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G4 breakdown

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March 1, 2001 12:54:28 AM

A little of topic, but might be interesting to this forum. thanks for understanding fredi.

The guys from Apple ran me over a new 733 G4 w/ Geforce3 and OS 9.1

A few changes to existing G4 design

One 5.25 drive bay (used by DVD-R/CDRW) so no second CDROM to copy CD's

They moved power suppy cord from swing down door assembly so side can be opened while plugged in. before you used to have to unplug unit to open.

only 1 (unused) external 3.5 drive bay, no face plate or options for (zip,jazz,slot CD,...) drive bay covers.

OS X will not install (build 4K72) on new G4's. I am supposed to get 4K73 tomorrow via download. kinda gay they build a machine so that you cannot load beta OS on it.

The CPU has very very large heat sink and what appears to be a huge 120mm fan case mouned directly over CPU. (nice design)

There is a place for one inernal hand drive and cable connector is present.

The gigabit ethernet doesnt have a SC connector. it uses the 10/100/1000 RJ45 connector w/ cat 5 (intel PWLA8490T)

There is no external speaker jack for connecting reguar speakers. you are forced to use USB speakers.

Onto the Geforce3, well its buggy. this machine has crashed several times and artifacts are getting annoying.

I will lose Geforce3 when I upgrade to OS X, I will lose DVD playback too.

In about 15 minutes I will have geforce3 ripped out and in a static bag OMW home to play with it in my PC.

Ill let you know tomorrow if it works, and if the detonator drivers work with it.

Ill post some pics of rather nice G4 case design, I like how they cool the CPU. Its a ATX mobo, wonder if my CUSL2-C will fit =P

More about : breakdown

March 1, 2001 2:17:40 AM

OSX doesn't support any of that?

"I think I brained my damage"
March 1, 2001 7:24:28 AM

We all know Apples are Crap. I like the idea what my system looks like and how many drives I can have. I have three cdroms drives one cdrw drive. 13 scsi hard drives 2 ide drives. And it easy upgraded.
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March 1, 2001 4:25:56 PM

Well, it deosent post =(

I believe its due to Apple firmware or Nvidia does not want this version going into PC platform.

Oh well.

What makes this more sad is that Apple has no options for larger case.

WTF are they thinking? everyone wants to buy external devices? everyone wants to pay 100 bucks extra for each device due to external housing cost?

I will play with this machine for a few days in OS X (FreeBSD Linux) compile crap made for FreeBSD. maybe race this against O2 R12k in photoshop filters and send t back to where it came from.
March 2, 2001 3:17:46 AM

fugger you're obviously into some heavy intensive graphics work. What is it exactly? Have you used 3dmax4 yet?

"I think I brained my damage"
March 2, 2001 4:45:10 PM

I know this is the anti-Apple site and all but....

It seems that as you're damning Apple for their 'poor' design flaws and such you seem to have forgotten that the version of hardware and software are still far from stable releases. Remember that OSX is cut several times a day and isn't in any way supported by Apple as a usuable, stable OS yet. I test Apple and MS stuff for my company. The 4k43 OSX wouldn't install on a Blue G3 but would on a Beige. Big deal. The 4k46 worked fine on both.

As for the GF3 I'm sure dozens of changes in the driver and the firmware will make it more usable for final release. I'd say you should consider yourself lucky to get to play with those kind of toys, Apple or not.

Am I the only person here who can use Microsoft and Apple and still be a normal fucntioning person? Sometimes I feel like these sites (and Mac sites) are the internet equivalant of Calvin peeing on a Chevy logo. Get over it.

Side note: the G4 still Has speaker outs. Apple just calls in the headphone jack.
March 2, 2001 5:35:12 PM

I am a Advanced Systems Integrator for SGI.

I used to be a service tech, now I do training and installs. even tho I still do some service calls.

I have 3D studio max 4 for PC. not for mac OS.

Apple OS X current release is 4K74 as of today and it will work on G4 w/ digital audio. but... no sound (wtf good is that headphone jack that is non standard connector(nothing fits)), no DVD, no OpenGL on video cards other than Radeon!!! GG on getting Geforce3.

Currently playing with apache, Ill attempt to install counterstike server later, gcc compiler is fubar on OS X,soundsprocket calls cause pauses, networking is still lacking alot even tho its FreeBSD Linux.
March 2, 2001 5:39:18 PM

FreeBSD and Linux are two seperate entities. Mac OS isn't based on Linux at all.

/Athlon-1.2GHz@1370MHz(137MHz*10)/Asus_A7V133/
Anonymous
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March 2, 2001 6:15:06 PM

Hmm, sounds nice. Pity about OSX beta not running correctly! It should ship pretty soon now anyway, and as for the GeForce3, I'm sure the drivers will be sorted for all OSes fairly quickly...

I heard that they were gonna release a 800MHz and 833MHz G3 pretty soon. That should be nice.

In any case, what more could you want, other than a DVD/CDRW? It can do everything two drives can simply by using a CD image on the hard disk. Sure, it takes twice as long, but I'd trade the looks of the mac for that time any day.

Sure you could have 3 CD-ROM drives, but what for? I never play CD Audio on my PC - it sounds bad compared with my $2000 Hi-fi which sits idley round the corner.

~ I'm not AMD biased, I just think their chips are better. ~
March 2, 2001 6:19:12 PM

AHAHAH, OS X is FreeBSD Linux!!
DO a little research =)

FreeBSD Linux with Apple GUI and support for sprockets.

OS X does run classic applications made for OS 9 and earlier.

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by FUGGER on 03/02/01 03:35 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
March 2, 2001 6:20:44 PM

I hate to point out these things, but the reason most people hate Macs is because they're such a pain.

There are hardly any choices for chip speed. The systems are barely upgradable compared to a PC. I haven't even seen a full tower Mac that I'd ever call worth the effort.

If you buy a Mac, you're basically buying a system that you never intend to upgrade. It'll sit there. It'll look pretty. And when it comes time for anything better, you've got to replace it entirely.

Meanwhile you're forced into using whatever hardware they decide a Mac is supposed to use. You get no freedom of choice. And often, the choices that are made for you are bad ones that don't meet your needs.

And, they're bloody expensive!

I used to use a Mac. I thought it was nifty. Then I got into PCs enough to actuall start doing things like upgrades. Now I wouldn't touch a Mac to save my life because they're just not worth the effort or money.

- Sanity is purely based on point-of-view.
March 5, 2001 11:15:28 AM

Yes, Mac OS X is based on the FreeBSD kernel. Not the linux kernel. They are not the same thing. One was an open source project created by Linus Torvald, built from the ground up based on UNIX, the other an open source project based on BSD. They have very different strengths, weaknesses, and development paths.

/Athlon-1.2GHz@1370MHz(137MHz*10)/Asus_A7V133/
March 5, 2001 7:12:40 PM

OS X is FreeBSD LinuX.. Is that too hard to understand

Thats like saying that KDE and GNOME DWM on Redhat linux no longer means its redhat linux. GG

Once AGAIN

OS X is FreeBSD Linux with Apple "DWM" interface w/ sprockets.

Your arguement is stupid "Yes, Mac OS X is based on the FreeBSD kernel. Not the linux kernel. They are not the same thing" You know nothing about UNIX/Linux so STFU already.
March 5, 2001 9:36:56 PM

Silver, of course those are faults of the mac, but regardless the mac is a more powerful computer. Unfortionately it's expensive to upgrade and the software is limited, but if there was more software (games) I'd go back to mac in a heartbeat. Maybe you haven't used Windows lately, but for the life of me I can't seem to get that OS to NOT mess up my harddrive. It's a friggen nightmare of an OS. I would use linux, but the same thing applies; I want to play games.

"I think I brained my damage"
March 6, 2001 11:37:53 AM

I'm afraid you are the clubie here. FreeBSD is NOT linux! Go read some History of Unix articles or books. Linux and BSD are two completely different projects that branched from Unix so long ago they cannot be considered the same. FreeBSD is not some Linux distribution, it has its own kernel that is very different than the Linux kernel, and many of its own programs and services unique to the BSD world. Saying FreeBSD Linux would be more like saying "I'm running the Redhat Slackware distribution" or "I'm running KDE Gnome as my window manager" or "Gimme a second, I'm going to boot up my Linux Solaris box"

/Athlon-1.2GHz@1370MHz(137MHz*10)/Asus_A7V133/
Anonymous
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March 6, 2001 5:49:08 PM

Soujourn is correct. FreeBSD and Linux are two different animals.

John Garrett
System Admin - www.elementk.com
Editor - Exploring Windows NT Professional
March 6, 2001 7:49:47 PM

FreeBSD uses Linux binaries,

Maybe too many years from seeing Caladra, redhat, Suse, and FreeBSD grouped in same catagory and force of habbit put FreeBSD and Linux in same sentance.

FreeBSD is said to run 90% of all Linux applications. Im yet to see a Linux app to run on all flavors.

More like calling a mac a PC.

Where this became a pissing contest was disputing OS X being FreeBSD based "Mac OS isn't based on Linux at all." yes it is. and yes it compiles Linux applications. to be honest, linux apps run better under FreeBSD than Redhat. performance wise.

I understand your point that, FreeBSD wants real bad to be Unix for X86. I believe SCO falls under this catagory too. SCO is less than favorable for compiling linux apps. at least in my experiance.

Ok, 2 different projects, but FreeBSD does run Linux apps and is Linux based compatability wise being abe to execute the same binaries. Only diff I can point out is HFS File system is slightly different. but after seeing a dozen diff file systems it was no supprise.

So when searching for applications for OS X, I look for FreeBSD Linux applications first to compile.

Dont get bent over the use of FreeBSD Linux in the same sentance.
Anonymous
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March 6, 2001 7:57:40 PM

FUGGER wrote:
Dont get bent over the use of FreeBSD Linux in the same sentance.

Wow, I didn't think I was getting bent out of shape when I said:
Soujourn is correct. FreeBSD and Linux are two different animals.

I guess I'll have to watch my tone next time.

John Garrett
System Admin - www.elementk.com
Editor - Exploring Windows NT Professional
March 6, 2001 8:12:49 PM

For those that care,

I pulled Geforce3, and running a Radeon 64DDR. There is no support for geforce3 under OS X.

Im running Beta 4K73 atm, with no sound.

Im considering pulling the processor out and checking resister packs on the bottom to see if there is any room to adjust the multiplier higher. if possible.

I have found a few webistes on overclocking the "sawtooth" 100Mhz versions but nothing on the 133Mhz "digital audio" versions.

Maybe in a week or two when I get bored with it Ill attempt overclocking.

Another thing thats odd, its the amount of wasted space on the motherboard. 60%+ is unused.

622mb memory bandwidth -+20 (poor memory perf)
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