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Has my computer got PMS?

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Last response: in CPUs
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September 9, 2001 12:34:24 PM

Early last week my PC failed to boot. blue screen of death on ntoskrnl.exe (win2k).
also got bad sectors on my 60GXP. initially i thought my ibm 60GXP died, but my other old drive wouldnt install win2k or 98 either, and exhibited the same issues, even on a new cable.

eventually i went back to my old favorite FSB of 150, as i was on 135 for some unrelated benchmarking. i.e. was (10x135=1350), now back to my old (9x150=1350).

and NO, my PC is 100% stable at 150Mhz fsb & overclocked to 1350Mhz. and it has been for 3 months... till now.

so there i was... back up again. thinking the only plausable cauzes of my grief were a dirty power supply, bad PSU or bad mobo.

now tonite, ive been cruzing the net, searching for the cure for cancer, and ripping 30 odd music CD's. a light nites work.
when half way through ripping a CD my computer spontaneously REBOOTS!
now that im back in whenever i insert a CD into either cd drive (pioneer 106S or ricoh12x10x32x) they make repeated seeking noises when a cd was inserted.

whats up?
is my PSU on the way out?
or is it my mobo?

for more info i have posted a more detailed thread in the Hard Disk forum.



I'll respect your comments & opinions, even if i disagree with them, Provided you display maturity.

More about : computer pms

September 10, 2001 4:21:19 AM

run at stock speeds and see if you still have the problem. THen you'll know for sure. Maybe its just taken awhile for your overclocked machine to not work correctly any more. My friend had a celeron that would overclock almost 100% but after awhile it just stopped overclocking, won't go as high any more.
September 10, 2001 4:41:12 AM

suppose its worth a try... but i suspect the chance of that is remote. my pc has been running at 1350 @ 150 for over 4 months now.
and last time i seemed to fix the bug by underclocking then going back to overclocked.

easy to implement anyways
thanx
think ill also look around for a new psu while im at it. really want one with twin fans

I'll respect your comments & opinions, even if i disagree with them, Provided you display maturity.
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September 10, 2001 6:54:26 AM

I had a similar problem too. My 1.2 is not stable at more than a 10x multiplier (regardless of the voltage) but I had been able to overclock the FSB to 139 (Mushkin PC133) with no problem for probably 2 months or more. Then I installed multiple OS's (XP and Linux-Mandrake) and got that ntsokrnl.exe error when trying to start 2000 after about a week of all 3 OS's working great. I was able to copy a new ntsokrnl file from the CD and EXPAND it to replace the bad one and everything worked fine. At the same time I cut the FSB back to 135. Haven't had a problem since. It could be the multiple booting (which I seldom use anyway) but I really think it was the overclocking FSB. I'm happy with a 1.2 @1350 AXIA anyway. I think the 1.4 steppings are the better OC'ers though.
September 10, 2001 7:16:42 AM

the 10X u say.... hmmms

what confuses me is that both drives were doing it at 10x135, but fine later at 9x150.

and when it first started i was single booting only.

and last nite i got a spontaneous reboot ripping a cd on my dvd drive.
different controler, different cable. hmmms
i HOPE its something easy to replace like the psu.

can u tell me how to do that kernel thinggy?
expanding it u said...

Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
September 10, 2001 1:04:43 PM

it happened again!
was running at stock 1200mhz to test my pc.

at 8x150=1200 win2k locked up with a constant beep ripping a cd.
i then throttled it back to 9x133. got into windows and almost finished loading startup apps before it locked up with screen corruption.
THEN in desperation tried 12x100.
and its been running at this for 3 hours, no issues.

so therefor its GOTTA be the mobo or the RAM.
im thinking the ram most likely...
why has it died all of a sudden.

and has anyone else seen bad ram cauze spontaneous reboots when ripping cd's?
or hard disk corruption?

Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
September 10, 2001 1:58:22 PM

I've had bad ram freeze and reboot a computer while surfing the internet. It can do all sorts of weird things.

What is the difference between <font color=red>pink</font color=red> and <font color=purple>purple</font color=purple>? The <b>GRIP</b>!
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
September 10, 2001 2:38:47 PM

Iwonder buy running 150fsb has damaged some of your hardware gradually? I reckon i killed a HDD like that.

But what would I know!



<A HREF="http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/story_18170.asp" target="_new">Go home boatpeople</A>
September 10, 2001 11:54:26 PM

anyone know the name of that ram testing program???

i want to try that at 133 and 150.
specially as 100Mhz is running fine with no problems.

i always assumed that if ram went bad, it went bad at whatever Mhz you set it too.


UPDATE:
the problem difinately is getting worse. 133 or 135 Mhz makes my computer crash within an hour, then repeatedly and very quickly (usually cannot fully load win2k) after unless a speed change is instituted.
150 Mhz seems more stable for some bizzare reason, but it too gives up the ghost after a few hours.
NOTE: i run cure for cancer ALL the time, so bear in mind these lockups occur after a number of hours of running at 100% proc/mem thruput.

changing from Cas2,2,2 to 3,3,3 appears to have NILL impact, at any speed rating.

i think what ill do next is set my FSB & ram to asynchronous.
try to conclusively pin down the ram as the weak link, and not something plugged in to the FSB speed so to speak, like the pci bus.
ie. fsb to 100, mem to 133.

heh. despite all this, and despite giving my poor ibm 60GXP a bad sector in the process, my hard drive is still going strong. i wonder how many other people with bad 60GXP's have done what i did?

Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
September 11, 2001 1:05:17 AM

Try CPUcool as it has an interesting reporting feature, get cacheman for optimizing the ram. About a gazillion others to use, goto tweak files and see for your self. What about checking that swap file maybe , change it to fixed or whatever(even let windows manage it just for laughs).
How hot is you ram getting, do you have a probe on it while you have been o/cing it. Like I said above, you may have damaged something gradually by overclocking the fsb for so long.

But what would I know!


<font color=green>Lizards </font color=green>hide under rocks, <font color=red>Trolls</font color=red> hide under bridges ready to ruin things!
September 11, 2001 1:24:19 AM

trust me, cpu cool and cache man wont work when it lockes up before reaching windows.

ram temps ive got no idea, but it is pc150 CERTIFIED ram, in a decently ventilated case, so temps should be fine.
what i can and will do is try reseating both, see if heat cauzes contact problems, then swapping out each of the 2 sticks, and trying them in different slots, and see if i can identify if its one particular stick, or slot giving me grief.

thinking over it it may be temp related... as it doesnt occur at bootup. usually takes an hour or so to manifest itsself (at 133 or 150), then once present no number of reboots helps. the only thing that does work is setting it to 100mhz.

looks like ive got a numer of things to try this evning.

Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
September 11, 2001 5:00:18 AM

read your latest posts and I don't know what to say. What brand is your PC150? Do you have multiple sticks or maybe it is worth buying a new stick to see if that is the problem since memory is cheap now and you could always use more.

The krnl file is on your win2000 cd as ntoskrnl.ex_ I believe. A command "EXPAND ntsokrnl.ex_ ntoskrnl.exe" from the command prompt (DOS) will allow you to restore the file to the c:/WINNT/SYSTEM32 folder. Kind of like unzipping it. Delete the old file first and make sure you get it in the system32 folder. I did all this when booting XP but if you don't have a second OS you may have to use a boot disk with CD drivers support or something to read the CD. Your Emergency Startup disk should work too. the file expand.com should be on the cd and has been in dos forever I think. I'm guessing if you have NTFS you might have to use the one off of the 2000 CD though.
September 11, 2001 5:20:18 AM

Have you checked your load temps and if they are somewhat high try realigning your HSF and get a fresh set of Artic Silver II on it. Not too much mind you. Random lockups I have found are usually a matter of heat.

Schmide
September 11, 2001 11:23:16 AM

CRAP CRAP CRAP CRAP CRAP

swapped out all my IDE cables.
no change
tried my PC on on ram stick.
then the other.
then in a different slot
no change.

CRAAAAAAAP
now running asynchronously...
fsb=100mhz
ram=133mhz

and its going good.
crap.
means something on my mobo is bad... northbridge, southbridge, ide controller... who knows :( 


Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
September 11, 2001 11:26:25 AM

hey scotty.
it aint the ram.

positive

gotta be the northbridge, southbridge or maybe the fsb of the processor.

cauz im runnin at fsb=100 ram=133 no probs so far.

before when i was doing 133/133 it was real bad.

any way of discrimitating between the mobo and cpu?

Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
September 11, 2001 12:01:14 PM

Try swaping cpu's/ motherboards!
Did you recently change HSF's? Hope you didnt take a corner off the core because that could change things, otherwise I'm out of ideas.
Whats this running asynchronously? Might help me with a problem I have.



<font color=green>Lizards </font color=green>hide under rocks, <font color=red>Trolls</font color=red> hide under bridges ready to ruin things!
September 11, 2001 12:40:37 PM

Hey you said that your CD drive just blinks and searches? maybe its messed up, worth a try to unhook it... and anything else you dont need. you know start from the basics, if you have a different IDE controller it would be convenient. See if you can boot from floppy and do HDD utilities. you tried everything else its worth a shot.
September 11, 2001 11:04:06 PM

no to swapping coolers and stuff.

this PC has only one heatsink remount, professionally done, was done to remove the thermal pad some 3 months ago now, with no lockup or heat realted issue till now.

did a bit more investigating, and the problem STILL manifests itself even when i underclock as low as 7x133=933.
so it just has to be something on the motherboard which is progressivly dying, a FSB of 133 or higher just makes it die after a predictable period of time at full load, and repeatedly consistantly after.

by asynchronously i mean like the old thundabird B's and the original KT133 chipset,
fsb=100, ram=133.
doing that at the moment and its running fine.

i COULD use this as an excuse to get a new processor though *grins* had my eye on a 1.4 AYHJRA.. or however u spell it.

but its gotta be the mobo *sigh*

a question: the shop that put it together, they will replace it yes? free of charge? even though i had to get inside to problem solve this? bloody well hope so.

i wonder... should i get another a7v133? or go for something different/better?
and would they swap? or just replace

Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
September 11, 2001 11:26:17 PM

nup. not the processor thank goodness.
my full load temp has never got above 58 C.

its VERY FSB sensitive
i.e. 12x100=1200 is ok, but 9x133=1200 is not.
even happens way down at 7x133=933
mobo dying. gotta be
also works fine at fsb=100 ram=133, so my ram is A-ok too.


Need MUCH more chlorine in the gene pool i believe.
September 12, 2001 2:30:45 AM

Did you try upping the IO (Ram) voltage? I know that helped with a few of my overclocks.

Schmide
September 16, 2001 10:36:21 AM

well this is an annoying pain in the ass.

took it off to the place i bought it. did a whole day running their without problems.

now ive got it back and there are no issues.

must have been on of the following:

1. slightly loose component
2. some bios setting reset when i cleared the bios

so its PMS is over it seems... and ive done an extensive high FSB burn in to prove it.
damn i hate knowing exactly what the cauze was.

least i DID learn somthing.
found that both casefans are next to useless. not cauze they are cheap models but caze of the case design. drilled holes for the exhaust/intake vent means at least half the air circulated by the fan actually CANNOT leave the case
this is being remedyed the cheap and nasty way.
pair of metal cutters!
gonna completely chop out the 80mm circle of of fan exhaust.
*evil grin*


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