Sun is proabably even more out in the cold now. IBM are sitting on the fence, offering Itanium at the high end of their Intel line while continuing to develop the Power4. If Itanium does prove the all-conquering force many predict, IBM have an easy fall back position with Itanium. Sun however don't. And now they will face an HP-Compaq Goliath almost as big as IBM, and with the marketing might of Intel behind it, intent on defeating RISC.