-Crawl- Pan easier than the hells?

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It's been my first run through Pan with any crawl character, and i'm
finding it *much* easier than any of the hells. The hells really can
cause problems with the summons turning up at the most inconvenient
times, and no guarenteed time to rest and heal. Plus as i've mentioned
earlier the trips to the abyss can be a pain :)

The only times i've had any problems are with finger trouble and moving
around too quickly without paying attention. That's despite my best
stat being dex, my next best int (13), and str (11) with a great flail
weilding dwarf! Skills are clearly much more important than attributes.
even my magic isn't too terrible.

So am I missing something fundamental, or am i correct and Pan is
easier than the hells? One of my last nemelex punishments (been a long
time now, he still doesn't seem to be bored of me) was a pan banishment
when i was in one of the hells. it was a picnic in comparison and i
netted a rune from one of the special levels with no real problems.

Anyway off on holiday soon so you wont get bored with my posts for a
week and a bit :) Hopefully this chap can get all the runes, that's
certainly the plan. 4 special runes in pan plus any number of demonic
ones isn't it? Still reckon the golden rune has the capacity to kill me
no matter how buff a crawl character gets :) (excepting perhaps torment
resistant ones).


Rich
 
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Carrying on from this, there are tough spots in Pan. Multiple type 1
demons that torment are to be avoided at all costs. Still alive though,
but I'm getting bored! Have totalled lots of pan levels, but only found
one of the special levels and no demonic runes :( Defeated pan named
demons are:

Hfrxtac (Pan)
Nofigijyvifajo (Pan)
Lom Lobon (Pan) - Yeah first pan rune aside from the demonic one i
forgot to pick up on an earlier visit :)
Koh H H (Pan)
Pyhidorodyli (Pan)
Ibybekyklush (Pan)
Hutibom (Pan)
Egulyd Gudu (Pan)
Kowufemymukuk (Pan)
Ulydirol (Pan)
Dczchxkaaaaa (Pan)
Lysiriki (Pan)
Vugymag M (Pan)
Ypicyjyqutyp (Pan)
X Qumpr (Pan)
Pczchxk (Pan)
Teqykeceta (Pan)
Gisocis (Pan)
Rufeb Tev (Pan)
Eviheri (Pan)
Lerufruvuhiruv (Pan)
Tir C Xymy (Pan)
Edonejek (Pan)

Am I being really unlucky or am I missing something fundamental?
Current tactic is to cast detect creatures and items and go kill any
&'s then onto the next level. &'s that use torment a lot caused me a
couple of problems. As did one guarded by several shadow fiends. But
otherwise it's just tedious. I guess I just have to keep on going?


Rich
 
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Dafty wrote:
> Carrying on from this, there are tough spots in Pan. Multiple type 1
> demons that torment are to be avoided at all costs. Still alive though,
> but I'm getting bored! Have totalled lots of pan levels, but only found
> one of the special levels and no demonic runes :(

You've been a *little* unlucky, but not terribly so. There really is a
lot of dud levels. Seems like many of the best &-pits are the ones you
have to dig into, which is a bit of a pain.

> But otherwise it's just tedious. I guess I just have to keep on going?

Yes, and yes. :)

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In article <1125661175.040980.209300@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Dafty <richard.clements@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>Am I being really unlucky or am I missing something fundamental?
>Current tactic is to cast detect creatures and items and go kill any
>&'s then onto the next level. &'s that use torment a lot caused me a
>couple of problems. As did one guarded by several shadow fiends. But
>otherwise it's just tedious. I guess I just have to keep on going?

The '&'s are all generated in little mini-vaults. Two or three of these
minivault types have 'great'-level items generated in them. You should
be (after a little experience) able to recognise these from the item
pattern around the '&' from 'detect items'. Kill the great-item '&'s and
clear their loot, and just skip other levels as fast as you can.

Remember that there's an infinite amount of Pandemonium, so there's no
real need to clear any particular level unless you want to (with the
caveat that the four 'special' levels (Lom Lobon was one) only ever
appear once: you should be able to recognise these from the detect
monsters+items spell results).

A couple of warnings:

- Leave any level with a large number of tormenting '&'s
- Leave any level with a large nunber of hellions
- Leave any level with a large number of neqoceks unless you are wearing
an amulet of resist mutation
- In fact, leave Pandemonium ASAP unless you are wearing an amulet of
resist mutation
- Leave Pandemonium ASAP unless you have a single-turn escape mechanism
(controlled blink, couple of scroll of blinking). Teleport doesn't
count due to the delay.

If you fail to heed these warnings you Will Die Eventually[1]. Trust me,
I've lost more winnable characters in Pandemonium than you've had hot
dinners :). Some of the random '&'s can do ~80 points of damage in a
round, which after a torment or two and a bit of Hellfire from the Fiend
next door is enough to put any character in Deep Trouble.

[1] Except for the case where you haven't got an amulet of resist
mutation, in which case you'll just wish you were dead.

--
Mark Mackey
The Association for the Advancement of Dungeon Crawling
Hints, tips and spoilers
http://www.swallowtail.org/crawl/
 
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> A couple of warnings:
>
> - Leave any level with a large number of tormenting '&'s
> - Leave any level with a large nunber of hellions
> - Leave any level with a large number of neqoceks unless you are wearing
> an amulet of resist mutation
> - In fact, leave Pandemonium ASAP unless you are wearing an amulet of
> resist mutation
> - Leave Pandemonium ASAP unless you have a single-turn escape mechanism
> (controlled blink, couple of scroll of blinking). Teleport doesn't
> count due to the delay.
>

Thanks for this advice. I've now trained blink so i can get a reliable
controlled blink spell :) I've now got a magical rune, and 4 demonic
runes. If I go to one of the other 3 special levels, and leave it
without getting the rune is it gone for good? I don't *think* I've
missed one, detect items and monsters on each level i'm pretty sure
will be obvious if I see a special level.

I've had a perverse desire to go and buy that glowing quick blade i saw
in a shop and see how short blades work from scratch with my level 27
fighting, 27 maces and flails, 27 dodging and 19 or so unarmed :) I can
take pretty much everything bare handed as it is so going for as many
skills at 27 plus all the runes might this character a bit extra
special :) The other reason for this is due to shuffle punishments I
have str 10, int 13 and dex 43 :)

Still need to go get the golden rune. May take the advice of another
poster and learn takumas dance and find me a decent sword :)

The other thing that surprises me is how well I can do spellcasting
despite only 13 int. Anyway I'm off on my hols on monday, and wont get
to play this guy again until I get back, so could be a while before my
YAVP/YASD :)


Rich
 
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"Dafty" <richard.clements@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:1125739169.753533.191450@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

> Thanks for this advice. I've now trained blink so i can get a
reliable
> controlled blink spell :) I've now got a magical rune, and 4
demonic
> runes. If I go to one of the other 3 special levels, and leave
it
> without getting the rune is it gone for good? I don't *think*
I've
> missed one, detect items and monsters on each level i'm pretty
sure
> will be obvious if I see a special level.

Scrolls of magic mapping or sense surroundings from an artifact
(the mutation doesn't work -- I presume that the fact that the
artifact version does is a bug) are better ideas. I think
there's probably only two that I could tell just from Detect
Items or monsters.
And yes, they're gone for good. And yes, if you get hit by a
reaper with a scythe of distortion while you're on one of them
it's practically a given that you'll be sent into the Abyss and
then you'll hate Ctawl, so the truly paranoid among us levitate
through them.

> I've had a perverse desire to go and buy that glowing quick
blade i saw
> in a shop and see how short blades work from scratch with my
level 27
> fighting, 27 maces and flails, 27 dodging and 19 or so unarmed
:) I can
> take pretty much everything bare handed as it is so going for
as many
> skills at 27 plus all the runes might this character a bit
extra
> special :) The other reason for this is due to shuffle
punishments I
> have str 10, int 13 and dex 43 :)

You can give it a try, but bew warned: characters more
spectacular than even yours have died of hubris in Pandemonium.

> Still need to go get the golden rune. May take the advice of
another
> poster and learn takumas dance and find me a decent sword :)

I missed that post. Are you talking about Tukima's Dance for
the Tomb? I know it seems like a very clever idea, but it still
doesn't really work -- the Greater Mummies and Mummy Priests
cast abjuration by "gesturing wildly", which means they can do
it even when silenced. This will cause your weapons to fall
from the air. Not a bad way to take out the Guardian Mummies,
of which there are a lot, but the really tough ones you'll still
have to fight.

--
Jeremey