Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

How many people have ascended?

Last response: in Video Games
Share
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 2:30:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?

Is there a website that would tabulate this?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

More about : people ascended

Anonymous
September 13, 2005 7:26:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

> Most of the ascensions on nao seem to be repeat ascensions.
> Only drew of dtype would know for sure. Drew runs(?) nao.

Seems that way.

Feel free to do more analysis than I do. The logfile is always
available at http://alt.org/nethack/logfile

That's the source for all the stats on alt.org/nethack.

As for this discussion... that data is representative of the players on
NAO, but may or may not represent the player base as a whole. I'd
venture that it probably isn't an order of magnitude off for a global
population, though. If it is off in any direction, it is probably
towards the advanced player base, as new players may choose to screw
around on their own machines before displaying their game for all to
see. Others (like myself) are more than happy to be inept in front of a
group.

The repeat ascension phenominon likely comes from good players wanting
to show off a bit, and post their scores in a very public place. There
is also some permanence and validation of scores on NAO, as I've always
run a vanilla game (with non game-changing patches), and can ensure
that a claimed score is real. (Every game is recorded for audit by
anyone that wants to endure it.)

These days, I'm probably described better as the host than the
operational guy. Pasi (paxed) certainly spends more time than I do
serving the nethack players now.
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 11:08:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Jove wrote:
> The percentage of demigods among known players may be capable
> of determination. But it won't necessarily reflect the
> percentage among unknown players.

Definitely. Tons of people at university played, only me and one other
ever had gotten as far as the Quest. Most played hack-n-slash, try out
everything as soon as you find it, etc.

> The most surprising people (or person, anway
> ;-) haven't ascended.

Who's that? Or are you only counting 3.4.3 ascensions here?
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/rec.games.roguelike.ne...


> Sort of, nao (go to <http://www.alt.org&gt; and follow the nethack
> server link) has a lot of information on its players.
> (Best games, best players, most recent game endings, etc.)

I'd guess that ascenders are far more dense on nao than in the real
world. Just knowing of the existence of NAO is a good indicator that
you have a _lot_ more NH knowledge than the average player.
Related resources
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 11:49:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

pendell@hotmail.com wrote:
> How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
> in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
> does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?
>
> Is there a website that would tabulate this?

Maybe nethack.alt.org is somewhat representative, what with being
the biggest public nethack server and all:

Monthly ascensions: http://alt.org/nethack/monthlyasc.html
Games finished per day: http://alt.org/nethack/perday.html


--
Pasi Kallinen
paxed@alt.org
http://bilious.homelinux.org/ -- NetHack Patch Database
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 12:02:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 13 Sep 2005 10:30:38 -0700, pendell@hotmail.com wrote:

>How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
>in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
>does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?
>
Since nethack is freely available and doesn't require contact
with other players or systems it may well not be possible to
know, or even guess, either number.

Just as the number of readers of a newsgroup may contain a high
percentage of lurkers.

(Someone once tried to appropriate the apparently defunct
alt.fan.scooby-doo(?) newsgroup. Lurkers on the (empty)
newsgroup came out of nowhere to stop it. The intruder
would have succeeded if not for those darn kids. ;^)

The percentage of demigods among known players may be capable
of determination. But it won't necessarily reflect the
percentage among unknown players.

Deciding who counts as a "player" of NetHack can also be
difficult. (This is Usenet. Deciding if it's *Usenet* or
not can be difficult. ;^)

Determining who's a demigod is not as easy as it might seem.
Does a demigod from a version before 3.4.3 count? 3.4? 3.0?
2.0? Hack? Rogue? (No, they didn't have ascension, but they
theoretically could be "won".)

What about players of those versions/games.

And even demigods on 3.4.3 pretty much have to volunteer
the information. The most surprising people (or person, anway
;-) haven't ascended.

I, of course, outed myself in my YAFAP.


>Is there a website that would tabulate this?
>

Sort of, nao (go to <http://www.alt.org&gt; and follow the nethack
server link) has a lot of information on its players.
(Best games, best players, most recent game endings, etc.)


Most of the ascensions on nao seem to be repeat ascensions.
Only drew of dtype would know for sure. Drew runs(?) nao.


There are other nethack servers you play on, but I don't know
what player info they may or may not have available on line.

>Respectfully,

Now, now, let's not have any of your sass, youngster, or I'll
smite you with my cane. :-)



--
All the best,

Jove
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 2:34:09 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 13 Sep 2005 10:30:38 -0700, pendell@hotmail.com scribed into the ether:

>How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
>in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
>does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?

I imagine that with nethack being all free and everything, combined with
being really freaking hard, that the ratio of ascended to "played a couple
times and deleted" would be pretty lobsided.

Even folks who have been playing a long time don't ascend.
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 4:31:06 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

pendell@hotmail.com wrote:
> How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
> in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
> does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?
>
> Is there a website that would tabulate this?

From the NAO server I get these values...

1497 players, 1173 non-ascenders, 324 ascenders, which results
in 78.3% non-ascenders and 21.6% ascenders... -

....which are exactly the same values as for the N2 (nitrogenium)
and O2 (oxygenium) distribution in the air! 8-)

Janis
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 4:59:36 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

dtype wrote:
>
> Feel free to do more analysis than I do. The logfile is always
> available at http://alt.org/nethack/logfile

Ouch! - 150,000 lines of text, 13,000,000+ bytes of data, ... - ok.

If my program is not erroneous...

5389 players, 322 ascenders - that's 5.9% ascenders.

(Forget that astrological correlation with the O2/N2 distribution ;-)

> That's the source for all the stats on alt.org/nethack.

Janis
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 5:35:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 13 Sep 2005 15:26:52 -0700, "dtype" <drew.streib@gmail.com>
wrote:

>> Most of the ascensions on nao seem to be repeat ascensions.
>> Only drew of dtype would know for sure. Drew runs(?) nao.
>
>Seems that way.
>
>Feel free to do more analysis than I do. The logfile is always
>available at http://alt.org/nethack/logfile
>
>That's the source for all the stats on alt.org/nethack.

Thanks so much for making all that data available.

(Now Brian P. can get to work. ;-)

>
>As for this discussion... that data is representative of the players on
>NAO, but may or may not represent the player base as a whole. I'd
>venture that it probably isn't an order of magnitude off for a global
>population, though. If it is off in any direction, it is probably
>towards the advanced player base, as new players may choose to screw
>around on their own machines before displaying their game for all to
>see. Others (like myself) are more than happy to be inept in front of a
>group.

And others *thought* still they were just going to show off
on NAO after ascending on their own machine. (Not that *I* know
anyone who did that, oh no. ;-)

For those that haven't tried it, the menucolors on NAO add a
lot to the game. Watch a few games, then copy the menucolors
options from that players options file.

Yes, every player's options file can be viewed on the NAO
website. And yes, you can watch games in progress on NAO.

PuTTY is recommended for viewing/playing. It's free, and
so good I know a few big businesses using it. Kudos to them.




Here's a quick and dirty "standard" setup for PuTTY to you
started:

- Download and uncompress PuTTY. You have now completed
the PuTTY installation process. (I TOLD you it was good.)

- Select the Window->Translation settings page and select
"CP 437" from the translation drop down menu.

- Select the Window->Appearance settings page.
Click the "Change..." button by the Font section and select:
"Lucida Console" "Regular" "12"
for the font.

- Go back to the "Session" settings page.
Type in "nethack.alt.org" under "Host Name (or IP address)"

- Select the "Telnet" radio button under "Protocol"

- Type in "Nethack.alt.org" in the one-line window under "Saved
Sessions"

- Click "Save".

- Then double-click the "Nethack.alt.org" line that just
appeared in the larger window, just under "Default Settings".

You will then be connected to NAO. Follow the instructions
if you want to create an account. Or just watch a game in
progress for a while. (Reminder: 'q' to stop watching a given
game.)

Editting the options file for your account requires knowledge
of vi. There you are on you own. And if you are caught or
killed I will disavow all knowledge of your mission.


- To change settings on a saved config, select the "Session"
settings screen. Click *once* on the name of the configuration
you wish to change. Then click "Load" to load that config.
Make any changes, then click "Save" to save the changes.



The home page also talks about using a Java applet. (Now
you know as much about that as I do.)


<http://alt.org/nethack/&gt; is the home page. (or close enough)


"Find many of us in #nethack on irc.freenode.org.
Our friendly bot Rodney announces all the embarrassing details
of player deaths in channel as well. (Thanks to partycle from
fishpool for the Izchak script.)

Generally the people on IRC channel #nethack are watching,
playing, or commenting on games on NAO. Or all three.




>
>The repeat ascension phenominon likely comes from good players wanting
>to show off a bit, and post their scores in a very public place. There
>is also some permanence and validation of scores on NAO, as I've always
>run a vanilla game (with non game-changing patches), and can ensure
>that a claimed score is real. (Every game is recorded for audit by
>anyone that wants to endure it.)

And I really like being able to point to the independently
verified ascensions by Jove on NAO. (And thanks to whoever did
them. ;^)

However much of a fool I may play in the newsgroup, Nethack
thinks I've played some good games.

A year-round independent verifying entity is better than
the devnull tournament for my purposes.

>
>These days, I'm probably described better as the host than the
>operational guy. Pasi (paxed) certainly spends more time than I do
>serving the nethack players now.

And very grateful we should be, too. And I am.

A big public thanks from me to both of you!



Now, can we talk about expiring off all the games of players
ahead of me on the all-time list?

And keeping them that way? ;^D



--
All the best,

Jove
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 7:35:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 13 Sep 2005 19:08:08 -0700, "sjdevnull@yahoo.com"
<sjdevnull@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Jove wrote:
>> The percentage of demigods among known players may be capable
>> of determination. But it won't necessarily reflect the
>> percentage among unknown players.
>
>Definitely. Tons of people at university played, only me and one other
>ever had gotten as far as the Quest. Most played hack-n-slash, try out
>everything as soon as you find it, etc.

Well, that's hard data anyway. Not really surprising, I guess,
except that so many people continued to play it at that level of
skill.

>
>> The most surprising people (or person, anway
>> ;-) haven't ascended.
>
>Who's that? Or are you only counting 3.4.3 ascensions here?
>http://groups.google.co.uk/group/rec.games.roguelike.ne...
>

Touché. That's whom I was referring to. Glad to learn I was
wrong. Thanks.

>
>> Sort of, nao (go to <http://www.alt.org&gt; and follow the nethack
>> server link) has a lot of information on its players.
>> (Best games, best players, most recent game endings, etc.)
>
>I'd guess that ascenders are far more dense on nao than in the real
>world.

I resent that. I'm no more dense on NAO than in the real
world...or something. ;-)


>Just knowing of the existence of NAO is a good indicator that
>you have a _lot_ more NH knowledge than the average player.

I'm watching some of the games on NAO. Somebody was just doing
the Wizard Quest with an AC of 9. (Two pieces of armor, so it
wasn't a "naked" conduct.)

The Quest and an AC of 9 are two phrases that just don't
connect in my brain. (Like "A mistake carried out to
perfection." ;-)

There's another guy wearing cursed -4 leather armor.

On the other hand, there are four or five games of pudding
farmers or major altar camping, with characters with better
Hp and/or Pw than I've ever had.

Looks like the evidence is in favor of your statement, at
least as far as current players.


The logfile on NAO may not be as useful as I'd hoped. I
suspect it records character name, not player name. Players
that use different character names for different games...
will mess things up somehow, I'm sure of that.

And with most of the data only available in searches apparently
based on login name, it may not be possible to find information
about a player whose character uses a different name from the
login.

The wizard on the Quest I was watching earlier had a character
name of <something>Slow, but the search for options file by
the substring "slow" didn't find a login name like that.


Nor is there such a character(?) name in the logfile. Which
may just mean it's a new character name that hasn't had a game
end yet.







--
All the best,

Jove
September 14, 2005 9:01:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Janis Papanagnou <Janis_Papanagnou@hotmail.com> wrote in news:D g7lkp$oid
$1@online.de:

> dtype wrote:
>>
>> Feel free to do more analysis than I do. The logfile is always
>> available at http://alt.org/nethack/logfile
>
> Ouch! - 150,000 lines of text, 13,000,000+ bytes of data, ... - ok.
>
> If my program is not erroneous...
>
> 5389 players, 322 ascenders - that's 5.9% ascenders.

How exactly do you determine the the number of players?
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 10:53:46 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Jove <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
> The logfile on NAO may not be as useful as I'd hoped. I
> suspect it records character name, not player name. Players
> that use different character names for different games...
> will mess things up somehow, I'm sure of that.
>
> And with most of the data only available in searches apparently
> based on login name, it may not be possible to find information
> about a player whose character uses a different name from the
> login.

Login name and character name is always the same on NAO.
Of course, nothing prevents a player from making another account.

--
Pasi Kallinen
paxed@alt.org
http://bilious.homelinux.org/ -- NetHack Patch Database
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 2:00:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Wed, 14 Sep 2005 00:31:06 +0200, Janis Papanagnou
<Janis_Papanagnou@hotmail.com> scribed into the ether:

>pendell@hotmail.com wrote:
>> How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
>> in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
>> does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?
>>
>> Is there a website that would tabulate this?
>
> From the NAO server I get these values...
>
>1497 players, 1173 non-ascenders, 324 ascenders, which results
>in 78.3% non-ascenders and 21.6% ascenders... -
>
>...which are exactly the same values as for the N2 (nitrogenium)
>and O2 (oxygenium) distribution in the air! 8-)

80/20 is a common ratio in human activities, actually.
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 2:09:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 pendell@hotmail.com wrote:

> How many people have brought at least one character to the Demigod bar
> in the sky? Is the number in the thousands, tens of thousands? How
> does that compare to the number of people who actually play the game?
>
> Is there a website that would tabulate this?

I guess we can give you our answers and you'll make the site :-D

Jym, ascended a Nethack human monk, and a Slash'em doppelgagner monk.

--
Hypocoristiquement,
Jym.

Adresse mail plus valide à partir de septembre 2005.
Utiliser l'adresse de redirection permanente :
Jean-Yves.Moyen `at` ens-lyon.org
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 10:48:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Seraphim wrote:
> Janis Papanagnou <Janis_Papanagnou@hotmail.com> wrote in news:D g7lkp$oid
> $1@online.de:
>>dtype wrote:
>>
>>>Feel free to do more analysis than I do. The logfile is always
>>>available at http://alt.org/nethack/logfile
>>
>>Ouch! - 150,000 lines of text, 13,000,000+ bytes of data, ... - ok.
>>
>>If my program is not erroneous...
>>
>>5389 players, 322 ascenders - that's 5.9% ascenders.
>
> How exactly do you determine the the number of players?

I haven't inspected the data manually (150,000 entries!), and I had to rely
on the username in column 16, before the comma. So if there are any players
with more than one user ID I'd be out of luck. OTOH, for the purpose of the
OP's question it might be of some help. (What else could one do?)

What is the intent of your question? Shall I consider some fact to adjust
the algorithm? (Or have you got different results?)

Janis
Anonymous
September 14, 2005 11:55:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

Seraphim wrote:
> Janis Papanagnou <Janis_Papanagnou@hotmail.com> wrote in news:D g7lkp$oid
> $1@online.de:
>>dtype wrote:
>>
>>>Feel free to do more analysis than I do. The logfile is always
>>>available at http://alt.org/nethack/logfile
>>
>>Ouch! - 150,000 lines of text, 13,000,000+ bytes of data, ... - ok.
>>
>>If my program is not erroneous...
>>
>>5389 players, 322 ascenders - that's 5.9% ascenders.
>
> How exactly do you determine the the number of players?

Re-reading your question...
You maybe meant you want to know the algorithm? It's like that...

for each entry in file do
extract playername
associative_array [playername] = 1
done
count elements in associative array

Or do you want me to post the concrete algorithm? (It's written in awk.)

Janis
Anonymous
September 15, 2005 12:25:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.nethack (More info?)

On 14 Sep 2005 06:53:46 GMT, paxed@alt.org (Pasi Kallinen) wrote:

>Jove <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> The logfile on NAO may not be as useful as I'd hoped. I
>> suspect it records character name, not player name. Players
>> that use different character names for different games...
>> will mess things up somehow, I'm sure of that.
>>
>> And with most of the data only available in searches apparently
>> based on login name, it may not be possible to find information
>> about a player whose character uses a different name from the
>> login.
>
>Login name and character name is always the same on NAO.
>Of course, nothing prevents a player from making another account.

That's useful to know. I must have been hallucinating about
the "*Snow" name. (Dam' bad acid flashbacks ;-)


--
All the best,

Jove
!