{V} Question about ego_item.txt

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

I am confused by something in ego_item.txt (this is from Angband
3.0.6). Here is an sample entry:

N:91f *Slay Demon*
X:16:0
W:0:20:0:8000
C:0:0:0:2
T:21:0:99
T:22:0:99
T:23:0:99
F:KILL_DEMON | INT | RES_FIRE

According to the info at the top of the file,

# W: depth : rarity : weight : cost

There are a lot of 'depth 0' ego items. Is it really the case that,
say, Daggers of *Slay Evil* can appear at 50' just as easily as they
can at 2000'?

I was trying to write a script to determine the lowest levels at which
various resistances, etc. could be found and do some other statistical
analysis of items...but some of the ego_item.txt entries threw me off
since the depths are 0. Or does the tval rule the depth - e.g., for a
Rapier of *Slay Demon* it'd be a depth of 250' since the base Rapier's
depth is 5?

-Drew

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

andrew.fabbro@gmail.com wrote:
> I am confused by something in ego_item.txt (this is from Angband
> 3.0.6). Here is an sample entry:
>
> N:91f *Slay Demon*
> X:16:0
> W:0:20:0:8000
> C:0:0:0:2
> T:21:0:99
> T:22:0:99
> T:23:0:99
> F:KILL_DEMON | INT | RES_FIRE
>
> According to the info at the top of the file,
>
> # W: depth : rarity : weight : cost
>
> There are a lot of 'depth 0' ego items. Is it really the case that,
> say, Daggers of *Slay Evil* can appear at 50' just as easily as they
> can at 2000'?
>
> I was trying to write a script to determine the lowest levels at which
> various resistances, etc. could be found and do some other statistical
> analysis of items...but some of the ego_item.txt entries threw me off
> since the depths are 0. Or does the tval rule the depth - e.g., for a
> Rapier of *Slay Demon* it'd be a depth of 250' since the base Rapier's
> depth is 5?


It's not so simple as that. The chances of a good object go up with
dungeon level

>From apply_magic() in object2.c:


/* Base chance of being "good" */
f1 = lev + 10;

/* Maximal chance of being "good" */
if (f1 > 75) f1 = 75;

/* Base chance of being "great" */
f2 = f1 / 2;

/* Maximal chance of being "great" */
if (f2 > 20) f2 = 20;


So your odds of getting an ego item are pretty bad at dl1, while the
are very good at dl 50.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

andrew.fabbro@gmail.com writes:

> I am confused by something in ego_item.txt (this is from Angband
> 3.0.6). Here is an sample entry:
>
> N:91f *Slay Demon*
> X:16:0
> W:0:20:0:8000
> C:0:0:0:2
> T:21:0:99
> T:22:0:99
> T:23:0:99
> F:KILL_DEMON | INT | RES_FIRE
>
> According to the info at the top of the file,
>
> # W: depth : rarity : weight : cost
>
> There are a lot of 'depth 0' ego items. Is it really the case that,
> say, Daggers of *Slay Evil* can appear at 50' just as easily as they
> can at 2000'?

What this means is that if the dagger is a great item, it doesn't need
an extra check to be *Slay Demon* or *Slay Evil*. Great items are less
common at shallower dungeon depths, but if you find them (either by
chance, or forced when Smeagol drops one), the depth 0 items are all
reasonably likely.

> I was trying to write a script to determine the lowest levels at which
> various resistances, etc. could be found and do some other statistical
> analysis of items...but some of the ego_item.txt entries threw me off
> since the depths are 0. Or does the tval rule the depth - e.g., for a
> Rapier of *Slay Demon* it'd be a depth of 250' since the base Rapier's
> depth is 5?

There are two steps when the game chooses an item. First, the
appropriate depth is chosen. For items lying on the floor, it is the
dungeon depth; out-of-depth items are rare. Then, after the item is
chosen, it gets enchanted, and if it happens to be great, it has to pass
another out-of-depth check to be an artifact or ego item with a greater
depth. Thus, once you happen to have found a rapier on the first level,
it has the same chance as a dagger of being an ego item.

--
David Grabiner, grabiner@alumni.princeton.edu, http://remarque.org/~grabiner
Baseball labor negotiations FAQ: http://remarque.org/~grabiner/laborfaq.html
Shop at the Mobius Strip Mall: Always on the same side of the street!
Klein Glassworks, Torus Coffee and Donuts, Projective Airlines, etc.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

andrew.fabbro@gmail.com wrote:
> I am confused by something in ego_item.txt (this is from Angband
> 3.0.6). Here is an sample entry:
>
> N:91f *Slay Demon*
> X:16:0
> W:0:20:0:8000
> C:0:0:0:2
> T:21:0:99
> T:22:0:99
> T:23:0:99
> F:KILL_DEMON | INT | RES_FIRE
>
> According to the info at the top of the file,
>
> # W: depth : rarity : weight : cost
>
> There are a lot of 'depth 0' ego items. Is it really the case that,
> say, Daggers of *Slay Evil* can appear at 50' just as easily as they
> can at 2000'?

Pretty much yes. There is a code that makes them more likely at deeper
levels (look at other post), but it isn't "out of depth" at town.

I have got good Dagger Holy Avenger from Battle Scarred Veteran once
very early in game when I was playing priest.

If you kill lots of townsfolk you notice that they do drop ego-items
every now and then.

> since the depths are 0. Or does the tval rule the depth - e.g., for a
> Rapier of *Slay Demon* it'd be a depth of 250' since the base Rapier's
> depth is 5?

Of course all rarities/depths affect how rare item in reality is. BoC
*slay demon* would be rather rare at town because base item is much deeper.

Timo Pietilä

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

On 14 Sep 2005 11:43:39 -0700, andrew.fabbro@gmail.com wrote:

>I was trying to write a script to determine the lowest levels at which
>various resistances, etc. could be found and do some other statistical
>analysis of items...but some of the ego_item.txt entries threw me off
>since the depths are 0. Or does the tval rule the depth - e.g., for a
>Rapier of *Slay Demon* it'd be a depth of 250' since the base Rapier's
>depth is 5?

Hi Drew,

Good luck on the scripts - you'll need it, since item generation uses a
very complex algorithm.

If you can't or won't read the sources, then I advise you to check out
two of the object spoiler files: obj-long.spo and obj-good.spo. The
first one contains a complete description of the algorithm used for
(normal) item generation; the second goes in the fine details of when
and how the game decides to change a normal item into a good, ego,
cursed, or artifact item.

The spoiler files can be found here:
ftp://ftp.thangorodrim.net/pub/angband/Spoiler/


Best, Hugo
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