Clearing shops quickly (spoiler)

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

I do not know if this ever gets mentioned in the spoilers, but I
found the other day that the best way to clear any shop is with a
leash on your pet.

You can gather items, and drop them all on one location, then pick
up a couple items at a time that you think you might like to have.
Drop them about four paces from the door onto two different spaces,
leash your pet, then let it walk around until an item gets picked up.
Then, you can immediately walk toward the door. If you make it one
step out the door, there are only two spaces the pet will be able to
move into, causing it to eventually drop the item in a retrievable
space.

No more waiting around for your pet to finally decide to drop the
item where you can get it!

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 02:20:05 GMT, chuck <chucko@nil.car> Gave us:

>TokaMundo <TokaMundo@weedizgood.org> wrote in
>news9bjc1pbhukeq0ev45pcj27f1k7koamul8@4ax.com:
>
>> I do not know if this ever gets mentioned in the spoilers, but I
>> found the other day that the best way to clear any shop is with a
>> leash on your pet.
>>
>> You can gather items, and drop them all on one location, then pick
>> up a couple items at a time that you think you might like to have.
>> Drop them about four paces from the door onto two different spaces,
>> leash your pet, then let it walk around until an item gets picked up.
>> Then, you can immediately walk toward the door. If you make it one
>> step out the door, there are only two spaces the pet will be able to
>> move into, causing it to eventually drop the item in a retrievable
>> space.
>>
>> No more waiting around for your pet to finally decide to drop the
>> item where you can get it!
>>
>
>Fine, until it snaps the leash...

Heheh.. In my case, I have extras.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 4 Jul 2005 23:28:22 -0700, richwalm@gmail.com Gave us:

>I was playing a game the other day. All I needed to do was stand in the
>doorway of the shop and my pet would just pick up items and then drop
>them right infront of me (in the area that you're not chared for them).
>He did this quite a few times, so I guess I must have trained them
>pretty good.

You were lucky.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 2005-07-05, Kevin Wayne wrote:
> On 7/5/05 6:49 AM, TokaMundo wrote:
>> On 4 Jul 2005 23:28:22 -0700, richwalm@gmail.com Gave us:
>>
>>>I was playing a game the other day. All I needed to do was stand in the
>>>doorway of the shop and my pet would just pick up items and then drop
>>>them right in front of me (in the area that you're not charged for them).
>>>He did this quite a few times, so I guess I must have trained them
>>>pretty good.
>>
>> You were lucky.
>
> Not necessarily *pure* luck. Feeding pets treats (tripe rations)
> immediately prior to shoplifting causes them to drop things in front of
> you;
>
Immediately prior to shoplifting might not be the best thing. IIRC,
while shoplifting, immediately after your pet dropped something near
you, is the best time to throw tripe, aport-wise.

Ohle
--
Jann Ohle Claussen | GPG-Key-ID E7149169
http://www.stud.uni-goettingen.de/~s251251
"My education message will resignate amonst all parents."
--dubya

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 17:14:21 GMT, Faux_Pseudo <Faux.Pseudo@gmail.com>
Gave us:

>_.-In rec.games.roguelike.nethack, TokaMundo wrote the following -._
>> I do not know if this ever gets mentioned in the spoilers, but I
>> found the other day that the best way to clear any shop is with a
>> leash on your pet.
>
>while I have used the leash in the past I find the best way to do it
>is with a magic whistle. Of course the fastest way to clear a shop is
>with a a wand of death. But those are hard to find early in the game.


You... You.... You... MURDERER!

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

TokaMundo <TokaMundo@weedizgood.org> wrote in
news9bjc1pbhukeq0ev45pcj27f1k7koamul8@4ax.com:

> I do not know if this ever gets mentioned in the spoilers, but I
> found the other day that the best way to clear any shop is with a
> leash on your pet.
>
> You can gather items, and drop them all on one location, then pick
> up a couple items at a time that you think you might like to have.
> Drop them about four paces from the door onto two different spaces,
> leash your pet, then let it walk around until an item gets picked up.
> Then, you can immediately walk toward the door. If you make it one
> step out the door, there are only two spaces the pet will be able to
> move into, causing it to eventually drop the item in a retrievable
> space.
>
> No more waiting around for your pet to finally decide to drop the
> item where you can get it!
>

I prefer to use magic memory vaults and jems. Still early enough unless you
are doing a protection run.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Cyde Weys wrote:
> Ohle Claussen <claussen@dpi.physik.uni-goettingen.de> wrote in
> newsaebc9$d71$1@gwdu112.gwdg.de:
>
>
>>On 2005-07-05, Kevin Wayne wrote:
>>
>>Immediately prior to shoplifting might not be the best thing. IIRC,
>>while shoplifting, immediately after your pet dropped something near
>>you, is the best time to throw tripe, aport-wise.
>
>
> I have heard this myth oft-repeated and actually believed in it for awhile
> but upon digging through the source code I discovered no reason why this
> should be the case. Apport is raised by feeding your pet; there's no need
> to wait around for awhile for a low-apport pet to finally randomly drop an
> item at your feet. Just feed him and let the looting begin.

The mythical code is as follows:

edog->apport += (int)(200L/
((long)edog->dropdist + monstermoves - edog->droptime));

dropdist and droptime are set to udist (the distance to you) and
monstermoves (current timer) respectively each time the pet drops
something. So the amount of apport gain from dropping or throwing pet
food for your pet IS dependant on how far away you were the last time
the pet dropped an item and how long ago that was.


Atillo

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Faux_Pseudo wrote:
> TokaMundo wrote:
>
> > I do not know if this ever gets mentioned in the spoilers, but I
> > found the other day that the best way to clear any shop is with a
> > leash on your pet.
>
> while I have used the leash in the past I find the best way to do it
> is with a magic whistle.

I've used both magic whistle and leash at times. Magic
whistle is more common I think. It also never snaps,
your pet never breaks out of it and so on. Neither is
very common on the early levels were robbing a shop can
make a big difference in the rest of the game.

> Of course the fastest way to clear a shop is
> with a a wand of death. But those are hard to find early in the game.

It does let you rob *all* of the items in the shop,
though. Small dogs, kittens, regular dogs and
housecats don't ever seem to take the key, the cash
and the wand from shopkeepers. Polymorph into a
pet balrog, different story ...

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

In news:<Xns968AB7F71C60E2galopagosterrapincy@199.45.49.11>, Cyde Weys
<cyde@umd.edu> says...
> Ohle Claussen <claussen@dpi.physik.uni-goettingen.de> wrote in
> newsaebc9$d71$1@gwdu112.gwdg.de:
> > On 2005-07-05, Kevin Wayne wrote:
> >> On 7/5/05 6:49 AM, TokaMundo wrote:
> >>> On 4 Jul 2005 23:28:22 -0700, richwalm@gmail.com Gave us:
> >>>>I was playing a game the other day. All I needed to do was stand in
> >>>>the doorway of the shop and my pet would just pick up items and then
> >>>>drop them right in front of me (in the area that you're not charged
> >>>>for them). He did this quite a few times, so I guess I must have
> >>>>trained them pretty good.
> >>> You were lucky.
> >> Not necessarily *pure* luck. Feeding pets treats (tripe rations)
> >> immediately prior to shoplifting causes them to drop things in front
> >> of you;
> > Immediately prior to shoplifting might not be the best thing. IIRC,
> > while shoplifting, immediately after your pet dropped something near
> > you, is the best time to throw tripe, aport-wise.
> I have heard this myth oft-repeated and actually believed in it for awhile
> but upon digging through the source code I discovered no reason why this
> should be the case. Apport is raised by feeding your pet; there's no need
> to wait around for awhile for a low-apport pet to finally randomly drop an
> item at your feet. Just feed him and let the looting begin.

I am afraid it is you that are spreading myths and erronous information
this time. The http://www.helsinki.fi/~vviitane/spoilers/pets spoiler is
very slightly out of date, but you can see for yourself at line 175 in
dogmove.c. Ohle and the spoiler is right - so consult the spoiler if you
are interested in getting the most out of your tripe rations.

This spoiler is very specific though and does not give all apport-
related information, for additional hints you should check Eva's spoiler
at http://www.statslab.cam.ac.uk/~eva/nethack/pets2.html.

Furthermore, I think both of these spoilers omit the information that a
pet tries to keep closer to a player character which carries a treat
(tripe/etc) in the main inventory. See line 424 in dogmove.c.

Also please note other common pet myths at:
http://www.statslab.cam.ac.uk/~eva [...] .html#pets

/Kristoffer

--
This cookie has a scrap of paper inside. It reads:
Gurl fnl gung oyhr fgbarf ner enqvbnpgvir, orjner.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

chuck wrote:

>> I do not know if this ever gets mentioned in the spoilers, but I
>>found the other day that the best way to clear any shop is with a
>>leash on your pet.
>>
>> You can gather items, and drop them all on one location, then pick
>>up a couple items at a time that you think you might like to have.
>>Drop them about four paces from the door onto two different spaces,
>>leash your pet, then let it walk around until an item gets picked up.
>>Then, you can immediately walk toward the door. If you make it one
>>step out the door, there are only two spaces the pet will be able to
>>move into, causing it to eventually drop the item in a retrievable
>>space.
>>
>> No more waiting around for your pet to finally decide to drop the
>>item where you can get it!
>
> I prefer to use magic memory vaults and jems. Still early enough unless you
> are doing a protection run.

Hm. Does anyone know how much gold a pet will pick up? Because I think I
just thought of a new way to empty the vaults and a new use for the
magic whistle. Must keep this in mind! Could be tricky, probably
patience is required, and you're not likely to find a magic whistle
before a pick-axe, but isn't extreme situations like that what Nethack's
all about?!

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Sean wrote:
>
> > I prefer to use magic memory vaults and jems. Still early enough unless you
> > are doing a protection run.
>
> Hm. Does anyone know how much gold a pet will pick up?

Based on weight and carrying capacity, so a large dog will
pick up more than in any vault square while a small dog
might or might not.

> Because I think I
> just thought of a new way to empty the vaults and a new use for the
> magic whistle. Must keep this in mind! Could be tricky, probably
> patience is required, and you're not likely to find a magic whistle
> before a pick-axe, but isn't extreme situations like that what Nethack's
> all about?!

How would you tell when the pet has picked up any gold? Even
given the low cahnce of the pet landing in a vault after being
zapped with teleport.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

In article <1120661107.224272.139450@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Doug Freyburger <dfreybur@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Philip Kendall wrote:
>>
>> There's at least one tactic by which any pet can (safely) help you to
>> relieve the shopkeeper of their gold.
>
>There are ways without a pet.
>
>Playing a chaotic human wizard recently in 3.4.3, I
>learned that selling armor or weapon in a shop will
>type-id it but not plus/minus id it. Ashmumble offers
>you X zormids for your runed dagger, sell it? You
>sell your elven dagger for X zorkmids.

V'q nqivfr cnlvat pybfr nggragvba gb jung K vf va shgher.

>Keep selling a shopkeeper items until you get offered
>credit instead, and you have all his/her gold. Of
>course if you use a pet to be able to sell the same
>items over and over so much the better

This tactic brings linear rewards with respect to the number of items
stolen; clearing out shopkeeper of all his gold and stock like this
is... tedious, to say the least. There is a much more effective
tactic.

Cheers,

Phil

--
Philip Kendall <pak21@srcf.ucam.org>
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~pak21/

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Philip Kendall wrote:
> Doug Freyburger wrote:
> >Philip Kendall wrote:
>
> >> There's at least one tactic by which any pet can (safely) help you to
> >> relieve the shopkeeper of their gold.
>
> >There are ways without a pet.
>
> >Playing a chaotic human wizard recently in 3.4.3, I
> >learned that selling armor or weapon in a shop will
> >type-id it but not plus/minus id it. Ashmumble offers
> >you X zormids for your runed dagger, sell it? You
> >sell your elven dagger for X zorkmids.
>
> V'q nqivfr cnlvat pybfr nggragvba gb jung K vf va shgher.

For more reasons than plus/minus within an equipment
type. It is very interesting indeed what weapons or
armor cost what price. Look at the price of a bow
and a random melee weapon and you'll see how much
value the DevTeam puts on taking out an opponent
remotely.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 7/5/05 2:13 PM, TokaMundo wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 15:58:31 GMT, Kevin Wayne gave us:
>
>>On 7/5/05 6:49 AM, TokaMundo wrote:
>>
>>>On 4 Jul 2005 23:28:22 -0700, richwalm@gmail.com Gave us:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I was playing a game the other day. All I needed to do was stand in the
>>>>doorway of the shop and my pet would just pick up items and then drop
>>>>them right in front of me (in the area that you're not charged for them).
>>>>He did this quite a few times, so I guess I must have trained them
>>>>pretty good.
>>>
>>> You were lucky.
>>
>>Not necessarily *pure* luck. Feeding pets treats (tripe rations)
>>immediately prior to shoplifting causes them to drop things in front of
>>you; additionally, carrying treats causes them to want to get close to
>>you more than they usually do. Both of these effects together can create
>>a pretty efficient shoplifting pet.
>
> Both of which I also perform, and have in the past seen nearly no
> effect from.

You were unlucky. :-)

--
Kevin Wayne

"Art is a tremendous means by which painfully guarded individuals bare
their souls." --Steve Hindalong

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Sean <sgegg@hotspammeallyouwantpop.com> wrote in
news:lhUye.58570$Fe7.193260@news000.worldonline.dk:

> Jym wrote:
>
>>>>Because I think I
>>>>just thought of a new way to empty the vaults and a new use for the
>>>>magic whistle. Must keep this in mind! Could be tricky, probably
>>>>patience is required, and you're not likely to find a magic whistle
>>>>before a pick-axe, but isn't extreme situations like that what Nethack's
>>>>all about?!
>>>
>>>How would you tell when the pet has picked up any gold? Even
>>>given the low cahnce of the pet landing in a vault after being
>>>zapped with teleport.
>>
>> You can send it there via "ad aerum" traps. And wait a few turns in hope
>> it has picked up gold.
>
> Exactly! And here's an update on that idea: What happens, okay, what
> happens when a pet picks up a pile of gold and drops it on ANOTHER pile
> of gold? Eh? Think about it!
>

noop, you just wait until you get a pickaxe, and find the ad aerium trap,
drop your gold and use it.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 16:39:52 GMT, Kevin Wayne <killedbyafoo@yahoo.com>
Gave us:

>On 7/5/05 2:13 PM, TokaMundo wrote:
>> On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 15:58:31 GMT, Kevin Wayne gave us:
>>
>>>On 7/5/05 6:49 AM, TokaMundo wrote:
>>>
>>>>On 4 Jul 2005 23:28:22 -0700, richwalm@gmail.com Gave us:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I was playing a game the other day. All I needed to do was stand in the
>>>>>doorway of the shop and my pet would just pick up items and then drop
>>>>>them right in front of me (in the area that you're not charged for them).
>>>>>He did this quite a few times, so I guess I must have trained them
>>>>>pretty good.
>>>>
>>>> You were lucky.
>>>
>>>Not necessarily *pure* luck. Feeding pets treats (tripe rations)
>>>immediately prior to shoplifting causes them to drop things in front of
>>>you; additionally, carrying treats causes them to want to get close to
>>>you more than they usually do. Both of these effects together can create
>>>a pretty efficient shoplifting pet.
>>
>> Both of which I also perform, and have in the past seen nearly no
>> effect from.
>
>You were unlucky. :-)

Ahhh...

I want the old nethack back! Heheheh :-] Just kidding...

Actually, I want a quake 3 like game engine with nethack code used
as the odds/dice roll engine... like a vulture's eye thing...

maybe "Pterodactyl's Eye" or "Dragon's Eye" for the ultimate nethack
experience. Heheheheh :-]