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Apple is gone

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July 2, 2001 3:39:01 AM

Hi y'all.
I have been researching the Sledgehammer and Clawhammer processors from AMD, as well as the G5 from Apple. Here's the deal: Around teh end of this year, towards the beginning, the Sledgehammer 64-Bit processor from AMD will come out. The Sledgehammer will be made for servers, seriously high end workstations, and super computers. It's L2 cache at full speed will range from 512 KB to 2 Mb, depending upon what you choose- oh yeah, it'll also start out at 2Ghz! later on, the Clawhammer will come out, which will be made for high end PC's. It'll pretty much be teh same. The "Hammer" or K8 series from AMD will be fully backwards compatible with 16 and 32 bit applications.
What leaves to beleive that Apple is seriously srewed is that their all powerful G5, which will come out in Q3 of 2002 (way later than Sledgehammer) will also be 2 Ghz, although there have been rumors that it wil start out at 1Ghz. It isn't sure yet whether it will start out as 32-Bit and progress to 64, or whether it'll simply start out at 64-Bit. This is what leads me to beleive that Apple is screwed (oh, and don't even think about iTanium from Intel, according to studies done and actual testing, it will perform worse than a 1 Ghz P3 in 32 Bit applications!) Plus, AMD will intigrate QDR qhen it come sout, and Apple probably won't.

Looking for wife able to cook, fish, have boat and motor. Please send pic. of boat and motor.

More about : apple

July 2, 2001 6:24:26 AM

any links?

-* This Space For Rent *-
email for application details
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 2, 2001 8:10:12 AM

itanium's been out for a while now...
Related resources
July 2, 2001 8:32:19 AM

and that answers my question how?

-* This Space For Rent *-
email for application details
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 2, 2001 9:13:41 AM

Wouldnt suprise me too much if Apple would one day bring out a x86 based computer. Actually, it would make a lot of sense. Throw in a hammer cpu, install mac OS X on it, and put it all in a flashy case. It would make the fastest Mac ever. Im no specialist, but I'd think any program designed to work under Mac OS-X should run (possibly with minor changes) under OS-X for x-86. Apple has a proven track record of succefully moving to new architectures. Why not do it again ? I might even want one then.

---- Owner of the only Dell computer with a AMD chip
July 2, 2001 10:52:03 AM

CPU speed means nothing anymore. Intel has proved this since they have the highest GHz CPU, but not the highest performance benchmarks.

<font color=red>Yeah, I took a crap on your lawn. Whatcha gonna do about it?</font color=red>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 2, 2001 1:11:57 PM

Good MAC's Suck worst then AMD

! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !
July 2, 2001 2:08:40 PM

Quote:
CPU speed means nothing anymore

CPU speed is not the same thing as clock speed.

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Apple? Macintosh? What are these strange words you speak?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 2, 2001 2:41:05 PM

"! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown ! "

*Sigh*... he is even proud of it...
/ignore bowser

---- Owner of the only Dell computer with a AMD chip
July 2, 2001 3:18:48 PM

the hammer series will start at 2ghz, but when? aren't they talking 2nd quarter of 2002 at earliest?
we're talking 2ghz by the end of the year for others, aren't we?
by the time the hammer comes out, its gonna be slow(clock speed wise) or on an even keel.
I'm still interested, but I don't think its gonna be all that for a little while.

----------------------
Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
July 2, 2001 5:09:36 PM

Quote:

oh, and don't even think about iTanium from Intel, according to studies done and actual testing, it will perform worse than a 1 Ghz P3 in 32 Bit applications!)


Dude, It performs like a Pentium Pro in 32bit, not a 1GHz P3!!

---------
Grass is a beautiful weed
July 2, 2001 5:55:49 PM

M74Merc, Sledgehammer is supposed to be introduced at end of 2001 or beginning (Q1) of 2002.

Looking for wife able to cook, fish, have boat and motor. Please send pic. of boat and motor.
July 2, 2001 6:00:05 PM

AMD keeps pushing back it's release, though.

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My Athlon can beat your Ferrari off the line.
July 2, 2001 7:34:18 PM

all i can say is im waiting... when they come out ill be waiting for benchmarks... ill let the numbers decide... whats the point of speculating so much... the hammer series will be great... better than the itaniums... more speculation... for one thing i havent seen AMD screw up too hard... like the failed architecture switches with the P4... oh well... and the confusion caused to me when my pentium (pentiflux apparently... prototype... yet again apparently) 60 operated faster than the 100 mhz chip... confusion thrives... GOOD!

you do not strengthen the weak by weakening the strong
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 2:25:12 AM

i dont think apple will be gone, they will always have their niche and that cult following of theirs.all the visual arts people use them. the clock speeds are slower but the datapath is 128 bits as opposed to 32 or 64, well here is what apple sez:
"The Velocity Engine
The secret of the PowerPC G4’s
phenomenal performance is its aptly
named Velocity Engine. It’s the heart of a
supercomputer miniaturized onto a sliver
of silicon. The Velocity Engine can
process data in 128-bit chunks, instead of
the smaller 32-bit or 64-bit chunks used in
traditional processors (it’s the 128-bit
vector processing technology used in
scientific supercomputers — except that
we’ve added 162 new instructions to
speed up computations)."
at any rate they claim to be able to handle floating point calculations 2 to four times faster than x86 processors.
maybe their next generation will double their datapath. i dont know enough about it. i own an amd presently and have no plans to own an apple, i just dont think they will dissappear nor would they desire to make x86 machines. they arent less popular because its an inferior platform, its just that the pc was the adopted machine of the business world. the betamax was superior to the vcr but it never caught on. if you want to publish or do visual arts you use a mac. if you want the most kick ass gaming experience, the best software selection and compatability, unlimited hardware choices then you use an x86 pc.
my 2 cents
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 5:48:42 AM

Dont expect to know what the G5 will be. Mot always announces stuff and then changes it completley upon release.

Also you still have to remember that speed between the two platforms is a relative thing. The AMD will play games hella faster, but for most 2D work I bet you the G5 will rule.


I no longer wish to belong to the kind of club that accepts people like me as members - Groucho Marx
July 3, 2001 8:20:03 PM

Lemmings at war! hahaha clueless indeed.

http://www.simics.com/

Hammer is still a software simulator atm, no actuall product exists. so base your decision upon that!

Here is the whitepaper. take notice in no actuall numbers or specs. just a theory.

http://www.amd.com/products/cpg/64bit/64bit_wp.html

You do not buy a 64bit machine to run 32 bit apps. for the tax you paid on the Itanium you prob could buy a P4 and have change left over. 64 bit apps are very expensive atm.

I dont see anyone getting 64bit for home for at least 5 years. I know there are a few retards out there who will claim to get one or have one but realisticly there is not much available for consumers in the 64bit arena yet. just professional apps and specialized apps for genome, genemap, CFD, and so on.

Next thing off the block from Apple will be dual 733Mhz G4, it will ship with OSX preloaded.

http://www.dccworkstation.com/htm/articles_0300/FF04_Mo...

G4-II are not even ready for sample yet 3Q2001, G5 is the 64bit version 4Q2001.

Intel has 64bit product on market, AMD has jackshit, how can you compare the 2 and say AMD will beat Intel? [-peep-] loser lemmings at work!
July 3, 2001 10:39:57 PM

Wasn't there an article in tech news (not long ago) about Apple considering switch from RISC over to x86?
July 3, 2001 11:35:22 PM

Im currently .pdf challenged on IRIX 6.5, choad browser doesnt even show the link. sad indeed.

Just wanted to add, for those of you out there running OSX please visit these sites. read text below before visiting the sites.

www.amihotornot.com
www.seagate.com

For those without OSX, the first link will scramble all text and graphics not only in the browser window but on the desktop, when you get random letters on the desktop click on them and drag them around. this is a cool effect if you want to see how bad HTML/Java can whack the IE browser.

Second link will instantly bomb the whole system, protected mode memory has no protection from this web page.

Grizley1, somehow I didnt read a damn thing you replied too. maybe one day I will, anything in those stupid spaced out quotes surely gets scrolled passed rather quickly.
July 5, 2001 9:40:34 PM

I don't want to start a war here and since I own both a MAC and a Windows machine I think I'm neutral here. I just wanted to say that when a MAC is listed at say 500 MHZ it's much much faster than a 500 MHZ PC. I'm not quite sure why but I know it's a fact. If anyone knows the reason please share.

Also it's not ALL about power. I personally think the MAC operating system is much easier and seems less prone to melting down to the point where you need to reinstall everything and start fresh. I recently built a 1.4 TBIRD syatem and love it....but I still do alot of things on my MAC that would scare me to do on the PC...for fear of breaking the fragile windows OS.

I think I need both or maybe I have not found what I'm looking for yet. Linux maybe?????

Just my opinion.
Eric
July 5, 2001 10:01:06 PM

Quote:
Here is the whitepaper. take notice in no actuall numbers or specs. just a theory.

Quote:
Im currently .pdf challenged on IRIX 6.5, choad browser doesnt even show the link. sad indeed.


You mean you criticized a company's white papers when you didn't even look at them even a little bit??? I just lost any remaining respect for you, and you had better not dare ever again say anything about "AMD puppies" making stuff up, or talking about things they don't know about.

I'm still waiting for your technical cmparison of AMD vs. Intel you said you were smart enough to provide. In your own words, of course. I don't need to know about the sources you got your information from, since I can look it up for myself.

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My Athlon can beat your Ferrari off the line.
July 5, 2001 11:28:36 PM

and Intel sucks more than AMD too!!

Im savin up for a Cobra!! Hehe!! :wink: :wink:
July 5, 2001 11:30:59 PM

well at least the p4 sucks

Im savin up for a Cobra!! Hehe!! :wink: :wink:
July 6, 2001 5:24:55 PM

Yeah, no kidding. I can't believe he actually had the nerve to bash something he isn't even technologically capable of seeing.

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My Athlon can beat your Ferrari off the line.
July 6, 2001 5:35:44 PM

I've got an uncle that has a Mac and a PC. (Okay, actually several PCs and a single Mac.) We sat down one day and compared the Mac to an equal speed PC, same amount of memory. While running Adobe software, the Mac kicked the PC's butt. While running ANYTHING else (not just games, but any other software) the PC kicked the Mac's butt.

Go figure.

So if your world is Adobe, go with a Mac. If you plan on using any other software intensively, go with a PC. That's what I've seen anyway.

In theory, the Mac architecture is supposedly faster because of the way that it handles micro-code. How much faster though is really a mystery. And when you look at the maximum speed of a Mac compared to the maximum speed of a PC (especially an Athlon), the Mac is a joke. Especially after you've seen the prices for each (again especially the Athlon).

Add into that yet more, like the fact that Macs don't really upgrade well, have limited hardware choices, and take so long to incorporate new technologies, and it's pretty clear that Macs are more or less a joke to the majority of people in the world.

Is the Mac OS more stable than Windows? I think the answer depends entirely on two factors. 1) Which version of each OS is being used. 2) What hardware is in the PC and how good are the drivers.

A lot of people who have instability problems on the PC blame it on Windows. The sad truth though is that the vast majority of the instability problems on a PC are because of bad hardware or bad hardware drivers, not because of the OS. But because so many people use Windows on a PC, and because the OS is so much more appearant to someone than a hardware driver, the Windows ends up taking the blame for an awful lot more than it's at fault for.

Not to say that Windows isn't without it's bugs. Goodness knows I've reported my share of bugs to MS, and haven't seen a single one of them fixed yet. I'm just saying that MS isn't as much to blame as people like to think they are. If Linux were used as often as Windows was, we'd see just as many complaints about Linux.

-THG isn't AMD biased. They just turn Intel mobo reviews into AMD vs. Intel debates for fun. Yeah.
July 6, 2001 5:47:44 PM

http://www.apple.com/powermac/processor.html

Maybe you girls should learn about the velocity engine.

BTW, its not my machine that is not displaying link properly, its the uberlame programming on AMD website.

AMD lacks QA checks on website programming and processor production. [-peep-] sad that AMD cannot consistantly produce a processor, let alone apply glue straight.

Seems half the time I click the "search" button it give "file not found".
July 6, 2001 6:18:15 PM

If it's the programming on the website, why are you the only one having a problem. My P2 Gateway here at work is displaying it quite nicely.

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My Athlon can beat your Ferrari off the line.
July 6, 2001 6:44:10 PM

Im on a R14k with Irix 6.5.13b with custom kernel.

Slight difference between this and your dell.

I often switch back to PC but this is my primary machine I use at work. I also have dual 733 G4 with OSX but it also has problems on some web pages.
July 6, 2001 6:50:58 PM

I hope i dont get flamed:

Wouldn't a 800mhz L2 4mb Itanium be faster then a 2ghz Hammer due too the fact that the Itanium EPIC is alot faster of the Hammer CISC. Because the 1.7ghz P4 is fast as a 1.2ghz Athlon due to the P4 poor fpu.

Nice Intel and AMD users get a Cookie.... :smile: Yummy :smile:
!