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Dell selling AMD chips.... NOT!

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Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 12:22:00 AM

Quote from Jerry Colonel Sanders: "Our prospects of ever doing business with Dell are dim,"

Dell currently sells more PC's and servers then anyone else.. too bad for AMD.

More about : dell selling amd chips

May 3, 2001 12:31:44 AM

It depends on your point of view. I see it as too bad for Dell. They are missing out on a growing marketshare. IBM sees an advantage, and has gone with AMD for servers (and Intel as well). Why wouldn't a company want to take advantage of all the technology available to get as much marketshare as possible? Think of the growing number of AMD users and Dell is missing out on quite a market.

Better check my portfolios and be sure that I don't own any Dell stock......



<font color=blue>This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.</font color=blue>
May 3, 2001 12:46:14 AM

I have to agree. Too bad for Dell.

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I am the first and only one with a 16MB GeForce2 GTS graphics card! :smile:
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May 3, 2001 12:48:18 AM

Never say never; gateway did that and they are selling a lot of Athlons. Dell is taking a lot of losses those, They are the number 1 online seller, but retail they are not. They are going to cut another 3000 jobs, and their stock is falling.

760 chipset and the 760mp chipset will most likely change Dell's stance. Dell has stated that only reason why they won't sell AMD is because they do not have a stable chipset to run on. 760 chipset is a rocket and is one of the most stable chipsets I've had the pleasure working with.

MeldarthX
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 2:34:54 AM

Too bad for Dell? ummm... Let me reiterate.. Dell is the largest supplier of PC's in the WORLD. Dell is also the largest supplier of servers in the WORLD (overtaking Compaq for the #1 position this year). Hate to say it, but it looks like Dell is doin pretty damn good without AMD.
May 3, 2001 2:52:56 AM

<sarcasm> Yes. I think Dell shouldn't be selling that AMD stuff (read:p eep!) too. AMD is terrible for the US economy, and completely Un-American. Their utter lack of technological prowess is stiffling the entire advance of humanity. I firmly believe the major computer manufacturers like Compaq/Dell/Gateway/HP/IBM should boycott all AMD products. AMD is the prion disease of the computer age.</sarcasm>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 3:01:57 AM

"Never say never;"

Nobody said it would never happen. I believe Mr. Dell himself stated that they would jump on the AMD bandwagon once/if there are stable, compatible & reliable AMD motherboard chipsets availble.
Personally I think Dell made a smart move by shunning away from AMD/VIA. Dell figured it would cost more for tech support, R&D, replacement components etc.. then it would be worth. Apparently Dell's decision has been a wise one, his company has been the most profitable OEM ever since.
Also i might add, Dell pc's and notebooks have consistently been rated as top performers with excellent value.
May 3, 2001 3:31:58 AM

Gateway got burned in the K6 era, so AMD convincing Gateway to use them again is a pretty good accomplishment.
hopefully the nVidia partnership will work out.
Integrated video on laptops is pretty cool, especially if its a Geforce 2...

----------------------
why, oh WHY, is the world run by morons?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 5:51:13 AM

yea, i agree with you all, but sarcasm doesn't work on a forum... hehe
May 3, 2001 6:21:09 AM

Well, think about it. Any idiot can sell a lot of PCs. So dell sells more, so what? I could out sell them tommorrow with one ebay listing. There is a big differnce between selling a PC and making money. Remember all those companies that used to offer free 56K. They had a lot of customers. Where are they now?
May 3, 2001 7:47:20 AM

I am an Information Technology Director and I would never use their servers. They are far from high end.

Back to the point at hand. Who cares if they are the biggest supplier. It is all about profit. So what if Retailer X sells 10,000,000 pcs while retail Y sells only 8,000,000 but makes more of a profit. Units don't mean jack. Profits mean everything. Who cares if they are the biggest supplier today. Even the greatest companies can lose their shirt in only a year. Look at Intel stock, sales, and market share. Guess what? They are all down. AMD has never seen such a great market share. I would not invest in a company that had their head so high up their ass that they missed out on an opportunity to both become more profitiable from savings (AMD processors cost less) and growth (they losing customers who want an AMD machine).

Dell has not been doing so great. Their stock has been down (under $27):
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=DELL&d=c&k=c1&a=v&p=s&t=2y...

Hey Dell is so great that they are recalling 284,000 notebooks because they have a battery flaw. HAHAH. Yeah, really intelligent QA department. Way to go. Buy some of that stock.
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/cn/20010502/tc/dell_to_mou...

So they cut 1700 jobs in February and now another 3000 coming. Wow great management and some awesome plannings folks. Seems Merrill Lynch analyst Steve Fortuna raised his risk rating on Dell stock Tuesday from average to above average
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/keye/20010502/lo/dell_stoc...

Dell won't be the number one supplier in 3 years (probably less).



It worked yesterday! :lol: 
May 3, 2001 7:50:32 AM

Of course, everett6 is right!!! You always cut down on your employee count and your share price drops when you're company is the most profitable.


<font color=red>"My name is Ozymandias, King of Kings:
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and dispair!"</font color=red>
May 3, 2001 9:32:10 AM

Actually Dell's laptops were rated last until about 2000, that is when they started actually making their own. Like I said, with the 760 and 760mp; out and coming out I believe Dell will take a long hard look at AMD and most likely come out with AMD line.......

If not with the Athlon line, then with the Hammer line. The Sled hammer is going to be one very nice cpu.......:) 

MeldarthX
May 3, 2001 9:45:11 AM

_________________________________________________________
Hey Dell is so great that they are recalling 284,000 notebooks because they have a battery flaw. HAHAH. Yeah, really intelligent QA department. Way to go. Buy some of that stock.
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/cn/20010502/tc/dell_to_mou...
_________________________________________________________
actually we are only recalling the battery's for a single portable that has since been replaced by the next gen inspiron. there has only been one batt that actually had a problem. because of that one battery Dell decided to recall the whole shipment. i would have to agree that that is a sign of a good QA dept.


____________________________________________________________
So they cut 1700 jobs in February and now another 3000 coming. Wow great management and some awesome plannings folks. Seems Merrill Lynch analyst Steve Fortuna raised his risk rating on Dell stock Tuesday from average to above average
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/keye/20010502/lo/dell_stoc...
____________________________________________________________

this may be true but if you look around almot all the OEM computer manufacturer's stock is falling because of a lack of public interest.

as far a Michael Dell not wanting to switch to AMD i can sympathize with him because AMD does have a reputation of not haveing stable chipsets and is just trying to insure his company's future by playing it safe.



is this reality... i thought it would more realistic.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 11:21:05 AM

2 things.

1: From my point of view, I have to agree with Dell's decision up to this point, because of the non-stable platform. The OEM PC biz is about selling stable systems that can take a lot from people who don't know really how the machine works, and with AMD frankly has been difficult ever since K6-2 when they started having to ask third parties make a chipset for their CPU.
2: Yes, 760,760mp could convice Dell to sell some Servers and Workstations, and even High end systems.
And just a 3rd: We will just have to see aout this Nvidia-AMD agreement, Crush's specs are impressive, but we will have to wait and see if it is stable.
May 3, 2001 11:46:57 AM

Let <i>me</i> reiterate. TOO BAD FOR DELL. We're not talking about what they <i>are</i>, we're talking about what they <i>could be</i>.

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I am the first and only one with a 16MB GeForce2 GTS graphics card! :smile:
May 3, 2001 12:10:01 PM

So stability is an issue? Then that makes sense why Dell would not want AMD cpus. Yeah, they are better off building boxes based on Intel Processors. That way they can have yet another RECALL. If I am not mistaken Dell recalled thousands of PCs that have the unstable Pentium IIIs. Those were the high speed Pentium IIIs.
http://www.zdnet.com/eweek/stories/general/0,11011,2620...
There was also the Pentium IIs that have a floating point issue. I am too tired to go back in time and verify whether or not Dell had shipped any of these guys before they were recalled. Look here another issue with low speed Pentium IIIs:
http://maccentral.macworld.com/news/9909/30.bug.shtml

Sorry but if you want to base an argument on stability as to why Dell is really IMHO cheating it's share holders then you are simply out of luck because the historical record does not support such an argument.

It worked yesterday! :lol: 
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 2:10:19 PM

"Any idiot can sell a lot of PCs. So dell sells more, so what? I could out sell them tommorrow with one ebay listing"

Uhh... ok. lol. thanks for the laughs.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 2:21:36 PM

"I would never use their servers. They are far from high end."

It seems the majority of IT staff disagree with you, making Dell the largest supplier of servers in the world.

"So they cut 1700 jobs in February"

Ummm...ok, i hate to break this news to ya.. but the COMPUTER INDUSTRY HAS BEEN SEEING A DOWNTURN!! Name me one large company that isnt cutting back jobs. Obviously you have been hiding under a rock somwhere if you didnt already know this.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 2:23:12 PM

"You always cut down on your employee count and your share price drops when you're company is the most profitable."

In case you havent noticed everybody is cutting jobs not just Dell.. jeez.. some people will latch on to anything.
May 3, 2001 3:12:56 PM

True, but any business needs to increase it's customer base, and at all times. When a companies customer base stops growing, so do profits.

Dell is ignoring a very large part of the PC industry by leaving AMD out. Every AMD sale means a lost customer for Dell. That lost customer count will grow and it will make an impact on Dell. It already has. Look at their stock.

<font color=blue>This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.</font color=blue>
May 3, 2001 3:39:59 PM

You can't just look at stocks. About everything is down year to date:

Dell - Down 50%
Intel - Down 50%
Apple - Down 60%
AMD - Down 22%
Gateway - Down 67%
Compaq - Down 33%
IBM - About even
nVidia - Up 100%
ATI - Down 70%
Sun Micro - Down 56%
Cisco - Down 71%
Microsoft - About even

That's all the biggies. nVidia is the only goodie there.


"We put the <i>fun</i> back into fundamentalist dogma!"
May 3, 2001 4:06:12 PM

True, stock alone is not an indicator.

The best indicator is marketshare, who is going up, who is going down. Dell can increase marketshare by including AMD and capturing the lost sales. It would be foolish if they don't.

<font color=blue>This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.</font color=blue>
May 3, 2001 4:52:04 PM

The main thing about Dell choosing AMD is their market demographics. The average brand name CPU buyer (which is who all the major PC builders sell to) does not know the differences between Intel or AMD, and go to Intel simply because of brand recognition. When people do buy AMD, it is ususally because of the lower price, not really knowing much about the performance of the system compared to an Intel system. Dell may have a contract with Intel where Intel gives price breaks for certain volumes, and therefore it may be beneficial to Dell's bottom line to stick with Intel only. I don't know, but when Dell sells millions of computers, therefore buying millions of processors from Intel only, it is definately a possibility that Intel would do such a thing.

Obviously Dell is doing pretty good with Intel only computers. I mean, their market share has been growing and they captured the #1 spot from Compaq recently. But, it is very doubtful that the reason for that is Intel CPUs only, and they very well may have done it if they used AMD chips as well. I personally don't care either way. Obviously Dell and AMD are both doing pretty damn well in the current situation (both are constantly gaining market share against their competitors). But, you are all right, it may be better for both (but worse for Intel) if Dell and AMD do forge some sort of business alliance.

"We put the <i>fun</i> back into fundamentalist dogma!"
May 3, 2001 5:45:59 PM

I agree that Dell has done what is right for them as far as not yet adopting the AMD Chips. Dell has a reputation for Good Stability and support, and it would be a big risk to adopt anything new until it is proven to be stable enough to base a line of Desktops/Notebooks on. On the other hand, I do think that it is about Time Dell looks seriously at adopting AMD CPUs, as they have proven to be just as stable (including their chipsets) as Intel chips, and are a Better Value. Dell also takes advantage of Intel's marketing. What would you be more likely to buy, a system with a CPU you haven't heard much about, or one that has the CPU of a well-known and trusted company inside? If you want to see a crappy Computer Company, look at Compaq.... I'm still not too happy about all those sabotaged 200MHz Deskpros they sent a few years ago....

--Fltsimbuff
May 3, 2001 5:49:44 PM

"It seems the majority of IT staff disagree with you, making Dell the largest supplier of servers in the world.
"

Did you know that Ford sells more Ford F150 pickups in a year then all of the cars Mercedes sells (all model lines). So does that make the F150 pick up better. No! Cheap pieces of [-peep-] sell in higher quantity because more people can afford them. Toyota sells more Camry cars than Porsche sells from all their models. So according to you that Camry must be better. Sorry, more people can afford a low quality piece of [-peep-] server than a high quality top of the line awesome stability server.

You have no sense of logic or understanding whatsoever. You shoulg get a job for Dell. You would fit right in.

It worked yesterday! :lol: 
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 6:57:49 PM

F150's and Mercedes Benz have little in common. There is more of a demand for pickups than a Luxury vehicle, that's why more F150's are sold. Not too people narrow their car choice between a F150 pickup and a 4-door luxury sedan and then opt for a pickup because it's cheaper.

For some people a Camry is better than a Porsche just like a F150 is a better choice than a Benz, depends on you needs and circumstances. So according to your F**KED UP logic - the Yugo should have been a big hit outselling the almighty sales leader F150 because the Yugo was the biggest, cheapest piece of S**T available at the time. Don't see many Yugos around do you? Maybe you should go work for the Yugo sales team???

In my experience with Dell I think they are nice PC’s for desktop machines, not the cheap piece of crap you make them out to be. If people were looking for the cheapest, I would think you could do better than Dell…


<font color=blue>The #1 reason to upgrade your PC - to run faster benchmarks...</font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 7:30:01 PM

"Actually Dell's laptops were rated last until about 2000"

Odd, every time I read a reveiw they were or were one of the top rated laptops. Loved the one I had...

"with the 760 and 760mp; out and coming"

I heard that last summer, fall, winter.... Cheap, Fast Dual Durons systems. 760MP has been "out and coming" for a long time.....

<font color=blue>The #1 reason to upgrade your PC - to run faster benchmarks...</font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 7:44:56 PM

"The best indicator is marketshare"

True, the best indicator is market share, and Dell has had the biggest piece of the pie in the PC market for years and more recently in the server segment too. Yes, by including AMD systems Dell could increase there market share even more, but not without its price. In the end, Dell could end up spending more money for Tech support, R&D etc supporting the AMD/VIA platform then its worth right now. Not to mention tarnishing there excellent reputation. So why bother? It’s not very profitable and its risky. Mr. Dell has said numerous times that the current AMD platform is too "fragile” and many others in the industry agree.


<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by everett6 on 05/03/01 01:48 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 7:55:32 PM

"You have no sense of logic or understanding whatsoever. You shoulg get a job for Dell. You would fit right in."

lol.. I think 100mhz had a good response to your post. I having nothing more to add at this time.
May 3, 2001 8:05:08 PM

What about AOL from 9 years ago?

AOL - Up 60,000%

:wink:

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I am the first and only one with a 16MB GeForce2 GTS graphics card! :smile:
May 3, 2001 9:22:35 PM

<font color=blue>"In the end, Dell could end up spending more money for Tech support, R&D etc supporting the AMD/VIA platform then its worth right now."</font color=blue>

Not true. Because support is available only if the user has not changed the system configuration. I know Dell owners who are stuck with Windows 95 because if they put Windows 98 on their machines, they will no longer be supported. Compaq does this as well. Support is available as long as you do not upgrade your machine. This makes sense from the support side, as once a system is configured, there is only one configuration to support.

The user who changes the configuration does so at his/her own risk, becoming unsupported by the manufacturer. Common practice by the PC manufacturers.

However, I do have to agree with you on the "fragility" of the AMD system. Not the stability. Properly configured, it is stable. But the chips are too fragile. There would be a flood of cracked cores as unexperienced users attempt to remove HSF to overclock their PC's. There are too many posts here (and at other forums) to deny this. But this can be overcome with a statement: remove the HSF and you void your warranty, and lose all support.

<font color=blue>This is a Forum, not a playground. Treat it with Respect.</font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 3, 2001 10:05:44 PM

Quote:
There would be a flood of cracked cores as unexperienced users attempt to remove HSF to overclock their PC's. There are too many posts here (and at other forums) to deny this.

Yes, there is that type of fragility with AMD systems too. But when Dell says the AMD platform is fragile he means that there are "serious" compatibility issues. Read one of his statements below:


<b>In an interview held in London, Dell told ZDNet UK News that although AMD was making good progress with its processor range, the technology it offered "was too fragile" for Dell customers. Asked if by 'too fragile' he meant there were incompatibility issues with AMD architecture Dell said, "Yes, and that's vital."

Describing some of his customers as being at the "lunatic fringe" of computer use -- those users who are happy to remove and replace peripherals such as sound or video cards -- Dell said: "We found the AMD environment to be much more fragile... than equivalent Intel systems." He went on, "These are system issues that underlie the integrity of our own brand."</b>
May 5, 2001 6:46:22 AM

"F150's and Mercedes Benz have little in common"...

That is my point dumb ass. Neither does a Dell Server and a reliable stable scalable top of the line Server have anything really in common except they are both servers. Just like the F150 and Mercedes vehicles are all vehicles. Too bad you are too ignorant to realize that just like you can't compare vehicles you can't compare servers based on a simplified superclass object. The other dumb ass tried to imply because Dell sells more servers then their servers must be great. I clarified that is not a true logical conclusion via a comparable analogy of two subclass objects based on the same superclass.

The second anology is really simple. I am not suggesting that everyone needs a top of the line server. Clearly, for some people to buy a real high quality server (I won't suggest any since your feeble mind cound not understand a good server if it bit you in the ass) would be overkill. Though the fact of the matter is if Tom's Hardware Guide did a comparison of servers they would tell you which one was best. They would also tell you which one was worst and the ranking that they came in. Does that suggest that everyone needs top of the line. No it does not. It is a statement of fact, of workmanship, of performance, of novelty, etc. As people we like top performance all around. Just get your head out of your ass and look at these forums. Look at all the arguments about AMD vd Intel and Nvidia versus ATI. Look at people bragging about overclocking. The porshes compared to the camry is a comparison of a fast, sporty, exotic, to a standard, boring, daily driver. Any idiot would have taken that for what it was. Though you are even dumber than an idiot. Got more CPUs that your I.Q. I'll bet. This was once again a correction to the other ignorant fool who basically tried to imply Dell must have the best servers because they sell the most. Which is the argument that an uneducated 3 year old would make (and I feel bad insulting three year olds all around the world).

In almost all retail you will find that the highest-end products sell the least in quantity because they cost the most. This is something that you amphibian grabastic pieces of [-peep-] (quoting Full Metal Jacket here) could not comprehend.

Either you are not in IT or if you are then you are a pathetic uneducated drone. Learn something about top end servers and then maybe you can put up a post that is not F**KED up and a waste of all of our time.


It worked yesterday! :lol: 
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 5, 2001 7:06:44 AM

Wow, you sure had a lot of nice things to say.
I think there were more personal attacks and insults in your one post then I've seen in this entire forum. jeez.. what's the matter with you?

Help Intel's bottom line & buy AMD.
May 5, 2001 7:20:01 AM

Hehehe. Like most people I react. It is frustrating that people can recognize words, can read words, yet have no comprehesion. Your follower and yourself don't know how to comprehend. Also, your follower, in his ignorance of understanding was very insulting.

What is the matter with me. Not a thing. Although it was a waste of my time to clarify a simple point that was presented well the first time, I went ahead and did it yet again. Also, I expounded a little to return so well deserved insults.

I noticed that you did not seem to point out the total lack of comprehesion that your puppet posted. Nor did you ask him why he was so rude. If you did then you would have a concern for conduct on this forum. Since you didn't, you are only concerned with people supporting you even if they have no foundation for it at all. The old "ends justify the means". That's why you agreed with your puppet's uneducated babblings.

It worked yesterday! :lol: 
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 5, 2001 7:44:33 AM

It's understandable that you were frustrated with his post. (he had some good points) but in all honesty to attack him the way you did was, well, a bit much.

Through out your latest post you continually refer to him (100mhz) as a "follower" and a "puppet". I don’t think that is the case at all. He is just an intelligent person who share's a same view and opinion as me. So grow up and stop trying to insult him.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
May 5, 2001 8:03:08 AM

chrisojeda, I went back and re-read your orignal post and then your second post (i skipped all the insults) after re-reading them I realize now that you had a good point, but you just presented it wrong and I took it a different way. I dont want to go through all the details but I understand now what you were originally trying to point out. And I agree with you. I think this was all a misunderstanding. So, no hard feelings?
May 5, 2001 5:03:24 PM

Everett6,

No hard feelings...and also sorry about the insults. I've had a rough last six weeks of working 80 plus hours per week. I've been a bit on the edge. Some of the insults in the beginning were just in fun but toward the end I was getting a little grouchy.

It worked yesterday! :lol: 
May 5, 2001 5:47:31 PM

~ Name me one large company that isnt cutting back jobs. ~

Try Sun Microsystems, While everyone else has had a massive downturn Sun had a 2% increase in sales and continued to grab server market share (now No.1 in the US). The recently released UltraSPARC III is a 2nd Gen 64bit CPU and has more juice than the P4 & Athlon put together. I'm afraid 32bit is just childplay now.


Kiwi in the UK
!