[Crawl] Suggestion

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Hiho

Following Suggestion for Future Versions of Crawl:

One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From Living
Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.

greets....


--
www.tshq.de ---- German Ressource for Tholian Strategies
30 answers Last reply
More about crawl suggestion
  1. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Andreas Huck <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> croaked:

    > Following Suggestion for Future Versions of Crawl:

    Side-info: these are usually called YANIs; Yet Anoter Nifty/New
    Idea.

    > One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From
    > Living Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.

    Are you having food problems? (What happened to your mummy?)

    Hmmm... Meat rations that actually last would need all sorts of
    treatment and perhaps seasoning, no? Sounds more like a Nethack
    thingy (where they've got tinning kits and ice boxes and stuff).

    Maybe a spell? Or turn one of those useless misc items into
    something that can do this.

    Afair you can fry stuff in Adom to make it last somewhat (or maybe
    I'm hallucinating again), maybe that'd not be too 'outer space' for
    Crawl.

    How about just using a flaming bladed weapon to make fried/burned
    chunks, and freezing bladed weapons that make frozen chunks, that
    both last twice the normal time (but maybe lose in nutrition)?

    --
    Tina the Skullbreaker - a Priest of the Roasting Numeric Glass
  2. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    >
    > Are you having food problems? (What happened to your mummy?)
    >
    Oh my mummy still exist.... but i got bored to death in the snakepit
    so i started some new chars to lighten it up a bit.... macroing is
    sometimes somewhat boring to death....
    [well i already 'dug' out the complete level of snakepit5 and created a
    hallway with 'tomb' where the monsters can line up
    to be slain/drained/kicked in the ass several cool looking ways. makes it
    easyer to get all the stuff


    here a snip of what to get in the snakepit:

    Inventory:

    Hand weapons

    a - a +2,+2 vampiric glaive (weapon)

    well. do i get the healthpoints drained or is there only an additional
    draining ?

    Armour

    l - a +2 robepositive energy

    [i think this is a good one. it prevents me from being drained... but i dont
    think this is useful for me...]

    m - a +1 roberesistance (worn)

  3. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote in
    news:MSGID_2=3A240=2F2199.13=40fidonet_281d9ab1@fidonet.org:

    >> One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From
    >> Living Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.

    One of ADOM's classes (farmer) has the ability to make rations from
    corpses. However, it would be handy to be able to make them from
    *live* animals.

    > Hmmm... Meat rations that actually last would need all sorts of
    > treatment and perhaps seasoning, no? Sounds more like a Nethack
    > thingy (where they've got tinning kits and ice boxes and stuff).
    >
    > Maybe a spell? Or turn one of those useless misc items into
    > something that can do this.
    >
    > Afair you can fry stuff in Adom to make it last somewhat (or maybe
    > I'm hallucinating again), maybe that'd not be too 'outer space' for
    > Crawl.

    Yes, you can cook corpses/meat in ADOM, but it needs the required skill
    (or a sufficiently intense heat source).
  4. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    On Sat, 4 Sep 2004 16:03:00 GMT+1, Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall)
    wrote:

    >Andreas Huck <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> croaked:
    >
    >> Following Suggestion for Future Versions of Crawl:
    >
    >Side-info: these are usually called YANIs; Yet Anoter Nifty/New
    >Idea.

    Different groups use different terminology. Adomites write of RFEs
    (Requests For Enhancement), while neither rgr.angband nor rgr.misc has
    any standard form.

    >Afair you can fry stuff in Adom to make it last somewhat (or maybe
    >I'm hallucinating again), maybe that'd not be too 'outer space' for
    >Crawl.

    That's correct. Cooking skill is one method, but fire magic can also
    cook an Adomic corpse.

    >How about just using a flaming bladed weapon to make fried/burned
    >chunks, and freezing bladed weapons that make frozen chunks, that
    >both last twice the normal time (but maybe lose in nutrition)?

    Now that's a clever idea, but then one should add poisoning your food
    if you butcher with a venomous weapon. And distortion weapons would --
    what? Make mutagenic chunks?

    Richard Daniel Henry
    danhenry@inreach.com
  5. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Colin McCaughan <needle_ih8spammind@yahoo.co.uk> whined:
    > Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote

    >>> One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From
    >>> Living Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.

    > One of ADOM's classes (farmer) has the ability to make rations
    > from corpses. However, it would be handy to be able to make them
    > from *live* animals.

    That's Ultima 7 II, the spell of Vibrate will shake the meat out of
    the cows and leaves them alive and looking no worse for it. <g>

    Why would you want to do that in Crawl or Adom, though?

    >> Afair you can fry stuff in Adom to make it last somewhat (or
    >> maybe I'm hallucinating again), maybe that'd not be too 'outer
    >> space' for Crawl.

    > Yes, you can cook corpses/meat in ADOM, but it needs the required
    > skill (or a sufficiently intense heat source).

    Ah, nice. (Not hallucinating for once. :) )

    --
    Tina the Crawler of Death - a High Priest of the Ruling Negotiating Grievance
  6. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Andreas Huck <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> shouted:
    > Tina Hall wrote:

    Please add attributions (the stuff above) so people know who wrote
    what.

    >> Are you having food problems? (What happened to your mummy?)
    >>
    > Oh my mummy still exist.... but i got bored to death in the
    > snakepit so i started some new chars to lighten it up a bit....
    > macroing is sometimes somewhat boring to death....

    Heh. Understandable.

    > [well i already 'dug' out the complete level of snakepit5 and
    > created a hallway with 'tomb' where the monsters can line up
    > to be slain/drained/kicked in the ass several cool looking ways.
    > makes it easyer to get all the stuff

    With my SEEE I made little rooms around an up- and downstair each,
    on the lower levels. :) (Starting with a couple near the stairs to
    the Vaults, I think.)

    > a - a +2,+2 vampiric glaive (weapon)

    > well. do i get the healthpoints drained or is there only an
    > additional draining ?

    I don't know whether it works for a mummy (which is undead, after
    all), but normally it heals Hp when it drains a monster.

    > l - a +2 robepositive energy

    > [i think this is a good one. it prevents me from being drained...
    > but i dont think this is useful for me...]

    Normally it's a good thing, but as a mummy you already have the
    maximum resistance (3 levels) of this. Here (from a spoiler 'Loonie'
    posted a while ago, from his website, no idea about the adress, but
    I at least now know where I got the spoiler):

    [species relevant resistances]
    Fire Cold Elec. Poison Neg.Energy
    Mummy -1 +1 0 +1 +3

    > m - a +1 roberesistance (worn)

    >

    Indeed, it's a rather nice robe.

    --
    Tina the Boxer - the Champion of the Red Nefarious Grief
  7. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Tina Hall wrote:
    > Andreas Huck <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> shouted:

    <snip>

    >>well. do i get the healthpoints drained or is there only an
    >>additional draining ?
    >
    >
    > I don't know whether it works for a mummy (which is undead, after
    > all), but normally it heals Hp when it drains a monster.

    It also feeds you when you hit a monster, and speeds up your hunger rate
    by a bit.

    Graeme Dice
    --
    "Welcome aboard Southwest Flight XXX to YYY. To operate your
    seatbelt, insert the metal tab into the buckle, and pull tight.
    It works just like every other seatbelt and if you don't know how
    to operate one, you probably shouldn't be out in public unsupervised.
    In the event of a sudden loss of cabin pressure, oxygen masks will
    descend from the ceiling. Stop screaming, grab the mask, and pull
    it over your face. If you have a small child traveling with you,
    secure your mask before assisting with theirs. If you are traveling
    with two small children, decide now which one you love more."
  8. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    R. Dan Henry <danhenry@inreach.com> barked:
    > Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote:
    >> Andreas Huck <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> croaked:

    >>> Following Suggestion for Future Versions of Crawl:
    >>
    >> Side-info: these are usually called YANIs; Yet Anoter Nifty/New
    >> Idea.

    > Different groups use different terminology. Adomites write of
    > RFEs (Requests For Enhancement),

    Adom isn't free source, though. With that single programmer, a
    request might be better than just throwing around ideas... A YANI
    for a free source game could be picked up and realized by anyone.

    > while neither rgr.angband nor rgr.misc has any standard form.

    Rgr.misc doesn't have a FAQ either, afaik. The abbreviation has
    turned up before though, pointing it out does no harm, it's just
    trying to be helpful. (The OP hasn't been here all that long, after
    all...) It was only a 'btw, you might like to know this'.

    >> How about just using a flaming bladed weapon to make
    >> fried/burned chunks, and freezing bladed weapons that make
    >> frozen chunks, that both last twice the normal time (but maybe
    >> lose in nutrition)?

    > Now that's a clever idea, but then one should add poisoning your
    > food if you butcher with a venomous weapon.

    Heh, good idea.

    > And distortion weapons would -- what? Make mutagenic chunks?

    Sounds good, but could be abused I think. Weapons of distortion seem
    pretty popular, anyway, and if you're wielding one already, this is
    like a free Alter Self spell. The only drawback is that you don't
    get any normal food without pesky unwielding of the distortion
    weapon. (Eating mutagenic chunks doesn't look like they give any
    nutrition, or is it just very little?)

    Instead it could just be a pest to use them to cut something up,
    because they warp the space around each new chunk, so it could
    appear anwhere on the level. Only a percentage of the result being a
    mutagenic chunk could make this rather adventurous. (Well, they
    could be tagged as 'glowing', I suppose, but that would be out of
    character for Crawl.)

    (I think a weapon of crushing should be able to make puree, at
    least. If you're strong enough, you should be able to turn a yak
    into chunks with a hammer, anyway. But I don't think this idea will
    catch on. <g>)

    Anyway, there are other brands that could have interesting effects,
    here are some suggestions (I list them all for completeness). Since
    it might be difficult to tell them all apart (and all you need for
    that is a good memory), I'll add some suggested tags for the chunks
    (though actually telling the player anything is out of character for
    Crawl).

    'Contaminated' means it might make you 'sick', not that it's rotten.

    Flaming (fried)
    Fries chunks so they last twice as long, at a cost of a quarter of
    the nutrition (half if that's not enough).

    Freezing (frozen):
    Freezes chunks so they last twice as long, at a cost of a quarter of
    the nutrition (half if that's not enough).

    Holy wrath (pure or clean):
    Exerts its wrath on any bacteria that might creep into the chunks;
    uncontaminates every food and makes fresh chunks from rotten
    corpses.

    Electrocution (shocked):
    Fries better than simply flaming, so they lasts twice as long as
    'flamed' chunks, while costing only the same nutrition as frying.

    Orc slaying (pure or clean):
    Uncontaminates orcish (and orc-related; all the stuff it fights
    better) chunks. (It slays all 'orc' specific bits in the food...)

    Venom (poisoned):
    Poisons chunks, no problem when you're poison resistant. (Same as
    chunks from kobolds or bees.)

    Protection (everlasting?):
    Actually makes the food last forever.

    Draining (none):
    You get only half as many chunks as you'd otherwise get. (The food
    shrivels as you cut it.)

    Speed:
    ?

    Crushing:
    (That's blunt objects...)

    Slicing (none):
    Makes very neat chunks. <g> Random chance of getting an animal skin
    out of it, with a very small chance (1%?) of it having up to a
    quarter of the weapons plusses, could double the chance (or
    guarantee) getting hides from monsters that might leave a hide
    anyway (no plusses added to these).

    Piercing:
    Too bad you don't have a campfire handy, otherwise you could use it
    to grill the food over open fire. ;) (Not sure, is there any weapon
    of piercing that _can_ cut chunks?)

    Chopping (none):
    As a butcher's weapon, you get 1.5 as many chunks as you'd otherwise
    get.

    Vampiric (stale):
    Drains all nutrition (or at least half).

    Disruption:
    (Only maces and great maces that can have this.)

    Pain (rotten):
    Think stomachache, makes the chunks end up rotten straight away.
    Would be a good thing for ghouls I guess.

    Distortion (none/glowing):
    Mutagenic chunks, or chunks where a quarter vanishes, 1/2 end up
    anywhere on the level, and 1/8 of any of them turn out mutagenic.

    Reaching:
    ?

    Not sure whether the following should have any effect...

    Orcish (none):
    Slightly more chunks. (1 more chunk at a 5% chance, otherwise - if
    you add 5% of the resulting chunks - you'd never see any effect...)

    Elven (delicate):
    Slightly less contaminated chunks. (Some 5% chance again.)

    Dwarven (robust):
    Lasts slightly longer. (+5% of the normal time)

    --
    Tina the Basher - the Favourite Plaything of the Romantic Nebulous Glory
  9. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Well. Dont forget to what happens if u had bad targeting:

    ---- just a free guess
    you start to dissect [whatever]
    you fail.
    you cut yourself in chunks of human meat


    > Holy wrath (pure or clean):
    > Exerts its wrath on any bacteria that might creep into the chunks;
    > uncontaminates every food and makes fresh chunks from rotten
    > corpses.
  10. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    On Mon, 6 Sep 2004 00:28:00 GMT+1, Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall)
    wrote:

    >R. Dan Henry <danhenry@inreach.com> barked:
    >> Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote:
    >>> Andreas Huck <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> croaked:
    >
    >>>> Following Suggestion for Future Versions of Crawl:
    >>>
    >>> Side-info: these are usually called YANIs; Yet Anoter Nifty/New
    >>> Idea.
    >
    >> Different groups use different terminology. Adomites write of
    >> RFEs (Requests For Enhancement),
    >
    >Adom isn't free source, though. With that single programmer, a
    >request might be better than just throwing around ideas... A YANI
    >for a free source game could be picked up and realized by anyone.

    Well, now it is pretty clear ADOM is completely dead and TB is only
    working on JADE, so RFEs for ADOM are a waste of time. ADOM is dead.

    >> while neither rgr.angband nor rgr.misc has any standard form.
    >
    >Rgr.misc doesn't have a FAQ either, afaik. The abbreviation has
    >turned up before though, pointing it out does no harm, it's just
    >trying to be helpful. (The OP hasn't been here all that long, after
    >all...) It was only a 'btw, you might like to know this'.

    "Suggestion" doesn't take much longer to type and is clearer. I'd have
    to think about YANI.

    >Holy wrath (pure or clean):
    >Exerts its wrath on any bacteria that might creep into the chunks;
    >uncontaminates every food and makes fresh chunks from rotten
    >corpses.

    Okay, I can buy into that. Maybe it should create fewer chunks from
    "contaminated" corpses, burning away the "bad" ones? Useful, but less
    powerful and holy wrath is very good already.

    >Orc slaying (pure or clean):
    >Uncontaminates orcish (and orc-related; all the stuff it fights
    >better) chunks. (It slays all 'orc' specific bits in the food...)

    I was thinking it might totally hack up orcs, leaving no useful chunks
    (you can't really carry a puree). Other than orcs, does it actually
    slay anything else?

    >Protection (everlasting?):
    >Actually makes the food last forever.

    Too powerful as well as not having a logical connection to deflecting
    blows.

    >Draining (none):
    >You get only half as many chunks as you'd otherwise get. (The food
    >shrivels as you cut it.)

    Okay.

    >Speed:
    >?

    Slicing chunks takes half the time.

    >Slicing (none):
    >Makes very neat chunks. <g> Random chance of getting an animal skin
    >out of it, with a very small chance (1%?) of it having up to a
    >quarter of the weapons plusses, could double the chance (or
    >guarantee) getting hides from monsters that might leave a hide
    >anyway (no plusses added to these).

    Okay, I suppose that's possible (for animal corpses only). I think it
    should have a chance of providing an extra chunk (more efficient
    butchering).

    >Chopping (none):
    >As a butcher's weapon, you get 1.5 as many chunks as you'd otherwise
    >get.

    Okay, you thought of that for chopping, but it makes sense to me for
    slicing as well (especially as its the same brand with just a
    different name displayed).

    >Vampiric (stale):
    >Drains all nutrition (or at least half).

    But gives you a quarter of that nutrition immediately upon cutting the
    chunks.

    >Pain (rotten):
    >Think stomachache, makes the chunks end up rotten straight away.
    >Would be a good thing for ghouls I guess.

    I like this idea for the usefulness to ghouls.

    >Reaching:
    >?

    Cut up corpses from a distance?

    >Not sure whether the following should have any effect...

    Racial weapons, no, I wouldn't think so. That's just different
    manufacturing and design; you need magic to see an effect on the level
    of carving meat.

    Richard Daniel Henry
    danhenry@inreach.com
  11. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    "Andreas Huck" <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> wrote in message
    news:chbv24$tpj$06$1@news.t-online.com...
    > Hiho
    >
    > Following Suggestion for Future Versions of Crawl:
    >
    > One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From Living
    > Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.

    I'm just replying generally to the whole thread, I guess, but I think
    messing with the food system is a bad idea. Starvation has never really
    been a problem for me, and adding a cooking skill or having weapon brands
    do different things to corpses just seems like it'd unnecessarily
    complicate things.

    The problem with putting these things in is that 1) you'd need to balance
    things, somehow: if you can make meat rations from yaks, presumably you'd
    have to either make chunks less nutritive, or deal with the fact that now
    you're going to need to train your cooking skill, which would I can't
    imagine would be much fun. And 2) if you put stuff like these in, people
    are going to want to take advantage of them, which means that the late game
    is probably going to involve a lot of searching for daggers of distortion
    to make mutagenic chunks. Or you'll need 6 weapons to feed yourself, so
    you can make corpses from Orcs and eat necrophages safely, etc.

    A better idea might just be a "Knife of Butchering" as a very rare brand
    only on knives (or maybe an artifact?) that could turn clean meat into
    rations. If it's very rare, it wouldn't be unbalancing. Still, I don't
    think it's necessary.

    --
    Jeremey
  12. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    R. Dan Henry <danhenry@inreach.com> growled:
    > Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote:

    >> Adom isn't free source, though. With that single programmer, a
    >> request might be better than just throwing around ideas... A
    >> YANI for a free source game could be picked up and realized by
    >> anyone.

    > Well, now it is pretty clear ADOM is completely dead and TB is
    > only working on JADE, so RFEs for ADOM are a waste of time. ADOM
    > is dead.

    What's JADE? And why doesn't he simply release the source if he's no
    longer interested?

    >> Holy wrath (pure or clean): Exerts its wrath on any bacteria that
    >> might creep into the chunks; uncontaminates every food and makes
    >> fresh chunks from rotten corpses.

    > Okay, I can buy into that. Maybe it should create fewer chunks
    > from "contaminated" corpses, burning away the "bad" ones?

    Makes sense.

    >> Orc slaying (pure or clean):
    >> Uncontaminates orcish (and orc-related; all the stuff it fights
    >> better) chunks. (It slays all 'orc' specific bits in the
    >> food...)

    > I was thinking it might totally hack up orcs, leaving no useful
    > chunks (you can't really carry a puree).

    <g>
    It's not all that useful a brand, though, so a useful trait that
    works well with its normal trait seems sensible. Normally I'd not
    consider dragging this thing around, not even to fight orcs, because
    whatever my main weapon is, is more all-around useful...

    > Other than orcs, does it actually slay anything else?

    I got the impression (from the description in the game, I think)
    that it goes for ogre and similar, too.

    >> Protection (everlasting?): Actually makes the food last forever.

    > Too powerful as well as not having a logical connection to
    > deflecting blows.

    It's got a logical connection to 'protection'. I seem to be the only
    one who occasionally drags a weapon of protection around for
    emergencies. People say '+5 AC does not matter much, better have a
    mighty punch', but with this you'd have an extra reason...

    >> Speed:
    >> ?

    > Slicing chunks takes half the time.

    I thought of something else: The chunks rot twice as fast as
    normally. :) (Can't have all good ones, that'd be unbalancing.)

    >> Slicing (none):
    >> Makes very neat chunks. <g> Random chance of getting an animal
    >> skin out of it, with a very small chance (1%?) of it having up
    >> to a quarter of the weapons plusses, could double the chance (or
    >> guarantee) getting hides from monsters that might leave a hide
    >> anyway (no plusses added to these).

    > Okay, I suppose that's possible (for animal corpses only).

    Human skins might be fun for the less nice character types. <g>

    > I think it should have a chance of providing an extra chunk (more
    > efficient butchering).

    Maybe the blade is more concerned with making neat chunks than
    efficient chunks. :)

    If you have a dead pig and would have to cut up a bunch of identical
    looking 'Schnitzel' (whatever _do_ you call them in English?), you'd
    actually lose good meat.

    >> Chopping (none):
    >> As a butcher's weapon, you get 1.5 as many chunks as you'd
    >> otherwise get.

    > Okay, you thought of that for chopping, but it makes sense to me
    > for slicing as well (especially as its the same brand with just a
    > different name displayed).

    I like variety. :)

    >> Vampiric (stale):
    >> Drains all nutrition (or at least half).

    > But gives you a quarter of that nutrition immediately upon
    > cutting the chunks.

    Makes sense. I think less would be better, though. Vampiric weapons
    are already quite nice.

    >> Reaching:
    >> ?

    > Cut up corpses from a distance?

    Makes sense, but wouldn't that be too complicated? And where's the
    point? Unless you have that Apportation spell, but I still fail to
    see the advantage over just walking to it; if there's monsters
    around they won't sit still while you cut up the meat.

    Reaching could be interpreted as stretching, but I don't know what
    effect that could produce that something else doesn't already.

    >> Not sure whether the following should have any effect...

    > Racial weapons, no, I wouldn't think so. That's just different
    > manufacturing and design; you need magic to see an effect on the
    > level of carving meat.

    Right.

    --
    Tina the Grand Master - a High Priest of the Remotely Napping Ghost
  13. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote:
    >R. Dan Henry <danhenry@inreach.com> growled:
    >> Tina_Hall@kruemel.org (Tina Hall) wrote:
    >
    >>> Adom isn't free source, though. With that single programmer, a
    >>> request might be better than just throwing around ideas... A
    >>> YANI for a free source game could be picked up and realized by
    >>> anyone.
    >
    >> Well, now it is pretty clear ADOM is completely dead and TB is
    >> only working on JADE, so RFEs for ADOM are a waste of time. ADOM
    >> is dead.
    >
    >What's JADE? And why doesn't he simply release the source if he's no
    >longer interested?

    JADE is the Java ADom Engine, I believe.

    The second is one of those questions that has been beaten into a thin
    red paste on rgr.adom. Basically: Thomas does not want ADOM variants to
    exist. At least one person has said that if the source is released,
    they will release a variant, regardless of any restrictive licences
    Thomas places on it. Hence, Thomas will not release the source code to
    ADOM.
    --
    Martin Read - my opinions are my own. share them if you wish.
  14. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    "Jeremey Wilson" <noaddressgiven@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<Uk1%c.685$o76.290@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com>...
    > "Andreas Huck" <blaaaaaaaa@t-online.de> wrote in message
    > news:chbv24$tpj$06$1@news.t-online.com...

    > A better idea might just be a "Knife of Butchering" as a very rare brand
    > only on knives (or maybe an artifact?) that could turn clean meat into
    > rations. If it's very rare, it wouldn't be unbalancing. Still, I don't
    > think it's necessary.

    How 'bout having weapons of Electrocution cook food for you. i.e more
    nutruious and lasts longer.
  15. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Cyberdave <det14us@yahoo.com> wrote:
    >How 'bout having weapons of Electrocution cook food for you. i.e more
    >nutruious and lasts longer.



    I think the idea of cooking as a YANI is best handled with an extract from
    Ada Lovelace's correspondence;

    "Charles, I am much taken with your idea for a diverfion utilifing the
    Difference Engine. I am sure that the challenges you outline - strange
    monfters and deadly traps alike - will provide the operator with many
    hours of harmless amufement. However, if I might offer one small
    suggeftion, I feel the experience could be greatly enchanced if the
    operator's alter-ego could prepare tafty repafts with the aid of fire or
    flame and simple cooking implements such as grace any kitchen in England.

    I myfelf propofe a similar diverfion where the operator is challenged to
    guide a difc or spherelike being through a labyrinth confuming small dots
    while purfued by malicious ghofts [...] "
    --
    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Distortion Field!
  16. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> roared:
    > Cyberdave <det14us@yahoo.com> wrote:

    >> How 'bout having weapons of Electrocution cook food for you. i.e
    >> more nutruious and lasts longer.

    >

    > I think the idea of cooking as a YANI is best handled with an
    > extract from Ada Lovelace's correspondence;

    <snip obscure and hard to read text>

    What do you actually mean to say with it, though?

    --
    Tina the Avatar - the Champion of the Rampant Neon Grief
  17. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc,rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

    I'm always for more reality;
    [YANI]
    in reality, "food poisoning" may be due to active bacteria due to
    inadequately cooked food, rarely, heat-resistant bacterial spores, or
    heat stable toxin formed by active bacteria before cooking even
    though the bacteria die in cooking,( or, of course heat resistant
    toxins naturally found in the food while living),, (for you nethackers
    with your home tinning kits, botulinum toxin, great for cosmetic
    !oparalysis, btw, is broken down by cooking, but C. botulinum only
    grows anaerobically)

    cooking is a function to sterilize food and possibly eliminate toxins;
    freezing or preserving keeps it sterilized, but do little to eliminate
    existing toxin in food, and are less effective at killing bacteria
    than heat. freezing requires a thawing period before it can be eaten
    (a period of resumed but reduced growth).

    so; a cooking skill would help one to treat foods in these ways to
    prevent food poisoning,butchering corpses to remove existing toxicity
    (venom glands in scorpion's tail, for example), and recognizing the
    edibility of foods.

    Here's a model for food:
    a food/corpse has a chance per turn (which increases with its age) to
    become contaminated (and/or, with a smaller probability, poisoned, if
    corpse isn't already poisonous/contaminated). butchering has a chance
    to remove contamination, dependent on cooking skill and age of corpse,
    but the age of the corpse can still recontaminate it next turn,per the
    previous statement. cooking may also remove contamination/poisoning,
    dependent on skill, AND reduces the chance the meat will be
    recontaminated (effectively reducing meat's age, dependent on skill).
    however, cooking may also burn the food (it's useless, the item is
    removed from game), and can only be done once (cooked switch is set).
    freezing/preserving decrease the rate food ages dependent on cooking
    skill, and can reduce age one time per item, again, dependent on
    cooking skill. However, frozen food thaws over time, and must thaw
    before eating (for most characters,except say, in ice form),
    preservation is permanent, but preservatives are rare (salt deposits
    in rocks, herbs from shops or cooking fires?)


    however, cooking generally requires a heat source, fire in an enclosed
    space is risky (asphyxiation, smoke in an already dim environment) and
    without magic, requires a fuel source (clubs?) and an ignition source.
    smell of cooking food can attract unwanted guests, smoke can attract
    intelligent creatures.
    smell of rotting food is more likely to attract animals however.

    firewood is rare however, as it must be imported from the surface.
    there are other reasons wood might be present in the dungeon however;


    I'd like to see more scenery in my roguelikes, which could include
    wooden items. Assuming these dungeons are part natural caves, part
    artificial construction by different inhabitants over hundreds
    (thousands?) of years, there might be : stone or wooden columns or
    tunnel supports (esp. in mines) with risk of local cave-in if
    disturbed (possibile scenarios: digging wands, pickaxes or kicking in
    nethack, you or large creature snatching the column as a large club or
    for firewood, burning the column if wood, heating or freezing if
    stone, or Lee's rapid deconstruction in crawl, ). also doors could
    make for firewood, if wooden.
    cave-in's would be proportional in effect to the amount of open area
    around, not the usual nethack cave in during a crashed game. like a
    previous poster, i agree that mining a tunnel and safely supporting it
    are probably too time intensive for a roguelike action game, and so i
    don't propose a mining skill (besides, what if you got too good at
    mining and couldn't collapse the tunnel when you wanted too?)

    other occasional scenery: functional rooms/areas : wells (for water)

    maybe the occasional underground stream (in addition to the obligatory
    pools currently found, and including deep and shallow points that can
    be crossed, )

    an rare wizard's library [wooden bookshelves, flammable books, maybe
    an occasional spellbook, though even in these rare rooms, such a
    valuable item would probably have been removed, unless the library is
    still in active use], crypts,
    dens (residences of subterranean inhabitants),
    shops should normally occur only in well developed areas. who opens a
    shop in a dungeon anyway?
    Armories would have stored weapons, but locate only in inhabited
    levels, and dungeons could have a few weapons, and locate in
    inhabited or uninhabited levels, though uninhabited areas should
    mostly already have been scavenged of most valuables. dungeons might
    also have prisoners to free, (in NH, there are lockpicks)

    most of all, these places should be DARK, without a light source or
    infravision. the first level could have ambient light, the second
    level might have light more likely near the upstairs, rooms in lower
    levels could rarely have shafts to the surface to give some light
    (incidentally, ventilation for cooking), and inhabited areas might
    have torches (to use for cooking/ignition), as well as cooking fires
    (even orcs gotta eat)

    on the whole, wood is probably rare enough in uninhabited areas, and
    inhabited areas would be guarded enough, wood should be heavy enough,
    and cooking should be time intensive enough (step away to fight, food
    burns...), that cooking wouldn't be too unbalanced.
  18. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Tina Hall <Tina_Hall@kruemel.org> wrote:
    >David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> roared:
    >>Cyberdave <det14us@yahoo.com> wrote:
    >>>How 'bout having weapons of Electrocution cook food for you. i.e
    >>>more nutruious and lasts longer.
    >>
    >>I think the idea of cooking as a YANI is best handled with an
    >>extract from Ada Lovelace's correspondence;
    ><snip obscure and hard to read text>
    >What do you actually mean to say with it, though?

    This shouldn't need explained, but "for God's sake stop suggesting cooking
    as a new idea in roguelikes, people."

    It achieves this through exaggeration, by implying that the idea is nearly
    as old as the idea of the programmable computer.
    --
    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Kill the tomato!
  19. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc,rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

    Jason Northrup <jasonnorthrup@yahoo.com> wrote:
    >I'm always for more reality;

    Then you should shun roguelikes, since a big hole in the ground full of
    physically impossible monsters that don't eat anything and loot just lying
    around is highly unrealistic.

    The argument from realism is preposterous nonsense.

    >[YANI]

    I see the Lovelace quote was too subtle.

    COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.
    --
    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Distortion Field!
  20. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc,rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

    "David Damerell" <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote in message
    news:rdw*ZlMvq@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk...
    > Jason Northrup <jasonnorthrup@yahoo.com> wrote:
    > >I'm always for more reality;
    >
    > Then you should shun roguelikes, since a big hole in the ground full of
    > physically impossible monsters that don't eat anything and loot just lying
    > around is highly unrealistic.

    Somebody's never been to LA! Well, except for the loot. That's mostly behind
    gates.

    >
    > COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.

    Prostitution, you're thinking of. Though cooking's pretty old.

    --
    Jeremey
  21. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc,rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

    In article <5ug6d.1271$Rf1.1234@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com>, Jeremey Wilson wrote:
    >
    > "David Damerell" <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote in message
    > news:rdw*ZlMvq@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk...

    >> COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.
    >
    > Prostitution, you're thinking of. Though cooking's pretty old.

    in terms of downstream niche construction, cooking is probably the
    most evolutionarily important invention in hominid prehistory.

    --
    ru
  22. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    "Jason Northrup" <jasonnorthrup@yahoo.com> wrote:

    [cooking YANI]

    Don't people mostly come to these games to get
    _away_ from the world of cooking, cleaning, earning
    a living and such? I know "The Sims" are making
    someone rich putting all that stuff back into game
    playing, but it seems inappropriate in a dungeon
    crawl game.

    xanthian.


    --
    Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
  23. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc,rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

    David Damerell puts out:


    > COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.

    ADOM has cooking. Not very useful, it is almost the same as zap a wand of fire
    on a corpse.

    []s
    --
    Chaos Master®, posting from Brazil.
    "People told me I can't dress like a fairy.
    I say, I'm in a rock band and I can do what the hell I want!"
    -- Amy Lee

    The Evanescen(t/ce) HP: http://marreka.no-ip.com
  24. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    >
    > One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From Living
    > Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.
    >

    Hmm i apologize for this suggestion. just treat it as it was never said.
  25. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> buzzed:

    > COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.

    You do know that the 'N' in 'YANI' does not have to stand for 'new',
    right?

    --
    Tina the Caller - a Believer of the Ruddy Noxious Gun
  26. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Kent Paul Dolan <xanthian@well.com> roared:

    > [cooking YANI]

    > Don't people mostly come to these games to get _away_ from the
    > world of cooking, cleaning, earning a living and such?

    I think the idea is not (mainly) to add realism but something that
    makes a character's life a little better, or just add some
    interesting fun/pasttime to the game, but preferably both.

    Take Nethack, where you can do all sorts of weird stuff. Saddles for
    example. Saddles are a real life thing, and your knight starts with
    a saddled pony. Where it diverges from real life (apart from half
    your knights getting killed when they actually try to mount the pony
    on turn one) is that the same saddle-fits-all-even-jabberwocks can
    later be tied to your shiny silver dragon, on which you can gallop
    up to the Castle and play your favorite nymph a song, who might then
    lower the drawbridge and chase out all the critics that don't quite
    agree with your taste in music. ;)

    > I know "The Sims" are making someone rich putting all that stuff
    > back into game playing,

    Know next to nothing about them (and only know what they are because
    I was bored in front of the TV the other day, and all European NBC
    seems to broadcast is people sitting in front of some computer doing
    stuff with them, or alternately other people laying/reading cards
    for callers , a true shame that, it's both in German, too, they
    should show some undubbed Merkian series instead). Can't say I'm
    impressed with what I saw there. Lousy graphic that just interferes
    with any game that might be hidden in it, again.

    > but it seems inappropriate in a dungeon crawl game.

    Oh, I'd not mind a proper house or something (but not like in
    Angband where you can't properly store stuff). I make myself quite
    at home in the Temple, too, with things spread out and piled into
    Bermuda piles almost like at home. <g>

    Which had me stare in wonder and giggle. The first caller of
    that show sounded rather fake, too. A highlight was a lady that had
    'planet cards' "For the 10 planets." Eh, right.

    --
    Tina the Arsonist - the Favourite Plaything of the Roman Necromantic Glacier
  27. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Tina Hall <Tina_Hall@kruemel.org> wrote:
    >David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> buzzed:
    >>COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.
    >You do know that the 'N' in 'YANI' does not have to stand for 'new',
    >right?

    Any other expansion is a flagrant backronym.
    --
    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> flcl?
  28. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc,rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

    "Jeremey Wilson" <noaddressgiven@yahoo.com> wrote in
    news:5ug6d.1271$Rf1.1234@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com:

    >
    > "David Damerell" <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote in
    > message news:rdw*ZlMvq@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk...
    >> Jason Northrup <jasonnorthrup@yahoo.com> wrote:
    >> >I'm always for more reality;
    <snip>
    >>
    >> COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.
    >
    > Prostitution, you're thinking of. Though cooking's pretty old.
    >
    Killing is older.


    --
    Kizutsuite 'ta ano hi kara
  29. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> roared:
    > Tina Hall <Tina_Hall@kruemel.org> wrote:
    >> David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> buzzed:

    >>> COOKING IS NOT A NEW IDEA. IT IS JUST ABOUT THE OLDEST IDEA.
    >> You do know that the 'N' in 'YANI' does not have to stand for
    >> 'new', right?

    > Any other expansion is a flagrant backronym.

    What, like Random Nethack God for RNG in rgrn? How could anyone ever
    commit such an atrocity!?

    --
    Tina the Bludgeoner - a Believer of the Reaping Normal Gale
  30. Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

    Andreas Huck <blaaaaaa@t-online.de> whined:

    >> One should be able to create something like 'Meat Rations' From
    >> Living Things like 'Sheeps' 'Yaks' and whatever.

    > Hmm i apologize for this suggestion. just treat it as it was
    > never said.

    ;)

    Too late. Usenet posts take on a life of their own, whatever happens
    to them isn't your fault, so don't worry about it. <g>

    --
    Tina the Twirler - a High Priest of the Roguelike Napping Goblin
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