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Disapointing P4

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Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 2, 2001 10:29:16 PM

Watching the rollout of the P4 line has been a huge disapointment. I was interested because I am about to build a System. The Brookdale and the P4 Xeon were Intels chance to redeem there product but...
The first P4 has a terrible FPU, great bandwidth of which, it will not take advantage. Most Intel supporters stated "Wait for Brookdale" or "wait for the Xeon". Well we waited and they perform no better. Toms review of the brookdale is very telling.
Intel thinks it has invented "Crack Light" and we are all addicts. The Intel montra seems to be "take what we give you and like it because we are Intel." This stragedy may have worked before the Athlon, but not any more.
This is a compleatly ego
centric view but recent additions to the Highend testcenterhttp://www.highend3d.com/tests/maya/testcenter/database...
place the P4 Xeon behind the Athlon and even the P3. I find it hard to belive that people actualy spending money on these things.
This is not to say that future Intell products will be as lacking as the current one's, but a change in mindset (read managment) will be required.
I am voting with my dollars and they are going for (2) 1.2MP Athlon's with 1Gig ram and 2 X15's
Anim88tor

More about : disapointing

July 2, 2001 11:00:11 PM

And you're gonna have a really sweet system.

But I'm still waiting to see a P4 Northwood with DDR instead of Rambus.

------------------------------
My Athlon can beat your Ferrari off the line.
July 3, 2001 12:09:31 AM

yaa
those brockdale benchmarks were really sad...
i was tempted to loan THG my PC150 sdram :) 

how long before intel realises that DDRis NEEDED.
no more blue man adverts please.

mmm my athie 1200C has been running SETI@home for 3 days straight now :) 


My Hamster doesnt like sarcasm. He may very well bite you in your hard to reach places!
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July 3, 2001 1:51:24 AM

WOW, has intel lost their mind? Maybe they really are on crack?! The performance there is so pathetic that I'm sure only their most loyal contracted OEM's will be using that setup...

The fact that a P4 1.7 Ghz performs on par with an Athlon 1.2 Ghz is truly frightening. I wish we could get an official statement from Intel...

I'm still not giving up hope though. Intel is bound to get their act together. The problem is that most people won't have a clue about these benchmarks so Intel is just releasing products for marketing purposes, not performance...

<font color=red>Yeah, I took a crap on your lawn. Whatcha gonna do about it?</font color=red>
July 3, 2001 2:10:24 AM

I'd like to see AMD take about 50% of the market share, and then have Intel clean up their act.

"Ignorance is bliss, but I tend to get screwed over."
July 3, 2001 3:17:34 AM

I was thinking that they take 60% and then the two giants fight over that 10% majority. It would probably help motivate Intel to get thier act together.

<font color=red>Yeah, I took a crap on your lawn. Whatcha gonna do about it?</font color=red>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 5:40:27 AM

Hmmm, FAB capacity would seem to suggest that AMD couldn't possably take that much market share from Intel without years to build more FABs. But if the bottom falls out of the CPU market, Intel will be the one losing all the sales (do to the fact that they must sell there chips at higher prices to break even), meaning AMD might just get to the 40%-50% level. Unless Intel lets itself bleed money in exchange for market share.

Ok I'm done rambling...

Anyway forget Intel, VIA and other will have a decent P4 DDR chipset out long before Intel. Brookdale SDR is designed for the "screw the uninformed consumer" market.

I AM Canadian.
July 3, 2001 5:49:44 AM

be interesting that - Intel have always made the best chipsets for Intel CPU - not sure VIA will do better - unless you count Intel releasing bad chipset to marketing rather than performance (845)

-* This Space For Rent *-
email for application details
July 3, 2001 2:34:55 PM

I can't wait till fugger and amdmeltdown have to face the fact that the via chipsets are causing compatability issues with the pentium4, and amdmeltdown's sig will read

"intel and via you STILL are the weakest link, goodbye"

<sarcasm>if via kills amd what will it do to p4 ddr?</sarcasm>

BOWSER" P4 WITH VIA DDR IS SO FAST AND STABLE VIA RULES ALL"


Hypocrites


~Matisaro~
"Friends don't let friends buy Pentiums"
~Tbird1.3@1.55~
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 2:37:46 PM

Intel P4 Xeon is a workstation chip meant for Database's and webservers. you dumb amd puppies look at it for network wise.

! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !
July 3, 2001 2:50:29 PM

AnandTech <i>did</i> review the dual Xeons as server CPU's. The dual AthlonMP's still mopped the floor with Intel's best--in an SSE2-optimized benchmark, no less.

Perhaps you should rephrase your line:

"Intel P4 Xeon is an overpriced chip meant for people who want to pay way too much to get way too little. We dumb Intel lapdogs just don't know any better."

Hey everyone...should I cane this dumbass again?

Kelledin

"/join #hackerz. See the Web. DoS interesting people."
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 2:55:36 PM

>you dumb amd puppies look at it for network wise.

WTF?

>! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !

LoL,
If I were Meltdown or Fugger, I'd be bitching at bowser to change his signature. It makes them look bad by association. And that is some accomplishment!


<i>Cognite Tute</i>
(Think for Yourself)
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 2:59:17 PM

school is good take a math class.

! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !
July 3, 2001 2:59:52 PM

Hey Booso, lay off. Funny how the P4 Xeon get's out performed by Athlon MP's eh, in database's and the whole 9 yards. And I like how he goes off topic, not even comenting on the poor performance of i845.
Live up to the facts, review the benchmarks, stop telling yourself that your precious Intel is the best. I'm not an AMD Zealot, I don't even own an AMD based machine, but I go for what is best for the $$$. AMD gives that, and with added bonus's, MORE performance. I'm just saving up to get my A-4.
Live with it dude, Intel has its problems (i845, i820, P4 Performance, RAMBUS and now Sdram only based machines, If it's performance wasnt hindered by RAMBUS, now we got old Sdram on there....it's either To Expensive and not worth it, or still more expensive than AMD baed and disgusting performance. AMD has its problems (not manufa. there own chipsets in enormous amounts) but live with it. Nothings perfect. So stop saying all the crap about how AMD is sooo terrible and blah blah blah. Look at good and bad of both, not just Good of Intel and bad of AMD, there is 2 sides to everything.

-MeTaL RoCkEr

AMD = Always Making Dough... =)
July 3, 2001 3:04:36 PM

LoL
Oh my i can't stop laughing now. Aparently you peopel are Nazi's now because Booso shot himself in the foot with his staements, so instead of talkign about hardware, were talkign about World War attributes.
LoL.
Booso, do you realize how dumb you look now by saying that.
Your pretty much saying "Oh, so because you don't like us Intel fan's your racist against Jewish people"
Man, get a life now, or forever hold your piece (b4 sum 1 cuts it off u 'tard).

-MeTaL RoCkEr

AMD = Always Making Dough... =)
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 3:07:39 PM

Life is good. Don't ruin it by taking drugs and dropping out of school.

! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 3:12:56 PM

you sad looser

GET A LIFE
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 3:13:41 PM

Don't drink and drive.

! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by bowser on 07/03/01 11:27 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
July 3, 2001 3:14:36 PM

bowser what is your problem? There has not been anyone I would band but your Racial CRAP GETTING CLOST TO IT!

Jeff
July 3, 2001 3:15:19 PM

Now your trying to put words in my mouth, dude, get a life.
I'm not a part of Nazi party's or the KKK, I don't kill people and I haven't hung any black men, so where are you getting this from ?
Now, becasue I know I don't make anyone sick to the stomach (except for you now) I think everyone will be happy, especialyl knowing you have a weakness, Booso is getting sick, maybe he wont ever come back here. =)
BTW everyone, seeign as how you can all ready his post..

"MeTaLrOcKeR are you a member of the nazi party and the KKK you like to kill jews and hang black men you make me sick to the stomach."

Do you see how immature this women is? Sum 1 ban this girl.

-MeTaL RoCkEr


AMD = Always Making Dough... =)
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 3:16:26 PM

>your a nazi cuz you dont like intel users. You want to send them to a camp.

<font color=red>Ok Bowser, I'll cut you a little slack because I figure you're what 12 years old or so. But read some history your loser. Calling someone a Nazi is no damned joke, especially wrt something as trivial as your choice in CPUs. <b>Grow up or go away.</b></font color=red>

As for Intel, I've benchmarked my stuff on every processor family that Intel currently has released (except for the Celeron and the P4 Xeon). Have you? On my app, the P4 was absolutely dead last in $$$/performance. 100% higher then the Athlon solutions. It was lousy in terms of absolute performance also, about the equivalent of a 900MHz Athlon-B

I'll use Intel again when they have the best solution for my dollars.


<i>Cognite Tute</i>
(Think for Yourself)
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 3:17:00 PM

school is good read a book instead

! Member of the Intel Triple Threat w/ Fugger and AMDmeltdown !
July 3, 2001 3:19:43 PM

Bowser is a good example of parents not monitoring their children.

Jeff
July 3, 2001 3:21:02 PM

You do realize from saying what you did to me I can get you in some serious criminal stuff here. It's called slander.
Who's up for letting the good old people who run this Forum know what Bowser has said.

-MeTaL RoCkEr

AMD = Always Making Dough... =)<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by MeTaLrOcKeR on 07/03/01 11:22 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
July 3, 2001 4:04:39 PM

dont worry, bowser isn't answering because he is afraid and can't come up with a good comeback (we all remember "Look whos talking").

---------
Grass is a beautiful weed
July 3, 2001 4:09:13 PM

True enough, I still don't see though however why he had to bring in racial issues here.


-MeTaL RoCkEr

Eat, Sleep, Compute!
July 3, 2001 4:21:50 PM

I'm thinking intel = 10, AMD = 60, and Nvidia = 30. lol.. just thinking ... wouldn't that be sweet if nvidia came out with there own CPU and took 30 percent of the market from intel lol! After all people are sick of intels crap and don't like AMD but nvidia.. they know how good nvidia GPu's are ya know? i'd laugh that would be funny... i might even consider buying a nvidia CPU with it's nvidia chipset

*shrugs*
July 3, 2001 4:32:33 PM

hmmm...

Nice Intel and AMD users get a Cookie.... :smile: Yummy :smile:
July 3, 2001 4:33:46 PM

why are you so disappointed in the P4 ? there's nothing wrong with it! it's the memory, sdram sucks! brookdale is an Ok chipset but the memory still sucks.

also, I don't know but, I've never seen a "Wait for Brookdale" posted anywhere, can you point to the post?

another thing, your link to highend3d is not clear as to which is the best platform for Maya4, I'll wait 'til all the results come in, but it was interesting to see dual P3's on top of the Maya4 benchmark :-)

"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
July 3, 2001 5:16:09 PM

Hypocrites?

let's see how long you last with AMD, <A HREF="http://www.theinquirer.net/03070105.htm" target="_new"> Tiny bailed</A> (too many RMA's?), MicronPC gone! and dell is never going 100% with AMD not in this century!

eventually ppl go back to Intel.

"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
July 3, 2001 5:27:11 PM

i don't get it... why are you sticking up for intel? what has intel done for you? NOTHING! intel has done nothing for you nor will they ever pay you anything for advertising intel products. if anything they will sue you for using the intel name... There is no company that gives a rats a$$ about you or anyone else but the big dollar $ign. Thank AMD for the competition otherwise you would not have any computer at all for the intel chips andd boards would be extremly expensive and you would be forced to buy a cyrix chip or a MAC!!!!
July 3, 2001 6:03:48 PM

They somewhat care. Well when my celeron 533 went into flames. The computer shop wouldn't replace it and said i over clocked and i sent the burnt out to Intel. Well they sent me a sorry letter and a new P3 733 "when i first came out". There not that bad.

Nice Intel and AMD users get a Cookie.... :smile: Yummy :smile:
July 3, 2001 6:03:56 PM

They somewhat care. Well when my celeron 533 went into flames. The computer shop wouldn't replace it and said i over clocked and i sent the burnt out to Intel. Well they sent me a sorry letter and a new P3 733 "when i first came out". There not that bad.

Nice Intel and AMD users get a Cookie.... :smile: Yummy :smile:
July 3, 2001 6:11:20 PM

they just wanted to make sure they kept your business... thats all.. of course they will act nice and appear they care so you keep going back to them. No one likes a company that doesn't treat you good and usually doesn't buy anything from them again. so some companies treat the customers like gold.. because umm customers like you and I ARE gold to them. We make them exist.. with out customers there is no business. Bottom line is they care about your money and will do anything to keep in business with them.

thats how i see anyway... of course they gotta do what they gotta do to stay alive.
July 3, 2001 6:45:44 PM

I'm sure Intel <i>DOES</i> realise it needs DDR but they are kept from using it by Rambush...


<i><font color=purple>Running within specs is the key to a stable computer!</font color=purple></i>
<font color=red>LRMV</font color=red>
July 3, 2001 6:58:40 PM

Face the facts? Toms is clueless still. not sure who gave him that lame board but thats not even close to reality.

No clue where Tom got a Northwood 1.7Ghz. our lowest ES was a 2Ghz. The socket was correct, but something is not right.

I have a 2Ghz Northwood now with i845/DDR 2100, maybe its due to the fact we wil not produce a PC133 system or a screw around with the low end, but Intel provides us quality samples continously as the product gets changes.
The DDR Northwood out performs the Wilmette up to 25% at same clock speeds. Tom picked a winner when he compares PC133 "alpha" boards vs best of AMD. and Wilmette beat the AMD in almost everything.

Im sure AMD 760MP was ready for benching against top end products when it was @ 6 months prerelease.

Maybe you guys buy your gaming machine based upon MS office performance, thats all AMD had higher scores in.

Tom also fears the SSE2 coded software and expresses it in his article. something most of you have not even experiance yet. We are in development of approx 6 SSE2 demo's. I will post a they go live. yes the demos will be heavly coded for SSE2.

Call me a liar or whatever I dont care. your a Lemming and thats what you do best.
July 3, 2001 7:14:06 PM

he stated that the processor was a Williamette in 478 packaging.
you just look at the pictures don't you?

----------------------
Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 7:14:29 PM

Never mind liar --- how about prick of the month I watch these forums usually without comment but you take the biscuit-- the English word WANKER is a perfect match for FUGGER
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
July 3, 2001 7:18:58 PM

>No clue where Tom got a Northwood 1.7Ghz. our lowest ES
>was a 2Ghz. The socket was correct, but something is not
>right.

Fugger, did you even bother to read the article before you started spewing off?

<A HREF="http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/01q3/010702/pentium4-05..." target="_new">http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/01q3/010702/pentium4-05...;/A>

<i>"The processor we used for testing was a 1.7 GHz Pentium 4 with Willamette core, even though the new form factor may make you believe it was a 'Northwood'."</i>

>Maybe you guys buy your gaming machine based upon MS
>office performance, thats all AMD had higher scores in.

Ok, now I know you didn't read it.
The only thing the i845 system came close in <i>was</i> the sysmark tests. It didn't beat the 1.4GHz athlon in a single benchmark other then Flask-MPEG.

My opinion...
Frankly, there was far to much pre-production stuff in this review (wilamette on socket 478, i845 chipset) to take the numbers very seriously. We'll see what happens when it's released.


<i>Cognite Tute</i>
(Think for Yourself)
July 3, 2001 9:44:23 PM

Well when will this combo be ready? How about sending Tom one of these samples that you have so that the real story can come out on performance. You will probably sell many more. If you have a DDR version why in the hell is Intel selling a PC133 version? If they have a agreement with Rambus them they are committed but PC133!!! Intel would do better in waiting and allowing VIA to produce the Northwood/DDR boards until Intel can. I hope your 25% better numbers are correct in a broad sense and not one particular application or benchmark. Can you give us more details.
July 3, 2001 11:44:05 PM

I'm have no clue where people are getting the idea that Intel chips must be better due to their support....I can liken this assumption to a very greneralized metaphor:

McDonalds = Bad Food, Decent Service = People Like
Intel = Bad Chips, Decent Service = People Like

That is all.
July 4, 2001 1:16:41 AM

Dissapointed? well for me its really the Floating Point Processor. Being a scientist i know of and use a number of FPU intensive applications. And having a weak fpu is a real disadvantage. course there is SSE2, but a large number of older apps will never be SSE2 optimised. and probably a number of curent ones too. :( 
I also play alot of UT. :)  its been shown that a athlon 1200 can beat a p4 1700 in UT.
and lastly there is price. i just couldnt afford the p4, specially as i needed 512mb of ram. 2x256 rimms are amazing expensive in australia. 1 rimm costs as much as a athlon 1200C core. (or did when i got it)

thats the major reason why i went for athlon & not p4. the price of rdram doesnt help the p4 currently either in that regard.

mmmm 4 days straight now running SETI@home. finally found a stable combo in athlon & win2k.



My Hamster doesnt like sarcasm. He may very well bite you in your hard to reach places!
July 4, 2001 7:37:30 AM

There's a certain trend going on with all the most annoying handles on THG. Let's see if we can figure out who bowser is. First of all there is another person who was banned for calling people Nazis. Anybody know who? Second, that same person who had this bad habit of calling everybody monkeys, much like Bowser's puppies. Third of all, while Bowser has been busy being a troll this person (who has come back with a very similar name) has been gone. He finally appeared the other day to make a couple posts about nothing. I wonder if they are the same person considering that this particular person hates THG and constantly complains about it.

Yes, Spud, the friendly Spudmuffin. Hmmm.....

<font color=red>Yeah, I took a crap on your lawn. Whatcha gonna do about it?</font color=red>
July 4, 2001 4:37:46 PM

i dont really pay any attention. best that way.
i assume they think they are smart or get their rocks off *shrug*

the topic was pentium4 as per usual.
i was curious as to how long it takes a pee4 to do one SETI@home job.
as the p4 is reputed to have a weak FPU, and seti & home has quite alot of FPU calculations in it.

anybody?

P.S. Are therir any people out there who use a p4 and can verify this?

I think im going crazy and hearing voices, but my Hamster says im not!
!