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Intel v AMD performance/price issue

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November 14, 2001 6:43:32 PM

Remember that <A HREF="http://commerce.euro.dell.com/dellstore/config/frameset..." target="_new">PC from Dell</A>that I was talking about in my other thread? This was it's spec:

1.8 GHz Pentium 4 /256 cache
mini Tower chassis
384 Mb NON-ECC RDRAM 2(64+128)
100Gb HD (7200rpm)
19" Triniton Flat Screen Monitor,
16x DVD Drive & Software Decoding
16x IDE CD-RW Internal
Turtle Beach Santa Cruz Sound Card
Harmon Kardon 695 speakers
64MB nVidia GeFore3 Ti 200 Card
MS Windows XP
(plus other standard things)
3 years warranty
Total Price = £1300 (inc. VAT and delivery)

Well I went around to every PC store that I could find around my area here in United Kingdom, and asked them if they could beat that price. I also telephoned companies like Evesham.com and asked them if they could beat that spec and price.

The result was that everyone who looked at the spec from Dell was SHOCKED! They made remarks like "the price is amzing", "we can't beat that" etc.

The nearest price for a Pentium 4 they came to was £1500 (compared to £1300 for the PC from Dell).

I have read a lot of reviews for Evesham.com computers. They always get high marks for their excellent spec and very low prices. They gave me the following spec: <A HREF="http://www.evesham.com/document.asp?type=pc_ml&mr_id=8&..." target="_new">Click here</A>, at the bottom)

Athlon XP 1.53Ghz (1800+)
266Mhz cache
512 DDRAM
100Gb HD
64 Mb GeForce 3 Ti500
19" Flat screen monitor
16x DVD
16x CD-RW
Sound Blaster Live 5.12
3 years warranty

And guess what the price was?? £1643 (inc VAT & del) !!!!

What happened here?? I thought AMD systems were supposed to be cheaper than Intel??!!! That is what I have been reading in magazines, websites and even you guys keep going on about how cheap AMDs are compared to Intel. But when I asked for a SIMILAR spec to the Dell PC, the price for AMD became even more expensive.

I think I'm going to go ahead and buy the Dell computer. It's cheap and got excellent spec. Plus, it's "intel inside" !!!

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
November 14, 2001 6:47:13 PM

A comparable performance AMD system you build yourself will be cheaper, but when you start looking at OEMs, it's open season. They can charge you whatever they want.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
November 14, 2001 7:08:46 PM

Anyone on these forums will tell you that going with OEMs is the worst thing you can do and they're usually slower than self-built PCs because they come with inferior motherboards.

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
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November 14, 2001 7:24:00 PM

you cant just compare two systems with really dif components, such as TI200(P4), TI500(XP).
and other components and brands of each component.
i dont see your point.

btw they cant just give you a good price, there has to be a reson to it, they are saving money on something, i leave it to you to find what exactly is it that they are cutting down on.
remember they are bot making those hardware pieces so they dont have control over the OEM price of it so there is something missing here, might be some DSL(or such) pacage?

<font color=green>
*******
*K.I.S.S*
*(k)eep (I)t (S)imple (S)tupid*
*******
</font color=green>
November 14, 2001 7:35:59 PM

Why don't you have someone build you a system? I'm assuming you are in the UK. I know Techie2001, Wiggy5, and Calv all live in the UK. I'm sure one of them would be more than happy to help you.

Nice <b><font color=green>Lizards</b></font color=green> <b>crunch</b> Trolls cookies....... :smile: Yummy!! :smile:
November 14, 2001 7:41:01 PM

Yes, some components are difference in each case, but still, look at the difference in price. Athlon is about £344 more expensive. Is that justifiable? I thought Athlons were supposed to be cheaper together with good components.

I don't know why there's a price cut on the Dell system. Dell always has special offer's every month. And this was the best offer I have seen.

I did enquire about the makes of the components. This is what they told me:

The memory is consists of 2 x (64 +128) = 384. In other words it uses up four slots. So if I want to upgrade the memory, I would have to throw away the old memory first! (I don't think I would need upgrading the mem and if I did it would be after years, by then I would sell my old mem and buy new one).

The motherboard they told me was from intel. I asked for the make and the sales person mentioned "A45". I don't know what that meant. Can anyone help? It is socket 478 compatible though.

The DVD is Samsung. The CDRW is LG.

The thing is, I don't want to build my own system yet. I want to buy an OEM first, and then use this as a basic building block for years to come, when I will definetly be building and upgrading from it.

What do you think I should do? Buy the Dell PC or look for a better deal? Anyone seen a better OEM deal?

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
November 14, 2001 7:51:55 PM

I can understand why you want to go OEM. You want a company to back your warranty if any problems should arise. OEM systems are not good building blocks. They are usually proprietary (sp?). I would suggest looking into a ma and pa shop in the area that sells white boxes. Get a price quote and a warranty from them. Give us the system stats and price quote. We'll tell you the real price and then you see if you can get them down any on the price. Trust me. OEM systems are bad.

Nice <b><font color=green>Lizards</b></font color=green> <b>crunch</b> Trolls cookies....... :smile: Yummy!! :smile:
November 14, 2001 7:55:35 PM

Dell does not use proprietary parts like most OEMs. Actually, that is becoming less common. The only proprietary parts are the BIOS and some small things like the way the LEDs and switches connect to the MB.

BTW, the XP system will easily be faster than the P4 (except for a few apps, of course).

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
November 14, 2001 8:00:59 PM

Ok. But I know that Compaq (shudder) is highly proprietary. I wasn't sure how dell was. I don't like dell's cases though. Very chinsy. The metal is very flimsy. Also with OEM systems you have to reseat everything. They throw those systems together so quick and only test 1 out of 10. I don't like those odds. I don't trust OEM's. You are better off finding a computer shop in your local town. You'll probably get a better deal and they might even be nice enough to come out and set it up for you for free.

Nice <b><font color=green>Lizards</b></font color=green> <b>crunch</b> Trolls cookies....... :smile: Yummy!! :smile:
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 14, 2001 8:02:49 PM

ok I'm new here (shut up then i hear you say) I am not an Intel or AMD man, but I am to am looking to buy a new pc rather than build.

I cant see how you can compare the above systems though, and I don't think it's the choice of platform makes the difference. If you consider the price difference between the graphics card alone! I have played with all the 'design your pc online' toys and know how little changes here and there can bump up the price.

phew long for a first post eh, in the end you have to go with what you're happy with.

'i'm your little glowing friend'
November 14, 2001 8:06:07 PM

All I know is that most OEM's have a 400% mark up and most whitebox resellers have a 2~300% mark up. OEM's aren't anything special. I would much rather build my own system. But I understand someone wanting someone else to do it. If you do go with an OEM, make sure and get an ONSITE warranty. If not they'll try and screw you with shipping charges.

Nice <b><font color=green>Lizards</b></font color=green> <b>crunch</b> Trolls cookies....... :smile: Yummy!! :smile:
November 14, 2001 8:07:10 PM

There's your problem, the Dell system uses the 845 chipset and pc-133 ram.

The performance for the machine will be on par with an Athlon 1.2ghz with a geforce2 ti200

Plus I think the sound is crap on the Dell, better off with the Live! or Audigy.

Anyways, price out a T-Bird 1.2 with DDR on kt266a mobo, geforce ti200 and should be less than the Dell price.

Good luck.

Check out my rig:
<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=3737" target="_new">http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=3737&lt;/A>
November 14, 2001 8:14:57 PM

buy all the components from a single shop, at the least you wont find out in couple of months you got screwd on some small part that f%&ed your rig.
assamble it or get some one you know to.
again, comparing prices like you did is not a way to go, you should get same parts from same store or compare each component individually, then see where is the price cut.
i dont see how you get such a "great deal" with the P4, it has will perform much worse then the XP1800+PR(e.g-TI200/TI500) and the superiority of the XP in most benches.
btw 386MB VS 512?specially when its 64x2+128 modules?dont tell me you dont see why the price is so high..

<font color=green>
*******
*K.I.S.S*
*(k)eep (I)t (S)imple (S)tupid*
*******
</font color=green>
November 14, 2001 8:17:30 PM

He said it has RDRAM, but "A45" is very similar to "845". I'd double check that, Conqueror.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
November 14, 2001 8:25:11 PM

Quote:
There's your problem, the Dell system uses the 845 chipset and pc-133 ram.

Why would it use RDRAM if it was 845 chipset?


Quote:
Plus I think the sound is crap on the Dell, better off with the Live! or Audigy.

Have you actually heard sound from Turtle beach cruz sound card/Harmon Kardon speakers? I argued for along time with the sales person that SoundBlaster Live was better than Turtle beach Cruz sound card, and he kept telling me that I'm wrong, and that it was better than soundblaster live! Also notice that it costs about £50 more than soundblaster, so it has to be better.

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 14, 2001 8:27:50 PM

Just been to Dell website, it's RDRAM alright, I don't like the website though (sorry tangent!).

'i'm your little glowing friend'
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 14, 2001 8:31:40 PM

The Salesman is bound to say it's better, he's selling it, and who says expensive is always better, if so why is there any argument about Pentium/Athlon.

'i'm your little glowing friend'
November 14, 2001 8:36:29 PM

I looked a thte specs for the PC he mentions and nowhere did it say it used RDRam. In fact, it just said RAM. Perhaps he spoke with a Dell rep who said it was RDRam. However, The P4 motherboards all have names like D845 or D850 so it sounds like an 845 board, which indeed would have SDRam. That gives that 1.8ghz P4 performance about equivalent to a P4 1.5 or 1.6 with RDRam, or similar to a 1.1 or 1.2ghz P3. Certainly not lightning fast.

Other areas of cost cutting are the low end GeForce3 Ti200 card, which is significantly less expensive than the Ti500. Finally, the sound card is also less expensive, though not really all that much



When all else fails, throw your computer out the window!!!
November 14, 2001 8:38:02 PM

Quote:
He said it has RDRAM, but "A45" is very similar to "845". I'd double check that, Conqueror.

Yeah, i think you're right. Sales person must have meant 845, but I didn't get that because I asked her the make of the mobo and not the chipset.

And yes, the two systems have different memories. The Pentium4 has RDRAM, whereas the Athlon has DDRAM. So you should expect Pentium to be more expensive.

Also, true that they have a different graphics card, but even if the difference was £100, the Athlon still doesn't compare with the Pentium.

Quote:
I can understand why you want to go OEM. You want a company to back your warranty if any problems should arise.

No, not really. I just don't feel ready to build my own system yet. Also I just don't want to spend so much time and effort in it. Although, I must admit, it should be fun, and I love doing this sort of thing. I just was a basic system, and I'll work my way up from there.

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 14, 2001 8:38:33 PM

just as a little aside, i know it's silly but on the webpage if you add all the extras (minus printers and digital cameras) and cover options it comes to £4770.50 whew but what a spec! if you go for all the options i'll chuck in the 50p

'i'm your little glowing friend'
November 14, 2001 8:40:48 PM

Quote:
Also notice that it costs about £50 more than soundblaster, so it has to be better.


Please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please
tell me you're not serious.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
November 14, 2001 8:41:42 PM

Yeah, I've tried "building" the spec I quoted above on Dell's website from scratch, and it came to over £2,500 !!! But I'm getting all that for £1300!

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 14, 2001 8:42:58 PM

just as a little aside, i know it's silly but on the webpage if you add all the extras (minus printers and digital cameras) and cover options it comes to £4770.50 whew but what a spec! if you go for all the options i'll chuck in the 50p


'i'm your little glowing friend'
November 14, 2001 8:44:03 PM

lol @ FatBurger !

I was not serious! But it makes you think if you haven't tried the thing, doesn't it?

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 14, 2001 8:45:05 PM

sorry repeating myself

'i'm your little glowing friend'
November 14, 2001 8:46:12 PM

Not at all, because I know what's what. But for the average person, yes.

BTW, those Harmon Kardon speakers rock. They're cheap, but they sound great for what they are.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
November 14, 2001 8:56:06 PM

<A HREF="http://commerce.euro.dell.com/dellstore/config/frameset..." target="_new">Click Here </A> for the PC i'm looking at. you have to do a bit of reconfiguration to match the spec I quoted above.


Quote:
BTW, those Harmon Kardon speakers rock. They're cheap, but they sound great for what they are.

What are you trying to do FatBurger? what was your motive in writing that?

BTW, they are not cheap. the Harmon Kardon 695 is the latest in technology from them, they are quite expensive, cost £60.

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
November 14, 2001 9:14:44 PM

My motive is that the Dell I bought in January (I have a homemade computer now), came with Harmon Kardons, and they sound great.

EDIT:
Those are the 195s, but I've heard the 695s before, and they're nice.
<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by FatBurger on 11/14/01 03:18 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
November 14, 2001 11:09:16 PM

What are you waiting for, But it NOW. Before they take it off of Special.

KG.
November 15, 2001 1:48:58 AM

What in the world is VAT, and what currency is a J?? You said UK, but I'm not seeing the connection...

I bought a Dell, liked it, but have moved on. If you've made it this far I would recommend that you build your own system. The Dell system will cut corners just like any OEM will and you'll find that the powersupply for example is proprietary and is the bare minimum wattage to keep your system stable. Their cases are really nice, but it's proprietary too.

I don't care whether or not you buy an AMD or INTEL system, but if want to compare two, make them comparable. The AMD system you have listed is a faster system and it comes with a better videocard. If you're considering between those two then your choice is clear. You get more memory as well. I don't understand what your even debating.

Quote:
I think I'm going to go ahead and buy the Dell computer. It's cheap and got excellent spec. Plus, it's "intel inside" !!!


This doesn't hold water. Where did you get this line from?

<font color=red>God</font color=red> <font color=blue>Bless</font color=blue> <font color=red>America!</font color=red>
November 15, 2001 1:57:51 AM

I should note:

The A45 that he mentioned might also be the bios version. Their bioses start with A's and my Dell PII 400 had a A9 which got upgraded to A13.

Also, if you plan on "upgrading" from this machine in the future expect to pay a pretty penny. You'll need a new powersupply, motherboard, memory, cpu, videocard, adapter for the case, etc etc. Wow, that's a whole new computer isn't it?! Kind of defeats the purpose of "upgrading". It ends up being "building a new computer". There isn't much point upgrading anymore since components are so cheap and considering that the Dell system screws you by using up all 4 slots (since when did they start doing that crap?), you won't even be able to the most minor of upgrades.

<font color=red>God</font color=red> <font color=blue>Bless</font color=blue> <font color=red>America!</font color=red>
November 15, 2001 2:50:12 AM

why are you asking about 'J' all hte time.

do you mean the pound symbol.. my keyboard doesn't have, but in years gone passed the #%$^@&* and the like were in a different order with teh 'funny looking J' along with them... decimal has changed our lives forever.

Balzi

"I spilled coffee all over my wife's nighty... ...serves me right for wearing it?!?"
November 15, 2001 3:41:16 AM

Like how you slipped more ram and a gf3 ti 500 INSTEAD OF A 200, in there. To fatten up the numbers.

But, I digress, that amd system will kick the crap out of the p4 system handily, so you get what you pay for.

If you didnt pad the numbers you would find an equavalent amd system the only difference being the mobo/cpu/ram would always ALWAYS! cost less than the p4 counterpart.

I can search the web to find padded sales figures all I want, this is your third troll like post, I dont know if you are really asking for an answer, or just trying(poorly I may add) to make amd look bad.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~
November 15, 2001 3:46:49 AM

845 mobos for p4 use DRAM, so you would expect the ram to be cheaper, and much crapier.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~
November 15, 2001 5:33:48 AM

Are those Harmon Kardon speakers better that the Klipsch speakers?
November 15, 2001 6:55:33 AM

Quote:
The result was that everyone who looked at the spec from Dell was SHOCKED! They made remarks like "the price is amzing", "we can't beat that" etc.



Thats because you gave them mis information, the ram mobo you are quoting is an 845 sdram system, not a rambus system, conswquently the system will suck.

~Matisaro~
"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
~Tbird1.3@1.5~
November 15, 2001 10:43:10 AM

Quote:

Plus I think the sound is crap on the Dell, better off with the Live! or Audigy.

Aren't you reading the specs. It's a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz, which is roughly comparable to the Audigy and superior than the Live! in sound quality (at least to me).

AMD technology + Intel technology = Intel/AMD Pentathlon IV; the <b>ULTIMATE</b> PC processor
November 15, 2001 10:54:20 AM

I will have you know that I'm a Brit, (albeit an expat in HK). *Starts Singing "God Save the Queen"*. But I agree, I would have though a P4 and 384 RDRAM would put you on the wrong of £500. I believed that AMD ruled the roost in price (I'm Intel man through and through but that s beside the point)

Don't forget you can't overclock Dells (I found out the hard way).

Charlie

Did you know there never was there ever a cat so clever as magical Mr. Mistoffeles?
November 15, 2001 10:55:48 AM

Roll on Bonus Day.

Did you know there never was there ever a cat so clever as magical Mr. Mistoffeles?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 15, 2001 11:15:33 AM

Hi just read this
(I'm trying to get out of the other section a bit more. I'm turning into a hermit)

If you need any help at all with building a system me, wiggy and calv will help you no end. We can get cheap parts (well cheaper) So if you need a hand give us a shout.

Getting a decent system together is fun. But don't go OEM. Trust me I work for one (not saying which) the support that you will get you will have to pay through the nose for. The reason their machines are so cheap is probably because the money will be made up in warrenties and tech calls. Plus hidden extras. Bet you don't get a printer, scanner or anything else.

Also if you custom build a system it will be taylored to your needs - I'm in the process of making one which will deal with sound in the best possible way (for what I can afford) it dosn't need high graphics etc. So Sound cards are my main priority. What will the machine be for?

If you need contacts etc then give me a shout - you can pm if ya want as long as it's not technical - better posting that public - get more info that way.

Plus you'll get a free tech line through me and wiggy5. 12/7

You are responsible for any damage the info in your post may cause to my system.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 15, 2001 1:02:40 PM

Let me share to you my experience with Dell. I got a Dimension XPST-500 a while back, when the P3-500 was the fastest cpu on earth. What I loved about it:
- THe monitor.. very nice 19" trinitron tube..
- case : convenient, silent
- good performer back then (of course.. BX board, etc)
These are not really things that can not be bought elsewhere.

What I thoroughly disliked:
- support !! My system shipped with a Dell customized US Robotics V90 PCI modem and a Dell customized Aureol Vortex II sound card (turtle beuch montego).

Now, thats not too bad.. BUT my system shipped with windows 9X (98 i think). The day I upgraded to win2000, my soundcard would become troublesome, and my modem would refuse to connect to anything above 28.8. Dell could not supply me with updated drivers, as they discontinued both the modem and the soundcard. US robotics could not help me either. The standard drivers did not work, and USR told me they knew this and that I should contact Dell. Aureal was bought by Creative, and there where no proper w2k A3D drivers to be expected from them for my soundcard either. And dell would not help since I upgraded my operating system, and they only support the original shipped OS.

Can you believe that ? You upgrade your OS, and Dell is no longer obliged to ship you drivers for hardware they modified in such a way that the OEM drivers dont work anymore. I was forced to buy a new modem and soundcard just to run win2K !!! Good thing the videocard (TNT1 back then) was already replaced by a standard TNT2 card, cause i would not have been surprised if even nVidia's drivers would not have worked.

Are you still reading ? ;-)
Anyway, I wanted to upgrade my system after that. BUT, the PSU was dell-only.. would not work on a standard ATX motherboard. The case was not completely ATX standard either. THe mounting holes werent all corretly placed, the on/of/reset/led connector was propriaraty (or whatever you call it).

My advise: dont buy an OEM system if you even consider opening it once or if you ever want to install a new OS. Recommend one to your grandma if she want a pc.


= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =
November 15, 2001 1:32:22 PM

Conqueror...

845 board does NOT support RDRam. Either it's an 845 chipset based board with SDRam or it's an 850 board with RDRam. Those are the two chipsets Intel currently makes for the P4. There's no combination chipset supporting both memory types.

So, make DOUBLY sure whether the board uses 845 or 850. Once you find that out double check the memory types to make sure they jibe.

My suspicion is that it's the 845 chipset running SDRam, which, as I mentioned before, has nearly 30% LOWER performance than a comparable RDRam based system. Benchmarks already show P4 1.8 havign lower performance than an AthlonXP 1800+ by about 10%.....and that's the P4 having RDRam. Now with the 845 board and SDRam, the P4 1.8 runs not much faster than an AMD Duron 1200.

So, check and doublecheck the board chipset and memory type! It's ESPECIALLY important with P4! Why check both? Because if Dell told you it's an 845 board with RDRam memory, then they are plain wrong! One or the other specification is incorrect and the Dell rep doesnm't know what he/she is talking about.

Mark-

When all else fails, throw your computer out the window!!!
November 15, 2001 3:29:52 PM

Quote:
Are those Harmon Kardon speakers better that the Klipsch speakers?


Not at all, but they're still good.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
November 15, 2001 3:45:31 PM

techie2001, I really apreciate your help. Thanks for your kind words.

bbaeyens:
<i>"I was forced to buy a new modem and soundcard just to run win2K !!!"</i>

But the system I quoted comes with Win XP and all the hardware that comes with the system is compatible with it.

The experience you had could have been the case with anyone, not just you because you bought the PC from Dell. But your experinces did help though. If I ever buy an OEM PC, I will make sure that I will look out for these things. I have not decided yet whether to go with Dell.

One other thing. Why do you guys keep going on about 845?? I have already stated many times that the chipset is 850 and it uses RDRAM and not SDRAM. The socket version is 478.

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
November 15, 2001 3:55:48 PM

charlie, since you're in UK, what do you think of the Dell system I quoted? Is it a good buy?

Also, do you know any good places in Birmingham where I could get quality components for cheap price to build my own PC??

<font color=blue><i>Mankind must put an end to War,
or War will put an end to mankind!<i></font color=blue>
November 15, 2001 4:04:56 PM

And if two years down the road, MS releases "Windows BS," and you just have to have it? Windows XP won't be top-of-the-line forever.

bbaeyens's Dell box likely came with Win98 because Win98 was the best Windows OS at the time. Considering that it was the time of the P3-500, win98 couldn't have been out for long. If his sound card was a white-box Vortex 2 card instead of a Dell-modified Vortex 2 card, he would have a shot at getting it fully functional in Win2K. Same goes for the Dell-modified US Robotics modem, and the Dell-proprietary power supply. OEM system builders just do little stuff like that, and it ends up screwing you in the long run.

No system is completely future-proof, but OEM systems like Dell systems are the least future-proof of all.

Kelledin
<A HREF="http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/" target="_new">LFS</A>: "You don't eat or sleep or mow the lawn; you just hack your distro all day long."
November 15, 2001 4:07:32 PM

It sounds damn good. But have you taken VAT into consideration. That horrible Gordon Brown man will try and rip you off for all your worth.

I would advocate a self build but this is the U.K. so those SiS DDR boards are no where to seen and Dell are probably got some kind of deal with Kingston or whoever supply them with RDRAM. But sure go for it.

Charlie

Did you know there never was there ever a cat so clever as magical Mr. Mistoffeles?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
November 15, 2001 4:09:33 PM

I configured the same system from Dell in the US and it costs $2,217.00. Considering it costs about $1200 tops to build this system. Heres the link

http://ecomm.us.dell.com/dellstore/basket.asp?order_cod...

At my work we have about 12 Dell machines that aren't even one year old yet and half of them have been replaced due to bad motherboards, hard drives, etc. One machine we got back was sent in due to a bad hard drive, they sent it back, saying they replaced the hard drive only to find out the hard drive they replaced it with, had bad sectors all over it. Here's Quality at it's best!!!! lol
There logo should be we'll bend you over the right way!!! ;) 

"Sticks and Stones may break my bones, BUT OH CRAP HE"S GOT A GUN!!!!"
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