[Crawl] YACG -- Iron Man

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Actually, not "yet another," but the first challenge game ever, I think.

Who needs challenge games in Crawl, which is enough of a challenge in
itself already? Heck if I know, but challenge games can be fun in that
they can explore aspects of a roguelike that otherwise are
little-noticed, and can make it "a different game."

"Iron Man" is an old classic from ADOMland, where it takes place in that
game's only Angband-like dungeon. Crawl Ironman will be necessarily a
little different.

Rules:
------

1. Only main-dungeon down staircases can be taken until you reach D:27.
Only up staircases can be taken after you reach D:27.
2. Once the first relevant main-dungeon staircase on a level enters your
main-map view, only moves that decrease the distance to the staircase or
keep it the same are legal. Once you're standing on it, you have to
either rest or go down. If you are involuntarily teleported away from
the stairs, you must take the next staircase to enter your main view
(which may be the original staircase).
3. Until you reach D:27, your Iron Man Rating is the deepest level you
reach. If you reach the bottom, your rating starts increasing for each
level upwards you reach. Thus the highest possible rating is 53 (27 + 26).
4. Deliberately taking actions with a reasonable chance of taking you
off the current dungeon level are not allowed (examples: Portal,
Banishment, fishing for banishment via distortion, Zot, cards, miscasts,
or monsters' banishment attacks).
5. Have fun.

Musings:
--------

- Combos that aren't too dependent on found equipment have an advantage.
This is good for natural monks and characters with nasty equipment
restrictions (spriggans, ogres, etc.).
- Combos that don't need to take a god have an advantage in that you
can't enter the Temple. This is good for demigods, berserkers, priests,
paladins, chaos knights, and Y death knights.
- Combos that have less than usual to gain from slow diving have an
advantage. This is good for all religious characters whose god's piety
decreases with time (most relevantly berserkers, M chaos knights, Y
death knights).
- Magic mapping helps, since only stairs on the main map count (though
if you see it past an obstacle on the main map due to magic mapping, you
still "have to go there"). This is good for gnomes.

Erik

 

[Loonie]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper .-- .-. --- - . ---...

> Actually, not "yet another," but the first challenge game ever, I think.
>
> Who needs challenge games in Crawl, which is enough of a challenge in
> itself already? Heck if I know, but challenge games can be fun in that
> they can explore aspects of a roguelike that otherwise are
> little-noticed, and can make it "a different game."
>
> "Iron Man" is an old classic from ADOMland, where it takes place in that
> game's only Angband-like dungeon. Crawl Ironman will be necessarily a
> little different.
>
> Rules:
> ------
>
> 1. Only main-dungeon down staircases can be taken until you reach D:27.
> Only up staircases can be taken after you reach D:27.

This is kinda unclear in Crawl, the goal is orb of zot, so I'm surprised
that the objective is omitted. I think modification of this rules with
going straight for three runes first then for orb and then upstairs will be
more logical. BTW If one manage to 27 going up is less dangerous I guess,
even through unexplored levels.

--
Loonie
---------------------------------------
Respondit Pilatus quod scripsi scripsi.
http://www.crawl.webpark.pl

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Loonie wrote:
> Erik Piper .-- .-. --- - . ---...
>
>
>>Actually, not "yet another," but the first challenge game ever, I think.
>>
>>Who needs challenge games in Crawl, which is enough of a challenge in
>>itself already? Heck if I know, but challenge games can be fun in that
>>they can explore aspects of a roguelike that otherwise are
>>little-noticed, and can make it "a different game."
>>
>>"Iron Man" is an old classic from ADOMland, where it takes place in that
>>game's only Angband-like dungeon. Crawl Ironman will be necessarily a
>>little different.
>>
>>Rules:
>>------
>>
>>1. Only main-dungeon down staircases can be taken until you reach D:27.
>>Only up staircases can be taken after you reach D:27.
>
>
> This is kinda unclear in Crawl, the goal is orb of zot, so I'm surprised
> that the objective is omitted. I think modification of this rules with
> going straight for three runes first then for orb and then upstairs will be
> more logical. BTW If one manage to 27 going up is less dangerous I guess,
> even through unexplored levels.

Nothing illogical; the goal of a challenge game is whatever the
challenge game's ruleset says it is, which can very well be different
than the "normal" game's goal. I prefer simple rules as they provide
less space for unclear areas (look at how much had to be cleared up even
for the simple ruleset above), so this challenge is restricted to the
main dungeon for simplicity. If you'd like a similar challenge involving
acquisition of the runes and Orb, write a ruleset and publish it; nobody
will be bothered by that.

The last 26 rating points above are far easier than the first 27, yes.
Anybody who's gotten that far deserves a bit of an easier time.

Erik

 

[Loonie]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper .-- .-. --- - . ---...
>> This is kinda unclear in Crawl, the goal is orb of zot, so I'm surprised
>> that the objective is omitted. I think modification of this rules with
>> going straight for three runes first then for orb and then upstairs will be
>> more logical. BTW If one manage to 27 going up is less dangerous I guess,
>> even through unexplored levels.
>
> Nothing illogical; the goal of a challenge game is whatever the
> challenge game's ruleset says it is, which can very well be different
> than the "normal" game's goal. I prefer simple rules as they provide
> less space for unclear areas (look at how much had to be cleared up even
> for the simple ruleset above), so this challenge is restricted to the
> main dungeon for simplicity. If you'd like a similar challenge involving
> acquisition of the runes and Orb, write a ruleset and publish it; nobody
> will be bothered by that.

Ok, I understand your point, that makes the challenge more difficult and
pure. Maybe will give it a try, of course with TrBe I guess. Is going to
the temple allowed? It seems to me than not, but what about gods then -
majority is not involved.

> The last 26 rating points above are far easier than the first 27, yes.
> Anybody who's gotten that far deserves a bit of an easier time.

Hah. I don't think there will be plenty of these, late levels are nasty for
low-levels with weak items (as I reckon Ironguys ;-)

--
Loonie
---------------------------------------
Respondit Pilatus quod scripsi scripsi.
http://www.crawl.webpark.pl

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Loonie wrote:
> Erik Piper .-- .-. --- - . ---...

> pure. Maybe will give it a try, of course with TrBe I guess. Is going to
> the temple allowed? It seems to me than not,

1. Only *main-dungeon* down staircases can be taken until you reach
D:27. Only up staircases can be taken after you reach D:27.

(emphasis added)

> but what about gods then - majority is not involved.

Right, basically unless you get lucky and encounter a random altar or
mini-temple along the way, you're limited to your starting god, i.e.
only Elyvilon, Makhleb, Trog, Y, Zin, TSO, and Xom are available, I
think. Ely/TSO/Zin seems to be the weakest of these unless you can
afford to wait around a bit, and the two slow-metabolism races can't be
healers, priests or paladins, so you'd have to hope for your spriggan or
halfling to meet a random altar, or your healer/priest/paladin
compatible race to get a ring of sustenance. Xom would be... fun...
looks like Trog, Makhleb and Y will be the most help.

Incidentally --

I'm having some sneaky thoughts about deliberately angering one's god.
Likewise a silver statue might be a godsend in Iron Man. The unifying
idea behind these sneaky thoughts is "controlled environment." Not sure
if angering one's god is worth the cost when it's so difficult to wait
out their anger. Can't remember if mummies can be death knights, but a
Mummy death knight of Y could get away with it I think, though if Y can
also banish you, that comes into conflict with rule 4.

Erik

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:

Sorry for the spammage, but practice has shown that a few more
clarifications are needed.

> Rules:
> ------
>
> 2.

(New wording)

Summary: You have to make an honest effort to continue down the main
dungeon (only) at every opportunity.

a. Once the first down staircase to a main-dungeon level enters your
main-map view, only moves guaranteed to decrease the distance to the
staircase or
keep it the same are legal. (This does mean sidestepping around the
staircase before advancing inward is OK.)
b. Distance is counted "as the crow flies," i.e. the moves to reach the
staircase disregarding any eventual obstacles.
c. Once you're standing on a valid down staircase, you have to either
rest or go down.
d. Anything that can change your position is a "move" for the above.
Thus this includes deliberately causing an outside agent to move you
(e.g. via teleportation/blinking spells or weapons of distortion).
e. If you are involuntarily moved so that the relevant staircase is no
longer in the main view, you must take the next staircase to enter the
main view (which may of course be the original staircase).

Erik

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:
> The last 26 rating points above are far easier than the first 27, yes.
> Anybody who's gotten that far deserves a bit of an easier time.

What happens if you end up in a section of level with no secret doors
you can find and no stair going in the appropriate direction?

--
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
Palladium? Trusted Computing? DRM? Microsoft? Sauron.
"One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them
One ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them."

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Twisted One wrote:
> Erik Piper wrote:
>
>> The last 26 rating points above are far easier than the first 27, yes.
>> Anybody who's gotten that far deserves a bit of an easier time.
>
>
> What happens if you end up in a section of level with no secret doors
> you can find and no stair going in the appropriate direction?

Falls within the "honest effort" clause (not in the original ruleset,
but in an addendum later on) -- you get to explore it fully, of course,
and then get to go back up.

Erik

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:

> Erik Piper wrote:

<snip>

> a. Once the first down staircase to a main-dungeon level enters your
> main-map view, only moves guaranteed to decrease the distance to the
> staircase or
> keep it the same are legal. (This does mean sidestepping around the
> staircase before advancing inward is OK.)

Mummy spellcasters should probably be outlawed. They can sit in one
spot pretty much indefinitely, or until a storm dragon gets generated.