turns. Keep in mind I mostly play humans, which is one of the weakest races. Despite being called "average at everything", their stats are average but they are significantly below average in all the skills.


--
-Jeff


Author of NPPAngband. Check it out at:
http://members.cox.net/nppangband/

replace the ".spam"s with cox.net to reply

 

[shadus]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

On 2005-09-08, Timo Pietilä <timo.pietila@helsinki.fi> blabbed:
> Clarification: Even that I'm talking about NPP above poll is for Vanilla.
>
> I seem to always revert back to vanilla after I have tried some variant.
> NPP is fun, but not for me, unless I turn all non-vanilla like features
> off. And then it is like playing challenge char. NPP isn't really well
> balanced. OTOH it is being developed faster so fine-tuning
> balance-issues cannot be vanilla level.

Vanilla is probally around 6m on avg for me, ive done it 3 times all
around that mark.

T-O-M-E is by far my prefered varient, and except for alchemists which
are exceptionally easy I find its variations to be more fun than
vanilla... although I also like Z and O occasionally.

I think its mainly the spell system I don't like in vanilla and I always
play a caster of somesort.

 

[Guest]

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Cliff Stamp wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Sep 2005, [UTF-8] Timo Pietilä wrote:
>
>> This is NPP obviously. In NPP I can dive fast too. It is easier than
>> vanilla despite some _really_ dangerous monsters.
>
> That doesn't make sense to me, its the monsters that kill you. Does Vanilla
> have the ball spash ability of monsters and have summons on the caster?
>
> What makes NPP easier?

Better equipment earlier. A lot of monsters are easy to kill with very
low risk and good reward. Shop services pretty much eliminate stat-gain.
That sort of things.

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

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Cliff Stamp wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Sep 2005, [UTF-8] Timo Pietilä wrote:
>
>> This is NPP obviously. In NPP I can dive fast too. It is easier than
>> vanilla despite some _really_ dangerous monsters.
>
> I just tried the same character in Vanilla. No real difference, I retired
> him on Dl 13 at CL 13, ~20k turns.

Dl 13 with Cl 13 char is just beginning of the game. Major differences
for Vanilla and NPP come later. Young dragon pits for example are very
easy to clear and you get huge amount of items from those. Creeping coin
pits give insanely amounts of money (if you can deal with those, they
are actually pretty dangerous). If you get lucky with quests you get
enormous amount of good items at no time (Ancient dragon stronghold for
example contains a lot of wyrms). You can buy dungeon books from store
services which speeds up spellcasters quite a bit.

Of course you dive so fast in both that it might be difficult for you to
notice the difference.

One speeding factor is shafts. You can dive two levels at once.

> With the majority of that wasted trying
> to kill wormtongue with a regular dagger on Dl13.

Fastest easy way to kill Wormy at his native depth is use of Wand of
Wonder and few arrows. He lasts about three or four turns if you are
lucky with wand. If not, then leave and try again later.

> how long it would take, in a regular game I would have just moved on. Does
> Vanilla have squelching?

No.

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

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Cliff Stamp wrote:
> On Thu, 8 Sep 2005, [ISO-8859-15] Timo Pietil� wrote:

[Vanilla Squelch?]

>> No.
>
> That was why I stopped playing years back, it gets too annoying late game,
> but even early it is a hassle.

IIRC Robert said that it will be in 3.0.7 which should be ready "soon".
I think RL has gone into way, since I haven't seen any big changes in
CVS lately.

Robert, status?

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

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"Timo Pietilä" <timo.pietila@helsinki.fi> schrieb...

> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some of those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much.
> How do others do?

Don't know what my times in V 2.9.x were. I used an empty score file
when i converted to 3.0.5 this spring.

I had a hobbit warrior with 2.2 M turns, and a hobbit mage with 3.2 M.

The warrior was my first character beyond 2000', thus i played him quite
slow and careful. In addition, i waited quite a long time at 4900' waiting
for the uniques to show up, since i wanted a full monster memory.
I waited far too long, tkinking that severla high level uniques were missing.
When i finally checked monster.txt, i noticed that i had killed them all.

The mage was a pure magic mage - no melee, no shooting.
So he probably needed more turns than with other playing styles;
i need to rest for mana even after easy fights.

Werner.

 

[magnate]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

I won V precisely once (and it wasn't a real win, because I remember
save-scumming once or twice) in about 4M turns. Since then I've been
mainly playing S, or other variants at which I'm even worse, and have
not won since. I would not expect to win in under 2M turns though,
whatever I'm playing (unless it's an Eddie-enhanced comp char).

Re squelching in V: there is a patch, if you can compile it yourself.
If not, let's hope RR does finally include it in the next version!

CC

 

[Guest]

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magnate wrote:

> Re squelching in V: there is a patch, if you can compile it yourself.
> If not, let's hope RR does finally include it in the next version!

That's what RR said. He also said to revert unlimited recharging to
destroy one from the stack if recharging fails. If I read CVS correctly
that is already done. No 3.0.7 though.

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Timo Pietilä wrote:
> Hi all.
>
> In my recent converstion with Cliff Stamp he asked my average winning
> turn count. He did win NPP in about 250k turns which means that he is
> very fast. I take much longer in my games, but I still don't think I'm
> particulary slow player.
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>
> My winnings in average seem to be between 1.5 M and 3.5 M turns. Some of
> those are artifactless, but that doesn't slow me much. How do others do?
>
> Timo Pietilä

Umm.. damn. I was on 9M turns when I was killed on level 41 with a
level 30 mage. I made a macro key to rest full mana/hp which I use all
the time, plus I spent a *LOT* of time trying to charge wands and
staves up to higher than 6 charges so I could take out groups of
monsters. Still, it's a little discouraging to see people finishing
with so many fewer turns when I keep getting slaughtered. Must be doing
something wrong

 

[Guest]

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devapps wrote:
> Umm.. damn. I was on 9M turns when I was killed on level 41 with a
> level 30 mage. I made a macro key to rest full mana/hp which I use all
> the time, plus I spent a *LOT* of time trying to charge wands and
> staves up to higher than 6 charges so I could take out groups of
> monsters. Still, it's a little discouraging to see people finishing
> with so many fewer turns when I keep getting slaughtered. Must be doing
> something wrong
>

Yeah, we probably are. But you're not the only one. I'm often in
the same boat.

--
Wil Hunt
Geek in training.
Jack of few trades, master of none.

 

[Guest]

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Timo Pietilä wrote:
>
> So I started to wonder how fast players do win in average. It might be
> that I'm actually pretty slow.
>

Win? Huh? Is this something unique to NPP?

;-P