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# Looking for a Monitor GURU!

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October 16, 2012 10:53:42 AM

Hello,

I'm currently looking for a monitor, TN panels are out of the question! I am really focusing on Photography and going to school for post production which is video editing. I will be doing color correction, syncing, timing, audio, cutting, and viewing many many many movies from DSLRS, REDs, to even youtube.

So as of right now, our school has those fancy Retina displays. The viewing angels are amazing, the color pops, everything is easy to work with, etc. However, the price on those things are absurd. I know I could always go to my school for very precise editing if I'm working on a big project. I'm also using a windows machine at my house. I do play video games on my computer, nothing like first person shooters. More real time strategies such as League of Legends.

Now, I have about 1000 questions *hah*

6-bit vs 8 bit , I know there are many variations of the two (from what I've read), what would be an ideal panel to have? 6 or 8? I've read that some 6bits are capable of 16.7 million colors, so what are the main differences?

Again, I will be doing color correction.

What is an acceptable response time for games like League of Legends?

My current graphics card can only support 1920x1080, what would be the best panel size for this resolution?

If anyone could give me some advice and/or throw me some panels that will fit my needs, I would appreciate it!

My budget is 400.00, 500 tops if the panel is worth it.

Roman

a c 108 C Monitor
October 16, 2012 11:51:53 AM

there are actually 6bit (tn, va, e-ips), 8bit (p-ips, s-ips) and 10bit (h-ips) panels available. bit depth refers to how many different shades each pixel can produce. there are three pixel colors so you multiple them all together to get the maximum colors a monitor can replicate. the more colors, the more able a monitor is to match a color you create exactly.

6bit = 262,144 colors
8bit = 16,777,216 colors
10bit = 1,073,741,824 colors

if you plan on doing photography or graphic editing and require precision at bare minimum you need to buy an 8bit s-ips or p-ips panel. while e-ips may be cheaper and also may be superior to tn and va panels in a few ways it is no substitute.

a good brand 1920x1080 8bit panel is likely to set you back about \$600-650 unless prices have changed drastically since i bought mine. there is also the option of buying a refurbished model which will lower the prices.

panel size is dermined by your eyesight. the smaller the screen the sharper it is however it may be hard to see that detail for some people. most fine 20"-24" to be comfortable.

no 6bit panel is going to display 16.7 million colors. it would be an 8bit then.

what type of panel you buy depends on how serious you are. if all you plan to do is fiddle around and not accomplish anything then anything more than 6bit might be wasting money. if however you plan to either do quite a bit of schoolwork, practice or freelance work using the monitor going with at least an 8bit would be a very good idea even if you spend a little more on it then your budget allows.

i prefer my old viewsonic pro vp201b 4:3 monitor and it actually holds its price pretty well despite the model itself being 9 years or more old. do a search yourself. the nice thing about the monitor is that it has a matte display and not a glossy or anti glare coating which makes it perfect in my opinion.

just my 2 cents...
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October 16, 2012 2:22:56 PM

ssddx said:
there are actually 6bit (tn, va, e-ips), 8bit (p-ips, s-ips) and 10bit (h-ips) panels available. bit depth refers to how many different shades each pixel can produce. there are three pixel colors so you multiple them all together to get the maximum colors a monitor can replicate. the more colors, the more able a monitor is to match a color you create exactly.

6bit = 262,144 colors
8bit = 16,777,216 colors
10bit = 1,073,741,824 colors

if you plan on doing photography or graphic editing and require precision at bare minimum you need to buy an 8bit s-ips or p-ips panel. while e-ips may be cheaper and also may be superior to tn and va panels in a few ways it is no substitute.

a good brand 1920x1080 8bit panel is likely to set you back about \$600-650 unless prices have changed drastically since i bought mine. there is also the option of buying a refurbished model which will lower the prices.

panel size is dermined by your eyesight. the smaller the screen the sharper it is however it may be hard to see that detail for some people. most fine 20"-24" to be comfortable.

no 6bit panel is going to display 16.7 million colors. it would be an 8bit then.

what type of panel you buy depends on how serious you are. if all you plan to do is fiddle around and not accomplish anything then anything more than 6bit might be wasting money. if however you plan to either do quite a bit of schoolwork, practice or freelance work using the monitor going with at least an 8bit would be a very good idea even if you spend a little more on it then your budget allows.

i prefer my old viewsonic pro vp201b 4:3 monitor and it actually holds its price pretty well despite the model itself being 9 years or more old. do a search yourself. the nice thing about the monitor is that it has a matte display and not a glossy or anti glare coating which makes it perfect in my opinion.

just my 2 cents...

That's great info, but I'm going to add a thing or two -

There's a 10-bit PVA panel available for under \$400 that offers 96% of the AdobeRGB color space. It's the NEC P221w. Only 22" 1680x1050, but it's a great panel, and the "budget" choice for lots of photographers. But for video editing I don't know if AdobeRGB matters.

Also, while 6-bit e-IPS can only simulate the full 8-bit 16.7M colors, some 6-bit e-IPS panels have been reviewed to have better color accuracy than their regular 8-bit (still e-IPS) counterparts. I'm referring to the HP ZR2440w vs. ZR24w.

Anyway, ssddx is right that you should go for something at least 8-bit. I don't think you have to spend \$600 though. I'd recommend the Dell U2410, which can be had for \$450-\$500:
http://computers.pricegrabber.com/monitors/Dell-UltraSh...
It covers all your bases and at \$450 it's a steal.
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a c 108 C Monitor
October 16, 2012 3:19:07 PM

@naf

i was not aware they made 10bit pva panels. i will have to keep that in mind.

actual color accuracy can vary from panel to panel as we all know. this is why i always prefer to buy well known brands instead of the "far east specials". i was not aware e-ips is made in 8bit (i thought they were all 6bit). do you have any clarification on this?

my \$600 estimate is based on what i paid (albiet 9 years ago) and based on what this monitor and some similar products go for. as always, prices vary depending on brands and products.
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October 16, 2012 4:32:26 PM

ssddx said:
@naf

i was not aware they made 10bit pva panels. i will have to keep that in mind.

actual color accuracy can vary from panel to panel as we all know. this is why i always prefer to buy well known brands instead of the "far east specials". i was not aware e-ips is made in 8bit (i thought they were all 6bit). do you have any clarification on this?

my \$600 estimate is based on what i paid (albiet 9 years ago) and based on what this monitor and some similar products go for. as always, prices vary depending on brands and products.

The TFT Central review of the ZR24w has e-IPS(H2-IPS) and 8-bit in the spec sheet, which I found surprising (I also thought they were 6-bit only). I either don't know what the H2-IPS addition means, or they've mistaken the specs. HP's website says S-IPS, so I guess that clears that up. Sorry for the confusion. But the point still stands, that the newer HP 6-bit simulated 16.7M colors are as accurate as the old 16.7M 8-bit colors. Regardless, the OP would probably be better off with the H-IPS U2410 at \$450, so we can forget about the HPs.

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/hp_zr24w.htm

And the P221w is a niche monitor of sort — a monitor for color paranoid photographers without the cash for wide gamut IPS. So they use PVA. It doesn't have great viewing angles and it's poor for gaming, but the colors are great.
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October 16, 2012 7:13:14 PM

Thank you everyone for their replies!

As for the 6bit to 16.7million colors, here is the panel I was looking at::

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/dell_u2312hm.htm

Would this panel be less color/ responsive compared to that of Dell 2410U? It is nearly half the price.

However, as SSDDX wrote;

I will be doing mostly personal work - such as timelapse photography, color correction - since I do not own a mac, most of the video editing will be split between a Mac at my school and my own desktop at my house.

So if I was to put my work schedule into a percentage of usage, I think it would look like this:

Photography via a Canon 600D
(color/lowlight/macro/timelapse/personal) = 35%

Video Editing via many types of cameras
(cutting/color correction/syncing/School/personal) = 25%

Gaming and Entertainment

Again, thank you naf and SSDDX!

Buying a monitor is a big purchase for me, so I just want to make sure I get what I need.

I'll look into those monitors you listed. Would you recommend the same monitors after knowing what I will doing on them?

Here are some of things I will spending most of my personal work on

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October 16, 2012 10:11:40 PM

The U2312hm is a great monitor for that price. And yeah, you could have 2 of them for the cost of one U2410. Honestly you'd only notice the color accuracy difference if the two were sitting side by side, and even then it's subtle. And, when it comes to video work, you're at the mercy of whatever screen is playing the content back at the consumer's end anyway. If you routinely make prints of your photos, though, you might consider investing more in color accuracy. I decided 6-bit was adequate for me, and I'm a professional photographer (I rarely print though).

However, you still get what you pay for with monitors. My wide-gamut NEC offers peace of mind whenever I doubt the depth of the ZR2440w (not that the doubts are justified - it just happens), and I imagine the school monitors could do the same for you. Anyway, if you want a lower-cost 6-bit panel, the Dell U2412M or HP ZR2440w might be better options, primarily because they're 1920x1200 instead of 1920x1080. The value of 16:10 is a matter of opinion, but for everything you listed, except maybe League of Legends, more vertical space is preferable.

Also remember that monitors tend to be long term investments. I like to buy what I know will work well in several years. SSDDX has apparently had his for 9 years. I wouldn't want to use anything but the best I could afford for that long. Alternatively, you might not want to spend much now if you don't know what your needs will be in a few years.

Just my \$.02, hope it helps.
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October 16, 2012 11:33:00 PM

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October 16, 2012 11:33:35 PM

it has, thank you!
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October 17, 2012 7:07:20 PM

One more question;

My graphics card only support a max of 1920x1080 resolution, I dont think there is any updates for increased resolution.

If I got a 16:10, wouldn't it just stretch the resolution to fit it?

What would my other options be if that is the case?

Thank you

@naf
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October 17, 2012 7:38:34 PM

idoleyez said:
One more question;

My graphics card only support a max of 1920x1080 resolution, I dont think there is any updates for increased resolution.

If I got a 16:10, wouldn't it just stretch the resolution to fit it?

What would my other options be if that is the case?

Thank you

@naf

What graphics card do you have? It's hard to believe it would support 1080p and not 1200, regardless of what it says. Typically the cutoff is between 1920x1200 and 2560x1440. But you don't want the image to stretch - that would suck.
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October 17, 2012 7:44:02 PM

naf said:
What graphics card do you have? It's hard to believe it would support 1080p and not 1200, regardless of what it says. Typically the cutoff is between 1920x1200 and 2560x1440. But you don't want the image to stretch - that would suck.

Hi naf, ty for the quick reply.

I'm currently using a laptop 7690m XT GPU.

I only have HDMI and VGA output....

Would there be any issues? I see that most IPS do not offer HDMI other than the 2410....

But would tearing happen?
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October 17, 2012 8:06:02 PM

According to the AMD website you're good for 1920x1200. It says 2560x1600 via Display Port, too, but your laptop might not have that.

http://www.amd.com/us/products/notebook/graphics/7000m/...

Yeah, the U2312hm and the U2412m don't have HDMI. The HP ZR2440w does, + Display Port and DVI. You could get a HDMI->DVI cable for cheap though, like \$6.
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October 17, 2012 8:51:41 PM

I dont have display port on my laptop sadly ;/

i dont have DVI either, only VGA...and HDMI.
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October 17, 2012 11:17:43 PM

sorry for the late reply, but wouldnt it stretch?
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October 17, 2012 11:54:16 PM

idoleyez said:
sorry for the late reply, but wouldnt it stretch?

That would be weird. Both your video card and the HDMI interface are capable of outputting 1920x1200, and HDMI/DVI play nice together, so I don't think you should have a problem.

If you're worried about it, try to order it from somewhere with a good return policy or just get the U2312hm.
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October 19, 2012 6:23:58 AM

Hey Naf!

I just got a u2410 for 200.00 from a friend.

I'm using HDMI but the color space options i am able to use are"

RGB
YPbPr

(i dont have sRGB or adobe, why is that?)

I also have an option on my GPU called : xvYCC

I tried google these things, but I am lost. Any advice on calibration? And should I enable these features?
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October 19, 2012 2:38:00 PM

Sounds like a good deal.

Do you mean options on the monitor (meaning the monitor's menu via buttons on the panel) or in Windows? In windows you should have a big list of profile options to choose from. I've attached an image at the bottom showing how to get there. I've selected a custom one that I made with a hardware color calibrator (X-Rite i1) - if your school has one, I recommend borrowing it for an hour. If you can't, just do the regular calibration built in to windows in the Display settings.

Don't use YPbPr, that refers to the dated component cable interface.

"RGB" is a generic label that would cover both AdobeRGB and sRGB and other RGB spaces. I would assume that's the default selection, and that's okay.

Hope this helps.

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October 20, 2012 9:30:04 AM

Thank you again Naf
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