Really Scary Stuff!!!

In this months American Conservative, there is article reporting that the Bush administration (actually Dick Cheney) has ordered the Air Force to prepare plans for an air campaign against Iran which is to include the use of nuclear weapons. The plan is reportedly to be a contingency plan to be used if there is another 9/11 style attack on the US homeland...whether or not Iran actually has any ties to such an attack...

I can't wait to hear the Bushite apologists story on how planning a nuclear first strike against a nation that has not attacked us (and lacks the means to launch a nuclear strike of it's own against the US mainland) is simply "prudent planning".

BTW...The article in "The American Conservative" this month is not available online.

The military makes contingency plans for many scenarios, some for even very implausible scenarios. But the idea of the VP requesting plans for an air campaign using nuclear weapons against a third world nation as a contingency plan for a scenario where we are attacked by a third unrelated party should not be considered as "acceptable" or normal. This is the kind of activity that should cause an immediate move to remove the offending regime from power...through impeachment if necessary.

The US nuclear arsenal is supposed to be for "deterrence", not for first strike ops. The Iranians have no operational nuclear capability capable of hitting the US. They have no conventional military capability of challenging us in the Gulf, much less here at home. When you look at the Bushites desire for "usable" tactical nuclear weapons, their refusal to establish a "no first use" policy with respect to US nuclear weapons and the previous run up to the Iraq war, I don't see how you can draw any other conclusion but that they are planning on actually launching nuclear strikes at Iran at the moment that a suitable pretext appears...

Just as the Bushites launched a war against Iraq as soon a pretext became available. That the pretext need not have anything to do with Iran would seem to remove all doubt about the nature of these "plans". Bushites planning a nuclear campaign to vaporize Iranian cities is no more legitimate "contingency planning" than Nazis making plans to gas a few million Jews. Neither can be justified as "defensive" actions, and are clearly plans to commit horrific war crimes against what are basically defenseless people.

As for thinking Israel might "beat us to it", that is really not very likely. It is the Israelis who have been working very hard to encourage a US strike on Iran. They have the ability to launch a devastating nuclear strike against Iran themselves, but it would require the expenditure of virtually their entire strategic missile force, and even then they could not do the job as effectively as the USAF and USN can do.

Look around you...you see the same groups making the same arguments for war against Iran, that did so for war against Iraq. The run up is almost identical in many respects. There are only two major differences this time....First, there is no way to use the UN as a vehicle to justify a war against Iran. Second, due to the commitment of the bulk of it's striking power to Iraq, the US military no longer has the capacity to make a credible conventional military threat against Iran...thus the nuclear card.

There is every reason to believe that Cheney is demanding "planning" because he intends to implement those plans...I see nothing that would indicate otherwise, do you? Some people may have no problem with using nuclear weapons against third world nations, I do.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

Its great!

Nothing wrong with the notion of: 'pre-emptive strikes'

Its either them or me and it aint going to be me - I wont roll over for any fanatical fock.

<b><font color=green> "You listen to the fans and you'll be sitting up there with them". Bill Belichick on the Browns 'Dog Pound' calls for his exit after his axing of Bernie Kosar. </b> </font color=green>

Sad thing is the war in Iraq is probably all about the oil. Bush and his staff realize that oil has become a precious resource, so therefor why not invade Iraq. Now that we have Iraq "under control", we will move over to Iran and steal their oil.

Same plot... Iraq has WMD.. ok lets invade and oh yeah while we are at it why not make sure they US has first grabs on the oil from Iraq.

Uh oh the oil in Iraq is not enough... wait a minute Iran has "nuclear weapons" why not invade them too.

I hate bush, at first when he got elected it didnt bother me that much that he was president. Now after i see how the focked up crap he is doing it just make me sick.

Sad thing is we have to deal with it for another 3 years unless he gets kicked out of office.. which i doubt.. at least not during war time.

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I voted Bush, and would do again (not that it matters) if time were rolled back, if only tho for the other choice. I believe to some point at some level that the Dims and Pubes pre-arrange who will run, guaranteeing that one or the other gets in office due to this pre-arrangement.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

I used to believe this.
Contingencies are what plans are made up of in the military. You plan for every one.

It seems obvious to me that we should have had contingence plans for every possible conflict in the Middle East. This should have been planned for over the last 55 years at least.

I would think that any and all contingence plans for Middle East would require maps of the area.
At the time of Desert Storm, Guess want we didn’t have any decent maps of the area.

I wonder what these planners have been doing for the last 55 years.

What a waste of tax payer dollars.

I don’t just make this stuff up folks.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

we will probably run out of oil in our lifetime.. probably within the next 20 years we will have to find another fuel source... probably hydrogen

My PC:
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AMD Athlon 64 3200 Winchester
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WD Raptor 37 Gb SATA
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LOL! I noticed your posting frequency is declining steadyly, your in australia right? isnt late over there!??or your just to knocked up?

Asus P4P800DX, P4C 2.6ghz@3.25ghz, 2X512 OCZ PC4000 3-4-4-8, MSI 6800Ultra stock, 2X30gig Raid0

Labby and Bobby:-

I'm folding. Its 6:26 am, cold, and I'm [-peep-]' sauced beyond repair so time for me to call it a night.

Dont let these focks roll you too much, particularly you Bobby, the boys bite but not hard!

Fock I'm tired.

Take it easy.

<b><font color=green> "You listen to the fans and you'll be sitting up there with them". Bill Belichick on the Browns 'Dog Pound' calls for his exit after his axing of Bernie Kosar. </b> </font color=green>

Why don't you post the actual article, you have a scanner right?

Scan it! and post it! I'm having a hard time even believing this is true, the USAs nuclear weapons policy has always been defensive not offensive, sounds like BS to me.







<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=2541&st=0#entry20385" target="_new">My Puter</A>

And whats the latest count on how many countries we've used those on Asstaken, OOPS sorry had an older days flashback thats Alltaken! :-)

<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=2541&st=0#entry20385" target="_new">My Puter</A>

well it would take a rocket scientist to realise the US hasn't had a chance to test these in combat. i am not even sure if they are combat ready yet.

they were not ready for afganistan, and not ready for the early Iraq war. but they wanted to use them on Afganistan.

a war with any other middle eastern country and i think they would be ready to be deployed by then.

Alltaken

<A HREF="http://www.mudpuddle.co.nz" target="_new">http://www.mudpuddle.co.nz</A> its where its all going on, oh and its also all going on HERE <A HREF="http://doug.mudpuddle.co.nz/gallery/" target="_new">http://doug.mudpuddle.co.nz/gallery/</A>

oh ok, so you actually researched the reason why the US pulled out of the nuclear non-proliferation treaty, and looked into the new development of "tactile nuclear weapons" that were "specifically" designed for bunker busting during the afganistan war. i.e. that was their motivation for developing them.

you seem to be suprised by these nuclear developments and ambitions. why? i assume you didn't know about the mini nuke development. 1/3rd yield of the hiroshima bombs.

100% reason for their development is because they "can and will" be used in warfare, due to limited political fallout from their use. unlike an ICBM or standard yield Nuclear warhead which "nobody" will ever use due to the public opinion of such weapons. its a more dangerous threat to have a weapon that is more likely to be used.

Alltaken

<A HREF="http://www.mudpuddle.co.nz" target="_new">http://www.mudpuddle.co.nz</A> its where its all going on, oh and its also all going on HERE <A HREF="http://doug.mudpuddle.co.nz/gallery/" target="_new">http://doug.mudpuddle.co.nz/gallery/</A>

My friend was taught in war college back in the 50's.

Three rules:

Rlue #1 = How to fund it.

Rule #2 = How to get in.

Rule #3 = How to get out.

You could not break these 3 rules.
If you can't keep these 3 rules, you have no business in this job.

This has nothing to do with plan A, B or C.

To bad GWB didn't show up for class to learn the first 3 rules.

He skipped rule #1 jumped in and has no concept of rule #3.


<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

But we would not want to waste a tactile nuke on New Zealand. Ahhh, just the thought of it would have them running out of the hills and into the water like lemmings.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

I haven't missed a thing Rich!

<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=2541&st=0#entry20385" target="_new">My Puter</A>

You know I maybe mis-calculated great georges plan, he did get rule #1 correct, it will begin to and be paid for long after he is dead and gone, so on to rule 2, that is as far as he got....

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

Oops! I musta stepped on your nuts or something! ROFLMAO

<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=2541&st=0#entry20385" target="_new">My Puter</A>

Shall I launch my tactile nukes now, or wait for the precise climactic moment!

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

LMAO, I knew you wore heels! but did not think you would admit it!

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

Hehe, but even I am surprixed that you did not even feel the insertion of my unlubricated oversized dildo shaped muclear grenade in your anus, with a 10-second timer delay.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

I noticed, but laughed it off, since that was only the PoC to secure it in place....

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

Nuts are nothing, but the brain I destroy myself....

I saw a bumber sticker yesterday...it said

Republicans are people too!
albeit mean, selfish, greedy people.

<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

well i have no argument for that post. as i agree with everything you have said.

however the information you are stating is infact "worse" than the scenario i have.

as for the public not knowing crap about anything, well i can totally understand that. but as someone who doesn't know what i am not being told i can hardly use it as a debate topic.

i know that militaries around the world will have chemical, biological, viral, nuclear.... weapons that would probably wipe out the human race.

i heard reports of planes flying at over mach 16. (how many years was it before the public knew about stealth planes, 30 years or somthing wasn't it)

basicly i don't think that i want to know about how much we can F ourselves up.

as for updating nuclear arsenals, while saying they are downsizing, well i pretty much knew this, furthermore 20K nukes really arn't needed to wipe out the world, so there is little advantage in having so many anyway. the downsizing really hasn't reduced the destructive power....

the war on Afganistan and iraq has been a great excersize in getting rid of obselete weapon stock piles so i guess the old is always going and the new is being kept for a rainy day.

as for low yeild nukes. well IMO i don't think there would be that much negativity if it were used in an unpopulated area. if one were used to kill 100 people in a bunker, then i doubt people would be so against it. (this is my opinion) sure there would be some people, but given FUD circumstances that the government would use before the strike, i think it would be acceptable.

i mean they are using depleted uranium bullets in warfare, i don't understand how those passed the safety tests.


basicly i am against all war, and am pretty happy to live without any new weapons. but anything which leaves lasting consequences really peeves me off and makes me pretty disapointed.

mines
nukes
uranium shells
agent orange (and other chemicals that persist)
....

these are all weapons that i think were created by very short sighted individuals, and it does disapoint me that they are still in development.

bombs, bullets.... i can tollerate on moral levels, but the others i dislike a lot.

Alltaken

<A HREF="http://www.mudpuddle.co.nz" target="_new">http://www.mudpuddle.co.nz</A> its where its all going on, oh and its also all going on HERE <A HREF="http://doug.mudpuddle.co.nz/gallery/" target="_new">http://doug.mudpuddle.co.nz/gallery/</A>

So is the devil in the details running our government?

How many folks in our government have been channeling (letting other forces and spirits talk to/through them) for years, and is this where they get their directions in politics? Other than Bush?

Although god is omniscient and omnipotent, he/she/it still lets the devil control the world.

Or is Jesus driving the bus now.

And we'll all be okay.......All we got to do now is <b> trust </b> our leaders.


<pre><font color=red>°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°`°¤o \\// o¤°`°¤o,¸¸¸,o¤°
And the sign says "You got to have a membership card to get inside" Huh
So I got me a pen and paper And I made up my own little sign</pre><p></font color=red>

Where I live, it is the 2nd-3rd place that a nuclear bomb would hit. Not positive but thats what ive heard.

This is what we have within a 3 mile stretch..

Dupont, GE, AGA gas, Shell chemical, and a few other small chemical plants.

If the Dupont itself blew up it would set off a chain reaction that would level my house and everything within like 10 miles or something crazy like that. Not to mention all the chemicals that went into the atmosphere causing all kinds of problems.

right now my area is in a class action lawsuit against dupont for dumping carcenogens into the water supply.

I can get like 200 bucks just for filling out a survey.



My PC:
Abit AX8 Socket 939 VIA K8T890
AMD Athlon 64 3200 Winchester
Sapphire Radeon X700 Pro 256 Mb PCIe
WD Raptor 37 Gb SATA
Corsair 2x512 PC3200 DDR Dual-Channel Platnium Edition