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Is It Worth It?

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August 16, 2001 5:20:46 PM

Is it worth building a DDR Duron system? Will it provide better performance? Are there any factory unlocked Durons? Can an 800MHz Duron overclock to 1.066GHz (by raising the bus speed to 133 MHz) assuming I'm using a high quality copper HSF and maximum voltage (1.85v)? What is the most overclockable stepping for the Duron? I'm going to build a system for a friend and he wants me to build a cheap system and make it perform like a much more expensive one. I'm thinking that by giving the Duron a lot of bandwidth (266MHz bus and DDR) and overclocking it to 1.066GHz, it will perform as well as a 1GHz Athlon/SDR system but for slightly less money. By the way, the system will include 256MB PC2100 DDR RAM. It will probably be equipped with a Radeon LE that I will also unlock (registry hack) and overclock. The motherboard will be either an MSI K7T 266 Pro or an Asus A7A256. Which motherboard will perform better and which is better for overclocking? Any suggestions?

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor

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August 16, 2001 5:36:41 PM

The only comment I have is that the A7A266 motherboard is not one of the best out there. In fact, most the boards with the ALI Magik1 chipset underperform and have been reported to have problems. If you want to stick with Asus, I would suggest the A7M266, with the AMD 761 chipset. A friend of mine has this board with a Duron 900 (not overclocked at all) and it works great for him.

As for the overclocking, I have no personal experience with Duron processors, but from what I have read I think the Duron's have problems with any FSB high than 110MHz - 115MHz. But someone else can probably let you know that answer to that question better than I can.
August 16, 2001 5:44:36 PM

if you are decided on DDR, the A7M266 with AMD 761 chipset is the best one, but if you get across a A7A266 with ALi Magik chipset rev B0, go for it. it is supposed to solve the performance problem, that has been identified as memory laterncy.

girish

<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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August 16, 2001 6:28:01 PM

You guys are missing the point. I need a fast yet cheap motherboard. The two I named seem to combine the best of both worlds. I'm trying to save as much money as possible. This is supposed to be an extremely limit bugdet system. PC1600 is a waste of money because PC133 can perform as well as it. I need the FSB to run at 133 MHz (266 effective). What I'm trying to do is avoid the bottleneck the Duron is causing by it's limited cache size. By giving the Duron a lot of system memory bandwidth and system bus bandwidth this should compensate for the limited cache in most apps. I also want to avoid Sound Blaster Live! hassles, so I might just get him a PCI128. So what do you guys think? The KT266-based MSI m/b or the AliMagik1-based Asus m/b? I'm leaning towards the MSI board because it's V-link technology promises more responsive multitasking(eg. Watching a DVD and working with other apps, etc.) Also, anyone know about Duron steppings? Why would a Duron not like the 133 MHz bus? Would it still not work if I lowered the multiplier (6*133)?

Also I'm considering the Thermaltake Dragon Orb 3 or the GlobalWin FOP-38, GlobalWin WBK-38, and CAK38 as the CPU cooler. The CAK38 is the most expensive so I like to know if anyone of the other three is enough. I'm leaning towards the FOP38 because it's the cheapest. I'm trying to save as much money as possible. Will the FOP38 handle a 266MHz increase in clock speed? 1.6V is the default voltage of the Duron right? I think it should work at 1.066GHz with 1.85v. Am I correct?


AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
August 16, 2001 6:51:08 PM

well, then I would again suggest the A7A266 provided its has a B0 chipset. got to know if its available.

as for the VIA V-Link, its sure faster, but it is just a sort of DDR PCI, offers 266 MB/sec bandwidth between the Northbridge and the Southbridge. and the VT8233 (V-Link) southbridge is new and nothing is really known about it. looking at the history of VIA southbridges (that dates back to 486 times), i would rather stay away from it. VT8233 might be a very good component but it us yet to be verified. ALi southbridges are known to be problem free and perform quite well.

yes, the Duron would work at 133 MHz FSB, but taking it to 8x133=1064 is too far. I would suggest a modest begining, 7.5x127=952. later you could increase the voltage <i>And</i> FSB to get it higher. this is all assuming you have good cooling gear. 1064 at 1.85V would work. havent tested it but I have mu Duron 600 simply overclocked to 800 by setting FSB to 133. the board is KT133.

girish

<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
August 16, 2001 7:28:08 PM

How do I know if it's a B0 revision?

I've read in several places that V-link should improve multitasking and therefore DVD performance.

Hmm, I would think that the Thermaltake Dragon Orb 3 is enough for a large overclock. You should remember the Duron produces less heat than an Athlon. I doubt heat would be an issue. 127 would be underclocking the PCI and AGP bus. That's a waste of performance. Assuming cooling is not an issue, would 1.066GHz be possible?

Anyone know where I can find info on the Duron steppings?

Do any Durons come factory unlocked?

Will the MSI board I mentioned support the Athlon 4?

What about the Asus board?


AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
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August 16, 2001 11:27:15 PM

If you have not already purchased your motherboard, why not go with the ECS K7S5A for only $62 at cdr express, and with the money you save, you can afford to get an athlon 1.4. This motherboard works with sdram or ddram.
August 17, 2001 12:07:31 AM

No, sorry, I can't get that. I live in Canada and I can't find that board anywhere locally and I'm not willing to pay extra shipping and handling.

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
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August 17, 2001 12:35:15 AM

The A7A266 is an EXCELLENT CHOICE! Very few people are having problems with it. Most of the problems you see reported here are related to misinstalled software. It will perform almost as well with SDR as traditional SDR motherboards and has fewer compatability issues. The only compatablity issue I have heard of with it is the old ATI Rage series cards, and I haven't even confirmed that one yet. It does misreport the temperature 10C higher, which has lead many people to believe their processors are overheating when they are not. With so much else going for it, I consider the temp error to be a minor issue. In fact I recommend this board over all other AMD boards.

BTW I'm a system builder, I also do some work for a local shop configuring "problem" systems, all of which have had VIA chipsets! Go ALi!

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 17, 2001 1:04:29 AM

Thanks, I guess I'll go with the Asus A7A266 but is the onboard audio good enough for casual gaming or should I include a separate sound card? It would be great if I didn't have to, that would save some money.

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor <P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by AMD_Man on 08/16/01 09:05 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
Anonymous
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August 17, 2001 2:42:43 AM

Whats with the FOP? Why do you like this cooler? To tell you the truth, the Swiftech coolers are BETTER!!!!!!!!!!
FOP is really good, but as you were talking about, to get the BEST out of that system, go with the Swiftech, very good for overclocking!
I have a 1.33 AMD Athlon
ASUS A7M MOBO
current temp is 39c


Down at pants n at wit Donnie Iris
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August 17, 2001 2:47:44 AM

The onboard audio is adequate for most users, it is one of the better quality onboard audio chips.

I'm so tired of cookies I'd settle for spam!
August 17, 2001 12:58:14 PM

Well, I've been reading a lot of info about motherboards and so I finally decided on the perfect motherboard...the IWill KK266Plus! Sure, it's based on a KT133A chipset FROM VIA, but I don't have to worry about SoundBlaster compatibility because it includes onboard 5.1 surround sound capability. I found it for a price even cheaper than the Asus A7A266 board so now I can get him a 1GHz Athlon (AXIA, 266MHz Bus), 256MB PC133 RAM, 30GB 7200RPM hard drive, and a Radeon LE. These, of course, are only the major components. It will also include a 12x DVD drive, Floppy Drive, AOpen Mid-Tower Case with 300w Power Supply and a cheap AOpen network card. Cooling will include a Dragon Orb 3 and 1 or 2 case fans.

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
August 17, 2001 1:13:41 PM

Why is it people insist on using orbs even more so when these people want to over clock. Yes they are cool looking, and yes the do thier job, but they are flawed by design to perform maximun cooling. I use a swifttech MC370 HSF, which, sure, isn't as "cool" looking but as far as keeping things "cool" it works great. Keeps my 1.2/133 T-bird under 50 degrees full load @ 1.4 GHz. There are also much more efficient HSFs out there aside swifttech. I would go for them before getting an orb.

Computer: $2000 Internet Access: $40 Registering for forums: Free A good signature: Priceless
August 17, 2001 1:19:41 PM

The Dragon Orb 3 isn't like the other Orbs. Not only does it look "kewl", icools better than the GlobalWin WBK38 which costs the same! So what's wrong with the Dragon Orb 3? I just want to make it a good looking PC from the inside out.

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
August 17, 2001 1:53:44 PM

Also because a swiftech is not cheap.

Blah, Blah Blahh, Blahh, blahh blah blahh, blah blah.
August 17, 2001 4:57:41 PM

I know thats why I said There are also much more efficient HSFs out there aside swifttech. :smile:

Computer: $2000 Internet Access: $40 Registering for forums: Free A good signature: Priceless
August 17, 2001 9:00:00 PM

Hey, <A HREF="http://come.to/priceless" target="_new">here</A> is a site you might enjoy. At least based on your sig.

Sorry, should've warned everyone. This site contains nudity, although it is not a pornographic site, it's a comedic site.



<font color=blue>Quarter pounder inside</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Change the Sig of the Week!!!</font color=red><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by FatBurger on 08/17/01 03:35 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
August 17, 2001 10:24:38 PM

Man, why do people do that? I went to that site assuming I'd find hardware reviews or something and then I was shocked to find.... :smile: . Shame on you... :smile:

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
August 17, 2001 10:36:32 PM

Dude, I forgot about all the banner ads and everything. I was just thinking about the Mastercard ads, and that site popped into my head.
I apologize



<font color=blue>Quarter pounder inside</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Change the Sig of the Week!!!</font color=red>
August 17, 2001 11:56:25 PM

Excellent choice of a motherboard, the KK266 PLUS. Yes it has onboard 5.1, it even uses the C-MEDIA (CMI 8768-or some other number), and IMO, it is better than the S.B. LIVE cards.

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August 20, 2001 4:37:52 PM

Lol, having my boss pass by my cube right AFTER i closed that window sure gave me the shot of adrenaline i needed at the end of the day. Thanks FB

Althons and Pentiums are just melted rock. Who’s rock is better? Who cares, let’s play some games
August 20, 2001 4:42:34 PM

BTW, i like the name Pentathlon for a chip (call me crazy). Maybe Pentathalon though, like u know, a 5 event contest. Pentathalon. The 3 GHZ pentathalon. "runs circles around ur chip". Hmm. "will throw a javelin through the competition". Hmmmmm. "Will melt for Flops". Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. I'm not a marketer, someone else take over :) 

Althons and Pentiums are just melted rock. Who’s rock is better? Who cares, let’s play some games
August 20, 2001 5:11:05 PM

:smile: Haha, thanks...well I figured that if Intel and AMD team up and combine technologies and the strengths of each processor you'd have one hell of a PC processor...running at high speeds while maintainig IPC and a high-speed 256-bit unified cache technology, where you only have 384KB of L1 cache rather than L1 and L2 which would greatly reduce latency. It would also sport 3DNow! Professional + SSE2, and data-prefetch. It would have a .13 micron process and would also be ice cold, capable of running at room temp without active cooling. It would have unlocked multipliers that would go up by .1 to squeeze every last drop of performance out of the processor. It would utilize quad-channel DDR memory system that would be able to keep up with the processor in raw clock speed. Well, that's all I can think of for now...<b>The PERFECT PC PROCESSOR</b>

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
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