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Crawl Character Dumps

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Anonymous
June 8, 2005 4:03:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

How does one get those neat character dumps with all the resistances and
stuff listed up at the beginning? Please excuse me if this information
is easy to locate, but I haven't found it.

More about : crawl character dumps

Anonymous
June 8, 2005 5:21:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Elethiomel wrote:
> How does one get those neat character dumps with all the resistances and
> stuff listed up at the beginning? Please excuse me if this information
> is easy to locate, but I haven't found it.

By playing TileCrawl. :-)

(http://crawlj.sourceforge.jp/down_e.html)

Erik
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 5:21:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Elethiomel <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> writes:

[Tile Crawl dump]
> [...] I'm sure people who play non-tile Crawl would be happy to have
> a superior char dump tool available!

I've been planning to merge Tile Crawl's dump improvements and
bugfixes into the travel patch for a while now. Maybe I'll finally get
moving on it.

The randart shuffle between Tile Crawl and the travel patched ASCII
Crawl is because of the different compilers used. Tile Crawl uses
Borland's compiler, I use MinGW. Ideally, Crawl should include its own
RNG to make save files more portable.

--
Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> Deus vult
Related resources
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 5:35:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:
> Elethiomel wrote:
>
>> How does one get those neat character dumps with all the resistances
>> and stuff listed up at the beginning? Please excuse me if this
>> information is easy to locate, but I haven't found it.
>
>
> By playing TileCrawl. :-)
>
> (http://crawlj.sourceforge.jp/down_e.html)
>
> Erik

Thanks!

Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
dumps. :-)
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:06:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Elethiomel wrote:

> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
> game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
> dumps. :-)

Maybe the saves are compatible, so you can use TileCrawl as a dump tool
:-) Or just extract the dump routine from the huge TileCrawl diff and
apply it to your Crawl source (If I find a few hours to spare maybe I'll
do it).

Lars
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:06:49 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

bwross@csclub.uwaterloo.ca (Brent Ross) writes:
> In article <y89kkf3m.fsf@gmail.com>,
> Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
[...]
> // I've been planning to merge Tile Crawl's dump improvements and
> // bugfixes into the travel patch for a while now. Maybe I'll finally get
> // moving on it.

> Hopefully things aren't getting too entrenched. I'd like to add
> your UI stuff, but if you've got Gavin's stuff glued in there now
> then there will be fairly large problems

The standalone travel patch is still around.

> // The randart shuffle between Tile Crawl and the travel patched ASCII
> // Crawl is because of the different compilers used.
[...]
> [...] I also figured (at a different point) that it might be about
> time to stop randomly generating them on the fly and started storing
> and saving the properties (and many potentially useful things can
> come of this other than efficiency and compatibility).

As a long term fix, storing the properties themselves sounds a whole
lot better indeed.

--
Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> Deus vult
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:16:03 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 13:35:48 +0200, Elethiomel <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm>
wrote:

>Erik Piper wrote:
>> Elethiomel wrote:
>>
>>> How does one get those neat character dumps with all the resistances
>>> and stuff listed up at the beginning? Please excuse me if this
>>> information is easy to locate, but I haven't found it.
>>
>>
>> By playing TileCrawl. :-)
>>
>> (http://crawlj.sourceforge.jp/down_e.html)
>>
>> Erik
>
>Thanks!
>
>Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>dumps. :-)

--
R. Dan Henry
danhenry@inreach.com
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:16:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 13:35:48 +0200, Elethiomel <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm>
wrote:

>Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>dumps. :-)

While I prefer ASCII visually, TileCrawl includes (a somewhat old)
Darshan patch, a nice visual display indicating friendly monsters (a
heart) -- great if you're summoning or creating undead armies, and
fixes at least one bug (quarterstaves don't block punching). Most of
the nicenesses come from Darshan's patch collection, so you might want
to try ASCII Crawl patched.

--
R. Dan Henry
danhenry@inreach.com
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:32:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Lars Kecke wrote:
> Elethiomel wrote:
>
>> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>> game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>> dumps. :-)
>
>
> Maybe the saves are compatible, so you can use TileCrawl as a dump tool
> :-) Or just extract the dump routine from the huge TileCrawl diff and
> apply it to your Crawl source (If I find a few hours to spare maybe I'll
> do it).

Although I do know some programming, I don't read source well - it's
been quite some time since I practiced my skills. I'd have to compile
it, anyway, and I don't know that I have a C compiler handy (Crawl is
written in C, right?). But I'm sure people who play non-tile Crawl would
be happy to have a superior char dump tool available!
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:45:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Lars Kecke wrote:
> Elethiomel wrote:
>
>> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>> game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>> dumps. :-)
>
>
> Maybe the saves are compatible, so you can use TileCrawl as a dump tool
> :-) Or just extract the dump routine from the huge TileCrawl diff and
> apply it to your Crawl source (If I find a few hours to spare maybe I'll
> do it).
>
> Lars

The saves are compatible inasmuch as the two versions won't crash (or at
least haven't in the ~30 minutes overall I've spent in such situations)
when working with each others' saves. However, their map representations
are incompatible; you essentially have to either manually rebuild your
level maps through re-exploration, or just put up with it. It's too
complicated to explain, but in short, the maps get really screwed up.

Not sure what the incompatibility does to dump maps, but in any case, I
suppose just grafting the TileCrawl character summary onto the
ASCIICrawl remainder would suffice. You'd probably want to make, and
revert to, a backup rather than letting TileCrawl mess with the save,
though.

Erik
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 7:58:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Erik Piper wrote:
> Lars Kecke wrote:
>
>> Elethiomel wrote:
>>
>>> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>>> game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>>> dumps. :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Maybe the saves are compatible, so you can use TileCrawl as a dump
>> tool :-) Or just extract the dump routine from the huge TileCrawl diff
>> and apply it to your Crawl source (If I find a few hours to spare
>> maybe I'll do it).
>>
>> Lars
>
>
> The saves are compatible inasmuch as the two versions won't crash (or at
> least haven't in the ~30 minutes overall I've spent in such situations)
> when working with each others' saves. However, their map representations
> are incompatible; you essentially have to either manually rebuild your
> level maps through re-exploration, or just put up with it. It's too
> complicated to explain, but in short, the maps get really screwed up.

There's another incompatibility: Randarts change across versions. So
randart resistances aren't calculated correctly into the character summary.

> Not sure what the incompatibility does to dump maps, but in any case, I
> suppose just grafting the TileCrawl character summary onto the
> ASCIICrawl remainder would suffice. You'd probably want to make, and
> revert to, a backup rather than letting TileCrawl mess with the save,
> though.
>
> Erik
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 8:33:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

In article <y89kkf3m.fsf@gmail.com>,
Darshan Shaligram <scintilla@gmail.com> wrote:
// Elethiomel <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> writes:
//
// [Tile Crawl dump]
// > [...] I'm sure people who play non-tile Crawl would be happy to have
// > a superior char dump tool available!
//
// I've been planning to merge Tile Crawl's dump improvements and
// bugfixes into the travel patch for a while now. Maybe I'll finally get
// moving on it.

Hopefully things aren't getting too entrenched. I'd like to add your UI
stuff, but if you've got Gavin's stuff glued in there now then there
will be fairly large problems (it's actually filled with all kinds of
bugs and misconceptions... it even creates piles of additional ones,
like providing messages for multiple levels of mutations that aren't
implemented and such). If you could try and isolate your stuff a bit
it'd make it easier to merge.

// The randart shuffle between Tile Crawl and the travel patched ASCII
// Crawl is because of the different compilers used. Tile Crawl uses
// Borland's compiler, I use MinGW. Ideally, Crawl should include its own
// RNG to make save files more portable.

Actually, I implemented the ability to include the GSL a while back so
I could switch the RNG freely around... thus adding piles of different
RNGs to screw with compatibiliy if people wanted to. However, I also
figured (at a different point) that it might be about time to stop
randomly generating them on the fly and started storing and saving the
properties (and many potentially useful things can come of this other
than efficiency and compatibility).

Brent Ross
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 3:03:58 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Elethiomel" <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> wrote in message
news:42a6d9fb@news.broadpark.no...
> Erik Piper wrote:
>> Elethiomel wrote:
>>
>>> How does one get those neat character dumps with all the resistances
>>> and stuff listed up at the beginning? Please excuse me if this
>>> information is easy to locate, but I haven't found it.
>>
>>
>> By playing TileCrawl. :-)
>>
>> (http://crawlj.sourceforge.jp/down_e.html)
>>
>> Erik
>
> Thanks!
>
> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
> game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
> dumps. :-)

Why don't you like tilecrawl? Just the idea of tiles puts you off?

--
Glen
L:p yt E+++ T-- R+ P+++ D+ G+ F:*band !RL RLA-
W:AF Q+++ AI++ GFX++ SFX-- RN++++ PO--- !Hp Re-- S+
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 3:03:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Glen Wheeler wrote:
> "Elethiomel" <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> wrote in message
<snip>
>>Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>>game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>>dumps. :-)
>
>
> Why don't you like tilecrawl? Just the idea of tiles puts you off?

Well, yes. I'm an ASCII maniac. Somehow, H-World didn't put me off tiles
that much though; I think it was the overlays, and the ease with which I
could tell which tile something was on. Looking at TileCrawl's dragon,
for instance, it takes effort for me to see which tile it is occupying;
it looks when I glance at it like it's a four-tile monster. IVAN has
good tiles; they're iconic, and the map view is top-down, this helps.

So... the way they're implemented puts me off, rather than tiles
themselves. I don't know why though.
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 3:04:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Elethiomel wrote:
> Glen Wheeler wrote:
>
>> "Elethiomel" <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> wrote in message
>
> <snip>
>
>>> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>>> game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>>> dumps. :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Why don't you like tilecrawl? Just the idea of tiles puts you off?
>
>
> Well, yes. I'm an ASCII maniac. Somehow, H-World didn't put me off tiles
> that much though; I think it was the overlays, and the ease with which I
> could tell which tile something was on. Looking at TileCrawl's dragon,
> for instance, it takes effort for me to see which tile it is occupying;
> it looks when I glance at it like it's a four-tile monster. IVAN has
> good tiles; they're iconic, and the map view is top-down, this helps.
>
> So... the way they're implemented puts me off, rather than tiles
> themselves. I don't know why though.

Just started actual TileCrawl instead of looking at old screenshots on
the website and a few I had lying around, I must say that the current
default tileset is MUCH better. Much, much better. I may try it out with
a few of my next characters.
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 4:01:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

"Elethiomel" <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> wrote in message
news:42a6f8a3$1@news.broadpark.no...
> Elethiomel wrote:
>> Glen Wheeler wrote:
>>
>>> "Elethiomel" <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm> wrote in message
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>> Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my
>>>> own game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat
>>>> character dumps. :-)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Why don't you like tilecrawl? Just the idea of tiles puts you
>>> off?
>>
>>
>> Well, yes. I'm an ASCII maniac. Somehow, H-World didn't put me off
>> tiles that much though; I think it was the overlays, and the ease
>> with which I could tell which tile something was on. Looking at
>> TileCrawl's dragon, for instance, it takes effort for me to see which
>> tile it is occupying; it looks when I glance at it like it's a
>> four-tile monster. IVAN has good tiles; they're iconic, and the map
>> view is top-down, this helps.
>>
>> So... the way they're implemented puts me off, rather than tiles
>> themselves. I don't know why though.
>
> Just started actual TileCrawl instead of looking at old screenshots on
> the website and a few I had lying around, I must say that the current
> default tileset is MUCH better. Much, much better. I may try it out
> with a few of my next characters.

I *was* just about to post that the default is top-down. I remember
the old ISO-Angband (while good IMO) had awkward controls and a few
viewing problems due to it using a tileset designed for top-down
(dimetric, probably a new word) view.

--
Glen
L:p yt E+++ T-- R+ P+++ D+ G+ F:*band !RL RLA-
W:AF Q+++ AI++ GFX++ SFX-- RN++++ PO--- !Hp Re-- S+
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 7:50:47 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

R. Dan Henry wrote:
> On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 13:35:48 +0200, Elethiomel <kkkk@lllllll.mmmm>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Too bad, though. I don't like what I've seen of TileCrawl, and my own
>>game enjoyment is slightly more important than super neat character
>>dumps. :-)
>
>
> While I prefer ASCII visually, TileCrawl includes (a somewhat old)
> Darshan patch, a nice visual display indicating friendly monsters (a
> heart) -- great if you're summoning or creating undead armies, and
> fixes at least one bug (quarterstaves don't block punching). Most of
> the nicenesses come from Darshan's patch collection, so you might want
> to try ASCII Crawl patched.
>

I am running ASCII Crawl patched with Darshan's travel patch (used the
"Windows binaries with all patches applied" download link), which I like
very much. It's one of the rasons why I prefer playing Crawl, actually -
getting from place to place is so much more convenient and tedium-free
than in other roguelikes. Removal of tedium is a very good thing in
games, MMORPGs nonwithstanding.

Too bad my news server apparently doesn't carry Darshan's replies, for
some reason. I only see the quoted parts of them, by other posters. :( 
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 8:22:00 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.misc (More info?)

Elethiomel wrote:
> R. Dan Henry wrote:

> I am running ASCII Crawl patched with Darshan's travel patch (used the
> "Windows binaries with all patches applied" download link), which I like
> very much. It's one of the rasons why I prefer playing Crawl, actually -
> getting from place to place is so much more convenient and tedium-free
> than in other roguelikes. Removal of tedium is a very good thing in
> games, MMORPGs nonwithstanding.

Crawl is special for me in another way -- it's one of the few roguelikes
where a tiled version player doesn't have to choose between small tile
sizes that lead to eyestrain and large tile sizes that cause excessive
scrolling. It's ironic, because the root cause of this advantage is the
main view size that one then-newcomer to Crawl once described like...

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.games.roguelike...

....this.

:-)

Erik
!