[Skill] Concentration for monks

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Hello,

Recently, one of my players, new to the campaign choosed to play a monk
(I run a 3.5 game in a home brew world). The guy put 5 ranks in
Concentration skill. I know that skill is perfect to describe a
meditating ascetic which was the purpose of my friend.
But I wonder whether or not it could have game effects for a non-caster.
Well, I read again and again the description of that skill in the PHB
and there's no other formal use than staying focused while casting.
I'm currently eager to find other uses for Concentration, especially for
non caster characters et why not, feats demanding ranks in the skill as
prereq., e.g. feats to develop the ki capacities of the Monk.
I browse some websites and boards but couldn't find anything worth
(perhaps one or two feats at Hong's)

Any of you experienced the same situation ?
Resources where I can find answers or a least inspiration ;) ?

Thank for your replies.

--
Seb L.
 
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Climbing and walking along narrow edges, balancing etc while being shot
at with arrows?

Doing something while enveloped by the tentacles of something horrid?

The uses of the concentration skill need not be tied to the obvious...

A roll could make other skills a less dificulty rating undear adverse
circumstances.
 
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Hong Ooi wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:04:20 -0000, "Mark Blunden"
> <m.blundenATntlworld.com@address.invalid> wrote:
>
> >Murf wrote:
> >> Climbing and walking along narrow edges, balancing etc while being
> >> shot at with arrows?

<etc.>

> >Sounds good. Maybe make a DC20 Concentration check in order to take
10 on a
> >physical skill under pressure
>
> That's going on my web page!

Sounds neat, indeed, as an idea.
Would that only work for monks, or anybody with ranks in Concentration?
High level wizards and dwarven fighters would get a serious boost at
some skills.

Silveraxe.
 
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Murf wrote:
> Climbing and walking along narrow edges, balancing etc while being
> shot at with arrows?
>
> Doing something while enveloped by the tentacles of something horrid?
>
> The uses of the concentration skill need not be tied to the obvious...
>
> A roll could make other skills a less dificulty rating undear adverse
> circumstances.

Sounds good. Maybe make a DC20 Concentration check in order to take 10 on a
physical skill under pressure (with DC adjustments for the amount of
pressure). If you fail, you still get to roll your check as normal.

--
Mark.
 
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In news:4237dbf1$0$19322$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr,
Seb <sebastienNO-louchart@wanadooSPAM.fr> typed:
> Recently, one of my players, new to the campaign choosed to play a
> monk (I run a 3.5 game in a home brew world). The guy put 5 ranks in
> Concentration skill. I know that skill is perfect to describe a
> meditating ascetic which was the purpose of my friend.
> But I wonder whether or not it could have game effects for a
> non-caster.

How about going through stories of the stuff Yogi and other eastern mystics
are supposed to manage and let him pull some of those off with
concentration. Simple stuff like efficient sleeping (let him condense 8h
into 4-6h and maybe make it harder to wake him in between), changing his
bodytemp (to match the surroundings for infravision chameloen, or would that
be too much), total recall memorytricks and such.

--
T. Koivula
 
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Mere moments before death, Mark Blunden hastily scrawled:
>Murf wrote:
>> Climbing and walking along narrow edges, balancing etc while being
>> shot at with arrows?
>>
>> Doing something while enveloped by the tentacles of something horrid?
>>
>> The uses of the concentration skill need not be tied to the obvious...
>>
>> A roll could make other skills a less dificulty rating undear adverse
>> circumstances.
>
>Sounds good. Maybe make a DC20 Concentration check in order to take 10 on a
>physical skill under pressure (with DC adjustments for the amount of
>pressure). If you fail, you still get to roll your check as normal.

Too good. This plus Skill Mastery [Concentration] equals being able
to take 10 on any skill when under pressure.



Ed Chauvin IV

--
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use X = [(C2/10)^2], and RULE # 193 which is NOT meant to be read by
kids, since RULE # 187 EXPLAINS homosexuality mathematically, using
modifier G @ 11.

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--Terry Austin
 
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On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 13:04:20 -0000, "Mark Blunden"
<m.blundenATntlworld.com@address.invalid> wrote:

>Murf wrote:
>> Climbing and walking along narrow edges, balancing etc while being
>> shot at with arrows?
>>
>> Doing something while enveloped by the tentacles of something horrid?
>>
>> The uses of the concentration skill need not be tied to the obvious...
>>
>> A roll could make other skills a less dificulty rating undear adverse
>> circumstances.
>
>Sounds good. Maybe make a DC20 Concentration check in order to take 10 on a
>physical skill under pressure (with DC adjustments for the amount of
>pressure). If you fail, you still get to roll your check as normal.

That's going on my web page!


--
Hong Ooi | "COUNTERSRTIKE IS AN REAL-TIME
hong@zipworld.com.au | STRATEGY GAME!!!"
http://www.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/ | -- RR
Sydney, Australia |
 
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Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
> Mere moments before death, Mark Blunden hastily scrawled:
> >
> >Unless I'm missing something, Skill Mastery is a high-level
Rogue-only
> >optional ability that applies to a handful of skills.
>
> It applies to any skills the Rogue wishes to apply it to. Up to
> IntMod+3.

Ie, "a handful of skills".

>
> >Plus, the start of
> >this sub-thread was looking for more uses for Concentration,
>
> I'm not commenting on whether Concentration should be more useful,
> just this particular use of it.
>
> >and Skill Mastery doesn't do that.
>
> Skill Mastery does provide the suggested use if the Rogue chooses
> Concentration.

Huh?

>Why not make a feat similar to Skill Mastery that's
> more widely available? The Monk could choose whatever skill(s) he
> wants to get Zenny with and there you go.

Go back to sleep, Ed.


Hong
 
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"Seb" <sebastienNO-louchart@wanadooSPAM.fr> wrote in message
news:4237dbf1$0$19322$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr...
> But I wonder whether or not it could have game effects for a non-caster.
> Well, I read again and again the description of that skill in the PHB
> and there's no other formal use than staying focused while casting.
> I'm currently eager to find other uses for Concentration, especially for
> non caster characters et why not, feats demanding ranks in the skill as
> prereq., e.g. feats to develop the ki capacities of the Monk.

Look at the psionics handbook.

-Michael
 
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Mere moments before death, Lorenz Lang hastily scrawled:
>On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:28:12 -0500, Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
>> Mere moments before death, Lorenz Lang hastily scrawled:
>>>
>>>How about:
>>>
>>>Skill Concentration
>>>
>>>Prereq: Still Mind class ability
>>>
>>>Benefit:
>>>If you concentrate using a full-round action on your
>>>Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Jump or Tumble skill
>>>you gain a +1 insight bonus per 5 ranks of Concentration
>>>on this skill for the next round.
>>>
>>>Is this too weak? Should the bonus be +2 or +1 per 3 ranks for example?
>>
>> It seems to me that you guys are trying to fix a leaky pipe with a
>> hammer. Why not just make a Skill Mastery-like feat?
>>
>
>Do you think such a feat (as above) is worthless, silly or both?

As written, I think it's mostly worthless, and a just bit silly.
Worthless because it's at best a +4 bonus for a 20th level character,
in exchange for not being able to use most of the skills it's supposed
to be augmenting. If you use a FRA, you can't use a Move Action and
therefore can't Balance, Climb, Jump or Tumble *to* anywhere.

Also, the bonus is weird. I don't know if there's precedent or not,
but a +1 bonus per 5 ranks in some skill just seems odd. Most feats
that provide bonuses provide static bonuses, and those feats whose
bonus goes up with character level generally have static bonuses and
feat chains with stacking bonuses (TWF, ITWF*) or can be taken
multiple times (Toughness). And feats that are dependent on a skill
have ranks in that skill as a prerequisite and may use that skill to
"activate" the feat (Mounted Combat).

Thus, your feat should be more like:


Skill Concentration

Prerequisites: Still Mind class ability, Concentration 1 rank.

Benefit:
Once per round as a Standard Action, you may attempt a Concentration
check to gain a +2 insight bonus to your Balance, Climb, Escape
Artist, Jump or Tumble skill.


And then maybe have an Improved Skill Concentration that makes your
insight bonus +4, and a Superior Skill Concentration that makes it +6.

Also, one other thing that bugs me about the feat is the Still Mind
prerequisite. It seems to be a way around requiring levels in a given
class, but there's already a good way to do this and still let others
take the feat. Remove the Still Mind prerequisite, and allow Monks to
take this as one of their bonus feats. Oh, and this feat should
probably be of the form "Choose X skills. This feat applies to these
skills. This feat may be taken multiple times, each time choose X
more skills to apply it to."

Personally, I'd just make a feat that allows you to break the no
Taking 10 when in a stressful situation based on a Concentration
check.


Focused Concentration

Prerequisite: Concentration 1 rank.

Benefit:
Once per round as a Standard Action that provokes an Attack of
Opportunity, you may attempt a Concentration check to allow you to
Take 10 on a skill check you otherwise couldn't Take 10 on due to
being distracted or threatened.

Normal:
Without this feat you cannot Take 10 when distracted or threatened.



■: After all, reducing a penalty is really a bonus.

Ed Chauvin IV

--
DISCLAIMER : WARNING: RULE # 196 is X-rated in that to calculate L,
use X = [(C2/10)^2], and RULE # 193 which is NOT meant to be read by
kids, since RULE # 187 EXPLAINS homosexuality mathematically, using
modifier G @ 11.

"I always feel left out when someone *else* gets killfiled."
--Terry Austin
 
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Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
> Mere moments before death, Lorenz Lang hastily scrawled:
> >On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:28:12 -0500, Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
> >> Mere moments before death, Lorenz Lang hastily scrawled:
> >>>
> >>>How about:
> >>>
> >>>Skill Concentration
> >>>
> >>>Prereq: Still Mind class ability
> >>>
> >>>Benefit:
> >>>If you concentrate using a full-round action on your
> >>>Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Jump or Tumble skill
> >>>you gain a +1 insight bonus per 5 ranks of Concentration
> >>>on this skill for the next round.
> >>>
> >>>Is this too weak? Should the bonus be +2 or +1 per 3 ranks for
example?
> >>
> >> It seems to me that you guys are trying to fix a leaky pipe with a
> >> hammer. Why not just make a Skill Mastery-like feat?
> >>
> >
> >Do you think such a feat (as above) is worthless, silly or both?
>
> As written, I think it's mostly worthless, and a just bit silly.
> Worthless because it's at best a +4 bonus for a 20th level character,

+1 per 3 ranks would be +6 at 20th level, no problem.
If it's otherwise worthless or too weak,
let's just raise the boni a bit.

> in exchange for not being able to use most of the skills it's
supposed
> to be augmenting. If you use a FRA, you can't use a Move Action and
> therefore can't Balance, Climb, Jump or Tumble *to* anywhere.

You overlooked the 'next round' bit. Concentrate and focus
your Chi power or whatever as a FRA and gain a bonus on the *next*
round.
The Qi Gung people do it all the time :)

> Also, the bonus is weird. I don't know if there's precedent or not,
> but a +1 bonus per 5 ranks in some skill just seems odd.

Hey, am I creative or what? I invented a whole new feat mechanic!

> Most feats
> that provide bonuses provide static bonuses, and those feats whose
> bonus goes up with character level generally have static bonuses and
> feat chains with stacking bonuses (TWF, ITWF*) or can be taken
> multiple times (Toughness). And feats that are dependent on a skill
> have ranks in that skill as a prerequisite and may use that skill to
> "activate" the feat (Mounted Combat).

True, these are the usual mechanics...

> Thus, your feat should be more like:
>
>
> Skill Concentration
>
> Prerequisites: Still Mind class ability, Concentration 1 rank.
>
> Benefit:
> Once per round as a Standard Action, you may attempt a Concentration
> check to gain a +2 insight bonus to your Balance, Climb, Escape
> Artist, Jump or Tumble skill.

Yeah, but I tried to find an incentive for monks to invest ranks
in Concentration. This version is a rather small one...

> And then maybe have an Improved Skill Concentration that makes your
> insight bonus +4, and a Superior Skill Concentration that makes it
+6.
>
> Also, one other thing that bugs me about the feat is the Still Mind
> prerequisite. It seems to be a way around requiring levels in a
given
> class, but there's already a good way to do this and still let others
> take the feat. Remove the Still Mind prerequisite, and allow Monks
to
> take this as one of their bonus feats.

Prereq could be 3 ranks Concentration instead.
Without 3 ranks it's pointless to take anyway.
Takeable as a bonus feat for monks sounds very good.

> Oh, and this feat should
> probably be of the form "Choose X skills. This feat applies to these
> skills. This feat may be taken multiple times, each time choose X
> more skills to apply it to."

The list of skills is too restrictive, but it should not be allowed for
all skills. Another possibility is Perform(for example: Tea Ceremony).

> Personally, I'd just make a feat that allows you to break the no
> Taking 10 when in a stressful situation based on a Concentration
> check.

As a matter of taste I like this less than the above...

> Focused Concentration
>
> Prerequisite: Concentration 1 rank.
>
> Benefit:
> Once per round as a Standard Action that provokes an Attack of
> Opportunity, you may attempt a Concentration check to allow you to
> Take 10 on a skill check you otherwise couldn't Take 10 on due to
> being distracted or threatened.
>
> Normal:
> Without this feat you cannot Take 10 when distracted or threatened.

Which DC would you require for the Concentration check?
And it should be forbidden to take 10 on the Concentration check
explicitly.

LL

PS: I'll 'suffer' a 2-week easter vacation,
so maybe Ubi will take over the thread before I return.
:)
 
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Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
>
> Personally, I'd just make a feat that allows you to break
> the no Taking 10 when in a stressful situation based on a
> Concentration check.

Heh. That was the suggestion that started this whole sub-thread,
though not posed as a feat.

--
Nik
- remove vermin from email address to reply.
 
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Mere moments before death, Nikolas Landauer hastily scrawled:
>Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
>>
>> Personally, I'd just make a feat that allows you to break
>> the no Taking 10 when in a stressful situation based on a
>> Concentration check.
>
>Heh. That was the suggestion that started this whole sub-thread,
>though not posed as a feat.

Right.



Ed Chauvin IV

--
DISCLAIMER : WARNING: RULE # 196 is X-rated in that to calculate L,
use X = [(C2/10)^2], and RULE # 193 which is NOT meant to be read by
kids, since RULE # 187 EXPLAINS homosexuality mathematically, using
modifier G @ 11.

"I always feel left out when someone *else* gets killfiled."
--Terry Austin
 

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"Mark Blunden" <m.blundenATntlworld.com@address.invalid> wrote in message news:<39tpqhF65kitsU1@individual.net>...

> Unless I'm missing something, Skill Mastery is a high-level Rogue-only
> optional ability that applies to a handful of skills. Plus, the start of
> this sub-thread was looking for more uses for Concentration, and Skill
> Mastery doesn't do that.

Some classes in Complete Adventurer have Skill Mastery in selected or
limited skills.
 
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Seb wrote:
> Recently, one of my players, new to the campaign choosed to play a
> monk (I run a 3.5 game in a home brew world). The guy put 5 ranks in
> Concentration skill. I know that skill is perfect to describe a
> meditating ascetic which was the purpose of my friend. But I wonder
> whether or not it could have game effects for a non-caster.

It already does:

You must make a Concentration check whenever you might potentially
be distracted (by taking damage, by harsh weather, and so on) while
engaged in some action that requires your full attention. Such
actions include casting a spell, concentrating on an active spell,
directing a spell, using a spell-like ability, or using a skill that
would provoke an attack of opportunity.

Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
like spellcasting does.
--
Bradd W. Szonye
http://www.szonye.com/bradd
 
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Mere moments before death, Lorenz.Lang@gmx.de hastily scrawled:
>Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
>> Mere moments before death, Lorenz Lang hastily scrawled:
>> >On Thu, 17 Mar 2005 09:28:12 -0500, Ed Chauvin IV wrote:
>> >> Mere moments before death, Lorenz Lang hastily scrawled:
>> >>>
>> >>>How about:
>> >>>
>> >>>Skill Concentration
>> >>>
>> >>>Prereq: Still Mind class ability
>> >>>
>> >>>Benefit:
>> >>>If you concentrate using a full-round action on your
>> >>>Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Jump or Tumble skill
>> >>>you gain a +1 insight bonus per 5 ranks of Concentration
>> >>>on this skill for the next round.
>> >>>
>> >>>Is this too weak? Should the bonus be +2 or +1 per 3 ranks for
>example?
>> >>
>> >> It seems to me that you guys are trying to fix a leaky pipe with a
>> >> hammer. Why not just make a Skill Mastery-like feat?
>> >>
>> >
>> >Do you think such a feat (as above) is worthless, silly or both?
>>
>> As written, I think it's mostly worthless, and a just bit silly.
>> Worthless because it's at best a +4 bonus for a 20th level character,
>
>+1 per 3 ranks would be +6 at 20th level, no problem.
>If it's otherwise worthless or too weak,
>let's just raise the boni a bit.
>
>> in exchange for not being able to use most of the skills it's
>supposed
>> to be augmenting. If you use a FRA, you can't use a Move Action and
>> therefore can't Balance, Climb, Jump or Tumble *to* anywhere.
>
>You overlooked the 'next round' bit. Concentrate and focus
>your Chi power or whatever as a FRA and gain a bonus on the *next*
>round.

Mea culpa. Well, at least it isn't useless. ;-)

>> Also, the bonus is weird. I don't know if there's precedent or not,
>> but a +1 bonus per 5 ranks in some skill just seems odd.
>
>Hey, am I creative or what? I invented a whole new feat mechanic!

No, you just used an existing mechanic in a non-standard way. ;-)

>> Most feats
>> that provide bonuses provide static bonuses, and those feats whose
>> bonus goes up with character level generally have static bonuses and
>> feat chains with stacking bonuses (TWF, ITWF*) or can be taken
>> multiple times (Toughness). And feats that are dependent on a skill
>> have ranks in that skill as a prerequisite and may use that skill to
>> "activate" the feat (Mounted Combat).
>
>True, these are the usual mechanics...
>
>> Thus, your feat should be more like:
>>
>>
>> Skill Concentration
>>
>> Prerequisites: Still Mind class ability, Concentration 1 rank.
>>
>> Benefit:
>> Once per round as a Standard Action, you may attempt a Concentration
>> check to gain a +2 insight bonus to your Balance, Climb, Escape
>> Artist, Jump or Tumble skill.
>
>Yeah, but I tried to find an incentive for monks to invest ranks
>in Concentration. This version is a rather small one...

What? The feat's usefulness is *directly* proportional to your
Concentration bonus.

>> And then maybe have an Improved Skill Concentration that makes your
>> insight bonus +4, and a Superior Skill Concentration that makes it
>+6.
>>
>> Also, one other thing that bugs me about the feat is the Still Mind
>> prerequisite. It seems to be a way around requiring levels in a given
>> class, but there's already a good way to do this and still let others
>> take the feat. Remove the Still Mind prerequisite, and allow Monks to
>> take this as one of their bonus feats.
>
>Prereq could be 3 ranks Concentration instead.
>Without 3 ranks it's pointless to take anyway.

Which makes requiring 3 ranks redundant. I don't even think you need
to require ranks, Concentration is an untrained skill after all.

>Takeable as a bonus feat for monks sounds very good.
>
>> Oh, and this feat should
>> probably be of the form "Choose X skills. This feat applies to these
>> skills. This feat may be taken multiple times, each time choose X
>> more skills to apply it to."
>
>The list of skills is too restrictive, but it should not be allowed for
>all skills.

Why not?

>> Personally, I'd just make a feat that allows you to break the no
>> Taking 10 when in a stressful situation based on a Concentration
>> check.
>
>As a matter of taste I like this less than the above...

Well, yeah. I don't

>> Focused Concentration
>>
>> Prerequisite: Concentration 1 rank.
>>
>> Benefit:
>> Once per round as a Standard Action that provokes an Attack of
>> Opportunity, you may attempt a Concentration check to allow you to
>> Take 10 on a skill check you otherwise couldn't Take 10 on due to
>> being distracted or threatened.
>>
>> Normal:
>> Without this feat you cannot Take 10 when distracted or threatened.
>
>Which DC would you require for the Concentration check?

Already covered in the Concentration rules. Read the skill
description.

>And it should be forbidden to take 10 on the Concentration check
>explicitly.

It already is.



Ed Chauvin IV

--
DISCLAIMER : WARNING: RULE # 196 is X-rated in that to calculate L,
use X = [(C2/10)^2], and RULE # 193 which is NOT meant to be read by
kids, since RULE # 187 EXPLAINS homosexuality mathematically, using
modifier G @ 11.

"I always feel left out when someone *else* gets killfiled."
--Terry Austin
 
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On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:10:35 GMT, "Bradd W. Szonye" <bradd+news@szonye.com>
wrote:

>Seb wrote:
>> Recently, one of my players, new to the campaign choosed to play a
>> monk (I run a 3.5 game in a home brew world). The guy put 5 ranks in
>> Concentration skill. I know that skill is perfect to describe a
>> meditating ascetic which was the purpose of my friend. But I wonder
>> whether or not it could have game effects for a non-caster.
>
>It already does:
>
> You must make a Concentration check whenever you might potentially
> be distracted (by taking damage, by harsh weather, and so on) while
> engaged in some action that requires your full attention. Such
> actions include casting a spell, concentrating on an active spell,
> directing a spell, using a spell-like ability, or using a skill that
> would provoke an attack of opportunity.
>
>Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
>like spellcasting does.

In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway. That's
things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.


--
Hong Ooi | "COUNTERSRTIKE IS AN REAL-TIME
hong@zipworld.com.au | STRATEGY GAME!!!"
http://www.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/ | -- RR
Sydney, Australia |
 
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In article <pdfo31dhn6989sls07oh0b9ajikkap1fcm@4ax.com>,
Hong Ooi <hong@zipworld.com.au> wrote:
>On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:10:35 GMT, "Bradd W. Szonye" <bradd+news@szonye.com>
>wrote:
>>Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
>>like spellcasting does.
>
>In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
>Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway. That's
>things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.

I can imagine a rogue madly trying to Open the lock to the getaway tunnel
while being whaled upon by goblins. "Work the lock. Don't look at the
rottweilers. Work the lock".
--
"Yo' ideas need to be thinked befo' they are say'd" - Ian Lamb, age 3.5
http://www.cs.queensu.ca/~dalamb/ qucis->cs to reply (it's a long story...)
 
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Mere moments before death, Hong Ooi hastily scrawled:
>On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:10:35 GMT, "Bradd W. Szonye" <bradd+news@szonye.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Seb wrote:
>>> Recently, one of my players, new to the campaign choosed to play a
>>> monk (I run a 3.5 game in a home brew world). The guy put 5 ranks in
>>> Concentration skill. I know that skill is perfect to describe a
>>> meditating ascetic which was the purpose of my friend. But I wonder
>>> whether or not it could have game effects for a non-caster.
>>
>>It already does:
>>
[...]
>>
>>Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
>>like spellcasting does.
>
>In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
>Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway. That's
>things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.

Who's fault is that?



Ed Chauvin IV

--
DISCLAIMER : WARNING: RULE # 196 is X-rated in that to calculate L,
use X = [(C2/10)^2], and RULE # 193 which is NOT meant to be read by
kids, since RULE # 187 EXPLAINS homosexuality mathematically, using
modifier G @ 11.

"I always feel left out when someone *else* gets killfiled."
--Terry Austin
 
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Hong Ooi <hong@zipworld.com.au> wrote in message news:<pdfo31dhn6989sls07oh0b9ajikkap1fcm@4ax.com>...
> On Fri, 18 Mar 2005 20:10:35 GMT, "Bradd W. Szonye" <bradd+news@szonye.com>
> wrote:
>
> >Seb wrote:
> >> Recently, one of my players, new to the campaign choosed to play a
> >> monk (I run a 3.5 game in a home brew world). The guy put 5 ranks in
> >> Concentration skill. I know that skill is perfect to describe a
> >> meditating ascetic which was the purpose of my friend. But I wonder
> >> whether or not it could have game effects for a non-caster.
> >
> >It already does:
> >
> > You must make a Concentration check whenever you might potentially
> > be distracted (by taking damage, by harsh weather, and so on) while
> > engaged in some action that requires your full attention. Such
> > actions include casting a spell, concentrating on an active spell,
> > directing a spell, using a spell-like ability, or using a skill that
> > would provoke an attack of opportunity.
> >
> >Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
> >like spellcasting does.
>
> In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
> Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway. That's
> things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.

But concentration stands for more than just taking damage. Imagine,
instead, doing something like making a map, or crafting an item, or
something, on a ship in rough weather.

But again, these come up only rarely.
 
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Bradd wrote:
>>> Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
>>> like spellcasting does.

Hong wrote:
>> In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
>> Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway.
>> That's things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.

David Alex Lamb wrote:
> I can imagine a rogue madly trying to Open the lock to the getaway
> tunnel while being whaled upon by goblins. "Work the lock. Don't
> look at the rottweilers. Work the lock".

And it's not too unusual to make a Heal check to stabilize a dying PC
while under fire. Hong right in spirit, though; they do come up rarely.
Is it worth investing in Concentration for it? Maybe, maybe not.
--
Bradd W. Szonye
http://www.szonye.com/bradd
 
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dalamb@qucis.queensu.ca wrote:

> >>Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
> >>like spellcasting does.
> >
> >In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
> >Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway. That's
> >things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.
>
> I can imagine a rogue madly trying to Open the lock to the getaway tunnel
> while being whaled upon by goblins. "Work the lock. Don't look at the
> rottweilers. Work the lock".

I can also *imagine* it, but as Hong said, it never actually comes up.
At least IME.

Especially for monks. A rogue just might need to pick a lock/disable a
device right now, enough so to ignore combat. But what skill is a monk
going to be using that needs concentration?


--
Jasin Zujovic
jzujovic@inet.hr
 
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In article <slrnd3opb0.a0b.bradd+news@szonye.com>,
Bradd W. Szonye <bradd+news@szonye.com> wrote:
>Bradd wrote:
>>>> Note the last phrase -- some skill checks require Concentration just
>>>> like spellcasting does.
>
>Hong wrote:
>>> In practice, this never comes up; most of the skills you'd require a
>>> Concentration check on, you're never going to use in combat anyway.
>>> That's things like Disable Device, Heal, Open Lock, etc.
>
>David Alex Lamb wrote:
>> I can imagine a rogue madly trying to Open the lock to the getaway
>> tunnel while being whaled upon by goblins. "Work the lock. Don't
>> look at the rottweilers. Work the lock".
>
>And it's not too unusual to make a Heal check to stabilize a dying PC
>while under fire. Hong right in spirit, though; they do come up rarely.
>Is it worth investing in Concentration for it? Maybe, maybe not.

Maybe not. It's easier to think of single examples than to analyse the
likelihood in an average campaign.
--
"Yo' ideas need to be thinked befo' they are say'd" - Ian Lamb, age 3.5
http://www.cs.queensu.ca/~dalamb/ qucis->cs to reply (it's a long story...)
 
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Jasin Zujovic <jzujovic@inet.hr> wrote:
>I can also *imagine* it, but as Hong said, it never actually comes up.
>At least IME.
>
>Especially for monks. A rogue just might need to pick a lock/disable a
>device right now, enough so to ignore combat. But what skill is a monk
>going to be using that needs concentration?

Balance?

Donald
 
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tsang@soda.csua.berkeley.edu wrote:

> >I can also *imagine* it, but as Hong said, it never actually comes up.
> >At least IME.
> >
> >Especially for monks. A rogue just might need to pick a lock/disable a
> >device right now, enough so to ignore combat. But what skill is a monk
> >going to be using that needs concentration?
>
> Balance?

AFAIK, balance is just moving; it doesn't provoke an attack of
opportunity, so concentration isn't needed. Unless you're moving through
threatened spaces, of course, but if you are concentration won't help.

It seems to me that most of the skills you'll be using in combat assume
they'll be so used, and so aren't considered to distract you from combat
enough to draw an AoO.

I like how d20 Modern made concentration a general AoO-avoiding skill,
but I don't want to give free AoO-avoidance to casters, who usually take
concentration anyway.

I like the suggestion with a concentration DC to take 10 on Str and Dex
skills, because it's more useful for non-casters. But it does tread
dangerously close to being skill mastery (all Str and Dex skills) for
the cost of a handful of skill points.


--
Jasin Zujovic
jzujovic@inet.hr