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[Crawl] Patch update: multidrop

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Anonymous
December 19, 2004 9:32:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
multidrop.

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/crawl/crawl-patc...

A Windows binary is here:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...

Please note that this version of the patch should be considered
experimental. I have had very little time to test this beast (and I'm
hoping for bug reports :-)). If you're playing a great character,
back up your save files to guard against bugs, or stick with the old
version of the patch until you've composed your YAVP.

To use multidrop, choose (d)rop as usual, hit * for the inventory
listing, select multiple items and hit Enter.

Multidrop is interrupted by hitpoint loss, stat loss and
teleportation. It is not interrupted by being in line-of-sight of a
hostile monster. Also, the order of the drops is as displayed in the
inventory; it is not the order in which you select items to drop. If
you're facing a firedrake and are looking to drop scrolls, you should
stick with the old drop-one-by-one strategy.

Unrelated bugfixes:

1. Interlevel travel now suggests a sensible default depth when
you're trying to travel back to the main dungeon out of Hell or
its branches.

2. You can use Escape to dismiss the interlevel travel prompt for the
depth of the level to travel to.

As always, suggestions and bug reports are welcome.

Darshan
Anonymous
December 19, 2004 11:38:46 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic) multidrop.

What a wonderful (and unexpected) christmas gift! To be honest, I didn't
expect it at all, after the recent less optimistic postings about such a
patch. Even a message about simply starting to work on it would have
made me happy already... :-)

> Please note that this version of the patch should be considered
> experimental. I have had very little time to test this beast (and I'm
> hoping for bug reports :-)).

Thanks for the warning. Currently I've not as much time for playing as I
wished and my current top scorer simply doesn't want to die. As soon as
I made my last fatal mistake, it'll be the first thing to do next:
unpacking my shiny new christmas gift! :-)

> As always, suggestions and bug reports are welcome.

Not a bug report, rather a question: auto-pickup doesn't seem to work
with travel. Is this intended? At least in the case of gold piles it
wouldn't make much sense IMO...

Thanks and - (in the case of this being my last post this year)
Merry Christmas, everyone! :-)

Rubinstein
Anonymous
December 20, 2004 8:52:55 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
>> multidrop.

> What a wonderful (and unexpected) christmas gift! To be honest, I
> didn't expect it at all, after the recent less optimistic postings
> about such a patch.

Oh, I didn't notice anybody sounding less than optimistic. :-)

>> As always, suggestions and bug reports are welcome.

> Not a bug report, rather a question: auto-pickup doesn't seem to
> work with travel. Is this intended? At least in the case of gold
> piles it wouldn't make much sense IMO...

Well, I thought it made sense at the time... Iirc, it was intended
to prevent getting burdened during travel. It certainly doesn't make
sense for gold, but special-casing gold didn't look like a good idea
to me (correction: it wouldn't have looked like a good idea if I'd
thought about it).

Since travel now stops if you get burdened, I could just remove the
no-autopickup feature.

> Thanks and - (in the case of this being my last post this year)
> Merry Christmas, everyone! :-)

Merry Christmas!

Darshan
Related resources
Anonymous
December 20, 2004 12:33:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 7:32:00 AM bork 12/19/2004 bork bork:

> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
> multidrop.
>

> http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/crawl/crawl-patc...
>
> A Windows binary is here:
>
> http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...
>
> Please note that this version of the patch should be considered
> experimental. I have had very little time to test this beast (and I'm
> hoping for bug reports :-)). If you're playing a great character,
> back up your save files to guard against bugs, or stick with the old
> version of the patch until you've composed your YAVP.
>
> To use multidrop, choose (d)rop as usual, hit * for the inventory
> listing, select multiple items and hit Enter.
>
> Multidrop is interrupted by hitpoint loss, stat loss and
> teleportation. It is not interrupted by being in line-of-sight of a
> hostile monster. Also, the order of the drops is as displayed in the
> inventory; it is not the order in which you select items to drop. If
> you're facing a firedrake and are looking to drop scrolls, you should
> stick with the old drop-one-by-one strategy.
>
> Unrelated bugfixes:
>
> 1. Interlevel travel now suggests a sensible default depth when
> you're trying to travel back to the main dungeon out of Hell or
> its branches.
>
> 2. You can use Escape to dismiss the interlevel travel prompt for the
> depth of the level to travel to.
>
> As always, suggestions and bug reports are welcome.
>
> Darshan
Anonymous
December 20, 2004 12:33:34 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 7:32:00 AM bork 12/19/2004 bork bork:

> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
> multidrop.
>

:-O

:-O

We love you, Darshan!

Erik
Anonymous
December 21, 2004 5:29:35 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:

> A Windows binary is here:
>
> http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...

Angelfire doesn't support the link from outside. Those of us smart enough to
use Firefox but lazy enough to use Windows don't even get a message saying
what's going on (though I probably wasn't alone in being smart enough to make a
test run in IE and find out what was the problem).

Erik
Anonymous
December 21, 2004 12:53:27 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 7:32:00 AM bork 12/19/2004 bork bork:

> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
> multidrop.

Sad news... I just reproduced a showstopper (for me at least bug) on a second
computer, so I have the sad task of reporting it to you.

Environments where reproduced: Win2k Pro, WinXP Pro
Behavior: When Num Lock is off, pressing the direction keys while
spellcasting will lead to a "what a strange direction" message, rather than
casting in that direction. IIRC it causes an immediate fizzle as well.

Unfortunately I overwrote the old patch with the new one. Looks like I'll be
playing some other roguelike for a while, unless I miraculously dig up
another copy of the old patch. :`-|

Erik
Anonymous
December 21, 2004 12:53:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:

>> A Windows binary is here:

>> http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...

> Angelfire doesn't support the link from outside. Those of us smart
> enough to use Firefox but lazy enough to use Windows don't even
> get a message saying what's going on (though I probably wasn't
> alone in being smart enough to make a test run in IE and find out
> what was the problem).

You need to copy-paste the link into your browser's address bar so
that no referer header is added by the browser.

Alternatively, you could go to the main page and download it from
there:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest

Darshan
Anonymous
December 21, 2004 1:19:16 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:
> bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 7:32:00 AM bork 12/19/2004
> bork bork:

>> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
>> multidrop.

> Sad news... I just reproduced a showstopper (for me at least bug)
> on a second computer, so I have the sad task of reporting it to
> you.

> Environments where reproduced: Win2k Pro, WinXP Pro Behavior: When
> Num Lock is off, pressing the direction keys while spellcasting
> will lead to a "what a strange direction" message, rather than
> casting in that direction. IIRC it causes an immediate fizzle as
> well.

Aha, I suspected mangling the Win32 keyboard handling as cavalierly
as I did might cause problems. I'll be on it right away, thanks.

Using the hjkl keys exclusively does mean I can miss the numpad
issues. Whoops.

> Unfortunately I overwrote the old patch with the new one. Looks
> like I'll be playing some other roguelike for a while, unless I
> miraculously dig up another copy of the old patch. :`-|

Shouldn't take me too long to get the fix in place.

Darshan
Anonymous
December 21, 2004 1:56:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:

>> Sad news... I just reproduced a showstopper

> Aha, I suspected mangling the Win32 keyboard handling as
> cavalierly as I did might cause problems. I'll be on it right
> away, thanks.

Fixed, the patch is at:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/crawl/crawl-patc...

and the fixed Windows binary is at:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...

(Copy-paste the links instead of clicking on them to keep Angelfire
happy).

Darshan
Anonymous
December 23, 2004 12:17:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:

> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
> multidrop.

I noticed an undocumented feature that at first looks like a bug; in the
unlikely case that you neither remove it nor document it in future releases, I
figure I'll at least note it in this thread for anyone researching the
initially-confusing (at least it was for me) feature on Google Groups. What it
is is that if you enter a keystroke corresponding to the symbol for an item
type and you're on a page of the listing where that item type is present,
you'll select/deselect all items of that type.

Cute!

Erik
Anonymous
December 23, 2004 8:47:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
>> multidrop.

> I noticed an undocumented feature that at first looks like a bug;
> in the unlikely case that you neither remove it nor document it in
> future releases, I figure I'll at least note it in this thread for
> anyone researching the initially-confusing (at least it was for
> me) feature on Google Groups. What it is is that if you enter a
> keystroke corresponding to the symbol for an item type and you're
> on a page of the listing where that item type is present, you'll
> select/deselect all items of that type.

This is a NetHackism. I'll document it for the next release, when
I've made it possible to distinguish between rings and amulets
(currently both are selected by '=').

Another minor change that I haven't documented yet is that you can
scroll the inventory listing up and down using < and ; to page up
and > and ' (or the spacebar) to page down (on Windows and DOS you
can also use Page Up and Page Down, and use the up and down arrows
for single-line scrolling).

Darshan
Anonymous
December 24, 2004 8:53:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein wrote:

> Erik Piper wrote:
> > Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> >
> >> I've updated the ever-growing patch to include (very basic)
> >> multidrop.
> >
> > I noticed an undocumented feature that at first looks like a bug
>
> Why does it look like a bug in the first place? It's a very nice
> feature, thanks for mention it! ;-)

Heh, I thought somebody would ask that. I actually discovered it while I was
still getting used to the new interface, and prematurely pressed '?' "in order
to show the list again" when I was still in the list (because -- thank God! --
Darshan has removed the original behavior where a keystroke at the end of the
listing would kick you out of it). At first I thought the selection that then
occurred was random and unintended. Like I say, I'm slow. :-)

Oh BTW another feature that Darshan has been too modest to mention: you can
press number, item to drop only a certain number of a given item. This is
indicated in the list by a "#" sign instead of a plus for the given item.

And one quite minor ***bug report***: if you enter the list, press the letter
for an item you don't have (it's easy to test this with 'Z', since you usually
won't be carrying a 'Z'), then exit, you'll get a message stating "too many
items on this level, not dropping the item."

Erik
Anonymous
December 27, 2004 9:43:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:
> And one quite minor ***bug report***: if you enter the list, press
> the letter for an item you don't have (it's easy to test this with
> 'Z', since you usually won't be carrying a 'Z'), then exit, you'll
> get a message stating "too many items on this level, not dropping
> the item."

Should be fixed now, binary is up at:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...

Patch is at:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/crawl/crawl-patc...

Use the main page if you have problems getting at those links:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest


Other changes:

Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu to select which
items to pick up, which ought to be useful if you pile up lots of
stuff in a stash, or regularly raid labyrinths. Pickup remains
single-turn, of course.

Darshan
Anonymous
December 27, 2004 10:07:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> [snip latest patch, minor bug fix and:]
>
> Other changes:
>
> Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu to select which items
> to pick up, which ought to be useful if you pile up lots of stuff in a
> stash, or regularly raid labyrinths.

Wonderful, that was my last remaining wish! :-)

As a sidenote, do you remember my mysterious 'XXL'- crawl binaries? Even
more mysterious: the most recent binary is a little smaller now (6.3Mb
to 6.6Mb before), though still to large. I'm using gcc-3.4.3 (vanilla).
But why? Did you clean up some parts of the code? If not, it probably
was the 'hardened' version of gcc which I used to compile the slightly
larger version (just a guessing).

Also, I always get lots of compiler warnings about some declarations are
not for C++, but C/ObjC. Is this normal, can I ignore them? Or do I need
to invoke gcc with some special parameters?

Rubinstein
Anonymous
December 27, 2004 10:07:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
> As a sidenote, do you remember my mysterious 'XXL'- crawl
> binaries? Even more mysterious: the most recent binary is a little
> smaller now (6.3Mb to 6.6Mb before), though still to large. I'm
> using gcc-3.4.3 (vanilla). But why? Did you clean up some parts of
> the code?

No, although a cleanup is in the offing.

> Also, I always get lots of compiler warnings about some
> declarations are not for C++, but C/ObjC. Is this normal, can I
> ignore them? Or do I need to invoke gcc with some special
> parameters?

Could you mail me the warning noises you're seeing?

Darshan
Anonymous
December 27, 2004 11:30:47 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
>> As a sidenote, do you remember my mysterious 'XXL'- crawl
>> binaries?
>> [...]
> [...]
>> Also, I always get lots of compiler warnings about some declarations
>> are not for C++, but C/ObjC. Is this normal, can I ignore them? Or do
>> I need to invoke gcc with some special parameters?
>
> Could you mail me the warning noises you're seeing?

On the way (I hope your From header doesn't show an anti-spam fake
address). If it's too short (don't think so), tell me and I'll send you
more.

Rubinstein
Anonymous
December 28, 2004 9:18:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:

> Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu to select which
> items to pick up, which ought to be useful if you pile up lots of
> stuff in a stash, or regularly raid labyrinths. Pickup remains
> single-turn, of course.

Absolutely wonderful. The best Christmas gift I could wish for. :-)

Erik
Anonymous
December 28, 2004 10:47:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>
>> Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu...
>> [...]
>
> Absolutely wonderful. The best Christmas gift I could wish for. :-)
>
Now we finally recovered the real name of Sant Claus: Darshan Shaligram! :-)

Rubinstein
Anonymous
December 29, 2004 4:53:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote on Dec 18, 10:32 pm:

> To use multidrop, choose (d)rop as usual, hit * for the inventory
> listing, select multiple items and hit Enter.
Using Win98/2k, and you don't have to type *. Typing '?' works...
Anonymous
December 30, 2004 2:41:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
> Erik Piper wrote:
>> Darshan Shaligram wrote:

>>> Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu...
> >> [...]

>> Absolutely wonderful. The best Christmas gift I could wish for.
>> :-)

> Now we finally recovered the real name of Sant Claus: Darshan
> Shaligram! :-)

Do I get reindeer and a sleigh? :-)

I've made more minor tweaks to the patch, which, as ever, is up at:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/crawl/crawl-patc...

and a Windows binary at:

http://www.angelfire.com/trek/mazewest/binaries/dc400b2...

Changes:

1. The pickup and drop menus can now also be accessed by hitting ','
(in addition to * and ?).

2. The stash-tracker suffixes the level name to the stash
coordinates.

3. Travel now remembers the last square you attempted to travel to
on the current level; you can jump the cursor to the last travel
target by hitting any key that would normally start travel (one
of .,; or Enter). If the cursor is sitting on the player's
current position, it jumps to the last travel target; else
travel is started.

I'd be interested to hear whether #3 helps or hurts usability of the
travel interface.

Darshan
Anonymous
December 30, 2004 3:32:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> > Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
> >> Erik Piper wrote:
> >>> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> >
> >>>> Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu...
> >> >> [...]
> >
> >>> Absolutely wonderful. The best Christmas gift I could wish for.
> >>> :-)
> >
> >> Now we finally recovered the real name of Sant Claus: Darshan
> >> Shaligram! :-)
> >
> > Do I get reindeer and a sleigh? :-)
>
> You don't have? Makes me wonder... ;-)
>
> > [snip recent patch update]
> >
> > Changes:
>
> First impressions...
>
> > 1. The pickup and drop menus can now also be accessed by hitting
','
> > (in addition to * and ?).
>
> Why?
>

I am not used to how Crawl was
without multidrop, never got a
character that far to *have* to
drop lots of stuff, but, I find
it slightly annoying that there
is *no* normal way of accessing
your inventory when dropping
items. This makes dropping
*one* item a little more of a
task -- as you have to hit
enter to complete the task. I
was not aware of the patch, and
was playing the original b26.

There are many cool features
with the patch, especially
travel & autopickup of missles
fired. :) )
Anonymous
December 30, 2004 9:28:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
>> Erik Piper wrote:
>>> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>
>>>> Hitting * at the pickup prompt brings up a menu...
>> >> [...]
>
>>> Absolutely wonderful. The best Christmas gift I could wish for.
>>> :-)
>
>> Now we finally recovered the real name of Sant Claus: Darshan
>> Shaligram! :-)
>
> Do I get reindeer and a sleigh? :-)

You don't have? Makes me wonder... ;-)

> [snip recent patch update]
>
> Changes:

First impressions...

> 1. The pickup and drop menus can now also be accessed by hitting ','
> (in addition to * and ?).

Why?

> 2. The stash-tracker suffixes the level name to the stash
> coordinates.

Nice!

> 3. Travel now remembers the last square you attempted to travel to
> on the current level; you can jump the cursor to the last travel
> target by hitting any key that would normally start travel (one
> of .,; or Enter). If the cursor is sitting on the player's
> current position, it jumps to the last travel target; else
> travel is started.

But that is greeeeat! Just did a short test on a simple level and it
works. :-)
Now I'm really serious whether it also works with intertravel (when you
mark a location on your level which is only reachable by a walk through
the levels above or below). In this case the new function would be
particularly useful! I'll see very soon...

Rubinstein
Anonymous
December 31, 2004 9:50:21 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:

> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>> 1. The pickup and drop menus can now also be accessed by hitting
>> ',' (in addition to * and ?).

> Why?

I find it easier to hit , than * or ?. :-)

>> 3. Travel now remembers the last square you attempted to travel
>> to on the current level; you can jump the cursor to the last
>> travel target by hitting any key that would normally start
>> travel (one of .,; or Enter). If the cursor is sitting on the
>> player's current position, it jumps to the last travel target;
>> else travel is started.

> Now I'm really serious whether it also works with intertravel
> (when you mark a location on your level which is only reachable by
> a walk through the levels above or below).

No, travel forgets its target when you change levels, so if
you leave the level, it'll forget the location. It'll also forget
the location if you use Ctrl+O to explore or Ctrl+G for interlevel
travel, because those commands use travel as well, overwriting the
travel target you selected.

However, when you select a travel location that is not directly
accessible (perhaps because it's on a disconnected area of the
level), interlevel travel is invoked, and you can hit Ctrl+G and
Enter to resume interrupted interlevel travel.

Confused yet? :-)

Darshan
Anonymous
December 31, 2004 10:27:04 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"RecRanger" <spamphobia@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I find it slightly annoying that there is *no* normal way of
> accessing your inventory when dropping items. This makes dropping
> *one* item a little more of a task -- as you have to hit enter to
> complete the task.

True. I can't think of a clean solution to this without adding a
separate drop command, as Rubinstein suggested originally. Maybe I
should put in a Ctrl+D extended drop and return (d)rop to its
old behaviour. Thoughts, anyone?

> There are many cool features with the patch, especially travel &
> autopickup of missles fired. :) )

Glad you like it. :) 

Darshan
Anonymous
December 31, 2004 10:27:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"RecRanger" <spamphobia@yahoo.com> wrote:

> I find it slightly annoying that there is *no* normal way of
> accessing your inventory when dropping items. This makes dropping
> *one* item a little more of a task -- as you have to hit enter to
> complete the task.

True. I can't think of a clean solution to this without adding a
separate drop command, as Rubinstein suggested originally. Maybe I
should put in a Ctrl+D extended drop and return (d)rop to its
old behaviour. Thoughts, anyone?

> There are many cool features with the patch, especially travel &
> autopickup of missles fired. :) )

Glad you like it. :) 

Darshan
Anonymous
December 31, 2004 12:02:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> "RecRanger" <spamphobia@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> I find it slightly annoying that there is *no* normal way of
>> accessing your inventory when dropping items. This makes dropping
>> *one* item a little more of a task -- as you have to hit enter to
>> complete the task.
>
> True. I can't think of a clean solution to this without adding a
> separate drop command, as Rubinstein suggested originally. Maybe I
> should put in a Ctrl+D extended drop and return (d)rop to its
> old behaviour. Thoughts, anyone?

I would prefer Ctrl+D as a toggle key between old and new behaviour.
Otherwise the players who prefer the new behaviour could now complain
about everytime having to use a doublekey-command where a single was
before. This way everyone should get the best of both ways.

Rubinstein
Anonymous
December 31, 2004 1:07:53 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>> "RecRanger" <spamphobia@yahoo.com> wrote:

>>> I find it slightly annoying that there is *no* normal way of
>>> accessing your inventory when dropping items. This makes
>>> dropping *one* item a little more of a task -- as you have to
>>> hit enter to complete the task.

>> True. I can't think of a clean solution to this without adding a
>> separate drop command, as Rubinstein suggested originally. Maybe
>> I should put in a Ctrl+D extended drop and return (d)rop to its
>> old behaviour. Thoughts, anyone?

> I would prefer Ctrl+D as a toggle key between old and new
> behaviour. Otherwise the players who prefer the new behaviour
> could now complain about everytime having to use a
> doublekey-command where a single was before.

Ah, but what I'm proposing is that Ctrl+D directly bring up the
inventory menu, so you're saved the extra keystroke (hitting * or ?)
that's necessary with (d)rop.

Darshan
Anonymous
December 31, 2004 8:59:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
>
>>Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>>
>>>"RecRanger" <spamphobia@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>>>>I find it slightly annoying that there is *no* normal way of
>>>>accessing your inventory when dropping items. This makes
>>>>dropping *one* item a little more of a task -- as you have to
>>>>hit enter to complete the task.
>
>
>>>True. I can't think of a clean solution to this without adding a
>>>separate drop command, as Rubinstein suggested originally. Maybe
>>>I should put in a Ctrl+D extended drop and return (d)rop to its
>>>old behaviour. Thoughts, anyone?
>
>
>>I would prefer Ctrl+D as a toggle key between old and new
>>behaviour. Otherwise the players who prefer the new behaviour
>>could now complain about everytime having to use a
>>doublekey-command where a single was before.
>
>
> Ah, but what I'm proposing is that Ctrl+D directly bring up the
> inventory menu, so you're saved the extra keystroke (hitting * or ?)
> that's necessary with (d)rop.

Maybe I've missed something, but - why do you think the extra keystroke
would be needed in a 'toggled' version? The only difference I can see
you would always use (d)rop for both versions and Ctrl+D only once (if
at all, perhaps a default in init.txt for instance). I don't understand
why it should affect the basic behaviour of either drop version...

Rubinstein
Anonymous
January 1, 2005 12:40:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
>
>> Darshan Shaligram wrote:
>>> 1. The pickup and drop menus can now also be accessed by hitting
>>> ',' (in addition to * and ?).
>
>> Why?
>
> I find it easier to hit , than * or ?. :-)

How could I miss that?!
Of course it's much faster to hit ',' 2 times than ',' and '*' or '?'.
I've just found that pressing ',' 3 times in a row selects all items on
the current page. For what it's ever good for, I don't know. Maybe when
you're going to recycle *lots* (more than all other items together) of
rotten flesh and other yunk, you select all and deselect the rest.

Btw, I've never used the select all (of 1 page) function. I would
use it a lot, though, if it would listen to a set of keywords from
init.txt...
Imagine something like 'select_all_filter = rotten, cursed' and you
could clean up your inventory just with a triple ',' then.

>>> 3. Travel now remembers the last square you attempted to travel
>>> to on the current level; you can jump the cursor to the last
>>> travel target by hitting any key that would normally start
>>> travel (one of .,; or Enter). If the cursor is sitting on the
>>> player's current position, it jumps to the last travel target;
>>> else travel is started.
>
>> Now I'm really serious whether it also works with intertravel
>> (when you mark a location on your level which is only reachable by
>> a walk through the levels above or below).
>
> No, travel forgets its target when you change levels, so if
> you leave the level, it'll forget the location. It'll also forget
> the location if you use Ctrl+O to explore or Ctrl+G for interlevel
> travel, because those commands use travel as well, overwriting the
> travel target you selected.
>
> However, when you select a travel location that is not directly
> accessible (perhaps because it's on a disconnected area of the
> level), interlevel travel is invoked, and you can hit Ctrl+G and
> Enter to resume interrupted interlevel travel.
>
> Confused yet? :-)

Actually, yes! ;-)

If I got it right, in the first case you describe a scenary with a
'normal' travel started, but interrupted for a level change. A pretty
rare case I think, since why should you want to leave the level when you
selected a target on the same level (with direct access)?

The other case, with invoked interlevel travel, was exactly what I had
in mind and also the one bothering me all the time: when the interlevel
travel was interrupted on the _wrong_ level, I couldn't reselect my
former location.

Is Ctrl+G+Enter to resume interlevel travel a new one or did I just miss
it all the time?

Rubinstein
Anonymous
January 1, 2005 4:42:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

In article <Xns95D09EF45C2CCscintillagmailcom@130.133.1.4>,
Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
// Ah, but what I'm proposing is that Ctrl+D directly bring up the
// inventory menu, so you're saved the extra keystroke (hitting * or ?)
// that's necessary with (d)rop.

Truth is, I'd like to keep CTRL commands as meta-game commands. I think
the closest precedent here is with targeting, which does the shifting
at the prompt (not a special command for target any as opposed to
target friend/foe). Not sure I'm happy with ^D being used to bring
up the multidrop list there either, though... perhaps + is better
(it carries the mnemonic of additional items... * and ? should almost
certainly carry the old behaviours from the first prompt, and toggle
all and scrolls from the multidrop prompt after hitting d+).

Brent Ross
Anonymous
January 1, 2005 11:09:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Brent Ross wrote:

> In article <Xns95D09EF45C2CCscintillagmailcom@130.133.1.4>,
> Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
> // Ah, but what I'm proposing is that Ctrl+D directly bring up the
> // inventory menu, so you're saved the extra keystroke (hitting * or ?)
> // that's necessary with (d)rop.
>
> Truth is, I'd like to keep CTRL commands as meta-game commands. I think
> the closest precedent here is with targeting, which does the shifting
> at the prompt (not a special command for target any as opposed to
> target friend/foe). Not sure I'm happy with ^D being used to bring
> up the multidrop list there either, though... perhaps + is better
> (it carries the mnemonic of additional items... * and ? should almost
> certainly carry the old behaviours from the first prompt, and toggle
> all and scrolls from the multidrop prompt after hitting d+).
>
> Brent Ross

Conjurers tend to use + a lot for targetting -- although it's hard to say
without actually picking up such an interface and using it, I have visions of
(should I ever play a conjurer again ;-)) occasionally being dropped into the
multidrop menu because of a miscast or a misstroke, and being thoroughly
confused.

Personally, I don't mind multidrop being tied to 'd'... isn't this the kind of
thing init.txt was made for? Pretty please with cream and sugar on it?

---

Now for some (once again minor) *bug report* FUN!

* Bug or misfeature, this one kinda gets me: if you use multipickup and take
advantage of the (undocumented but expectable and, incidentally, marvelous)
partial-pickup feature, the item is no longer flagged as a dropped item, so the
next time you walk over it, you autopickup it if applicable. (You pick up a
pile of 3293 scrolls of remove curse. You collapse under the weight of your
belongings. You die...) Occasionally annoying when navigating one's stash-room.

* Well, this one too is not really so much a bug as a misfeature. If an letter
is not visible on the current page, but is valid, and you type it in the
multidrop interface, it's selected for dropping. So far so good. But this
feature works in some way separately from the rest of multidrop, and only holds
one letter. I often drop things based on my memory of what their letters are
from the reading the message buffer, and if they're all beyond the page
(generally this happens because I think they SHOULD be on the first page, but
they aren't), only the last one gets dropped, and I end up a little snorgled,
(which is the state of mind one enters when one goes to drop several things and
only drops the last one). Is there any chance the dropping of items not visible
on the current page of the listing can be unified with other types of dropping?

* I've "succeeded" in dropping a "buggy bola" a couple of times -- once I
thought I had a consistent repro by typing "?" and then leaving the screen, but
then I couldn't get repro again... I'll have my eyes out for this, but I figure
there's no harm in alerting you to it already now. (I always escaped rather
than dropping the buggy bola, one never knows what kind of insidious dancing
poisonous vorpal flaming weapon might come of that.)

BTW these are all from the second- or third-to-last build of the patch, so my
apologies if they're no longer relevant for the latest build.

Erik
Anonymous
January 2, 2005 1:19:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

In article <33oechF4148s4U1@individual.net>,
Erik Piper <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:
// Brent Ross wrote:
//
// > In article <Xns95D09EF45C2CCscintillagmailcom@130.133.1.4>,
// > Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
// > // Ah, but what I'm proposing is that Ctrl+D directly bring up the
// > // inventory menu, so you're saved the extra keystroke (hitting * or ?)
// > // that's necessary with (d)rop.
// >
// > Truth is, I'd like to keep CTRL commands as meta-game commands. I think
// > the closest precedent here is with targeting, which does the shifting
// > at the prompt (not a special command for target any as opposed to
// > target friend/foe). Not sure I'm happy with ^D being used to bring
// > up the multidrop list there either, though... perhaps + is better
// > (it carries the mnemonic of additional items... * and ? should almost
// > certainly carry the old behaviours from the first prompt, and toggle
// > all and scrolls from the multidrop prompt after hitting d+).
// >
// > Brent Ross
//
// Conjurers tend to use + a lot for targetting -- although it's hard to say
// without actually picking up such an interface and using it, I have visions of
// (should I ever play a conjurer again ;-)) occasionally being dropped into the
// multidrop menu because of a miscast or a misstroke, and being thoroughly
// confused.

Misstrokes are unavoidable [1]. But as far as macros go, at least
there's flush options. Flush on failure will kill any macro on a
miscast... and for more solid protection you can use flush on command to
prevent any macro from running more than a single command. Of course,
they somewhat limit the power of macros... but if you want that extra
(and very dangerous) power, you gotta take the lumps that come with it.

// Personally, I don't mind multidrop being tied to 'd'... isn't this the kind of
// thing init.txt was made for? Pretty please with cream and sugar on it?

Well, options to enforce or default to multi or single drop on all drop
listings is possible. But for those who want to mostly drop single items
(sometimes with lookup), but occasionally drop multiple items... they
really can't have it as an option.

Brent Ross


[1] After all, it doesn't matter what the mode switch or command character
is ... misstrokes will always happen, have to be assumed to generate any
sequence, and so will always cause confusion. So being sudden thrown
into a multidrop menu is going to happen, you're going to have to deal
with it eventually regardless (I haven't looked at the patch... hopefully,
there's a good message at the top to tell you what happened). If you're
so sloppy with spell casting that you're conjuring keeps getting you into
the multidrop menu, all you have to do is put a non-targeting spell in
slot d... that will pretty much stop it (since you mention that you're
happy with multidrop being tied to d, you're going to eventually see it
come up from the d spell anyways if you are sloppy... that's a single
stroke sequence, so I'd expect it more often than the two stroke d+).
Anonymous
January 3, 2005 4:15:51 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein wrote:
> Darshan Shaligram wrote:

> > Ah, but what I'm proposing is that Ctrl+D directly bring up the
> > inventory menu, so you're saved the extra keystroke (hitting *
> > or ?) that's necessary with (d)rop.

> Maybe I've missed something, but - why do you think the extra
> keystroke would be needed in a 'toggled' version?

Well, at the time I was writing the previous posts, I'd overlooked
the auto_list option, and it appears that everyone else upthread
uses auto_list and I don't.

Since auto_list pretends * has already been pressed, I can see why
Ctrl+D is an extra keystroke.

So here's my new (rather baroque) proposal:

Brent's idea of using * or ? for the old single-item-selection and +
(and comma - I like commas!) for the multiselect looks the way to
go. For auto_list users, setting auto_list = true or auto_list = *
will default to the old single-item select, auto_list = + will
default to the new multidrop.

In addition, you can hit Ctrl+D in-menu to toggle it from
single-item to multi-item, but the toggling will be only for the
lifetime of the menu.

To indicate whether the inventory menu is looking for a single item
or multiple items, we should probably change the menu title (from
"Inventory: yadda yadda" to "Select an item to drop" or "Select
items to drop").

Thoughts?

Darshan
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 1:05:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

In article <1104743751.325442.166130@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
<scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
// So here's my new (rather baroque) proposal:
//
// Brent's idea of using * or ? for the old single-item-selection and +
// (and comma - I like commas!) for the multiselect looks the way to
// go. For auto_list users, setting auto_list = true or auto_list = *
// will default to the old single-item select, auto_list = + will
// default to the new multidrop.

Actually, I can see all four possibilities being useful to someone [1],
so it's probably best to have a separate option to mark the default mode
(single/multi).

// In addition, you can hit Ctrl+D in-menu to toggle it from
// single-item to multi-item, but the toggling will be only for the
// lifetime of the menu.

Really, it should be on the same key. I overlooked that books on some
displays are + and thus + gets used to represent the class... which,
of course, means that it's already used from the multidrop menu. [2]

^D is also not particularly a good choice here. The only reason to
use it is that it was suggested for a separate multi-drop command. [3]
It certainly doesn't have any solid mnemonic pertainly to the concept of
switching modes or multiple drop. ^F at the targeting prompt at least
has the friends/foes mnemonic (which isn't particularly good either).

I've been thinking that maybe what we need is a general key for doing
these mode switches. Some safe ones that pop to mind would be @ or ^M.

// To indicate whether the inventory menu is looking for a single item
// or multiple items, we should probably change the menu title (from
// "Inventory: yadda yadda" to "Select an item to drop" or "Select
// items to drop").

Ideally, from a UI point of view this string should be identifiable within
the first few characters and have a different shape (they tend to get
read once and matched instantly as blobs every time after). That little
's' is too deep and hidden to be useful except for figuring out what
happened after things go wrong. Better would be to only change the
title for the multidrop menu, because it's the special and different one
(compared to other menu listings)... or make the stings much more unique
(maybe as simple as putting "Multidrop: " in front of that one).

Brent Ross


[1] For example, I might really like multidrop but be playing on a
slow terminal/connection and thus be adverse to full screen redraws
automatically happening. Thus the behaviour of jumping to multidrop
on * or ? is what would be called for.

[2] Which reminds me... selecting all corpses must be impossible (shame),
involve selecting all food as well (ick), or have required some creativity
(assuming one can still select item X). I really need to take a peek now.

[3] Like nethack does, but they don't have dissection so they can do it
on shift-D which is a bit more natural, but not what I'd call ideal.
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 6:19:36 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Brent Ross wrote:
> In article <1104743751.325442.166130@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
> <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:

>// Brent's idea of using * or ? for the old single-item-selection
>// and + (and comma - I like commas!) for the multiselect looks the
>// way to go. For auto_list users, setting auto_list = true or
>// auto_list = * will default to the old single-item select,
>// auto_list = + will default to the new multidrop.

> Actually, I can see all four possibilities being useful to someone
> [1], so it's probably best to have a separate option to mark the
> default mode (single/multi).

The auto_list style I'm proposing does allow for different default
modes, right? auto_list = ? will default to the old drop, auto_list
= + will default to multidrop, and the user can always switch
the drop interface in-game using the mode-change key. If they're not
auto-list users, they can use * or ? to bring up the old interface,
or + and , to bring up the multidrop menu.

The other uses of auto_list (apart from drop) will not be affected
anyway, because they don't have alternate interfaces.

If that isn't what you're referring to, I'm officially confused.

> I've been thinking that maybe what we need is a general key for
> doing these mode switches. Some safe ones that pop to mind would
> be @ or ^M.

@ sounds good; ^M == Enter, so we can't use that.

[menu title]
> other menu listings)... or make the stings much more unique (maybe
> as simple as putting "Multidrop: " in front of that one).

I like the prefixing with "Multidrop" idea.

> [2] Which reminds me... selecting all corpses must be impossible
> (shame), involve selecting all food as well (ick),

Food and carrion are selected by % (ick). Better ideas have not
occurred to me. :-( The best I could think of was to steal '#' or
'&' for corpses.

Darshan
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 6:58:01 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:
> Now for some (once again minor) *bug report* FUN!

> * Bug or misfeature, this one kinda gets me: if you use
> multipickup and take advantage of the (undocumented but expectable
> and, incidentally, marvelous) partial-pickup feature, the item is
> no longer flagged as a dropped item, so the next time you walk
> over it, you autopickup it if applicable.

Fixed, thanks for the report.

> (You pick up a pile of 3293 scrolls of remove curse. You collapse
> under the weight of your belongings. You die...)

Sounds distinctly Adom-ish. Speaking from experience? :-)

> * Well, this one too is not really so much a bug as a misfeature.
> If an letter is not visible on the current page, but is valid, and
> you type it in the multidrop interface, it's selected for
> dropping. So far so good. But this feature works in some way
> separately from the rest of multidrop, and only holds one letter.

Fixed, thanks.

> Is there any chance the dropping of items not visible on the
> current page of the listing can be unified with other types of
> dropping?

Done; off-page selection is now allowed in the drop menu (but not
for pickup).

> * I've "succeeded" in dropping a "buggy bola" a couple of times --

I haven't seen this; please let me know if it happens again.

I've uploaded another binary, although this, again, has to be
classed as extremely experimental. I've been tweaking a lot of
things, any of which might have broken.

Some of the multidrop changes we're discussing are also in, so
you might want to use

auto_list = +

in your init.txt.

Darshan
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 4:33:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork scintilla@gmail.com bork 12:58:01 PM bork 1/4/2005 bork bork:

> Erik Piper wrote:

[...]

> > (You pick up a pile of 3293 scrolls of remove curse. You collapse
> > under the weight of your belongings. You die...)
>
> Sounds distinctly Adom-ish. Speaking from experience? :-)

Heh, indeed. I was hoping you'd catch that one.

Gateway to Apshai (on my friend's Atari 800, I think) was my first
"roguelike-like", DoD (or whatever) for the early pale-blue-and-black Macs
was my first modern roguelike, and the Nethack distribution in CZLUG's distro
of Debian was the first roguelike on a computer that was actually mine, but
ADOM...

ADOM, for all its faults, is what ended something like eight years of Civving
and threw me into the roguelike camp for good.

[...]

> > * I've "succeeded" in dropping a "buggy bola" a couple of times --
>
> I haven't seen this; please let me know if it happens again.

Hmm, on the one hand it hasn't, but on the other hand I was "able" to produce
a similar incident (not that I was trying) by reading a scroll of identify
and accidentally typing "?" while in the list -- I was kicked out and told
that I had just identified something very roughly like

Bolander's +2355, +5451 Buggy Bola

Now, I do realize that other than "?" as enabler and the Buggy Bola -- which
is probably just a generalized debugging aid anyway -- this probably has
nothing to do with the patch... UNLESS something was changed in the
item-listing code overall...?

Shortly afterwards, Crawl crashed. (Thankfully, despite all the spaghetti
code, etc., Linley and those who cleaned up after his work have made Crawl
into a very robust beast, and even the very rare crash is easy to recover
from thanks to the directly-usable autosave each time the player enters a
level.)

> I've uploaded another binary, although this, again, has to be
> classed as extremely experimental. I've been tweaking a lot of
> things, any of which might have broken.

This one I definitely WILL download, as both of the fixes mentioned in the
deleted parts of your post are ones I'll greatly appreciate.

[...]

Cheers,
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 4:35:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork scintilla@gmail.com bork 12:19:36 PM bork 1/4/2005 bork bork:

[Darshan wrote... er, that which he wrote]

OK, so if I get this straight:

If my desired behavior is for "d" to always, by default, throw me directly
into the list, with multidrop active, then all I need to do is to have the
line

auto_list = +

in my init.txt.

Right?

Erik
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 11:02:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

scintilla@gmail.com wrote:
> Brent Ross wrote:
>> In article <1104743751.325442.166130@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
>> <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>> [...]
>> I've been thinking that maybe what we need is a general key for
>> doing these mode switches. Some safe ones that pop to mind would
>> be @ or ^M.
>
> @ sounds good; ^M == Enter, so we can't use that.

You don't mind @ being already there for 'status' (Linux at least)?
Not that I find a message like 'You are alive.' particularly useful...

Rubinstein
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 8:25:47 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:
[...]
> ADOM, for all its faults, is what ended something like eight years
> of Civving and threw me into the roguelike camp for good.

Well, I've said nasty things about Adom in the past, but I have to
admit it's one of the great roguelikes. At least, it showed me that
NetHack wasn't the only game in town (without which I might never
have tried Crawl :-)). It also led me to give Angband a second
chance, but for that I forgive it. :-)

[...]
> Hmm, on the one hand it hasn't, but on the other hand I was "able"
> to produce a similar incident (not that I was trying) by reading a
> scroll of identify and accidentally typing "?" while in the list
> -- I was kicked out and told that I had just identified something
> very roughly like

> Bolander's +2355, +5451 Buggy Bola

Oh, evil.

> Now, I do realize that other than "?" as enabler and the Buggy
> Bola -- which is probably just a generalized debugging aid anyway
> -- this probably has nothing to do with the patch... UNLESS
> something was changed in the item-listing code overall...?

The item-listing code has been subjected to hideous tortures, so
this is very likely the patch acting up.

> Shortly afterwards, Crawl crashed.

Dreadful. This thing needs a lot more work, it seems. Did the crash
follow on the heels of the identify, or was there something else
that triggered it?

> (Thankfully, despite all the spaghetti code, etc., Linley and
> those who cleaned up after his work have made Crawl into a very
> robust beast, and even the very rare crash is easy to recover from
> thanks to the directly-usable autosave each time the player enters
> a level.)

Yes, this is why I can bravely play-test my most radical changes.

Thanks for the bug reports, I'll go back and take a good hard look
at the code.

Darshan
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 9:24:39 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Erik Piper" <efrniokr@sdky.cz> wrote:

> If my desired behavior is for "d" to always, by default, throw me
> directly into the list, with multidrop active, then all I need to
> do is to have the line

> auto_list = +

> in my init.txt.

> Right?

Right, at least for the moment. :-)

Darshan
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 9:27:32 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:
> scintilla@gmail.com wrote:
>> Brent Ross wrote:
[...]
>>> I've been thinking that maybe what we need is a general key for
>>> doing these mode switches. Some safe ones that pop to mind
>>> would be @ or ^M.

>> @ sounds good; ^M == Enter, so we can't use that.

> You don't mind @ being already there for 'status' (Linux at
> least)?

Yes, but since we're only using @ when the drop menu is up, it
doesn't conflict with the other use.

> Not that I find a message like 'You are alive.' particularly
> useful...

Yes, "You will soon be dead" is far more realistic.

Darshan
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 9:35:36 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:

> Btw, I've never used the select all (of 1 page) function. I would
> use it a lot, though, if it would listen to a set of keywords from
> init.txt...

> Imagine something like 'select_all_filter = rotten, cursed' and
> you could clean up your inventory just with a triple ',' then.

That feature's almost there, but it'll take a while, because I'm in
the middle of some fundamental changes to the multidrop mechanism.

> If I got it right, in the first case you describe a scenary with a
> 'normal' travel started, but interrupted for a level change. A
> pretty rare case I think, since why should you want to leave the
> level when you selected a target on the same level (with direct
> access)?

I often leave the level in a hurry when I see the first dragon of
the game in the way; your mileage may vary. :-)

> The other case, with invoked interlevel travel, was exactly what I
> had in mind and also the one bothering me all the time: when the
> interlevel travel was interrupted on the _wrong_ level, I couldn't
> reselect my former location.

> Is Ctrl+G+Enter to resume interlevel travel a new one or did I
> just miss it all the time?

It's been around forever, but it's easy to miss it if you triggered
interlevel travel from the basic travel interface.

Darshan
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 10:38:33 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

In article <1104837576.737356.267490@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
<scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
// Brent Ross wrote:
//
// > Actually, I can see all four possibilities being useful to someone
// > [1], so it's probably best to have a separate option to mark the
// > default mode (single/multi).
//
// The auto_list style I'm proposing does allow for different default
// modes, right? auto_list = ? will default to the old drop, auto_list
// = + will default to multidrop, and the user can always switch
// the drop interface in-game using the mode-change key. If they're not
// auto-list users, they can use * or ? to bring up the old interface,
// or + and , to bring up the multidrop menu.

Except that the character used shouldn't be different here than at
any prompt in the system. Since you can't use '+' in the system for
this (as it toggles books), it probably shouldn't be used here either
(because that could make d+ and d*+ potentially very different things...
and if d*+ is "bring up inventory, convert to multdrop mode" then d*++
becomes even ickier).

// The other uses of auto_list (apart from drop) will not be affected
// anyway, because they don't have alternate interfaces.

Except that the notation is awkward, and so it's not explicit as to
what '+' means at other listings. Some people might not want that to
automatically be converted to a question mark. It's just too simple to
add another option to the game (in fact it's being kept intentionally
easy to do so)... clarity and flexibility are cheap here currently so
they might as well get used. So I really can't see why we can't cater to
multidrop junkies and allow them to get multidrop from * or ? (so they
don't have to tokenize a new finger sequence and then keep it straight
from the other prompts).

// > [2] Which reminds me... selecting all corpses must be impossible
// > (shame), involve selecting all food as well (ick),
//
// Food and carrion are selected by % (ick).

Yeah, there are cases for doing both at the same time, but it's probably
better to not do corpses (ie merely "shame") than to always tie them
together. That could lead to a character trying to quickly scoop
up some honeycomb and yanking up several dozen bee corpses with it.
We like the fact that Crawl doesn't have autopickup food as a deathtrap,
and so it's good to keep the food/carrion distinction everywhere.

// Better ideas have not
// occurred to me. :-( The best I could think of was to steal '#' or
// '&' for corpses.

Either one is okay... they're certainly better than using X here
(although, who needs all those inventory slots... /surely/ the players
won't miss *one* little slot down at the end of the list). I'd probably
go with '&' here, because '#' might be useful for something involving
counts or numbers at a prompt later.

Brent Ross
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 1:33:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 6:25:47 AM bork 1/5/2005 bork bork:

> > Shortly afterwards, Crawl crashed.
>
> Dreadful. This thing needs a lot more work, it seems. Did the crash
> follow on the heels of the identify, or was there something else
> that triggered it?

T+ 10, maybe 20 turns. But there was nothing memorable about the action that
finally laid it on its back. I think it was somewhere between when Muhammad
Ali's Buggy Bola delivered its 256th and 276th punches... that last left hook
was nasty, but no nastier than the rest. ;-)

Erik
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 5:12:00 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bwross@csclub.uwaterloo.ca (Brent Ross) wrote:
[...]
> So I really can't see why we can't cater to multidrop junkies and
> allow them to get multidrop from * or ? (so they don't have to
> tokenize a new finger sequence and then keep it straight from the
> other prompts).

Okay, I see the point. I've added a drop_mode option that controls
whether multidrop or the old one-item-drop is the default drop
interface, and unmangled the auto_list option.

[key to select carrion]
> I'd probably go with '&' here, because '#' might be useful for
> something involving counts or numbers at a prompt later.

& it is.

Darshan
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 5:18:46 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Rubinstein <picommander@t-online.de> wrote:

> Btw, I've never used the select all (of 1 page) function. I would
> use it a lot, though, if it would listen to a set of keywords from
> init.txt...

> Imagine something like 'select_all_filter = rotten, cursed' and
> you could clean up your inventory just with a triple ',' then.

I don't know about a triple ',', but I've added the drop_filter
option to do the filtering. Patch and binary are up at the usual
places. To default to the multidrop behaviour, you now have to add

drop_mode = multi

to your init.txt. The auto_list option is a straight true/false
again.

Bug reports are welcome. :-)

Darshan
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 9:29:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 3:18:46 PM bork 1/5/2005 bork bork:

First impressions from testing the latest beta:

- Putting "[Multidrop]" at the top of the multidrop interface was definitely
a good move.

- In terms of future-proofing, I liked your tactic, in an earlier beta, of
using "x turns" instead of "x items" at the top right. You and I know that
items to be dropped = turns it's gonna take, but if the patch ever gets
merged into the main distribution files, we may see newbies using multidrop
off the bat, and thinking it will work like multidrop in other games. Of
course there are plenty of cues in the game to demonstrate to them that this
is not so; I'm not so silly as to really think that this will confuse anyone
about the nature of multidrop for long. But no harm in providing an extra
learning aid, methinks.

- I couldn't select carrion with "&" from the multidrop interface. Am I doing
something wrong, or is that coming up in a future release?

- Just a general comment: So far I see you've been very careful and diligent
in accompanying players using very different interface choices than your own
(numpad, non-auto-list, etc.). Thanks!

- I swear there's a key for selecting all items on a page, but suddenly I
can't seem to find it...

----

Two feature requests, one "on-topic" and the other not:

- a way of invoking the multipickup interface for single-type stacks, in
order to be able to do partial-pickup. No matter how obscure the key for this
would be, it would beat the heck of having to pick up 500 stones/vanilla
arrows/etc. (i.e. an item of key importance for a given character type that
is stashed on its "own" square), then drop 470 of them.

Of course, if I'm the only player who ever does this kind of thing, it
probably doesn't make sense...

- if you're not too exhausted after all fine-tuning all the pickup/drop
enhancements... any chance that, via some tweaking, morgue.txt could be made
useful, i.e. by not automatically overwriting itself (perhaps by dumping to
custom_path/charname_morgue.txt)? (Yes, I know, if I had any cred, I would
write a script to monitor for a dump of morgue.txt and automatically arrange
the rest for me. I don't, and I can't. :-))

Erik
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 9:42:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bork bork bork Darshan Shaligram bork 3:18:46 PM bork 1/5/2005 bork bork:

First impressions from testing the latest beta:

- Putting "[Multidrop]" at the top of the multidrop interface was definitely
a good move.

- In terms of future-proofing, I liked your tactic, in an earlier beta, of
using "x turns" instead of "x items" at the top right. You and I know that
items to be dropped = turns it's gonna take, but if the patch ever gets
merged into the main distribution files, we may see newbies using multidrop
off the bat, and thinking it will work like multidrop in other games. Of
course there are plenty of cues in the game to demonstrate to them that this
is not so; I'm not so silly as to really think that this will confuse anyone
about the nature of multidrop for long. But no harm in providing an extra
learning aid, methinks.

- I couldn't select carrion with "&" from the multidrop interface. Am I doing
something wrong, or is that coming up in a future release?

- Just a general comment: So far I see you've been very careful and diligent
in accompanying players using very different interface choices than your own
(numpad, non-auto-list, etc.). Thanks!

- I swear there's a key for selecting all items on a page, but suddenly I
can't seem to find it...

----

Two feature requests, one "on-topic" and the other not:

- a way of invoking the multipickup interface for single-type stacks, in
order to be able to do partial-pickup. No matter how obscure the key for this
would be, it would beat the heck of having to pick up 500 stones/vanilla
arrows/etc. (i.e. an item of key importance for a given character type that
is stashed on its "own" square), then drop 470 of them.

Of course, if I'm the only player who ever does this kind of thing, it
probably doesn't make sense...

- if you're not too exhausted after all fine-tuning all the pickup/drop
enhancements... any chance that, via some tweaking, morgue.txt could be made
useful, i.e. by not automatically overwriting itself (perhaps by dumping to
custom_path/charname_morgue.txt)? (Yes, I know, if I had any cred, I would
write a script to monitor for a dump of morgue.txt and automatically arrange
the rest for me. I don't, and I can't. :-))

Erik
!