Reliably enchanting past +5?

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

"Electronic Samurai" <Crash_jet@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:1123115872.903204.224480@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:

> I've managed to get magic weapons up to +5 before, but there are plenty
> of posts where users have risked +7 or higher enchantments on their
> magic weapons/artifacts. What's the best way to do this without
> evaporating your item?
>
>

Enchant a weapon to +4, read a blessed scroll of enchant weapon and hope
that it doesn't evaporate and there's a message of "Your %weapon
(violently) glows blue for a while."

If it's already at +5, just engrave a single character in the ground with
your weapon to dull it to a +4 enchantment.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Haakon Studebaker <heptapod@gmail.com> wrote in
news:Xns96A7C4AC73C1Cheptapodyahoocom@216.196.97.131:

> "Electronic Samurai" <Crash_jet@hotmail.com> wrote in
> news:1123115872.903204.224480@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:
>
>> I've managed to get magic weapons up to +5 before, but there are
>> plenty of posts where users have risked +7 or higher enchantments on
>> their magic weapons/artifacts. What's the best way to do this
>> without evaporating your item?
>>
>>
>
> Enchant a weapon to +4, read a blessed scroll of enchant weapon and
> hope that it doesn't evaporate and there's a message of "Your %weapon
> (violently) glows blue for a while."
>
> If it's already at +5, just engrave a single character in the ground
> with your weapon to dull it to a +4 enchantment.

Ummm, you're wrong ... here is the corrected version.


Enchant a weapon to +5, read a blessed scroll of enchant weapon and hope
that it doesn't evaporate and there's a message of "Your %weapon
(violently) glows blue for a while."

If it's already at +6, just engrave a single character in the ground with
your weapon to dull it to a +5 enchantment, or drop it on the ground and
zap drain life at it.


--
~ Cyde Weys ~

Mana du vortes, mana du vortes
Aeria gloris, aeria gloris

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Haakon Studebaker wrote:

> Cyde Weys <cyde@umd.edu> wrote in
> news:Xns96A7E00A1FA2F2galopagosterrapincy@199.45.49.11:
>
>>Ummm, you're wrong ... here is the corrected version.
>
> Not wrong, just playing it safe.

Wrong not playing safe.

If you've read my post 'Annotated code for enchant weapon' or you'd read
Dylan's spoilers correctly you'd know the following:

Weapons have a propability to evaporate if they are enchanted positively
when their enchantment is already higher than +5 (ie. >+5 which is the
same as >=+6) or when they are enchanted negatively and their
enchantment is already lower than -5 (ie. <-5 which is the same as <=-6).

Enchanting a weapon with blessed scroll of enchant weapon have adds a
random amount to the enchantment in a range of 1..x where x is depending
on the current enchantment of the weapon. Like thi:

Current enchantment of the weapon Range
+8 - +6 1..1
+5 - +3 1..2
+2 - -2 1..3
-3 - -5 1..4
-6 - -7 1..5
etc.

If the current enchantment level of the weapon is higher than +8 there
is one in the current enchantmet chance to get an additional 1 but this
does not depend on blessedness of the scroll, chance is the same for
non-cursed scrolls.

So to get +7 weapon, you'll have to start with +5 from +4 you only can
get +6.

Please don't post misinformation.

Topi

P.S. If one wants to try to get +127 weapon then it's easier to do it
with cursed scrolls of enchant weapon as if the weapon is not evaporated
then a cursed scroll always lowers the enchantment by -1.

--
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are
always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts."
- Bertrand Russell
"How come he didn't put 'I think' at the end of it?" - Anonymous

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

In news:<1123115872.903204.224480@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
Electronic Samurai <Crash_jet@hotmail.com> says...
> I've managed to get magic weapons up to +5 before, but there are plenty
> of posts where users have risked +7 or higher enchantments on their
> magic weapons/artifacts. What's the best way to do this without
> evaporating your item?

Other responses have told about the standard 'use a blessed scroll when
the item is at its highest safe-to-be-enchanted value (+5/+3), and if
you don't get +2 boost (ie +6/+4) then remove 1 and try again for 7/5'.
You find a good and detailed spoiler about it here:
http://www.helsinki.fi/~vviitane/s [...] ant.limits

However you can get your stuff better enchanted than so, if you have
some spare items to risk, and if they are stackable the real nice part
is that it won't cost you as many ?oEW as one might think at first.

Say that you want a bunch of daggers well enchanted - a very powerful
weapon in most hands and extremely deadly in some.
Say that you have got your greedy hands on ~120 stackable daggers, not a
very difficult task. Note now that there is not much practical
difference in having 120 +9 daggers and 10 +9 daggers. Furthermore you
have a bunch of ?oEW, blessed as needed.
Wield the whole 120 dagger stack (this is when roleplaying goes out the
window ) and enchant them the standard way up to +7, add blessing and
fooproofing as desired. Now drop 2/3 of them, and use another ?oEW
(doesn't have to be blessed), you have a 1/3 chance of the stack not
evaporating, and getting a +1 boost. (This is when you should have done
your sacrifices to the RNG.) If your stack evaporates, take half of
what's left and go on, if it does not evaporate you now have 90 +7
daggers and 30 +8 daggers, drop 2/3 of the +8s and try going for +9 with
the 10 you're still holding. You get the idea. Repeat this until you
have just the amount of daggers you expect to be needing, at the highest
enchantment made available by the RNG. Note that enchanting gear already
at +9 level and above have a very small chance of succeeding.

Then combine this with polypiling for getting +9 non-stackable weapons
(I think, I have never bothered myself actually) and even more merriment
might ensue.

Perhaps there is some better algorithm than the 'risk 1/3' for going
from +7 and up? Make a program and do some analysis on this as an
optional exercise. Inputs should be 'available items', 'minimum
number of items left at end', 'varying degrees of enchantment accepted
at end', 'available ?oEW', etc...

/Kristoffer

--
This cookie has a scrap of paper inside. It reads:
Gurl fnl gung vg'f abg bire gvyy gur sng ynql fubhgf `Bss jvgu vgf
urnq'.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Tuomas Härkönen wrote:
>
> The same theory applies to armor, except that the safe starting
> enchantment is +3, from which you can safely get to +4 or +5 with a
> blessed scroll. Elven armor is an exception: they can be enchanted
> safely to +7, using the same numbers as when dealing with weapons.
>
> I know of no safe way of getting beyond these numbers (+7 weapons, +5
> armor, +7 elven armor).

Weapons can be dulled by engraving. Armor can't. Does
it take a drain life spell to pull a piece of armor back
from +4 to +3 to try again? I generally end up with
some +4 and some +5 items rather than risking evaporation.

Another fun difference. Weapons have a chance of evaporation
that gets worse and worse as the enchantment increases.
Armor over the safe limit always has the same 2/3rds chance.
This makes highly enchanted armor somewhat less difficult
for the dedicated player.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

In article <dcrqj3$iel$1@nyytiset.pp.htv.fi>,
Tuomas Härkönen <see.sig@xxxx.xxx> wrote:
>
>
>On 4.8.2005 3:37, Electronic Samurai wrote:
>> I've managed to get magic weapons up to +5 before, but there are plenty
>> of posts where users have risked +7 or higher enchantments on their
>> magic weapons/artifacts. What's the best way to do this without
>> evaporating your item?
>>
>
>Reading a _blessed_ scroll of enchant weapon on a +5 weapon is
>risk-free, although not reliable. You'll get either a +6 or +7 weapon
>out of it. If you get +6, you'll have to get it back to +5 before trying
>again -- enchanting a +6 weapon is not safe.
>
>The same theory applies to armor, except that the safe starting
>enchantment is +3, from which you can safely get to +4 or +5 with a
>blessed scroll. Elven armor is an exception: they can be enchanted
>safely to +7, using the same numbers as when dealing with weapons.
>
>I know of no safe way of getting beyond these numbers (+7 weapons, +5
>armor, +7 elven armor).
>
>(This post is a random delurk by an old nethacker, so take this
>information with a grain of salt. I haven't actually played the game
>"seriously" in many years.
>
>--
>Tuomas Härkönen
>tharkonen, gmail and com
The high enchantments you see in YAAP's often comes from polypiling.
In endurance games you get so much stuff like elven armor, that sooner
or later you can get that +9 piece of magical garb.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Haakon Studebaker <heptapod@gmail.com> wrote in
news:Xns96A7E157CBA09heptapodyahoocom@216.196.97.131:

> Cyde Weys <cyde@umd.edu> wrote in
> news:Xns96A7E00A1FA2F2galopagosterrapincy@199.45.49.11:
>
>> Ummm, you're wrong ... here is the corrected version.
>
> Not wrong, just playing it safe.

No, your playing it stupid. You can safely enchant at +5 without any
risk, so Cyde's method is perfectly safe. All you are doing is wasting
time and increasing the chance of getting a lower final enchantment
level.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Cyde Weys wrote:
> james wrote:
> > In article <Xns96A7C4AC73C1Cheptapodyahoocom@216.196.97.131>,
> > Haakon Studebaker <heptapod@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > >If it's already at +5, just engrave a single character in the ground with
> > >your weapon to dull it to a +4 enchantment.
> >
> > Only works for edged weapons.
>
> *Only works for edged weapons that will become dull (athames don't).

Nevermind, I think that may be wrong. Athames will engrave Elbereth in
one turn but I guess they do still get dull.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Topi Linkala <nes@iki.fi> wrote in newscsfrs$oq4$1@nyytiset.pp.htv.fi:

> Haakon Studebaker wrote:
>
>> Cyde Weys <cyde@umd.edu> wrote in
>> news:Xns96A7E00A1FA2F2galopagosterrapincy@199.45.49.11:
>>
>>>Ummm, you're wrong ... here is the corrected version.
>>
>> Not wrong, just playing it safe.
>
> Wrong not playing safe.
>
> If you've read my post 'Annotated code for enchant weapon' or you'd read
> Dylan's spoilers correctly you'd know the following:

Sorry, I didn't catch your posts. I've had sporadic internet access fwiw.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

james wrote:

> How do you dull a hammer?

Drop it and cast drain life at it.

--
Boudewijn.

--
"I have hundreds of other quotes, just waiting to replace this one
as my signature..." - Me

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

BWIGLEY wrote:
> "Boudewijn Waijers" wrote...
>> james wrote:

>>> How do you dull a hammer?

>> Drop it and cast drain life at it.

> Cursed ?oEA ?

No, but a cursed scroll of enchant weapon will.

--
Boudewijn.

--
"I have hundreds of other quotes, just waiting to replace this one
as my signature..." - Me

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Boudewijn Waijers wrote:

> BWIGLEY wrote:
>> "Boudewijn Waijers" wrote...
>>> james wrote:
>
>>>> How do you dull a hammer?
>
>>> Drop it and cast drain life at it.
>
>> Cursed ?oEA ?
>
> No, but a cursed scroll of enchant weapon will.

Not on artifacts.

Raisse, killed by touching Grayswandir

--
irina@valdyas.org LegoHack: http://www.valdyas.org/irina/nethack/
Status of Raisse (piously neutral): Level 8 HP 63(67) AC -3, fast.

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

rlb@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl (Richard Bos) wrote in news:42f3da67.24581437
@news.xs4all.nl:

> fishbowl@conservatory.com (james) wrote:
>
>> In article <1123183950.071837.311040@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
>> Cyde Weys <cyde@umd.edu> wrote:
>> >> Only works for edged weapons.
>> >
>> >*Only works for edged weapons that will become dull (athames don't).
>>
>> How do you dull a hammer?
>
> Since when is a hammer an edged weapon?

When did he say a hammer is an edged weapon?

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

james wrote:

> In article <1123183950.071837.311040@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
> Cyde Weys <cyde@umd.edu> wrote:
>>> Only works for edged weapons.
>>
>>*Only works for edged weapons that will become dull (athames don't).
>
> How do you dull a hammer?

Hammers are already dull; you can't reduce the enchantment on Mjollnir by
engraving (that's what you meant, right?) Artifacts resist cursed enchant
weapon too, so your only options are (1) hit a disenchanter with it, (2)
cast drain level at it, (3) cancel it to uncursed +0 and start over. 1
and 2 take a lot of patience, 3 a lot of resources. I'm usually satisfied
with +6 until I do (1) by accident.

Raisse, killed by touching Grayswandir

--
irina@valdyas.org LegoHack: http://www.valdyas.org/irina/nethack/
Status of Raisse (piously neutral): Level 8 HP 63(67) AC -3, fast.