A name for each alignment?

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A name for each alignment:

I've read somewhere about why the protagonist of A clockwork Orange was
named Alex:

"without law" /short for Alexander (defender of men)/ A law unto himself.

So this got me thinking: What is the archetypal name for each alignment?

Or archetypal names, because I we have more than one root language to work
with.

I have no suggestion myself.
 
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drow wrote:
> Alien mind control rays made pjmcgurk@gate.net write:
> > So this got me thinking: What is the archetypal name for each
alignment?
>
> LG Bob

No, No, No. Needs a name that says loyal and good, like Spot. Yes,
definatly Spot. See Spot Adventure. See Spot heal. Heal Spot heal!

> NG Jim

I always pictured Captain Kirk as CG... on the other hand he runs a
tight ship, unlike those later so-called captains. O.k. I'll accept
Jim.

> CG Eric

Ted, see below....

> LN Ted

No way. Ted is Toasted. Whoaaa, Duuude! Probably CG... Um. Judge
or Law comes to mind. Yes both those are names. A little unusuall
though, and LN is all about conforming.

> N Zgutmonoyn'zhinzyk

I think you got this mixed up with CN. TN should be a common name like
the rest of your Let's see Mike? Mike is supposely the most common
name right now for a guy at least, but it doesn't really say TN to me.


> CN Lou

See N.

> LE Bob

Hmm? Bob as both LG and LE? Should be Tim. I know a Tim, definatley
LE. Of course you could go with historical figures... Adolph...
although he might be NE, he just had a lot of LE cronies.

> NE Carl
> CE Hank "The Destroyer"

Come On! Everyone knows this should be Jeff!

- Justisaur.
 
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Alien mind control rays made pjmcgurk@gate.net write:
> So this got me thinking: What is the archetypal name for each alignment?

LG Bob
NG Jim
CG Eric
LN Ted
N Zgutmonoyn'zhinzyk
CN Lou
LE Bob
NE Carl
CE Hank "The Destroyer"

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drow wrote:
> Alien mind control rays made pjmcgurk@gate.net write:
>
>> So this got me thinking:
>> What is the archetypal name for each alignment?
>
> LG Bob
> NG Jim
> CG Eric
> LN Ted
> N Zgutmonoyn'zhinzyk
> CN Lou
> LE Bob
> NE Carl
> CE Hank "The Destroyer"

PotW!


Arivne
 
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"Bradd W. Szonye" <bradd+news@szonye.com> wrote in
news:slrnd6g9ki.uf5.bradd+news@szonye.com:

> Justisaur <justisaur@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> CE Hank "The Destroyer"
>>
>> Come On! Everyone knows this should be Jeff!
>
> Heikkinen or Goslin?

What is wrong with either of those lagers?
 
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<pjmcgurk@gate.net> wrote in message
news:1WR9e.10472$sp3.6579@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...

> So this got me thinking: What is the archetypal name for each alignment?

A different slant than elsewhere:

LG: Defender
CG: Free Spirit
NG: Philanthropist
LN: Judge
N: Balancer
CN: Anarchist
NE: Bane
LE: Dominator
CE: Destroyer

David


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On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 18:03:41 +0000, pjmcgur wrote:

>
> A name for each alignment:
>
> I've read somewhere about why the protagonist of A clockwork Orange was
> named Alex:
>
> "without law" /short for Alexander (defender of men)/ A law unto himself.
>
> So this got me thinking: What is the archetypal name for each alignment?
>
> Or archetypal names, because I we have more than one root language to work
> with.
>
> I have no suggestion myself.


LG obviously is Benedict.

LL (really not Lawful^2)
 
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Lorenz Lang <lang@netlife.invalid> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 18:03:41 +0000, pjmcgur wrote:
>
>> What is the archetypal name for each alignment?
>
> LG obviously is Benedict.

That's just someone who speaks well. We need someone who acts well.

Bono also sounds like a name for a good guy.


mcv.
 
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David wrote:
> <pjmcgurk@gate.net> wrote in message
> news:1WR9e.10472$sp3.6579@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
>
> > So this got me thinking: What is the archetypal name for each
alignment?
>
> A different slant than elsewhere:
>

You know the PHB has the following, only with some changes.

> LG: Defender

PHB: Crusader. I like yours better.

> CG: Free Spirit

PHB has Free Spirit for CN, and Rebel for CG. Not sure it might fit
better reversed like you have it though.

> NG: Philanthropist

PHB: Benefactor. Yours is a bit more descriptive.

> LN: Judge

More like Beurocrat, but the PHB agrees with you here.

> N: Balancer

Not sure that's apropriate. Seems a holdover from previous editions.
PHB has Undecided. I'm not entirely comfortable with that either
though. I'd probably just go with Commoner.

> CN: Anarchist

See CG.

> NE: Bane

Bane is a bit weak, need something more accessable. From
dictionary.com we have meanings of bane as a bringer of ruin, and a
bringer of inconvenience ;)
from wikipedia we have it as a murderer, tyrany, slavery, and strife.
That seems to fit LE more.

PHB has Malefactor which I think is a bit better, but still not
terribly good.

> LE: Dominator

Same as PHB

> CE: Destroyer
>

Same as PHB.

I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE... like
drow. Now a horde of orc tribes, sure. Of course I'm just going off on
a tangent, because that's a problem with drow, not the alignment. But
as long as I'm doing that, I'll pick on the other side of elves too,
since most DMs seem to run thier society as more NG than CG.

-Justisaur
 
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> LG obviously is Benedict.
>
> LL (really not Lawful^2)

Sure that's not LE?

If Ian McDarmid croaked before they could finish filming SW3:RotS Darth
Benedictus could have easily subbed in...
 
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Justisaur wrote:

> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE... like
> drow.

I'd imagine it would be a "might makes right" situation. If you want to
be the man, you have to beat the man. If you can kill the King,
congratulations, you're King. Until someone who can kill you comes
around...

-Will
 
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On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 15:16:39 +0930, elfbard wrote:

>> LG obviously is Benedict.
>>
>> LL (really not Lawful^2)
>
> Sure that's not LE?

Me or Benedict?

> If Ian McDarmid croaked before they could finish filming SW3:RotS Darth
> Benedictus could have easily subbed in...

I was talking about the name Benedict and not the
'Pontiff formerly known as Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger'.

'Bene' symbolizing Good and 'Dict' Law. See the spell 'Dictum'...
I thought that would be obvious.

LL
 
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On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 13:02:51 +0200, Lorenz Lang wrote:

> On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 15:16:39 +0930, elfbard wrote:
>
>>> LG obviously is Benedict.
>>>
>>> LL (really not Lawful^2)
>>
>> Sure that's not LE?
>
> Me or Benedict?
>
>> If Ian McDarmid croaked before they could finish filming SW3:RotS Darth
>> Benedictus could have easily subbed in...

Know I know what you're talking about:
I just recieved a picture via email with both of them (Benedict and Darth
Sidius) and a certain alikeness can't be denied...
:eek:)

LL
 
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Justisaur wrote:
>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE...
>> like drow.

Will Green wrote:
> I'd imagine it would be a "might makes right" situation. If you want
> to be the man, you have to beat the man. If you can kill the King,
> congratulations, you're King. Until someone who can kill you comes
> around...

Also, Northern European feudalism is arguably a chaotic form of
government. Feudalism is based on personal relationships and contracts
rather than rule of law, which is pretty chaotic as far as government
goes, and Northern Europe added a big dollop of personal rights on top
of that foundation. (Contrast with Southern Europe, which favored
centralized government and authoritarianism.)

A brutal feudal system that treated its innocent subjects badly might
therefore be chaotic evil.
--
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http://www.szonye.com/bradd
 
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On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 21:09:17 GMT, "Bradd W. Szonye"
<bradd+news@szonye.com> wrote:

>Justisaur wrote:
>>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE...
>>> like drow.
>
>Will Green wrote:
>> I'd imagine it would be a "might makes right" situation. If you want
>> to be the man, you have to beat the man. If you can kill the King,
>> congratulations, you're King. Until someone who can kill you comes
>> around...
>
>Also, Northern European feudalism is arguably a chaotic form of
>government. Feudalism is based on personal relationships and contracts
>rather than rule of law, which is pretty chaotic as far as government
>goes, and Northern Europe added a big dollop of personal rights on top
>of that foundation. (Contrast with Southern Europe, which favored
>centralized government and authoritarianism.)
>
>A brutal feudal system that treated its innocent subjects badly might
>therefore be chaotic evil.

You can also look at things like 1930s China where the government were
fundamentally lackeys of organised crime, which, despite the name, is
a great deal less organised than the average legit government. Then
there's 20th century Afghanistan where basically the central
government has only ever had nominal control of the hills and valleys
with the actual local power being whatever hardass who managed to put
together a big enough gang to control the local civilians.

Of course such societies in real life rarely manage to put up a
creditable threat to neighboring societies which might be considered
Lawful. But then, that's because we don't live in a world where
constant conflict can grant you the powers of a comic book superhero.

If we did, then cultures like Afghanistan or the Sudan would be very
scary to more peaceful neighbours. D&D game mechanics actually
balance the scales between Law and Chaos.
 
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Lorenz Lang wrote:
>
> Know I know what you're talking about:
> I just recieved a picture via email with both of them (Benedict and Darth
> Sidius) and a certain alikeness can't be denied...

http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/darthbenedict.jpg

--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

Perge, scelus, mihi diem perficias.

Asatoma sat gamaya, tamasoma jyotir gamaya, mrityorma anritam gamaya.
 
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Bradd W. Szonye wrote:
> Christopher Adams wrote:
>> Lorenz Lang wrote:
>
>>> Know I know what you're talking about:
>>> I just recieved a picture via email with both of them (Benedict and
>>> Darth Sidius) and a certain alikeness can't be denied...
>>
>> http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/darthbenedict.jpg
>
> Nice.

Not mine, alas. I stole it from a Photoshop thread on Fark.com.

--
Christopher Adams - Sydney, Australia
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/prestigeclasslist.html
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/mhacdebhandia/templatelist.html

Perge, scelus, mihi diem perficias.

Asatoma sat gamaya, tamasoma jyotir gamaya, mrityorma anritam gamaya.
 
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Will Green wrote:
> Justisaur wrote:
>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE... like drow.
> I'd imagine it would be a "might makes right" situation. If you want to
> be the man, you have to beat the man. If you can kill the King,
> congratulations, you're King. Until someone who can kill you comes
> around...

The 'Woman', as we are dealing with Drow. :)
--
"... respect, all good works are not done by only good folk ..."
--till next time, Jameson Stalanthas Yu -x- <<poetry.dolphins-cove.com>>
 
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~consul wrote:
> Will Green wrote:
>
>> Justisaur wrote:
>>
>>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE...
>>> like drow.
>>
>> I'd imagine it would be a "might makes right" situation. If you want
>> to be the man, you have to beat the man. If you can kill the King,
>> congratulations, you're King. Until someone who can kill you comes
>> around...
>
> The 'Woman', as we are dealing with Drow. :)

Point. :)

-Will
 
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Alien mind control rays made ~consul <consul@invaliddolphins-cove.com> write:
> Will Green wrote:
>> Justisaur wrote:
>>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE...
>>> like drow.
>>
>> I'd imagine it would be a "might makes right" situation. If you want to
>> be the man, you have to beat the man. If you can kill the King,
>> congratulations, you're King. Until someone who can kill you comes
>> around...
>
> The 'Woman', as we are dealing with Drow. :)

hmmm? (the big secret? the rulers really are all guys, we just
like david bowie a lot.)

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Justisaur wrote:
>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE...
>> like drow.

FWIW, drow alignment is usually /neutral/ evil in D&D3.

tussock wrote:
> They've traditionally been described as a LE society of CE
> individuals. There's rules and regulations and strictures for every
> aspect of life, and they all cheat, or do whatever they need to, to
> get what they want regardless.

Sounds a lot like Melniboneans, who don't seem D&D-chaotic at first
glance. However, the Melniboneans didn't follow tradition for its own
sake; their "tradition" was more like a huge knowledge base of what
works and what doesn't based on millenia of practical experience. Like a
D&D-chaotic character, they always tried to make choices according to
personal judgment, it's just that their judgment included a vast body of
best practices. Also, note that Melniboneans wouldn't back a king or any
other authority figure just because he's king; a weak or unwise king --
one who won't or can't observe the best practices as perceive by the
subjects -- would get into trouble quickly, as Elric did.
--
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tussock <scrub@clear.net.nz> writes:

> Justisaur wrote:
>> I still don't understand how you can have a civilization of CE... like
>> drow.
>
> They've traditionally been described as a LE society of CE
> individuals. There's rules and regulations and strictures for every
> aspect of life, and they all cheat, or do whatever they need to, to
> get what they want regardless.
> Everyone respects the /rank/ and /authority/ of rulers and house
> matrons regardless of the individual, but if another sees relative
> weakness in that individual, they try to take the position for
> themselves.
>
This is basically the description I have in my Orc sourcebook here
('Fury in the Wastelands' by Kenzer and Company).

A CE society functions because the lower rungs fear the higher ups. It
is the *personal* power of the higher ups that give them their
authority, and the fear of that personal power that keeps the lower
ranks in line. Power thus derives not from law, but from individual
strength.

Meanwhile the lower ranks scheme and wait for a moment of weakness, so
that they can replace the higher ups when those show a sign of weakness.

Sounds perfectly Chaotic to me, and pretty workable as a society. Not
a very advanced one, and not one with a lot of prospect at progress
(that requires some voluntary cooperation, which is hard for CE
types), but a viable society nonetheless.

Oh, and for people looking for a good Orc sourcebook, 'Fury in the
Wastelands' is rather light on setting specific stuff and can be
easily adapted to any setting, not just 'Kingdoms of Kalamar'. I'd
recommend it to any DM needing fully fleshed out Orcs as
adversaries.

Mart

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