too shay

trak0r · Aug 18, 2001

" AMD Releases x86-64 Specifications

Last week AMD announced the availability of vital information for its 64-bit answer to Intel's Itanium. AMD also christened its upcoming 64-bit line of microprocessors as "Hammer," with the first offering still commonly known as Sledgehammer (see Jerry Sanders's interview below for a possible change). The AMD Hammer line of microprocessors will be based on AMD's x86-64(tm) architectural specifications. The x86-64 specification is currently detailed in publicly available documents on AMD's Web site.

The x86-64 architecture is a logical and simple extension to the current x86-32 instruction set architecture currently used in all Windows based PCs. Intel chose a different tact with its 64-bit Itanium by not only introducing a different instruction set, but by also implementing a radical and complex design that is ultimately dependent on equally new and radical compiler technology. Intel's attempt to drive the problem ridden and chronically late Itanium into the market suffered another setback as recently as last month. There is now serious doubt that Intel will be able to make good on its promise to deliver 800MHz Itaniums before year's end.

Few foresee problems with either implementation of the Hammer designs or sufficient compiler support for AMD's x86-64 since the number 2 CPU company's design is based on well understood and widely known principles. The Itanium flounders when running 32-bit code (all modern Windows software) as it is optimized for 64-bit VLIW (Very Long Instruction Word) architecture. Athlons, Coppermines, P4s, Mustangs and perhaps even Durons will outperform Itaniums running "legacy" software. The Hammer family is quite different as it serves up un-compromised 32-bit performance. In fact, AMD's Drew Prarie has confirmed that the Sledgehammer ....

"will have two processors on a single die so the Sledgehammer will not just be a fast 64-bit processor, but it will likely also be the fastest processor available running 32-bit software. "

http://www6.tomshardware.com/column/00q3/000822/

Guest · Aug 18, 2001

well, anyways you guys probably wouldn't understand the articles anyway's,

Thanks for enlightening me.. I understand now.. yeah.. well I think... 64 bit language and all..kick ass.. and very efficient.. woosh.. maybe I'll have to read some more of Toms in depth info.. thanks for the tip

---- Owner of the only Dell computer with an AMD chip

zengeos · Aug 18, 2001

IA64 is NOT the next Pentium. It is a whole new chip specifically designed for higher end servers. While there will likely be a P5 in a couple years, it will likely not resemble IA64.

Mark-

When all else fails, throw your computer out the window!!!

Rop · Aug 19, 2001

The real question on Hammer will be the cost it will have when it comes out. I sure do hope AMD can make it go mainstream as fast as possible so that they can truely dominate the market. If not i do fear that Intel will take an upper hand in the race.

64 bit and an Antlon as well

You cant beat that combo!

ALL HAIL HAMMER ! heh

Rop

Why do I use LINUX ? Cause its the BEST OS
Why do I use Windows? Cause its the BEST Nintendo..

girish · Aug 19, 2001

Itanium is not next Pentium.

Intel will for sure make a 32 bit P5 sometime later since they need to stay in the mainstram processor business.

The Itanuim is a clear diversification from their current line into high end server and workstation arena. And I do expect a Itanium-II in a few years.

Pentium and Itanium are two radically different processor lines, sharing the common roots in x86 architecture.

girish

No system is fool-proof. Fools are Ingenious!

zengeos · Aug 19, 2001

little typo there girish...

Itanium does NOT share common roots with X86 CPU's.

It uses a completely different instruction set from X86 processors. That's why X86 apps will need to be emulated with software and run so slowly.

If it had common X86 roots there should be no need for software emulation.

Mark-

When all else fails, throw your computer out the window!!!

girish · Aug 19, 2001

the Itanium architecture is a superset of the older 32 bit x86 architecture, which was in turn a superset of still older 16 bit architecture.

that is why, in the 127 64 bit GPRs, you can have your old 24 registers - the RAX(EAX(AX(AL:AL))) through RBP(EBP), from r8 to r32.

older register set seems to be lost in the vastly added resources in the Itanium. and yes, it can execute older code but very inefficiently.

Itanium optimisation is a complicated science, and current code is too far from Itanium optimised, especially in its 32 bit mode.

girish

No system is fool-proof. Fools are Ingenious!

AmdMELTDOWN · Aug 19, 2001

dude, you have no clue! first, the hammer presently is virtual vaporware i,e. nonexistant! Intel Itanium exists and is performing well.

two, you'd be one dumb newbie if you play a 32-bit game or use 32-bit apps on a IA64 platform.

thus, if you're thinking of buying a hammer just to play 32-bit games then you need your head checked.

also, by the time your dream system comes true there will be a P4 @5+GHz .13micron, costing less than $200, AMD tbirds costing $0.75, geforce5 -$300, dual Mobos - $50, 512 rdram 1200-1600 -$100

so, if your smart enough you'd buy the tbirds @ 50 cents ea. right? LOL!

"AMD/VIA!...you are still the weakest link, good bye!"

trak0r · Aug 19, 2001

Post deleted by trak0r

juin · Aug 20, 2001

For me knowlege Itanium are very complex and still in major developement the next version (merced) ithink will be twice as faster that dont change anything it will take 5 yea before i buy he 64 bit cpu.

Hammer also to me kownlege is a 2*32 bit core and not a true 64 bit cpu that why he run faster the 32 bit apps anyway it wont be avaible until 2 year.

AmdMELTDOWN · Aug 20, 2001

ROTFLMAO, Dude come back in a few years when you've got your AMD hammer with 64-bit linux configured(for surfing 64-bit porno sites) and duke nuke'm running in compatibility mode so I can laugh my a$$ off at you once again. LOL!

"AMD/VIA!...you are still the weakest link, good bye!"

FatBurger · Aug 20, 2001

A 32 bit, and a 64 bit.

It's two 32-bit, not one of each, is it not?

And x86-64 cannot run IA64, although you seem to think it can.

Quarter pounder inside
Change the Sig of the Week!!!

trak0r · Aug 20, 2001

Post deleted by trak0r

FatBurger · Aug 20, 2001

THe hammer is a 64 bit.... AND a 32 Bit platform you piece of [-peep-]. You can use any 64 bit windows

You most certainly did say it could run IA64, whether you meant to or not

Quarter pounder inside
Change the Sig of the Week!!!

AmdMELTDOWN · Aug 20, 2001

dude, you're like a whinning baby pooping on yourself!

All I'm saying is that If you buy a 64-bit cpu to run 32-bit software then you need your head checked!

even if you do get a 32/64-bit cpu you'll have to wait for 32-bit software to be recompiled to get the most out of your investment and I know you puppies don't want that seeing how you ppl bitched so much about SSE2.

Btw the article you quoted seems to be a bit dated, well researched, bravo!

P.P.S. I never said anything about a IA64 would run on x86-64 bit platform.

"AMD/VIA!...you are still the weakest link, good bye!"

FatBurger · Aug 20, 2001

Of course the article is dated, it's one of the first to be talking about Hammer being a concept. Nobody is saying it's new, but x86-64 hasn't changed a whole lot since then, same with IA64.

And as for IA64 running on x86-64, he was talking to me, not you.

Quarter pounder inside
Change the Sig of the Week!!!

FUGGER · Aug 21, 2001

Yet another clueless lemming posting on a topic they know nothing about. typical lemming style.

"Intel's attempt to drive the problem ridden and chronically late Itanium into the market suffered another setback as recently as last month"

Itanium is shipping, hammer is not... Mkay

"The Itanium flounders when running 32-bit code (all modern Windows software) as it is optimized for 64-bit VLIW (Very Long Instruction Word) architecture. "

Itamium is a 64bit processor, and its made to run 64bit software specificly. NOT 32BIT. Mkay

"will have two processors on a single die so the Sledgehammer will not just be a fast 64-bit processor, but it will likely also be the fastest processor available running 32-bit software. "

I told you lemmings that the Hammer was dual cores AKA SMP on a chip yet you losers called me a liar and spewed more crap than ever before. its not a true 64bit CPU. Keep dreaming on how its going to perform since you have no sample to even base that statement on. I dont see people spending $10k on a Itanium to run MS word. GG on this "very lemming" post.

FatBurger · Aug 21, 2001

FUGGER, pull your head out of your ass and listen up for a minute.

I'm going to talk about the home user for a minute here, ok?
How many of these home users will want to buy a new computer and upgrade their CPU all at once? None. Don't even think about saying Itanium isn't for the home user, I'm not talking about Itanium, I'm talking about whatever product Intel brings out for the home user. Am I clear so far? Hope so.

Now, if IA64 runs 32-bit code like crap, then that means that everyone will either have to put a sleeping bag by their computer for the long waiting times, or upgrade all their software to 64-bit at the same time they buy this new, expensive computer.

What's the largest ISP currently? AOL. Why? Because they're "So easy to use", remember? I can't stand AOL, but the average home user, stupid as they may be, likes that. They like minimal fuss, they like having things done for them. These are the people that pay Intel's bills (and yours), not people like us who sit in a computer nerd forum arguing about IA64 vs. x86-64.

Now, none of these home users will want to do that. They'd be far happier to stick with their 32-bit computers than 1) upgrade all their software, or 2) pay out the ass for a new computer and run everything rrreeeeaalll ssssllllloooowwwwww.

If you can prove to me that the home version of IA64 can run 32-bit code at a decent speed, then I'll consider IA64 as a decent solution. Until then, it sucks.

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trak0r · Aug 21, 2001

I need to opologize for all the confusion here. It seems some people would like to go over the edge when they post, and some just like to inform and correct. My intention was to inform of the hammer, and what it is capable for average user. when people decide to upgrade, they want to spend little amount, and be able to have the best of both worlds at there finger tips. I hope, really hope that IA64 architecture does not take off, and become the standard! That means that all the computetion will be in Intel's hands , once again. All these cool prices your seeing, is a direct result of competitors, like AMD, stepping up to the plate. I seriously doubt AMD will try to copy IA64 into their processors because they wanted to go with what works! x86-64. But, they will adapt if Intel wins, and drives the market up once more

whatever. you guys know exactly what I mean. I spend $300, and get a hammer that runs 32 bit better then current athlons, and I get a 64 bit that runs the best at 'x86-64 64 bit instructions' (not itaniums radical, and monopolizing spec's, called IA64). OR I could go and spend $1200 for and 'IA64 processor' to run my legacy software (like a P3), but to run all the proggies that was customized for the IA64 (be it windows or whatever). The futute is pretty clear I think. Itunium will strictly settle into the server, suppercomputer market, and there will be a P5, that works on a x86-64 platform, but will not have sufficeient 32 bit support to compete with its own predeccesor, the P4. well.. those are my last thoughts for this forum.

goodbye.

Tr@k0r.

P.s. I will not read, nor reply to anything else said in this forum. I do not have the time.

FUGGER · Aug 21, 2001

AHGAHAHAHAHAHA, Home users are not going to buy a Itanium.

10K for the machine and even more for the applications...

Home users.... ROFLMAO

I can forsee a mad rush on SV1 Cray supercomputer to run 32bit apps. its a supercomputer and it should run 32bit apps right? well since a 386SX can beat SV1 at 32bit apps they should just junk the SV1 and buy used 386's huh?

REPEAT, Itanium is not made for 32bit (IA64) or home users. get over it already.

Grizely1 · Aug 21, 2001

I really couldn't give a damn if the Hammer series would be 64bit or not. The only reason I would buy a Hammer would be for it's 32bit capabilities.

--
It's Princess Leia, the yodel of my life. Give me my sweater back or I'll play the guitar.

FUGGER · Aug 21, 2001

Speaking of getting shot down, Hypertransport was shot down in flames as a PCI standard. =P

On the brigher side
http://www.osc.edu/

Out in the Midwestern U.S., the Ohio Supercomputer Center (OSC) and SGI have put together a new cluster system using the Itanium-based Silicon Graphics 750 system. The system makes use of a whopping 146 processors and will allow Ohio researchers to study everything from quark-antiquark attraction and radiation transfer in astrophysical outflows to simulations of photosynthesis components and matter in the early universe. The latest Silicon Graphics 750 system has 292GB memory, 428GFLOPS peak performance for double-precision computations, and 856GFLOPS peak performance for single-precision computations

You can visit your beloved Hammer at www.simics.com
Did I mention its a software simulator/macromedia demo?
When AMD has a working hammer sample the world will know, untill then you got alot of wasted bandwidth.

FUGGER · Aug 21, 2001

Let me put it another way, would you spend 10K for a home PC? I didnt think so.

FatBurger · Aug 21, 2001

Me:

Don't even think about saying Itanium isn't for the home user, I'm not talking about Itanium

You:

AHGAHAHAHAHAHA, Home users are not going to buy a Itanium.

FUGGER, time and time again you prove how big an idiot you really are. When are you going to give up?

Quarter pounder inside
Change the Sig of the Week!!!

FatBurger · Aug 21, 2001

Exactly. So what 64-bit HOME SOLUTION is Intel going to pull out of their ass to compete with Hammer?

Quarter pounder inside
Change the Sig of the Week!!!

too shay

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