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Mandrake 8.1 easier than Win-XP

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December 19, 2001 3:40:35 PM

:) 

"Mandrake 8.1 easier than Win-XP
By Thomas C Greene in Washington
Posted: 18/12/2001 at 01:23 GMT


Windows addicts curious to see how the other half lives but wary of the installation challenges Linux is supposed to present will find Mandrake 8.1 considerably easier to install and configure than Win-XP. It's quite nearly Harry Homeowner-proof.

Ready for some cultural tourism? No need to hesitate; the full Pro package sells for a mere $150.00, compared with XP's $300, so it's hardly a major investment even if you should run home to Redmond in the end.

Installation
The Mandrake installation beats even SuSE's, which is relatively comprehensive and trouble-free. The first issue for me was whether I'd get the same fatal read-errors I got from Red Hat and SuSE with my CD-ROMs set to cable select, as the Dell factory likes them. This is important because Compaq, Gateway and HP also like this arrangement, and Harry is most likely using an OEM box.

With Red Hat the installation failed, and the documentation was inadequate to sort out the issue. With SuSE it failed as well, but the YaST installer prominently offers a safe-mode installation, and the documentation prominently urges this whenever there's a problem. The user may never know why his first attempt failed, but his second will go all right so long as he follows directions.

Again I set up my two CD-ROMs and two HDDs with cable select, and ran Mandrake's DrakX installer. It handled the CS arrangement flawlessly. I was so surprised that later I switched everything back to master/slave configs and re-installed, but that worked fine as well.

So on the Harry test I give an F to Red Hat for having no knowledge of the CS issue and no useful recommendations; a C+ to SuSE for making it easy for Harry to get it right the second time around; and an A to Mandrake for having no such issue at all.

The second issue for me is my networking scheme, which, while not quite an out-of-the-box setup, is by no means over the top. Perhaps a bit eccentric by Harry standards, I'll allow.

I'm using a DSL modem, ethernet cards and a router to connect my machines to Verizon's DSL service. I need a PPPoE client running. Red Hat took me hours to configure; and SuSE never did work due to some lame-assed PPPoE client I was told to fetch from their Web site (hello!). Win-XP never worked either, because it was convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt that it had already installed all the software needed to run my hardware and arrogantly refused to be corrected.

And Mandrake? It detected my ethernet card correctly, and when I installed ADSL it popped in a handy PPPoE client and connected the first time. I mean, immediately after configuring it, without any subsequent tweaking.

As for other hardware detection, Mandrake was infallible. The drives; the wheel-mouse, the keyboard, the monitor, the video card (nVidia Ge-Force AGP 64 MB), the sound card (SoundBlaster Live), all of it. All I had to do was confirm its choices every now and then.

Disk partitioning and formatting is an absolute breeze in expert mode, with a graphical menu showing all your hard drives and partitions. You just click to select a partition or a chunk of free space, and it's selected in the configuration menu. It's a mousey affair, with little sliders to set the partition sizes. (Mousey is OK with me, as is texty; what irritates me is a combination where I'm shifting back and forth between mouse and keyboard.)

Video gremlin
Ah, but there had to be at least one hitch. The driver for my video card with hardware acceleration which I was offered froze my machine during the boot and nothing could make it start, not even a boot floppy.

There was an "experimental" driver which I didn't try. The one I did try wasn't flagged for danger, but should have been. So I had to use the driver without hardware acceleration which worked fine, and then download the right RPM from nVidia's Web site. Not a lot of trouble, but this is precisely the sort of little oversight which will drive poor Harry to distraction; and it's the only thing I encountered during several different Mandrake installations which mars an otherwise outstanding Linux eXPerience.

What to expect
There will of course be some trade-offs if you migrate from Windows. You'll loose the Microsoft puppy yapping at your heels, harranguing you to 'activate' and get a Passport. You'll finally be permitted to configure your machine pretty well as you please, which may take some getting used to.

But regardless of whether you choose to run KDE or Gnome, the Linux desktop definitely isn't as pretty. It's more configurable, certainly; the OS is more stable; you get lots of free applications and utilities; and your machine will be a lot more secure, if for no reason other than your immediate escape from that premium virus propagator Outlook.

If you're into graphics work, Linux is not your environment. But then you're already using a Mac. If you're heavily into games, then you're definitely stuck with Windows. Linux's multimedia support is crude out of the box, but there are heaps of applications and codecs for download, so this limitation can be overcome.

So what's it good for? Everyday chores with a lot less noise and nonsense, especially those related to the Internet. It's a fine choice if you want to surf the Web and take control of the information you're leaving behind, and which Web sites are leaving on your machine; it's good for using e-mail with far fewer malware dangers (start by displaying all received messages as text only); and of course it works well for chatting and trading files with your friends on line.

In other words, it's better at most of what the majority of Windows addicts use their computers for: wasting time on line.

Office applications are adequate, but not great. Personally I never use anything but a text editor, though many people seem to relish the distractions of word-processors and spreadsheets. Here you have several choices, none of which is as slick as its MS Office counterpart. Sun's StarOffice 5.2 is particularly loathsome, but recent reports indicate that version 6.0, due out in early 2002, marks a giant step forward.

Of course Linux is a great development platform if you like to roll your own progies, and perfect if you want to run a little Web or FTP server off your home machine. It's far cheaper, simpler and safer than using IIS over NT or 2K. (Also excellent in the enterprise space, but that's another story.)

Other virtues include the simple pleasure of 'getting clean' following years of addiction to the Microsoft upgrade dependency scam. The sweet sensation of rehabilitation alone is worth the purchase price.

If you'd like to eXPerience that sensation, Mandrake 8.1 is, hands down, the easiest way to get started. "

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/23436.html


<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=9933" target="_new"> My Rig </A>

More about : mandrake easier win

December 19, 2001 5:14:24 PM

This stuff doesn't belong in the cpu forum.

ALso, linux is crap. AT least with windows you don't have to recompile things when a new version comes out.

<i>Mommy that dog is trying to jump over that other dog but he keeps not making it</i>
December 19, 2001 5:26:40 PM

so you like giving your paycheck to microsoft then? You might wanna learn linux! As it keeps getting better

Don't be surprised when microsoft incorporates a yearly license fee of 100 bucks to run windows!

as for your recompiling BS. Have you ever used linux at all? Just wondering.

At least with linux you don't have to suck Bill Gates dick to run your computer!

<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=9933" target="_new"> My Rig </A>
Related resources
December 19, 2001 5:42:28 PM

One major flaw, Legacy hardware support.

I often run across PCI cards that are not supported by Linux. 3 options, Pull card, Ignore card, scrap Linux.
December 19, 2001 5:47:37 PM

Quote:
Don't be surprised when microsoft incorporates a yearly license fee of 100 bucks to run windows!


I've seen that rumor more times than the "Send this to 20 people with a Hotmail account so we know you're active, or you'll be deleted".

Give me a break. A coworker went to a seminar in August (I think it was August) that was only about Microsoft's licensing plans. They specifically said that they had no future plans to go to a yearly fee, because it'd be suicide.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
December 19, 2001 5:47:42 PM

Forget legacy fugger, there isnt even decent support for CURRENT hardware, im sorry but running my gf3 at tnt2 ultra speeds with some 1337 hax0r's home made driver does NOT make me wanna rush on the linux bandwagon.

Tom did a recent article where he compared like 10 soundcards, and not a single one had drivers for linux. Damn shame.

"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
No Overclock+stock hsf=GOOD!
December 19, 2001 5:50:27 PM

ya but it can only get better. And what do you want for free? You can download it for free. If you have broadband anyway.

i'd start to learn it along side with windows. When bill gate$ mentiones yearly $100 licensing fees that scares me.

<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=9933" target="_new"> My Rig </A>
December 19, 2001 5:53:14 PM

It can only get better?

we already have better: windows.

You won't win much linux sympathy here, this board is generally gamers and power users, who want their new hardware to actually be supported.

<i>Mommy that dog is trying to jump over that other dog but he keeps not making it</i>
December 19, 2001 6:13:22 PM

When has Bill Gates mentioned yearly licensing.
And what does the $100 cover? I'd gladly pay $100 a year to use any and all of their software I wanted.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
December 19, 2001 6:25:19 PM

Ya i'm sure they will find a way. Where there is a will there is always a way. If there was no will there would be no mention of it.



<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=9933" target="_new"> My Rig </A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by xxsk8er101xx on 12/19/01 03:35 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
December 19, 2001 6:32:52 PM

i read it somewhere and can't find it. it was just for the OS.

Just the fact you said you would be willing to do it tells me we are in a lot of trouble in the future. Before you know it every software will have a yearly licensing fee.

Just my prediction because users are stupid enough to accept it.

<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=9933" target="_new"> My Rig </A>
December 19, 2001 7:30:43 PM

FUGGER:
If you find the following comment insulting, <b>too damn bad.</b> :wink:

The "legacy hardware" support is BS. A lot of my hardware is ancient, but all of it works in Linux--including an old EtherExpress 16 ISA card that Win2K just can't handle.

Matisaro:
If you find the following comment insulting, please accept my apologies.

Companies often release drivers for Linux, they just don't make a big fuss about it. Creative has <A HREF="http://opensource.creative.com" target="_new">http://opensource.creative.com&lt;/A>, and Adaptec has <A HREF="http://linux.adaptec.com" target="_new">http://linux.adaptec.com&lt;/A>. nVidia and Intel both release Linux drivers for their products; I use an Intel PRO/1000 driver and nVidia's Linux driver.

As for the GeForce3 running at TNT2 speeds...that's a bit of an <A HREF="http://www.evil3d.net/articles/linux/pageflip/?page=4.p..." target="_new">exaggeration</A>. In some cases it runs faster than it does in Windows.

Oh, and don't knock us "l33t hax0rs" and our <A HREF="http://mondo-daemon.sourceforge.net/" target="_new">home made drivers</A>. A lot of them work pretty damn good. :wink:

Kelledin
[dave@discovery ~] kill -9 1
init: Just what do you think you're doing, Dave?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
December 19, 2001 7:42:52 PM

Quote:

It can only get better?
we already have better: windows.
You won't win much linux sympathy here, this board is generally gamers and power users, who want their new hardware to actually be supported.

Mmmm, It appears your posts can only get worse.
I would class developers as "power users", wouldnt you? Obviously not. But then, "development" is only something that those imaginary peeple do isnt it? Also, those people that have something other than an Intel or AMD inside are what, imaginary also? You dont consider users of Alpha, Sparc systems etc. "power users"?
I had a feeling that you were just an ignorant Windozer, now you have proved yourself. So, recompiling software is a disadvantage? lol, just proves you know jack sh*t about Linux (Or software in general for that matter). Therefore, you are in NO position to make any ignorant comments about Linux. Open your tiny, narrow mind to the whole picture and
stick to what you know best; trivial arguements about CPUs.

PS
My SB Live Platinium sound card works fine under Linux.
<font color=red>alere flamman</font color=red>
December 19, 2001 7:49:49 PM

Im not insulted... It seems we play with more hardware than you. too often I come across PCI cards that do not have Linux drivers.

Not everyone can write their own driver on the fly.
December 19, 2001 8:05:01 PM

Hey you don't have to convince me! I love Linux. I've got Mandrake 8.0. I'm really new at it though, and sometimes I do get pretty frustrated. For example:

1. I still haven't been able to get my zip drive to work.
2. I still can't print to my Win98 box printer
3. My scroll wheel on my mouse still doesn't work

As soon as I graduate and I'm not afraid to lose all of my important data, I'm going to start all over with 8.1. I've got a LONG way to go to fully understanding the intracies of Linux, but I really can't wait. I think learning Linux will really help me to understand computers better. Who knows maybe I'll be able to write my own Linux drivers one day!

BTW, Linux rocks for doing research work (thesis)- especially LaTeX.

GO LINUX!


Catheter and Caffeine IV are in place. Let's PLAY.
December 19, 2001 8:13:20 PM

I would be willing if it was all their software for $100/year. If it was too much more, or too little of their software, I wouldn't.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
December 19, 2001 8:27:32 PM

1) <A HREF="http://www.linuxdoc.org/HOWTO/mini/ZIP-Drive.html" target="_new">http://www.linuxdoc.org/HOWTO/mini/ZIP-Drive.html&lt;/A>

2) Samba setup, perhaps? I could take days going over possible Samba misconfigurations...

3) If you're using XFree86 4.x, a section of my XF86Config might help you some:

<pre>Section "InputDevice"
Identifier "Mouse0"
Driver "mouse"
Option "Protocol" "IMPS/2"
Option "Device" "/dev/psmouse"
Option "ZAxisMapping" "4 5"
Option "Resolution" "200"
EndSection
</pre><p>ZAxisMapping and the Protocol setting are the important parts for scroll wheels. The options are similar for XF86 3.3.x, but the syntax is different. =/

(See, Intel_Inside was actually right about one thing--this isn't the section for it. =/)

Kelledin
[dave@discovery ~] kill -9 1
init: Just what do you think you're doing, Dave?<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by kelledin on 12/19/01 04:31 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
December 19, 2001 8:32:30 PM

Quote:
this board is generally...power users (windowze)

MMmmhahahahahahhahahhahammahahahh!!!!!!!!! HWooooohooO!!!
"Windows" & "Power Users"
That was the funniest sh!t I have ever heard!!! Hey man, do you know anything about ANYTHING??!!! LOL!!!
One of the reasons why Linux is Open-Source is so that <b>POWER USERS</b> can go "under the hood" and and tweak <b>EVERYTHING</b>--from memory allocation to kernal configuration. Can you do that with windoze?--don't think so....all you can do is mess with the registry...even doing that won't warrant you the title of being a 'Power User'. Too bad ignorant kids like you still think Linux is as difficult to use as flying a space ship. Go back to your Compaq machine that your mommy bought for you that came preinstalled with Windowze and have fun watching BSOD.

d4n13l: you took the words right out of my mouth! =)

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by STICK_e_MOUSE on 12/19/01 02:39 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
December 19, 2001 8:37:07 PM

BTW: You won't win much sympathy here, this board is for people who actually KNOWS, or wants to learn, stuff about Computer hardware & software....not make stupid assumptions like you just did.

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
December 19, 2001 8:52:32 PM

w00t!
:D 
YOU took the words right out of my mouth dude.
Lest we forget:
The learning curve for Windoze is steep but shallow, the learning curve for a system like Linux is gradual but goes a thousand times higher than that of Windoze.
Given its so widespread, 99.9% of Windozers mindsets mirror its learning curve (Yes, you are part of that 99.9% Intel_Inside)
:smile:
Intel_Inside is like dev/zero - just gives you null information.

<font color=red>alere flamman</font color=red>
December 19, 2001 9:20:22 PM

We just finished a month long section on Mandrake 8.1
and there is a few things we learned:

1) 95% of computers at the server level and above run UNIX/Linux

2)You can install Linux on everything from a 386 with a floppy
to a 10,000 node SPARC supercluster.

3)If you don't buy get the manual or buy the O'Rielly books, you're screwed
'cause the HOW-TO's and man pages were written by geeks for geeks

4)When PROPERLY configured, crashes and reboots are virtually non-existent.

5)It's going to take at least another 5 years before a distro is out
that Joe Blow off the street can configure PROPERLY.

Flame not, lest ye be flamed.
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
December 19, 2001 9:51:48 PM

What rubbish!
I have it from a "good source" that Linux is "crap"
Here, I will quote them:
Quote:

ALso, linux is crap. AT least with windows you don't have to recompile things when a new version comes out.
<by Intel_Inside>

This guy obviously knows what he is talking about.
J/K
:wink:
lol

<font color=red>alere flamman</font color=red>
December 19, 2001 10:53:08 PM

hehe ya. I got a copy from my dad who got a copy from his boss of mandrake linux 8.1. I can't wait to try it out. First i have to buy a router though. lol using that computer i wanted to use as a linux box as a router right now lol.

lol i can't believe how ignorant some of these users are who think they know everything lol. It's pretty funny. But ya i heard linux 8.1 is completely different then 8.0. might be worth it to switch. *shrugs* or not i don't know.
windoze is the best OS ever lol. Thats pretty funny.

At UB we have spark stations and using CDE (NOT KDE) as the OS. That is such a nice OS! there are others but i forget what they are.

<A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?id=9933" target="_new"> My Rig </A>
December 19, 2001 10:58:28 PM

Just to clear things out, CDE and KDE are not OSs--they are Desktop Environments (hence C<b>DE</b> and K<b>DE</b>).

"Windoze is the best OS"--ha ha, that is pretty funny.

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
December 19, 2001 11:17:26 PM

Now if only Linux ran all my games...
I'm just going to cross my fingers and hope that <A HREF="http://www.lindows.com" target="_new">Lindows</A> isn't just vaporware.

"Ignorance is bliss, but I tend to get screwed over."
December 20, 2001 2:23:47 AM

IMO, XP and Mandrake are da bomb once u learn em. O, and yes u can mess w/ windows' code- just don't let the cops catch u:)  Plus, the fun (partially anyway) of comps is getting em to work- once I config something to be nice and dandy, I usually get my bro to press random buttons so I can fix it:) 

What if your life moved.....2 inches to the left?
December 20, 2001 3:21:52 AM

Mandrake took 5 minutes to boot on my pc vs 1 minute to boot win98se. After that I didn't even bother to use it again. I know you will say 'but linux doesn't have to reboot ever' but in my case I would have to often because all the programs I use are for windows, and I don't want to have to learn the open-source hacked together clones of them.

Linux is a great server OS, but it will be at least a couple of years before it is useful for most people on the desktop.

<i>Mommy that dog is trying to jump over that other dog but he keeps not making it</i>
December 20, 2001 3:50:32 AM

Quote:
it will be at least a couple of years before it is useful for most people on the desktop.

You made another funny! Hahahahahahah!!

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
December 20, 2001 1:19:01 PM

Im not offended kelledin heh, my point was that modern hardware generally gets linux support as an afterthought at all, and since I am a poweruser and a gamer, linux was not the choice for me. I also admit it is a good stable and fast os, but I will stick with windows xp for the time being.

My friend runs linux and he runs a windows emulator to chat with us, and he cant even copy and paste in it....what kind of emulator is that, c&p is a basic function of windows~!

"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
No Overclock+stock hsf=GOOD!
December 20, 2001 1:23:34 PM

With windows xp, and even in a smaller case, windows9x a poweruser COULD tweak almost anything, the registry is a powerful tool, I had my win98 box allocating memory for everything from a ramdrive to a larger filecache, and my 98 box never crashed. Now with xp there are tons of administrator settings I can tweak to my hearts content.

My caveat about linux, and the reason I have never gone to linux is support, sure as kelledin showed it may be there, but it is NEVER as good as with windows. Furthermore, as a gamer, the selection of linux games is practically nil, so another strike. Some people dual boot windows and linux, linux to work and windows to play games, but since my xp is stable and fast I dont need to do that.


"The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark"
No Overclock+stock hsf=GOOD!
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
December 20, 2001 1:51:07 PM

I installed linux redhat once - It locked me out saying my username and password were wrong. I didn't know any of the code so I couldn't reformat the drive. I didn't know anyone who knew Linux's "dos" code so I have a useless hdd. Winodws wouldnt install over it "Windows has detected another operating system setup cancelled" - OVERWRITE IT YOU GIT. No joy.

Is there any decent "READABLE" books on linux. What I don't want is a 5000 page handbook with pages and pages of writing. Just something to give me the basics then I generally take my self from there. Once I have the basics I teach myself the tricky bits.

<font color=purple><b>Techie2001</font color=purple></b>
<i>(Crazy Alien)</i>
If it ain't broke, Don't fix it. :wink:
December 20, 2001 2:15:03 PM

well, if you ask me (which you might not but im going to say anyway....)
xp is ok, easy to use (easier than mandrake I dont know- I use redhat), good for games, fairly straightforwarg gui, and crap help, good for games.
Linux is ok, kde/gnome are easy to use, lower runlevels (i.e. console) arnt as easy, but you can do anything from console that you can with a gui. networkning in linux couldnt be easier, and the security is a lot better
there, thats my opinion, how many "windows firewalls " do you see????????


Next time you wave - use all your fingers
December 20, 2001 4:08:03 PM

And turning for the better with all the other great features it has.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
December 20, 2001 4:22:00 PM

You can't just format over the Linux partition. Windows can't read it.
Use fdisk on the Windows9X CD, or in NT/2K/XP you can do this during the install: delete all the partitions and create a Windows partition. Then you can format it and install Windows.

*****

That's what you get for buying your computer based on <font color=orange>color</font color=orange>. :redface:
December 20, 2001 5:13:45 PM

One quick and easy book I recommend to my friends that want to try out Linux for the first time is "Sams Teach Yourself Linux in 24 hours." It is a pretty good book for newbies that just want to get their feet wet with linux. If you want something more thorough, get one of the O'Reilly books.

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
December 20, 2001 5:17:22 PM

Yes, Windowze can be configurable, but not nearly as much as Linux--like I said before, it's open-source for a reason.

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
December 20, 2001 6:30:47 PM

FDISK will only work if you put Linux on a FAT partition
if you put it on an EXT2 partition you'll have to resort
to something a little heavier like Partition Magic

Our whole class just wasted half the morning trying to wipe
the drives for the next semester's class

Flame not, lest ye be flamed.
December 20, 2001 6:45:55 PM

Activation for Windows? Oh u mean that thing that can be overridden w/ getting Corporate from company or through a simle registry edit?

What if your life moved.....2 inches to the left?
December 20, 2001 7:33:18 PM

When that happens, I just use the partitioning software that comes in the Linux installation disk (like I if I were doing a fresh installation) and clear the disk completely or just convert it to FAT.

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
December 20, 2001 8:19:38 PM

oh dear, 5 minutes.
lemme guess - Win98 booted in 1 minute and ran for 1 minute.
I know you made these figures up but it doesn't matter.

When Linux boots up, if it takes a longer time it is probably doing more.
i can boot Windows faster if I disconnect my modem, my sound-card, my ethernet and then remove the drivers.

now - your comments. If all the programs you use are Windows then you will never need to boot linux. If you use a hybrid machine like me, then make better use of your time.
Clones -> well, use the windows ones. I run VMware for one app, it has seamless intergration to my serial ports, plus I can suspend the Windows session to save processor WHENEVER I like - I can reboot the machine, run Win2000, boot back to linux and restore VMware next week if I like.

other options for avoiding clones is taking time to find apps that do what you want that are better than the Windows versions.
I use a couple of programs quite often.

"Linux is a great server OS" - oh dear, Intel_Inside, .. you have .. it's .. I .. but... .that comment is true.. I can't believe my eyes... wooaah!!

"but it will be at least a couple of years before it is useful for most people on the desktop."

let the lies begin. I use SuSE Linux every working day of my life.. have done for 2 years.. my boss was using it long before that. Granted it use to need some intelligense to install, but that was some good experience.

If Linux didnt' exist, my software creation would need to be done in notepad, without syntax highlighting and i'd need to run.. **yechh** MPLAB **VOMIT**.

Getting back to the quoted article - I thought it was good that someone finally admitted that Linux needs better office support, and that it doesn't look as nice.
I can admit that Linux cannot replace Windows in every circumstance - but when people discard it as totally useless, well may they forever live well enough to afford MS SW.

LAstly - the bench mark of all benchmarks (jk) - under Win2000 on my machine a seti unit averages 13 hours (4 in a row 13, one was 11.5)
Under Linux it averages 10 hours (mostly 9.5 sometimes 11)

so linux is better.. hahaah (oh, please direct flames to yuo_idiot@I.was.joking.edu)



I spilled coffee all over my wife's nighty... ...serves me right for wearing it?!?
December 20, 2001 9:32:25 PM

"Granted it use to need some intelligense to install, but that was some good experience."

Obviously, it doesn't require good spelling or grammar to install, either.

My own experience with Linux is, admittedly, limited. I used both Redhat Linux (version 5, I think) and Mandrake 8.1 for a number of months on two separate occasions. What I liked about Linux was the near-total ability to configure the system to my specifications and the vastly superior networking solutions (as compared to Windows 98). It was also pretty darned fast, as well as very stable once it was working properly. Oh, and it was cheap.

What I didn't like was the sloppy driver support, and the loads of time it took to get said drivers configured properly; in particular a video driver for an ATI Mobility Rage card in a Dell laptop. Doing bunches of math to figure out my maximum vertical and horizontal resolutions, etc., is not how I want to spend my lunch hour. This was with Mandrake 8.1 mainly running Gnome, although KDE had similar issues.

Overall, I liked Linux, but for what I do on my computer, I prefer Windows. What everyone is forgetting here is that when people say Linux "isn't useful for most people on the desktop", they mean MOST PEOPLE; i.e., Grandma using it to write e-mail to her grandkids on AOL and to make greeting cards and stuff. Or John and Jane Q. Public who want to buy a computer for little Johnny to do homework and stuff on, although he's also going to be secretly downloading porn over the internet and randomly messaging others with stuff like "U EAT DOG BALLS FAGOT!!!!" But I digress....

Is it always going to be this way? I certainly hope not. Hell, I welcome the day when Linux (or BeOS or OSX or even something entirely new) is a viable alternative to Windows for mainstream computing. Choice = Good.
December 20, 2001 10:13:25 PM

I see you have recognised my grammatical error, and will now fix it.
Allow ->
Granted, there was time when a certain level of intelligence was required to install a Linux System on a Personal Computer, but the experience gained had since far out-weighed the effort paid in the first.


there, pleasure to do linguistical business with you my good man.

my second argument, is that when typing , i generally can't be bothered checking my spelling.. it's like talking, you just roll on.. you mis-pronounce a word.. no big deal...
But then a 'sdausmus' comes along and suddenly I feel a need to check all periods and dots and crosses and hyphens.. arrgghgh!!!! go away!?!?!

lastly, I agree with said comments regarding sloppy driver support.
I've had numerous problems with missing video drivers, bad ethernet card drivers.
But here's my opinion on it all.
So often I can't find a driver for MyModem or MyVidCard or Mymonitor.
but this occurs both in Windows and Linux.

this is where different tracks appear.
Both drivers generally exist.
They are both somewhat ahrd to find, but i'd be naive if I didn't admnit that Linux is usually MORE difficult.
BUT ->> in Windows later releases I have more chance of embedded support. i.e Win2000, WinXP (guessing). but it's the same for Linux. SuSE 7.3 has embedded support for all my hardware and so did win2000, whereas SuSE 7.0 didn't but neither did 95.

the next difference is installing. Some modem drivers and PCI serial card drivers were impossible under Win95 and older Linux.
later Windows fixed taht.. but my SuSE 7.3 has sax2 (brilliant graphical interface setup tool that you can also use to test your driver on the fly)
and yast2 (Yet-Another-Setup-Tool) that does the best job of installing hardware.. it's even easier than Control Panel add hardware if you ask me.

anbyway, that's my $4.50

Balzi

I spilled coffee all over my wife's nighty... ...serves me right for wearing it?!?
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
December 20, 2001 10:27:40 PM

Quote:

Or John and Jane Q. Public who want to buy a computer for little Johnny to do homework and stuff on, although he's also going to be secretly downloading porn over the internet and randomly messaging others with stuff like "U EAT DOG BALLS FAGOT!!!!" But I digress....

Little Johnny AKA Intel_Inside.
:smile:
"Choice = good"
True, it is a shame that OS/2 didnt do better, it was a far better OS than 9x ever could even pretend to be.

Intel_Inside, I dont know how your Linux system took 5 mins to boot, but mine takes less time than Windoze does to boot. The problem is, Linux is not an OS for the dumb masses, which is why I presume you quit with it. I suppose that you threw Windoze away after your first BSOD?

PS
If anybody wants a good book on Linux, I recommend O'Reillys 'Running Linux'.

<font color=red>alere flamman</font color=red>
December 20, 2001 10:43:25 PM

Hmm...I've got Mandrake 8 sitting at home. Never bothered to install it. I think I will, though.

<font color=orange>Quarter</font color=orange> <font color=blue>Pounder</font color=blue> <font color=orange>Inside</font color=orange>
December 20, 2001 11:20:27 PM

>>If anybody wants a good book on Linux, I recommend O'Reillys 'Running Linux'.

And if anybody wants a complete book on Linux commands, I recommend O'Reilly's "Linux In A Nutshell".

See a real naked pic of Britney Spears <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stick_e_mouse" target="_new">here</A>!!!
December 21, 2001 1:01:42 AM

yeah, I'm sure linux is good if you feel like fooling around with systems, a good hobby. For productivity and entertainment at the time being though, windows is the way to go.

<i>Mommy that dog is trying to jump over that other dog but he keeps not making it</i>
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