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DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!

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Anonymous
April 29, 2005 2:25:17 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

<advertisement-like voice>

Rejoice, for DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!

I proudly present to you the new version of DoomRL with...

SOUND AND MUSIC :-D

Yesss! Now you can hear those damn former humans dying, now you can
listen to your favourite Doom I tunes... And more even, you can download
MP3 files from http://www.sirgalahad.org/paul/doom/ and plug them into
DoomRL for maximum pleasure (RECOMMENDED! -- see doomrl.ini for
instalation information).

But it's not all!

The long awaited Save-On-Crash function is implemented! No longer will
you loose your ass kicking marine to some damn "IsPlayer" crash! I also
tried to fix some of those bugs by the way ;-).

But wait, there's more!

Two new level TYPES are in! Play NOW and check them out before They do...

Still not enough?

Expanded mortem.txt! Now you will be able to share on rgr.misc what
happend to your marine on each level! Also, you'll know how many
bastards have escaped your trusty chaingun....

SO WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR? GRAB IT NOW!
http://chaos.magma-net.pl/doom/

</advertisement-like voice>

Changes from version.txt

v.0.9.8 (beta)
(9 bugfixes, 4 modifications, 8 additions)
(28.IV.2005)
[add] -- SOUND! Yeah, now hell is getting real ;-)
[add] -- MUSIC! Let the party begin!
[add] -- Possibility to bind MP3Files instead
[add] -- Prepared bindings for MP3's from www.sirgalahad.org/paul/doom/
[add] -- Saving on crash, finally! (greetings to R. Dan Henry)
[add] -- new level TYPE! (dedicated to Archibald ;-) ).
[add] -- another deadly level TYPE!
[add] -- killrate in mortem
[mod] -- Boots get more damaged
[mod] -- Cyber is unaffected by knockback!
[mod] -- Cyber has increased vision (prepare phase-devices)
[mod] -- increased Invulnerability duration.
[fix] -- proper Keybindings support in target and look mode
[fix] -- no pumping message when combat shotgun empty
[fix] -- fixed a CreateRoundDir bug
[fix] -- fixed a blood boots crash bug
[fix] -- fixed a bug in the celleffect code (possible IsPlayer crash)
[fix] -- fixed a bug in the telefrag code (possible IsPlayer crash)
[fix] -- NoIntro and NoFlashing in ini file works as it should
[fix] -- IronMan also increases HP (not only HPMax)
[fix] -- Cyberdeamon => Cyberdemon

--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"The name of GenRogue, has become a warning against excessively
complex design." -- RGRD FAQ

More about : doomrl

Anonymous
April 29, 2005 2:25:18 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

I downloaded it quickly on my friend's comp, and all I have to say is,
WOW! Seamless sound integration. Simply amazing. Sound and music
adds a lot to the game. Well done!

However, unfortunately for me, I won't be able to play it at home,
since I don't have Windows. Why no sound in the DOS version? It
can't be too big of a hassle to add it, and if you did, all us linux
folk could emulate it. So, sadly, I won't be able to enjoy the sound
for more than a few minutes here and there, until you make the change
for the DOS version too. Sigh...

You really should make the addition to the DOS one too, since this is
an amazingly great change, and I'm dying to play it on my laptop at
home! Great job Kornel, keep it up! DoomRL was great before, but
this puts it into a league of its own. :-)


--
"There are of course many problems connected with life, of
which some of the most popular are `Why are people born?'
`Why do they die?' `Why do they spend so much of the
intervening time wearing digital watches?'"

-- The Book.
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 2:31:03 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> <advertisement-like voice>
>
> Rejoice, for DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!

LEGAL NOTE:
All the Sounds and Music in this version of DoomRL are the property of
ID Software. I decided to include them into DoomRL for your gameing
pleasure. I guess that's not entirely legal -- but the files can be
obtained from major Doom Editing sites. So in this version you can
download them with DoomRL, in further versions I will probably remove
them from the zip file and add a ink to where you can download them.
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Gott weiss, Ich will kein Engel sein..." -- Rammstein /Engel/
Related resources
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 3:23:07 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Timothy Pruett wrote:
> I downloaded it quickly on my friend's comp, and all I have to say is,
> WOW! Seamless sound integration. Simply amazing. Sound and music adds
> a lot to the game. Well done!

:-D. Have you noticed the Stereo and Distance effects? :-D

> However, unfortunately for me, I won't be able to play it at home, since
> I don't have Windows. Why no sound in the DOS version?

Because neither SDL nor FMOD works with DOS. And the choice of Sound
libraries for FreePascal is rather limited. I would need to prepare a
separate Dos version, which I think is useless. Also AFAIR there's no
MIDI support on Linux through FMOD (why?). But the good news is that the
near-completion Linux port will still be able to use the superior MP3
files. And yes, it will have sound :-)

> Great job Kornel, keep it up! DoomRL was great before, but this puts it
> into a league of its own. :-)

:-D
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Invalid thought detected. Close all mental processes and
restart body."
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 3:23:08 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> Timothy Pruett wrote:
>
>> I downloaded it quickly on my friend's comp, and all I have to say is,
>> WOW! Seamless sound integration. Simply amazing. Sound and music
>> adds a lot to the game. Well done!
>
>
> :-D. Have you noticed the Stereo and Distance effects? :-D

Yeah, I did! Needless to say, I was blown away.

>> However, unfortunately for me, I won't be able to play it at home,
>> since I don't have Windows. Why no sound in the DOS version?
>
>
> Because neither SDL nor FMOD works with DOS. And the choice of Sound
> libraries for FreePascal is rather limited. I would need to prepare a
> separate Dos version, which I think is useless. Also AFAIR there's no
> MIDI support on Linux through FMOD (why?). But the good news is that the
> near-completion Linux port will still be able to use the superior MP3
> files. And yes, it will have sound :-)

Well, as long as the linux port will have sound, I'm happy. :-)


--
"There are of course many problems connected with life, of
which some of the most popular are `Why are people born?'
`Why do they die?' `Why do they spend so much of the
intervening time wearing digital watches?'"

-- The Book.
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 4:48:48 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Uzytkownik "Kornel Kisielewicz" <kisielewicz@gazeta.pl> napisal w
wiadomosci news:D 4rjj9$mel$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
> Because neither SDL nor FMOD works with DOS. And the choice of Sound
> libraries for FreePascal is rather limited. I would need to prepare
> a separate Dos version, which I think is useless. Also AFAIR there's
> no MIDI support on Linux through FMOD (why?). But the good news is
> that the near-completion Linux port will still be able to use the
> superior MP3 files. And yes, it will have sound :-)

I will take a moment to point that the Allegro library has sound under
Linux, Windows _and_ dos. I always stated it's better than SDL :-)

regards,
Filip
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 5:06:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Filip Dreger wrote:
> I will take a moment to point that the Allegro library has sound under
> Linux, Windows _and_ dos. I always stated it's better than SDL :-)

Yes! I should have bet something -- I *knew* you would blast into this
thread and point that out :-D. I wonder wether allegro has MP3 support
;-). And wether the Audio system can be ran independently of the rest of
allegro. And wether it can play MIDI's on Linux :-P
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"If hackers will ever use virtual reality, it would show a bunch
of text terminals floating around them..." -- The Sheep
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 5:06:23 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> Filip Dreger wrote:
>
>> I will take a moment to point that the Allegro library has sound under
>> Linux, Windows _and_ dos. I always stated it's better than SDL :-)
>
> Yes! I should have bet something -- I *knew* you would blast into this
> thread and point that out :-D. I wonder wether allegro has MP3 support
> ;-). And wether the Audio system can be ran independently of the rest of
> allegro. And wether it can play MIDI's on Linux :-P

I think the functionality is the same. It doesn't matter though, since
Allegro is a C library and DoomRL is written in something else.

(One more reason C is better -- much wider variety of 3rd-party
libraries available in C than in other languages.)

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 5:48:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>> Filip Dreger wrote:
>>
>>> I will take a moment to point that the Allegro library has sound
>>> under Linux, Windows _and_ dos. I always stated it's better than SDL :-)
>>
>>
>> Yes! I should have bet something -- I *knew* you would blast into this
>> thread and point that out :-D. I wonder wether allegro has MP3 support
>> ;-). And wether the Audio system can be ran independently of the rest
>> of allegro. And wether it can play MIDI's on Linux :-P
>
> I think the functionality is the same. It doesn't matter though, since
> Allegro is a C library and DoomRL is written in something else.
> (One more reason C is better -- much wider variety of 3rd-party
> libraries available in C than in other languages.)

I'm quite positive there are FreePascal bindings for Allegro. Actually -
- if something is in a *.dll or *.so, and doesn't use C++ classes then
making a header for FreePascal is trivial. That's why FreePascal has
OpenGL, SDL etc. support.

Oh, BTW -- thanks for a few good tips from before. I finally made that
huge step and thrown away both Outlook Express and Internet Explorer. I
guess that now, after a few days of usage, no one could force me to go
bal -- Thunderbird and Firefox are a lot better ;-)
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"A random group of people is useless for anything except
statistics" -- Anubis
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 4:48:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Quoting Kornel Kisielewicz <kisielewicz@gazeta.pl>:
><advertisement-like voice>
>Rejoice, for DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!
>I proudly present to you the new version of DoomRL with...
>SOUND AND MUSIC :-D

Hooray! I hope some of the crashes are out, too. :-)
--
David Damerell <damerell@chiark.greenend.org.uk> flcl?
Today is Aponoia, May.
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 8:10:36 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

David Damerell wrote:
> Quoting Kornel Kisielewicz <kisielewicz@gazeta.pl>:
>
>><advertisement-like voice>
>>Rejoice, for DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!
>>I proudly present to you the new version of DoomRL with...
>>SOUND AND MUSIC :-D
>
> Hooray! I hope some of the crashes are out, too. :-)

I found some of them. And I guess the save-on-crash feature will make
the rest less annoying (and easier to write down the tracedumps too).
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Oh come on. We both know the truth about this game --
vapourware." -- Anathiel about GenRogue
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 8:52:53 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:

> Mechanoid wrote:
>> - Get just a few more DooM sounds in there for the tougher enemies! Is
>> it a Baron or a Knight? Sargeant, or Commander? Granted, it's scarrier,
>> but it'd be even scarrier if you didn't find the staircase and you
>> heard a Knight!
>
> Okay ;-). But I don't know wether they were actually different.

Baron of Hell and Hell knight have very different sounds. For the zombie
soldiers i'm not sure. I think they are different but in the end, they all
look the same more or less.
Anonymous
April 30, 2005 3:09:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Uzytkownik "Kornel Kisielewicz" <kisielewicz@gazeta.pl> napisal w
wiadomosci news:D 4rpk7$dgp$1@inews.gazeta.pl...

> Yes! I should have bet something -- I *knew* you would blast into
> this thread and point that out :-D. I wonder wether allegro has MP3
> support ;-).

I was hoping noone would ask about this... no, it does not support
mp3.

And wether the Audio system can be ran independently of the rest of
> allegro. And wether it can play MIDI's on Linux :-P
Audio system is not detachable :-(
But it indeed plays mids both under Linux and Windows.

regards,
Filip
Anonymous
April 30, 2005 8:38:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Filip Dreger wrote:
> Uzytkownik "Kornel Kisielewicz" <kisielewicz@gazeta.pl> napisal w
> wiadomosci news:D 4rpk7$dgp$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
>
>
>>Yes! I should have bet something -- I *knew* you would blast into
>>this thread and point that out :-D. I wonder wether allegro has MP3
>>support ;-).
>
>
> I was hoping noone would ask about this... no, it does not support
> mp3.

Duuh, then it's useless for me -- after I heard the Doom MP3's I just
can't stand falling back to MIDI's :-/

> And wether the Audio system can be ran independently of the rest of
>
>>allegro. And wether it can play MIDI's on Linux :-P
>
> Audio system is not detachable :-(

This seems like another thing why Allegro isn't a good choice ;-).

> But it indeed plays mids both under Linux and Windows.

This one's interesting tough... (but come to think of it, so does SDL ;-) ).
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"11 years and no binary. And it's not vapourware" -- Igor Savin
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 3:08:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Great. The sound FX just give that extra-punch to the game. I thought
the blood stains in the floor and walls were a cool feature, the one
item in one space only also added to the effect (various characters
appearing at the same time around the corpse emulates a body
explosion). Now the sound FX ;)  Nice idea, indeed.

Also, any level design improvments are always welcome. :) 

Btw, I like the ascii-pics of the monsters. Would it possible to, for
example, put the monster's pic that killed you in the mortem file? ;) 


Keep up the good work!
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 4:39:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

AngeloB wrote:
> Great. The sound FX just give that extra-punch to the game. I thought
> the blood stains in the floor and walls were a cool feature, the one
> item in one space only also added to the effect (various characters
> appearing at the same time around the corpse emulates a body
> explosion). Now the sound FX ;)  Nice idea, indeed.

:-D

> Also, any level design improvments are always welcome. :) 

And there will be more to come.

> Btw, I like the ascii-pics of the monsters. Would it possible to, for
> example, put the monster's pic that killed you in the mortem file? ;) 

Well it would, but I think it isn't a good idea. Those ASCII pics look
cool because they are coulored. Without colors the comletely don't look
like the oroginal :-/
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"It's much easier to make an army of dumb good people than to
make one single smart good guy..." -- DarkGod
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 9:13:48 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

On Sun, 01 May 2005 00:39:13 +0200, Kornel Kisielewicz
<kisielewicz@gazeta.pl> tried to confuse everyone with this message:

>AngeloB wrote:
>> Great. The sound FX just give that extra-punch to the game. I thought
>> the blood stains in the floor and walls were a cool feature, the one
>> item in one space only also added to the effect (various characters
>> appearing at the same time around the corpse emulates a body
>> explosion). Now the sound FX ;)  Nice idea, indeed.
>
>:-D
>
>> Also, any level design improvments are always welcome. :) 
>
>And there will be more to come.
>
>> Btw, I like the ascii-pics of the monsters. Would it possible to, for
>> example, put the monster's pic that killed you in the mortem file? ;) 
>
>Well it would, but I think it isn't a good idea. Those ASCII pics look
>cool because they are coulored. Without colors the comletely don't look
>like the oroginal :-/

Well, people at alt.ascii-art could do them better...

--
|a\o/r|,-------------.,---------- Timofei Shatrov aka Grue ------------.
| m"a ||FC AMKAR PERM|| mail: grue at mail.ru http://grue3.tripod.com |
| k || PWNZ J00 || Kingdom of Loathing: Grue3 lvl 18 Seal Clubber |
`-----'`-------------'`-------------------------------------------[4*72]
May 1, 2005 3:02:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> > ABCGi wrote:
> >
> >> Bug: Can't save on stairs to special level :( 
> >
> > Yes. I know.
> >
> >> Idea: be able to eat corpses while berserk
> >> for small amounts of health - 'g' when on
> >> corpse.
> >
> > Oh come on ;-). Or maybe, as a small hidden feature :-D
>
> Cool. Little cookies like that... have in mortem.txt
> how many secrets were found out of how many... adds an
> extra challenge.
>
> Here is my pedantic corrections of the opening text
> including use of commas which I don't even use myself
> on usenet! Corrections exist in each paragraph below...
>
> The trip was long, you thought it would never end. Hell, a job as
> a marine reserve is sooo boring. You hate UAC -- nothing happens
> here. Even now, you have to wait for your fellow marines who
> were supposed to check what happened on Phobos.
>
> Not knowing what to do with yourself you just sit near the comm
> console and listen to the news from your fellow marines.
>
> "Hell, what bloodshed!" you hear from the comm, "Corpses
> everywhere!"

Kornel, I implore you to keep the line "What a bloodshed!"

Please don't correct this!
A.
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 5:03:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> <advertisement-like voice>
>
> Rejoice, for DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!
>
> I proudly present to you the new version of DoomRL with...
>
> SOUND AND MUSIC :-D
*SNIP*
> SO WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR? GRAB IT NOW!
> http://chaos.magma-net.pl/doom/
>
> </advertisement-like voice>

Freakin' awesome, well done. Full play test
report later but love the sounds (should add
the bang bang bang noise and slurps in the
intro), and the credits are nice too.

I would of done the music in the ini file
without extension and look for mp3 first
in not exist goto mid named the same - so
players don't have to edit ini file.

Prefer game not close down at finish, I
add this to batch file;

:label
doomrl
goto label

alt-enter and click x to quit. Ugly :) 

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 5:09:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Timofei Shatrov wrote:
>>Well it would, but I think it isn't a good idea. Those ASCII pics look
>>cool because they are coulored. Without colors the comletely don't look
>>like the oroginal :-/
>
> Well, people at alt.ascii-art could do them better...

You think they would do so much work for free?
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Shadows universe is non-heroic, unfair, cruel and designed to
start playing on your nerves and sanity." -- Anubis
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 5:12:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Freakin' awesome, well done.

:-D

> Full play test
> report later but love the sounds (should add
> the bang bang bang noise and slurps in the
> intro), and the credits are nice too.

Credits?

> I would of done the music in the ini file
> without extension and look for mp3 first
> in not exist goto mid named the same - so
> players don't have to edit ini file.

I made it as it is, cause the names that are available now, are the
original ones, and don't need any fidling around if you just download
them from somewhere else.

> Prefer game not close down at finish, I
> add this to batch file;
>
> :label
> doomrl
> goto label
>
> alt-enter and click x to quit. Ugly :) 

LOL! My friend had such an autoexec.bat on his DOS machine!

If you want I can add an option in the ini-file -- RESTARTATDEATH ?
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Shadows universe is non-heroic, unfair, cruel and designed to
start playing on your nerves and sanity." -- Anubis
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 6:32:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>> <advertisement-like voice>
>>
>> Rejoice, for DoomRL 0.9.8 is out!
>>
>> I proudly present to you the new version of DoomRL with...
>>
>> SOUND AND MUSIC :-D
>
> *SNIP*
>
>> SO WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR? GRAB IT NOW!
>> http://chaos.magma-net.pl/doom/
>>
>> </advertisement-like voice>
>
> Freakin' awesome, well done. Full play test
> report later but love the sounds (should add
> the bang bang bang noise and slurps in the
> intro), and the credits are nice too.
>
> I would of done the music in the ini file
> without extension and look for mp3 first
> in not exist goto mid named the same - so
> players don't have to edit ini file.
>
> Prefer game not close down at finish, I
> add this to batch file;
>
> :label
> doomrl
> goto label
>
> alt-enter and click x to quit. Ugly :) 

DOOM-RL - ver 0.9.8 WIN-S on Win XP - playtest
----------------------------------------------

As usual take what you like and feel free to ignore
the rest!

GOOD
----
* Sound and music! Esp sound is atmospheric.
* Combat shotgun is the bomb - great strategy.
* Performance of DOS window is fine on my high end PC.
* Game comes with midi files so works out of box.
WAV files should always accompany every release IMO.
* Standing adjacent to monster engages their melee mode.
* Love the post mortem stuff, prev dead warriors etc
* Targeting system is excellent
* Wait command is good tactically.
* Good 'n hard!
* 'U'nload weapon from ground is great! Would rather it
be SHIFT 'g' (or whatever keys are used for pickup)
though. speed speed speed gameplay ;) 
* Sounds are great for shooting into the dark without
the need to use text notification!
Make sure monsters do actually respond to being shot
in this way or its a bit of a exploit.
* Background sounds of living monsters is cool and
informative.
* Knock back is the rox (see kick RFE below).

ISSUE [fix]
-----
* '.' wait command should also pump the combat shotgun
* Pressing the med kit letter in the inventory should
use the health kit.
* Equip screen should not escape when you change slot.
* User should not have to fiddle with ini files etc
To appeal to more than just us high end geeks :) 
* English on intro needs corrections...
"who supposed" = "who were supposed"
I could be more pedantic but I won't ;P
Should there be a time limit before it continues
to next screen instead of waiting for SPACE?
* Changing from inventory screen to equipment screen
i tried to press e but this tried to use item e
= got attacked and died
* Post mortem should not say "There finally he..."
when he only fought a few levels... also should
the PC always be a male??? ;) 
* U for use lever means can't use item on lever
(existing bug!)
* Numpad '.' does not work with num lock off but
movement only works with num lock off meaning
main keyboard needed for wait command.
* Interesting animation on black screen occurs
while 'u'sing med kits in the middle of combat.
In dos window.
* ',' run command stops at corpse - debatable -
but when I reach the corpse I should run
over it the second time I engage run.
* Is TAB to cycle targeting in the keybinding?
It could also be on the line Fire -- Choose target...
[f]ire [TAB] [ESC]
When I cycle to the 2nd of two monsters, fire,
then on next round it is on the 2nd monster
and I press tab it is still on the 2nd monster...
then subsequent tabs work properly (ie that bit
of code has not yet been told the current target is
not the default closest one).
* Post mortem General section does not mention those
that ran away! 'Q'uit... ;) 
Consider saving each mortem.txt file as
mortem_playername.txt ?

CHANGE REQUESTS [mod]
---------------
* I should be able to drop currently held weapon...
this should be faster than 1/2 of a weapon switch :) 
SHIFT weapon quick key would be fine way of doing
this (drops current weapon and switches to selected
weapon)
* Sound when player missing?
* When player moves monster aim should suffer a penalty.
You prob. already have this, but if I'm out in the
open and stand still the monsters should get more
accurate after their first shot - much like playing
Doom where you strafe left and right between firing.
* Don't repeat the music on a level, let it play through
once per level... just the noises by themselves can
also be cool and creepy! Or music toggle: on, off
for rest of level, mute.
* Target stay at same empty point aimed at last turn.
I often shoot into the dark a full clip to "test the
waters" ;) 
* Character screen ('@') can show things like effect of
current tactic setting (cautious, aggressive) and
break down of all PC stats and to-hit changes etc

RFE [add]
---
* Dual pistols! etc
* Kick command - if successful knocks monster back a
certain distance (depending on str and monster) and
may stun monster for that turn. Great for pushing
monsters into acid - or kicking them back then
giving them both barrels - or kicking them in
front of a chaingun. Also kicking barrels will
slide them x distance based on strength and do
a small amount of damage to the barrels integrity -
allowing a barrel against a wall to be kicked till
it blows up or for a weak barrel to blow up in the
PCs face when kicked. Or something along these lines.
Kicking one barrel into another explodes them both :) 
Chance to disarm former humans etc.
* Do something interesting on various names entered
as player names - just easter eggs, nothing too
unbalancing. You already do the cheat codes right??? ;) 
Colour the name differently to indicate user has
found an easter egg ("John Romero" "Id" etc)
* Add tip section to level up screen - random tip such
as "Remember you can 'U'nload a weapon from the
ground to take just its ammo" or "Barrels hurt!" etc.
Helps gets noobs in faster, and is kind of an adding
experience to the player AND the PC.
* '5' on numpad to do something (pick up?) - sacrilegious
I know - prob just used to it now from playing the tombs
(btw Martin if your reading - see how the sounds in this
really add to the game!)
* Dive command - SHIFT any movement key dives the PC in
that direction, moving two squares and being harder to
hit, with whatever time penalty balances it out?
* '@' character screen could have ASCII picture of bloodied
face depending on damage status.
* Pets - fellow marines = cannon fodder! ;) 
* Do the monsters fight each other when they hurt each other?

Great great great game - much harder and therefore much more
replayability, as of course defeating it does take a shine off
the challenge factor. That seems to be enough feedback :) 
I'll let you know if I notice any major problems but it all
seems pretty clean and professional!

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 6:32:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:

<snip suggestions, RFEs, etc>

Another minor little quirk to mention:

Make 'R' ("Special Reload") do a normal reload for weapons that don't
have a special reload, instead of just giving an error message. Not
really a big deal, but I play with the combat shotgun a lot, so I'm
used to hitting 'R' a lot, and when I finally switch to a new gun, I
typically hit 'R' a few times by mistake, only to have to hit 'r'
again afterwards. Like I said, not a big deal, but it's just one of
those little things that adds some polish to the game.


--
"There are of course many problems connected with life, of
which some of the most popular are `Why are people born?'
`Why do they die?' `Why do they spend so much of the
intervening time wearing digital watches?'"

-- The Book.
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 6:32:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> DOOM-RL - ver 0.9.8 WIN-S on Win XP - playtest
> ----------------------------------------------
>
> As usual take what you like and feel free to ignore
> the rest!

;-)

> GOOD
> ----
> * Sound and music! Esp sound is atmospheric.

Noticed the stereo/distance effects? :-D

> * Combat shotgun is the bomb - great strategy.
> * Performance of DOS window is fine on my high end PC.

It works a lot better fullscreen tough. But still, I'm happy it works
out of the box on XP machines.

> * Game comes with midi files so works out of box.
> WAV files should always accompany every release IMO.

But they're licenced :-(. I don't know how much of an infraction is
that. Maybe a confirmation page that appears after clicking download
would be enough? I mean that those MIDIs and WAVs are available at any
editing site, and I just packaged them in...

> * Love the post mortem stuff, prev dead warriors etc

:-). I wonder what more can be added there.

> * Targeting system is excellent

But buggy still :-D

> * Good 'n hard!

Many people say it's too easy :-). I think Nightmare mode is in order...

> * Sounds are great for shooting into the dark without
> the need to use text notification!

LOL! True. You just hear: Bang! Urgggh!

> Make sure monsters do actually respond to being shot
> in this way or its a bit of a exploit.

It's a good exploit :-) -- like playing Quake by the ear...

> ISSUE [fix]
> -----
> * '.' wait command should also pump the combat shotgun

It doesn't?

> * Pressing the med kit letter in the inventory should
> use the health kit.

It doesn't??

> * Equip screen should not escape when you change slot.

This is needed. I don't want any offscreen deaths. And changing a slot
must take a turn.

> * User should not have to fiddle with ini files etc
> To appeal to more than just us high end geeks :) 

You mean an "options" menu instead?

> * English on intro needs corrections...
> "who supposed" = "who were supposed"

Where did you find that?

> I could be more pedantic but I won't ;P

Oh, do be :-). I'll run in a pedantic person anyway some time, so it's
better to correct it sooner :-D

> Should there be a time limit before it continues
> to next screen instead of waiting for SPACE?

??

> * Changing from inventory screen to equipment screen
> i tried to press e but this tried to use item e
> = got attacked and died

??

> * Post mortem should not say "There finally he..."
> when he only fought a few levels... also should
> the PC always be a male??? ;) 

I don't know -- adding a gender choice would be just another keypress
before you enter battle...

> * U for use lever means can't use item on lever
> (existing bug!)

You should use the inventory screen then.

> * Numpad '.' does not work with num lock off but
> movement only works with num lock off meaning
> main keyboard needed for wait command.

I'll see to that.

> * Interesting animation on black screen occurs
> while 'u'sing med kits in the middle of combat.
> In dos window.

Not only I think. It's the way the game handles redraws. I'm not sure
that can be easily fixed.

> * ',' run command stops at corpse - debatable -
> but when I reach the corpse I should run
> over it the second time I engage run.

Okay.

> * Is TAB to cycle targeting in the keybinding?
> It could also be on the line Fire -- Choose target...
> [f]ire [TAB] [ESC]

True :-).

> When I cycle to the 2nd of two monsters, fire,
> then on next round it is on the 2nd monster
> and I press tab it is still on the 2nd monster...
> then subsequent tabs work properly (ie that bit
> of code has not yet been told the current target is
> not the default closest one).

Aaaah. I will need to look at that ;-).

> * Post mortem General section does not mention those
> that ran away! 'Q'uit... ;) 

Aaaah!

> Consider saving each mortem.txt file as
> mortem_playername.txt ?

Good idea :-). But only for windows version :-D. I'll also move them to
a separate directory.

> CHANGE REQUESTS [mod]
> ---------------
> * I should be able to drop currently held weapon...
> this should be faster than 1/2 of a weapon switch :) 
> SHIFT weapon quick key would be fine way of doing
> this (drops current weapon and switches to selected
> weapon)

Hmm... I don't know if it wouldn't be just painful.

> * Sound when player missing?

?

> * When player moves monster aim should suffer a penalty.
> You prob. already have this, but if I'm out in the
> open and stand still the monsters should get more
> accurate after their first shot - much like playing
> Doom where you strafe left and right between firing.

I don't get it. What's wrong with the way it is now? Now only when you
move, there's a chance that he will target the square you *were* on,
instead the square you *are* on.

> * Don't repeat the music on a level, let it play through
> once per level... just the noises by themselves can
> also be cool and creepy! Or music toggle: on, off
> for rest of level, mute.

Hmm. I will have to rethink that :-). I also thought about one track per
4 levels, and dedicated tracks for special levels.

> * Target stay at same empty point aimed at last turn.
> I often shoot into the dark a full clip to "test the
> waters" ;) 

AI needs a redesign, I know ;-)

> * Character screen ('@') can show things like effect of
> current tactic setting (cautious, aggressive) and
> break down of all PC stats and to-hit changes etc

Yeah.

> RFE [add]
> ---
> * Dual pistols! etc

Oh come on ;-). How do you imagine that interface wise?

> * Kick command - if successful knocks monster back a
> certain distance (depending on str and monster) and
> may stun monster for that turn. Great for pushing
> monsters into acid - or kicking them back then
> giving them both barrels - or kicking them in
> front of a chaingun.

I don't know how better that would be instead of just blasting him. And
do you imagine a kicked baron/demon/arachnotron/cyberdemon would buldge
at all (or feel that kick at all)?

> Also kicking barrels will
> slide them x distance based on strength and do
> a small amount of damage to the barrels integrity -
> allowing a barrel against a wall to be kicked till
> it blows up or for a weak barrel to blow up in the
> PCs face when kicked.

That's useless :-)

> Or something along these lines.
> Kicking one barrel into another explodes them both :) 

Also useless, cause you'l get in the blast of both for sure...

I may consider the kick command, but only if you come up with at least 3
realy usefull applications of it.

> * Do something interesting on various names entered
> as player names - just easter eggs, nothing too
> unbalancing. You already do the cheat codes right??? ;) 

Actually they were removed when I changed the input system :-/

> Colour the name differently to indicate user has
> found an easter egg ("John Romero" "Id" etc)

Hmm... I *do* have an idea for a few easter eggs ;-D

> * Add tip section to level up screen - random tip such
> as "Remember you can 'U'nload a weapon from the
> ground to take just its ammo" or "Barrels hurt!" etc.
> Helps gets noobs in faster, and is kind of an adding
> experience to the player AND the PC.

Good one ;-). And easier then updating the manual :-D

> * '5' on numpad to do something (pick up?) - sacrilegious
> I know - prob just used to it now from playing the tombs
> (btw Martin if your reading - see how the sounds in this
> really add to the game!)

Shouldn't it be the "wait" key?

> * Dive command - SHIFT any movement key dives the PC in
> that direction, moving two squares and being harder to
> hit, with whatever time penalty balances it out?

Hmm... i don't know. May be fun, but poses some problems.

> * '@' character screen could have ASCII picture of bloodied
> face depending on damage status.

LOL :-). I don't have so much time and patience with ASCII tough...

> * Pets - fellow marines = cannon fodder! ;) 

LOL2! Kinda undoomish tough ;-).

> * Do the monsters fight each other when they hurt each other?

Not yet ;-).

> Great great great game - much harder and therefore much more
> replayability, as of course defeating it does take a shine off
> the challenge factor. That seems to be enough feedback :) 

I want someone to post a YASD or YAVP on rgr.misc! I'm eager to see how
people play...

> I'll let you know if I notice any major problems but it all
> seems pretty clean and professional!

Thanks!
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Shadows universe is non-heroic, unfair, cruel and designed to
start playing on your nerves and sanity." -- Anubis
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 6:32:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Timothy Pruett wrote:
> ABCGi wrote:
>
> <snip suggestions, RFEs, etc>
>
> Another minor little quirk to mention:
>
> Make 'R' ("Special Reload") do a normal reload for weapons that don't
> have a special reload, instead of just giving an error message. Not
> really a big deal, but I play with the combat shotgun a lot, so I'm used
> to hitting 'R' a lot, and when I finally switch to a new gun, I
> typically hit 'R' a few times by mistake, only to have to hit 'r' again
> afterwards. Like I said, not a big deal, but it's just one of those
> little things that adds some polish to the game.

Ok. I'll remember that.
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Gott weiss, Ich will kein Engel sein..." -- Rammstein /Engel/
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 7:00:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> Mechanoid wrote:
>> A few suggestions:
>> - Invisibility Globe! 8D
>
> Oh come on ;-). If I add invisibility I'll add invisible demons too, you
> know ;-).

It needs them... super creepy to hear the demon but
not be able to see it till attacks. Firing shotgun
in every direction - hearing it groan - killing
it and it becomes visible ;)  Using barrels or splash
damage to take them out where you /think/ they are!

Also 'k'ick command kicks gibs! Leaves red mark where
it bounces off walls, stuns monster for round if hit.

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 7:00:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>> Mechanoid wrote:
>>
>>> A few suggestions:
>>> - Invisibility Globe! 8D
>>
>>
>> Oh come on ;-). If I add invisibility I'll add invisible demons too,
>> you know ;-).
>
>
> It needs them... super creepy to hear the demon but
> not be able to see it till attacks. Firing shotgun
> in every direction - hearing it groan - killing
> it and it becomes visible ;)  Using barrels or splash
> damage to take them out where you /think/ they are!

Yes, but as designer, I have to think about gameplay: for many people it
would be frustrating, and not fun. Moreover, I'm afraid, that watching
for invisi-demons would drasticaly reduce the pace of the game. As I
think about it, invsi-demons would only turn-up in caves, and only in
one that hold only them...

> Also 'k'ick command kicks gibs! Leaves red mark where
> it bounces off walls, stuns monster for round if hit.

You're serious? :-)
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Gott weiss, Ich will kein Engel sein..." -- Rammstein /Engel/
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 7:53:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
>> But they're licenced :-(. I don't know how much of an infraction is
>> that. Maybe a confirmation page that appears after clicking download
>> would be enough? I mean that those MIDIs and WAVs are available at any
>> editing site, and I just packaged them in...
>
> I thought Id released Doom into the public domain or
> open source. Or is this just the source code.

Just the source code. You can't get all 3 episodes legaly without paying.

>> :-). I wonder what more can be added there.
>
> #times bleeding

I don't know if it's of any revelance ;-)

> #times under 10% health

This OTOH may be -- although it would be hard to count -- example -- you
get shot, go 7%hp (check). Now you get shot again -- 6% (check? if not,
then how to differentiate between the former? -- ok, a flag), now medkit
-- 31%. Hit again, hit again -- 10% (check?)

> #real time clock of playtime

Hard ;-). I'm not much into reltime clocks in FP. But doable.

> #real time/turn average

Kheh ;-). Would be in miliseconds I guess...

>>> ISSUE [fix]
>>> -----
>>> * '.' wait command should also pump the combat shotgun
>>
>> It doesn't?
>
> Nope.

Ooops.

>>> * Pressing the med kit letter in the inventory should
>>> use the health kit.
>>
>> It doesn't??
>
> Nope.

Ooops.

>>> * User should not have to fiddle with ini files etc
>>> To appeal to more than just us high end geeks :) 
>>
>> You mean an "options" menu instead?
>
> Yeah, if you want even greater popularity you need
> the lowest common denominator ;) 

Ahhh. But I'd rather work on the AI or DunGen instead...

>>> * English on intro needs corrections...
>>> "who supposed" = "who were supposed"
>>
>> Where did you find that?
>
> 1st or 2nd page of intro...

Ok.

>>> Should there be a time limit before it continues
>>> to next screen instead of waiting for SPACE?
>>
>> ??
>
> On the intro, should it go to the next page automatically
> after 10 seconds.

Not everybody reads so fast :-D. Okay, okay, kiddin.

> When you press i you get inventory screen, a user might
> expect pressing e would goto equipment screen but instead
> it uses item e. Not sure what you can do about that other
> than make the 'e'quipment key something like keypad
> enter.

Dunno. I'll see to that.

>> Not only I think. It's the way the game handles redraws. I'm not sure
>> that can be easily fixed.
>
> Doesn't really need to be, its kinda psychedelic.

Kheh, it just draws what you notice at that moment ;-).

>>> * Target stay at same empty point aimed at last turn.
>>> I often shoot into the dark a full clip to "test the
>>> waters" ;) 
>>
>> AI needs a redesign, I know ;-)
>
> Oh but what I meant was my target aim should stay where
> it was last turn if no monsters around so I can "strafe"
> across empty space.

So if no monsters around, then target relative last square?

>>
>> Oh come on ;-). How do you imagine that interface wise?
>
>
> Press '1' equip pistol
> Press '1' again equip dual pistol (if 2nd pistol exist)

No way! I won't go into the two weapons under one key pitfall again! Die
QuickKey code!

> Press 'r'eload reloads first pistol if required
> Press 'r'eload reloads second pistol if first pistol full
>
> In the words of Ben Stiller: "DO IT!!!!" ;) 

Uhhh....

>>> Great great great game - much harder and therefore much more
>>> replayability, as of course defeating it does take a shine off
>>> the challenge factor. That seems to be enough feedback :) 
>>
>> I want someone to post a YASD or YAVP on rgr.misc! I'm eager to see
>> how people play...
>
> Haven't done either yet :)  Also don't really have any exciting
> screenies either yet!

Please do! ;-)
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Gott weiss, Ich will kein Engel sein..." -- Rammstein /Engel/
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 7:53:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> Yeah, if you want even greater popularity you need
>> the lowest common denominator ;) 
>
> Ahhh. But I'd rather work on the AI or DunGen instead...

AI? This is DooMRL we're discussing. It isn't very doomlike if the
monsters are *smart*. ;) 

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 9:15:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>>> Yeah, if you want even greater popularity you need
>>> the lowest common denominator ;) 
>>
>>
>> Ahhh. But I'd rather work on the AI or DunGen instead...
>
> AI? This is DooMRL we're discussing. It isn't very doomlike if the
> monsters are *smart*. ;) 

As for now monsters in Doom are a lot smarter then in DoomRL ;-)
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
My opinions are my own. Share them at your own risk.
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 10:11:06 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Timothy Pruett wrote:
> ABCGi wrote:
>
> <snip suggestions, RFEs, etc>
>
> Another minor little quirk to mention:
>
> Make 'R' ("Special Reload") do a normal reload for weapons that don't
> have a special reload, instead of just giving an error message. Not
> really a big deal, but I play with the combat shotgun a lot, so I'm used
> to hitting 'R' a lot, and when I finally switch to a new gun, I
> typically hit 'R' a few times by mistake, only to have to hit 'r' again
> afterwards. Like I said, not a big deal, but it's just one of those
> little things that adds some polish to the game.

Yes and in this coffee table speed game anything
that makes the interface go bling bling bling is
good as it adds to that feeling of pace. I like to
jam my finger on 'f' a lot and empty clips into
monsters - its almost like playing the original!

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 11:24:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi <abcgi@yahoo.com> writes:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> ABCGi wrote:

>>> "mode con cp select=473" returns
>>> The code page specified is not valid.

>> Hmm... No idea :-)

> That's the error I get running your batch file,

That should be "437", not "473".

--
Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> Deus vult
Anonymous
May 1, 2005 11:24:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Darshan Shaligram wrote:
> ABCGi <abcgi@yahoo.com> writes:
>>That's the error I get running your batch file,
>
> That should be "437", not "473".

Thanks!
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Well, the philosophy of the World of Shadows is based on most of the
degenerate, immoral and foremost amoral philosophical beliefs of our
world exagarated to the maximum." --Anubis
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 12:33:03 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Antoine wrote:
>>"Hell, what bloodshed!" you hear from the comm, "Corpses
>>everywhere!"
>
>
> Kornel, I implore you to keep the line "What a bloodshed!"
>
> Please don't correct this!
> A.

Why?
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"11 years and no binary. And it's not vapourware" -- Igor Savin
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 1:06:08 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

grue@mail.ru (Timofei Shatrov) wrote:
>On Sun, 01 May 2005 00:39:13 +0200, Kornel Kisielewicz
><kisielewicz@gazeta.pl> tried to confuse everyone with this message:
>
>>AngeloB wrote:
>>> Great. The sound FX just give that extra-punch to the game. I thought
>>> the blood stains in the floor and walls were a cool feature, the one
>>> item in one space only also added to the effect (various characters
>>> appearing at the same time around the corpse emulates a body
>>> explosion). Now the sound FX ;)  Nice idea, indeed.
>>
>>:-D
>>
>>> Also, any level design improvments are always welcome. :) 
>>
>>And there will be more to come.
>>
>>> Btw, I like the ascii-pics of the monsters. Would it possible to, for
>>> example, put the monster's pic that killed you in the mortem file? ;) 
>>
>>Well it would, but I think it isn't a good idea. Those ASCII pics look
>>cool because they are coulored. Without colors the comletely don't look
>>like the oroginal :-/
>
>Well, people at alt.ascii-art could do them better...

That's exactly what I was going to say. Where's ABCGi? He is more
respected there than me :D 
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 2:29:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Timothy Pruett wrote:
>
>> ABCGi wrote:
>>
>> <snip suggestions, RFEs, etc>
>>
>> Another minor little quirk to mention:
>>
>> Make 'R' ("Special Reload") do a normal reload for weapons that don't
>> have a special reload, instead of just giving an error message. Not
>> really a big deal, but I play with the combat shotgun a lot, so I'm
>> used to hitting 'R' a lot, and when I finally switch to a new gun, I
>> typically hit 'R' a few times by mistake, only to have to hit 'r'
>> again afterwards. Like I said, not a big deal, but it's just one of
>> those little things that adds some polish to the game.
>
> Yes and in this coffee table speed game anything
> that makes the interface go bling bling bling is
> good as it adds to that feeling of pace. I like to
> jam my finger on 'f' a lot and empty clips into
> monsters - its almost like playing the original!

KK...

+1:
"mode con cp select=473" returns
The code page specified is not valid.

-1:
TAB - target cycle is in the keybindings text after
all. ;)  like twice or so ! doh

-1:
You mention redefinition of keybindings in ini file
so I can make 'G' the Unload command. I think more
users if they don't have to edit ini file though.

+1:
If have a bleeding state - need to have a bandage
command feature?

+1:
RunOverItems = TRUE; - fair nuff :) 
auto names is cool too
But % gibs still stop the run and you can't
run over them even standing adjacent, or if
standing on them and there is an item next
door (even with above on)... ie needs a bit
of work.

+1:
Mention on save that it will be loaded on next level.
"You camp on the way down the stairs" or something...
or a confirmation ... load/save works though...

+1:
No error message generated if you assign the same key
to two actions, and only one action is performed.
Keybindings help text is not adjusted to what is set
in the ini file.

+1:
A turn counter or some indication of wait turns passing...

+1:
Be nice to assign more than one key to an action...

+1: An alternative pickup key that never picks up weapons
only unloads them, but picks up everything else.

+1: Don't make the same loading sound when they try to
switch to a weapon they don't have.

+1:
Real time clock timer and a fast player alternative high
score list AND/OR added to standard high score scoring.

xp display is good

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 2:29:32 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> KK...

Yes AR? ;-)

> +1:
> "mode con cp select=473" returns
> The code page specified is not valid.

Hmm... No idea :-)

> -1:
> TAB - target cycle is in the keybindings text after
> all. ;)  like twice or so ! doh

I don't get it ?

> -1:
> You mention redefinition of keybindings in ini file
> so I can make 'G' the Unload command. I think more
> users if they don't have to edit ini file though.

What do you suggest?

> +1:
> If have a bleeding state - need to have a bandage
> command feature?

Nah, that would be complicating things.

> +1:
> RunOverItems = TRUE; - fair nuff :) 

:-D

> auto names is cool too

You just discovered it? ;-)

> But % gibs still stop the run and you can't
> run over them even standing adjacent, or if
> standing on them and there is an item next
> door (even with above on)... ie needs a bit
> of work.

Okay, okay, I'll do that :) 

> +1:
> Mention on save that it will be loaded on next level.
> "You camp on the way down the stairs" or something...
> or a confirmation ... load/save works though...

Hmm, ok.

> +1:
> No error message generated if you assign the same key
> to two actions, and only one action is performed.

It might be hard to check on that. But I can see to it.

> Keybindings help text is not adjusted to what is set
> in the ini file.

True, so isn't the manual.txt. I might add "Default" to it tough.

> +1:
> A turn counter or some indication of wait turns passing...

Hmm, where?

> +1:
> Be nice to assign more than one key to an action...

Unfortunately that's an issue with Valkyrie I think.. I'll look to that.

> +1: An alternative pickup key that never picks up weapons
> only unloads them, but picks up everything else.

Oh come on! Soooo easy?

> +1: Don't make the same loading sound when they try to
> switch to a weapon they don't have.

Hmm, ok.

> +1:
> Real time clock timer and a fast player alternative high
> score list AND/OR added to standard high score scoring.

??
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Come on, Kornel. 11 years and no binary? And it's not
vapourware?" -- Mike Blackney
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 2:42:55 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> ABCGi wrote:
>
>> Freakin' awesome, well done.
>
> :-D
>
> > Full play test
>
>> report later but love the sounds (should add
>> the bang bang bang noise and slurps in the
>> intro), and the credits are nice too.
>
> Credits?
>
>> I would of done the music in the ini file
>> without extension and look for mp3 first
>> in not exist goto mid named the same - so
>> players don't have to edit ini file.
>
> I made it as it is, cause the names that are available now, are the
> original ones, and don't need any fidling around if you just download
> them from somewhere else.

hmmm I didn't explain that very well...

MUSIC4 = "music/e1m1"

if e1m1.mp3 exist use it, otherwise use e1m1.mid
requires renaming "11 - hangar.mid" to e1m1.mid

>> Prefer game not close down at finish, I
>> add this to batch file;
>>
>> :label
>> doomrl
>> goto label
>>
>> alt-enter and click x to quit. Ugly :) 
>
> LOL! My friend had such an autoexec.bat on his DOS machine!
>
> If you want I can add an option in the ini-file -- RESTARTATDEATH ?

Yes please :) 

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 2:42:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
>
> hmmm I didn't explain that very well...
>
> MUSIC4 = "music/e1m1"
>
> if e1m1.mp3 exist use it, otherwise use e1m1.mid
> requires renaming "11 - hangar.mid" to e1m1.mid

Yes, but this way, the MIDI's wont work "out of the box".

>> LOL! My friend had such an autoexec.bat on his DOS machine!
>>
>> If you want I can add an option in the ini-file -- RESTARTATDEATH ?
>
>
> Yes please :) 

Ok ;-)
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Gott weiss, Ich will kein Engel sein..." -- Rammstein /Engel/
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:34:05 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Bateau wrote:
> grue@mail.ru (Timofei Shatrov) wrote:
>>On Sun, 01 May 2005 00:39:13 +0200, Kornel Kisielewicz
>><kisielewicz@gazeta.pl> tried to confuse everyone with this message:
>>>AngeloB wrote:
*SNIP*
>>>>Btw, I like the ascii-pics of the monsters. Would it possible to, for
>>>>example, put the monster's pic that killed you in the mortem file? ;) 
>>>
>>>Well it would, but I think it isn't a good idea. Those ASCII pics look
>>>cool because they are coulored. Without colors the comletely don't look
>>>like the oroginal :-/
>>
>>Well, people at alt.ascii-art could do them better...
>
> That's exactly what I was going to say. Where's ABCGi? He is more
> respected there than me :D 

Sif not respect Bateau :)  I can ask - but what are we
going to ask for?

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:34:06 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
>> That's exactly what I was going to say. Where's ABCGi? He is more
>> respected there than me :D 
>
>
> Sif not respect Bateau :)  I can ask - but what are we
> going to ask for?

To be honest, I was thinking about ASCII images of Doom Weapons and
items. I don't have an idea tough, how to plug such "more info on item"
to the interface. Also, remakes of the monsters might be cool -- but I
doubt they would color them...
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Gott weiss, Ich will kein Engel sein..." -- Rammstein /Engel/
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:42:47 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> ABCGi wrote:
>
>> +1:
>> "mode con cp select=473" returns
>> The code page specified is not valid.
>
> Hmm... No idea :-)

That's the error I get running your batch file,
if I do it line by line.

>> -1:
>> TAB - target cycle is in the keybindings text after
>> all. ;)  like twice or so ! doh
>
> I don't get it ?

I was saying I'm an idiot :) 

>> -1:
>> You mention redefinition of keybindings in ini file
>> so I can make 'G' the Unload command. I think more
>> users if they don't have to edit ini file though.
>
> What do you suggest?

Like you said an options menu that effectively
just edits the ini file... bit of effort though
for not much gameplay reward. Depends how "perfect"
you want this thing.... muwhahahah!

>> +1:
>> If have a bleeding state - need to have a bandage
>> command feature?
>
> Nah, that would be complicating things.

True. Of course taking a med kit would save
you from bleeding to death - does it also
stop the bleeding - it should.

>> +1:
>> RunOverItems = TRUE; - fair nuff :) 
>
> :-D
>
>> auto names is cool too
>
> You just discovered it? ;-)

Yeah - mesa stoopid ;) 

>> But % gibs still stop the run and you can't
>> run over them even standing adjacent, or if
>> standing on them and there is an item next
>> door (even with above on)... ie needs a bit
>> of work.
>
> Okay, okay, I'll do that :) 

Did I mention that gibs stop the run command...
not sure if I did... ;P

>> +1:
>> Mention on save that it will be loaded on next level.
>> "You camp on the way down the stairs" or something...
>> or a confirmation ... load/save works though...
>
> Hmm, ok.

kinda pedantic though isn't it... I just got a surprise
first time I loaded to be on a new level!

>> +1:
>> No error message generated if you assign the same key
>> to two actions, and only one action is performed.
>
> It might be hard to check on that. But I can see to it.

It is kind of easy to do when manually editing... well
for non-geeks anyway.

>> Keybindings help text is not adjusted to what is set
>> in the ini file.
>
> True, so isn't the manual.txt. I might add "Default" to it tough.

Yeah bit easier to say "Default Keybindings" ;) 

>> +1:
>> A turn counter or some indication of wait turns passing...
>
> Hmm, where?

bottom right...?

>> +1:
>> Be nice to assign more than one key to an action...
>
> Unfortunately that's an issue with Valkyrie I think.. I'll look to that.

Only nice to have anyway.

>> +1: An alternative pickup key that never picks up weapons
>> only unloads them, but picks up everything else.
>
> Oh come on! Soooo easy?

True - mesa lazy...

How about an auto pickup mode - actually forget that.

>> +1: Don't make the same loading sound when they try to
>> switch to a weapon they don't have.
>
> Hmm, ok.
>
>> +1:
>> Real time clock timer and a fast player alternative high
>> score list AND/OR added to standard high score scoring.
>
> ??

Like speed chess. A real time clock counts as you play, to
see how fast you can defeat the game. Or on harder skill
levels you have to find the stairs before timer runs out
or your health starts draining ("poison gas is filling
the chamber!").

These are all really just extras - the game is brilliant
in its own right - I'm just finding whatever I can, which
isn't much!

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:42:48 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>>> -1:
>>> TAB - target cycle is in the keybindings text after
>>> all. ;)  like twice or so ! doh
>>
>>
>> I don't get it ?
>
> I was saying I'm an idiot :) 

An that's a -1? Unfair :-D

>>> -1:
>>> You mention redefinition of keybindings in ini file
>>> so I can make 'G' the Unload command. I think more
>>> users if they don't have to edit ini file though.
>>
>> What do you suggest?
>
> Like you said an options menu that effectively
> just edits the ini file... bit of effort though
> for not much gameplay reward. Depends how "perfect"
> you want this thing.... muwhahahah!

True ;-). I may make something like an Config-File-Edit module for
Valkyrie though -- and it would be reusable for
DiabloRL/GenRogue/Anyother game I make/Anyone using Vaklyrie.

>>> +1:
>>> If have a bleeding state - need to have a bandage
>>> command feature?
>>
>>
>> Nah, that would be complicating things.
>
> True. Of course taking a med kit would save
> you from bleeding to death - does it also
> stop the bleeding - it should.

It does ;-)

>>> auto names is cool too
>>
>> You just discovered it? ;-)
>
> Yeah - mesa stoopid ;) 

You know ABCGi is among them ;-).

>>> +1: An alternative pickup key that never picks up weapons
>>> only unloads them, but picks up everything else.
>>
>> Oh come on! Soooo easy?
>
> True - mesa lazy...
>
> How about an auto pickup mode - actually forget that.

LOL ;-)
Considering the limited inventory space, that's not wise.

> Like speed chess. A real time clock counts as you play, to
> see how fast you can defeat the game. Or on harder skill
> levels you have to find the stairs before timer runs out
> or your health starts draining ("poison gas is filling
> the chamber!").

Fast in realtime you mean? Cool ;-)
BTW -- I was thinking about lava/acid flooding levels...

> These are all really just extras - the game is brilliant
> in its own right - I'm just finding whatever I can, which
> isn't much!

But good. I need to work mostly on replayability now (it's low) any ideas?
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Due to Pascal's original purpose as a teaching language it forces one
to learn good habits - and those good habits stay with you, even when
you later migrate to a much more forgiving language." - Sherm Pendley
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:42:49 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> Like you said an options menu that effectively
>> just edits the ini file... bit of effort though
>> for not much gameplay reward. Depends how "perfect"
>> you want this thing.... muwhahahah!
>
> True ;-). I may make something like an Config-File-Edit module for
> Valkyrie though -- and it would be reusable for
> DiabloRL/GenRogue/Anyother game I make/Anyone using Vaklyrie.

Well, then, we can expect to see it, oh, probably shortly after
GenRogue's first release. ;) 

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:42:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Twisted One wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>
>>> Like you said an options menu that effectively
>>> just edits the ini file... bit of effort though
>>> for not much gameplay reward. Depends how "perfect"
>>> you want this thing.... muwhahahah!
>>
>>
>> True ;-). I may make something like an Config-File-Edit module for
>> Valkyrie though -- and it would be reusable for
>> DiabloRL/GenRogue/Anyother game I make/Anyone using Vaklyrie.
>
> Well, then, we can expect to see it, oh, probably shortly after
> GenRogue's first release. ;) 

*giggles*
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
My opinions are my own. Share them at your own risk.
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:44:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> ABCGi wrote:
>
>>
>> hmmm I didn't explain that very well...
>>
>> MUSIC4 = "music/e1m1"
>>
>> if e1m1.mp3 exist use it, otherwise use e1m1.mid
>> requires renaming "11 - hangar.mid" to e1m1.mid
>
> Yes, but this way, the MIDI's wont work "out of the box".

Ah. But midi's so small - when will you ever not
distribute them with your game?

Anyway I'm just being fussy - but most ppl will want
MP3's.

>>> LOL! My friend had such an autoexec.bat on his DOS machine!
>>>
>>> If you want I can add an option in the ini-file -- RESTARTATDEATH ?
>>
>> Yes please :) 
>
> Ok ;-)

Ta :) 

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 3:45:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> Yes, but this way, the MIDI's wont work "out of the box".
>
> Ah. But midi's so small - when will you ever not
> distribute them with your game?

Copyright issues :-(.
--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"Well, the philosophy of the World of Shadows is based on most of the
degenerate, immoral and foremost amoral philosophical beliefs of our
world exagarated to the maximum." --Anubis
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 4:23:53 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
> ABCGi wrote:
>
>>> But they're licenced :-(. I don't know how much of an infraction is
>>> that. Maybe a confirmation page that appears after clicking download
>>> would be enough? I mean that those MIDIs and WAVs are available at
>>> any editing site, and I just packaged them in...
>>
>> I thought Id released Doom into the public domain or
>> open source. Or is this just the source code.
>
> Just the source code. You can't get all 3 episodes legaly without paying.

Oh I see. Bummer. *backs out of room*

>>> :-). I wonder what more can be added there.
>>
>> #times bleeding
>
> I don't know if it's of any revelance ;-)

I love little stats like that, and its not hard to collect.

>> #times under 10% health
>
> This OTOH may be -- although it would be hard to count -- example -- you
> get shot, go 7%hp (check). Now you get shot again -- 6% (check? if not,
> then how to differentiate between the former? -- ok, a flag), now medkit
> -- 31%. Hit again, hit again -- 10% (check?)

The idea is how many times you get close to death. So I guess
back up above 50% will reset the check.

#times near death:

>> #real time clock of playtime
>
> Hard ;-). I'm not much into reltime clocks in FP. But doable.
>
>> #real time/turn average
>
> Kheh ;-). Would be in miliseconds I guess...

Yeah this idea is a bit wacky.

*SNIP*

>>>> * User should not have to fiddle with ini files etc
>>>> To appeal to more than just us high end geeks :) 
>>>
>>> You mean an "options" menu instead?
>>
>> Yeah, if you want even greater popularity you need
>> the lowest common denominator ;) 
>
> Ahhh. But I'd rather work on the AI or DunGen instead...

True - don't want to waste your time.

*SNIP*

>>>> Should there be a time limit before it continues
>>>> to next screen instead of waiting for SPACE?
>>>
>>> ??
>>
>> On the intro, should it go to the next page automatically
>> after 10 seconds.
>
> Not everybody reads so fast :-D. Okay, okay, kiddin.

Not very important anyway.

*SNIP*

>>>> * Target stay at same empty point aimed at last turn.
>>>> I often shoot into the dark a full clip to "test the
>>>> waters" ;) 
>>>
>>> AI needs a redesign, I know ;-)
>>
>> Oh but what I meant was my target aim should stay where
>> it was last turn if no monsters around so I can "strafe"
>> across empty space.
>
> So if no monsters around, then target relative last square?

I shoot at an empty square, if no monsters around
leave target at same square next time I hit 'f'
rather than reseting it back to my body. I can
then adjust my aim slightly to strafe the black space.

>>> Oh come on ;-). How do you imagine that interface wise?
>>
>> Press '1' equip pistol
>> Press '1' again equip dual pistol (if 2nd pistol exist)
>
> No way! I won't go into the two weapons under one key pitfall again! Die
> QuickKey code!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA! Now I remember...

SHIFT 1 to dual wield? There is a RL that already
does dual wield with guns and it works sweet.

>> Press 'r'eload reloads first pistol if required
>> Press 'r'eload reloads second pistol if first pistol full
>>
>> In the words of Ben Stiller: "DO IT!!!!" ;) 
>
> Uhhh....

"Starskey and Hutch"

>>>> Great great great game - much harder and therefore much more
>>>> replayability, as of course defeating it does take a shine off
>>>> the challenge factor. That seems to be enough feedback :) 
>>>
>>> I want someone to post a YASD or YAVP on rgr.misc! I'm eager to see
>>> how people play...
>>
>> Haven't done either yet :)  Also don't really have any exciting
>> screenies either yet!
>
> Please do! ;-)

You got it... thanks again for the game.

--
ABCGi ---- (abcgi@yahoo.com) ---- http://codemonkey.sunsite.dk
Fun RLs in rgrd that I have tested recently!
DoomRL - DwellerMobile - HWorld - AburaTan - DiabloBand
Heroic Adventure - Tower of Doom - Tendrils - TheTombs
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 4:23:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
> Kornel Kisielewicz wrote:
>> I don't know if it's of any revelance ;-)
>
> I love little stats like that, and its not hard to collect.

But I think it would be statisticaly average -- it doesn't depend on
anything except RNG.

>>> #times under 10% health
>>
>> This OTOH may be -- although it would be hard to count -- example --
>> you get shot, go 7%hp (check). Now you get shot again -- 6% (check? if
>> not, then how to differentiate between the former? -- ok, a flag), now
>> medkit -- 31%. Hit again, hit again -- 10% (check?)
>
> The idea is how many times you get close to death. So I guess
> back up above 50% will reset the check.

Ah. Hmm... two flags I guess.

>>>> AI needs a redesign, I know ;-)
>>>
>>> Oh but what I meant was my target aim should stay where
>>> it was last turn if no monsters around so I can "strafe"
>>> across empty space.
>>
>> So if no monsters around, then target relative last square?
>
> I shoot at an empty square, if no monsters around
> leave target at same square next time I hit 'f'
> rather than reseting it back to my body. I can
> then adjust my aim slightly to strafe the black space.

Hmm, ok.

>>>> Oh come on ;-). How do you imagine that interface wise?
>>>
>>>
>>> Press '1' equip pistol
>>> Press '1' again equip dual pistol (if 2nd pistol exist)
>>
>> No way! I won't go into the two weapons under one key pitfall again!
>> Die QuickKey code!
>
> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA! Now I remember...
>
> SHIFT 1 to dual wield? There is a RL that already
> does dual wield with guns and it works sweet.

Don't you see that that is a QuickKey monster, just in disguise? ;-)

--
At your service,
Kornel Kisielewicz (charonATmagma-net.pl) [http://chaos.magma-net.pl]
"It's much easier to make an army of dumb good people than to
make one single smart good guy..." -- DarkGod
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 4:23:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.development,rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

ABCGi wrote:
>>> In the words of Ben Stiller: "DO IT!!!!" ;) 
>>
>> Uhhh....
>
> "Starskey and Hutch"

Who?, Who?, and Who?

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."
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